Liverpool 4-4-1-1 "Pass and Move" - Paisley Era

[redmark]

make these changes and upload it redmark thanks

I'm going to test it for a couple of hours or so; if you can't wait, I'd suggest changing 'time wasting' on the team instruction screen to the highest notch of "medium".

[redmark]

I'm not convinced that the 'time wasting' setting is doing anything to reduce long shots (on an admittedly tiny sample size so far). Whether it is giving a more variable tempo is more interesting in my opinion, and of course more difficult to assess. I'm going to see out the rest of the season with it (and a couple of other tweaks) before uploading anything.

The other changes are:

- AMC set to shoot rarely instead of sometimes

- Counter attacking ticked (another factor in a 'variable' tempo strategy; encourage a quick break when it's on)

- Defensive line set one notch higher (actually back to the 'default' for the main tactical creator selections)

I've made these changes after 24 games played; I'd actually just gone top on goal difference. The first game with the changes was at home to United; not perhaps the best to check on any effect on long shots, as they're not going to pack the defence. United went 2-0 up in 10 minutes; I used the 'hassle' (or harass? can never remember), pass into space and work into box shouts - and went 3-2 up by half time, going on to win 4-2 (shouts removed in the second half).

It might be Thursday before I complete the season and (possibly) upload an updated tactic, but I want to give it until the end of the season.

[ataggy]

ok cool i will try them them adjustments aswell and let you know. i may start using shouts. i have completed first full season with my spurs team using this and i won the league and carling cup. i was using mr houghs for the first 2 seasons (winning league in both) and used yours fully in 3rd season. lets see how i get on in my 4th season.

[davehibb]

It seems I hit my February wobble again. I beat Chelsea but struggled, coming from behind to win 3-2 and got a 1-1 draw with Spurs setting up the LC final with Utd. A last minute Sneijder free kick beat Wolves away and I lost my first league game, away to Bolton. Carragher had a shocker against Davies and was subbed at half time with us 2-0 down. Brought it back to 2-1 but their keeper kept us at bay.

I had a simialr wobble at this time last season but I put it down to me switching tactics but maybe the weather and pitches etc. have had an effect, though I never put much stall by that. I'm getting back to playing well after that small blip of poor performances. A Torres hat-trick saw off Utd in the LC final 3-1 and I beat CSKA Moscow in the first knockout round of the CL 3-1 home and away.

The team is playing well again, pressing the opposition into mistakes and knocking it around very well themselves. Still waiting on Torres to master beating the offside trap and Gourcuff to pass instead of shooting to see if that increases the number of through balls and chances for El Nino.

I think setting the triangle of central midfielders to shoot rarely and employing counterattacking should work well. Not sure about the time wasting. I always think it's risky business messing with it. What influence will raising the defensive line have? Won't that congest the middle even more?

[gfvfbbv]

Hey redmark im going to give this a go with Bayern. Love the OP very detailed and great read. Im a Liverpool fan so was good to read about these tactical ideas. Already have a Liverpool game so decided I would go with Bayern. Some decent players in the midfield for this tactic and im thinking Olic up fron with his pace and work rate as he tends to perform better than Gomez despite his lack of techincal stats. Probably need a GK a LB and a more creative AMC although Kroos will be back at the start of season 2 so I may just use Muller there first season.

[redmark]

It seems I hit my February wobble again. I beat Chelsea but struggled, coming from behind to win 3-2 and got a 1-1 draw with Spurs setting up the LC final with Utd. A last minute Sneijder free kick beat Wolves away and I lost my first league game, away to Bolton. Carragher had a shocker against Davies and was subbed at half time with us 2-0 down. Brought it back to 2-1 but their keeper kept us at bay.

I had a simialr wobble at this time last season but I put it down to me switching tactics but maybe the weather and pitches etc. have had an effect, though I never put much stall by that. I'm getting back to playing well after that small blip of poor performances. A Torres hat-trick saw off Utd in the LC final 3-1 and I beat CSKA Moscow in the first knockout round of the CL 3-1 home and away.

The team is playing well again, pressing the opposition into mistakes and knocking it around very well themselves. Still waiting on Torres to master beating the offside trap and Gourcuff to pass instead of shooting to see if that increases the number of through balls and chances for El Nino.

I think setting the triangle of central midfielders to shoot rarely and employing counterattacking should work well. Not sure about the time wasting. I always think it's risky business messing with it. What influence will raising the defensive line have? Won't that congest the middle even more?

Time wasting - I thought the post I quoted was interesting, if it can generate the 'slow, slow, slow, quick, quick, goal' tempo employed by the real Paisley sides. In the absence of such control over tempo I've preferred quick along with control; but this might offer a bit more variety in build up tempo (along with ticking 'counter attack', which I've got over my mental block on ). I'm watching it for a few games to see if I like what it does (so far in 3 games, it doesn't seem to be having any effect on long shots; build up tempo is more difficult to assess, but I do seem to be finishing with player's condition a few points higher than previously). Of course, what I don't want is to lose the tempo entirely.

On the defensive line, it shouldn't have any effect on congestion near the opposition area. If you're seeing congestion in midfield, that should be a good thing: it opens up the prospect of through ball to Torres or the wide players. My aim with the DL tweak is simply that I was seeing a slightly too large gap between defence and midfield when defending; i.e. early in the play when your defence is falling back, they did so slightly too early and slightly too far; opposition players were picking up the ball unchallenged in the gap and running at Carra/Agger, which is more dangerous for those defenders than them already being tight when the player receives the ball and putting in a quick challenge. It's only a one-notch tweak, but so far appears to have moved them forwards an important yard or three.

I'm probably a couple of weeks (and a season) behind you; not seeing a wobble at the moment, apart from all the other teams in the title race, as we've won 8 straight league games to open up a gap of a couple of points over Spurs, and the big 3 haven't kept pace. I'm still hoping to see consecutive clean sheets for the first time all season, but scoring for fun (past 100 goals in all competitions by mid Feb). I've given Asamoah two starts now on the left; an assist in his first, a goal in his second, and definitely looks the part. For the first I benched Milner, but played him alongside Gerrard - quite successfully - in the second. Aquilani does ok, but doesn't seem to get the assists. Lucas gets assists, but not quite as box-to-box as I'd like (surely those two should be the other way round!). Milner (from the left) is second only to Gerrard on assists now and has good box-to-box abilities so I think I'll give him a run in the central role. Gerrard is playing out of his skin, with plenty of assists and goals, including a hat-trick of goal of the month contenders in a single game*; Torres still has over 1.5 goals per game. Gourcuff and Augusto are both playing pretty well - undecided for next season whether to rotate/juggle the two of them, or let one of them go. I have youngsters who are going to be ready as cover, so don't really need both.

* Has anyone ever come up with a way of automatically switching to a different camera view for highlights? I much prefer 2D classic for watching the game (shape, etc), but I'd love to see goal highlights from one of the 3D views without having to switch manually each time.

[redmark]

Hey redmark im going to give this a go with Bayern. Love the OP very detailed and great read. Im a Liverpool fan so was good to read about these tactical ideas. Already have a Liverpool game so decided I would go with Bayern. Some decent players in the midfield for this tactic and im thinking Olic up fron with his pace and work rate as he tends to perform better than Gomez despite his lack of techincal stats. Probably need a GK a LB and a more creative AMC although Kroos will be back at the start of season 2 so I may just use Muller there first season.

Glad you enjoyed it; Bayern should be an interesting team to try it with - at a national level, Germany have often seemed to be quite close to the Liverpool/Paisley system, with good (underrated) pass and move play, good technical players and tempo. How about Alaba (sp? - 17 yr old Austrian WB/AML) - does he play LB? I was looking at him as an option for the ML position, but Bayern refused the same price I got Asamoah for. My favourite AMC is at Leverkusen, you should be able to steal him .

[davehibb]

Time wasting - I thought the post I quoted was interesting, if it can generate the 'slow, slow, slow, quick, quick, goal' tempo employed by the real Paisley sides. In the absence of such control over tempo I've preferred quick along with control; but this might offer a bit more variety in build up tempo (along with ticking 'counter attack', which I've got over my mental block on ). I'm watching it for a few games to see if I like what it does (so far in 3 games, it doesn't seem to be having any effect on long shots; build up tempo is more difficult to assess, but I do seem to be finishing with player's condition a few points higher than previously). Of course, what I don't want is to lose the tempo entirely.

On the defensive line, it shouldn't have any effect on congestion near the opposition area. If you're seeing congestion in midfield, that should be a good thing: it opens up the prospect of through ball to Torres or the wide players. My aim with the DL tweak is simply that I was seeing a slightly too large gap between defence and midfield when defending; i.e. early in the play when your defence is falling back, they did so slightly too early and slightly too far; opposition players were picking up the ball unchallenged in the gap and running at Carra/Agger, which is more dangerous for those defenders than them already being tight when the player receives the ball and putting in a quick challenge. It's only a one-notch tweak, but so far appears to have moved them forwards an important yard or three.

I'm probably a couple of weeks (and a season) behind you; not seeing a wobble at the moment, apart from all the other teams in the title race, as we've won 8 straight league games to open up a gap of a couple of points over Spurs, and the big 3 haven't kept pace. I'm still hoping to see consecutive clean sheets for the first time all season, but scoring for fun (past 100 goals in all competitions by mid Feb). I've given Asamoah two starts now on the left; an assist in his first, a goal in his second, and definitely looks the part. For the first I benched Milner, but played him alongside Gerrard - quite successfully - in the second. Aquilani does ok, but doesn't seem to get the assists. Lucas gets assists, but not quite as box-to-box as I'd like (surely those two should be the other way round!). Milner (from the left) is second only to Gerrard on assists now and has good box-to-box abilities so I think I'll give him a run in the central role. Gerrard is playing out of his skin, with plenty of assists and goals, including a hat-trick of goal of the month contenders in a single game*; Torres still has over 1.5 goals per game. Gourcuff and Augusto are both playing pretty well - undecided for next season whether to rotate/juggle the two of them, or let one of them go. I have youngsters who are going to be ready as cover, so don't really need both.

* Has anyone ever come up with a way of automatically switching to a different camera view for highlights? I much prefer 2D classic for watching the game (shape, etc), but I'd love to see goal highlights from one of the 3D views without having to switch manually each time.

With the DL, I have noticed, especially against Man Utd that Rooney comes deep often to collect the ball between the back four and midfield but usually anyone doing that will get forced wide but I suppose raising it can't harm things.

I've asked Lucas to get forward more in his PPM so that he can fill in for Gerrard when injured. I don't know if he'll be a direct replacement for Stevie G long term as they are different types of players and who could replace Stevie G anyway? But if he does end up getting into the box and on the end of things I think he'll make a good stop gap until I can get my hands on another beast of a midfielder to take over that position.

I did make a deadline day offer for Ireland but I went up to £15m and City wouldn't even negotiate so I'll wait until the summer now. Carragher is having a dramatic drop in form. He got a 5.4 in the loss to Bolton and at 33 this might be his last season as a starter. Good job I brought Shawcross in.

I don't know of a way to view highlights in 3D automatically I'm afraid. I usually have them turned off and always watch the matches in 2D as the 3D engine can get very jerky on my old laptop. Now you've mentioned it though I might start watching a view goals in 3D.

[gfvfbbv]

Glad you enjoyed it; Bayern should be an interesting team to try it with - at a national level, Germany have often seemed to be quite close to the Liverpool/Paisley system, with good (underrated) pass and move play, good technical players and tempo. How about Alaba (sp? - 17 yr old Austrian WB/AML) - does he play LB? I was looking at him as an option for the ML position, but Bayern refused the same price I got Asamoah for. My favourite AMC is at Leverkusen, you should be able to steal him .

Yeah will probably use Alaba, Pranjic seems to get himself into decent spaces in friendlies. Olic's pace gets him free of the defence alot when up front although I have bought Cavani and Tafer.

I would get Augusto but with Kroos coming back from being on loan at the end of the season im going to see how he goes to start with.

Going to sell either Olic or Gomez and look for a class b2b midfielder although that may have to wait until mid season or start of next season. Thinking one of Meireles, Moutinho, Veloso or Muntari as they are guys that would probably be interested.

Edit: Played 2 competitive games so far a 6-0 in the german cup first round against some no name team. Then Bochum in the first game of the season and we won 8-1 big thumbs up so far see how it goes against some harder opposition

[gfvfbbv]

Conceding a few goals atm lost 3-0 to Real in CL and then 3-3 draw against frankfurt dont know whether its the tactics defence or that Ochoa just isnt a good enough keeper

[davehibb]

Having been 9 points clear at one point I managed to stutter over the finishing line with a 0-0 at Stoke to win my second title on goal difference. Chelsea put a great run together towards the end of the season while my injury ravaged and tired squad lost 2 more games, away at Arsenal and at home to mid table Newcastle.

I lost Torres for the season with an injury that also meant he failed to learn his PPM . He's hardly played this season and I also lost Lukaku to a broken leg early on so N'Gog and Nemeth have had to share the workload up front. I've got the CL final against Chelsea next with Torres and Sneijder out and Gerrard only 85% fit after being out with an injury.

The tactic has stood up well I think. Carragher's loss of form and injuries to key players caused us to struggle towards the end of the season. I think the squad needs a bit of a shakeup in the summer. I'll be shopping for a world class centre half, if Agger is still unhappy then he can go. Right midfield needs some new blood which means Maxi or Kuyt can go or maybe both as they aren't getting any younger, Benayoun's versitility might just save him from the chop.

Pacheco and Nemeth both did well when called on but I think I'll be on the look out for some youngsters too with Darby, Irwin and Spearing making way.

The season's highlight a 6-1 home win in th CL semi final against Barcelona. Lost 1-0 away and went 1-0 down at Anfield before roaring back to smash Barca. Everything just clicked. I made the suggested changes to the tactic and while it's hard to tell just from the highlights I certainly don't think they did any harm.

I am considering starting a new save, especially if the glitch on this one means I'm entered into the FA VAse again. >_>

[gfvfbbv]

Little update im top of the german 1st division by 4 points after 24 games and 1-0 up on Juve after first leg of the 1st KO round of the champions league. My only problem so far is conceding goals by the end of december we were conceding about 1.2 goals per game. although its the end of feb now and that is down to .9 goals a game its still a bit more than what I would like. May need a change of GK have Ochoa atm but he averages below 7

[redmark]

Little update im top of the german 1st division by 4 points after 24 games and 1-0 up on Juve after first leg of the 1st KO round of the champions league. My only problem so far is conceding goals by the end of december we were conceding about 1.2 goals per game. although its the end of feb now and that is down to .9 goals a game its still a bit more than what I would like. May need a change of GK have Ochoa atm but he averages below 7

It's odd, in my first season-long save, I conceded only 15 PL goals, and 33 or so in all competitions (conceded a few in the CL for some reason); this time around, I'm conceding at about the same rate as you, though it is gradually declining. The defence is exactly the same personnel; there were no tactical changes at all for the first half of the season (not played all that many games after the minor tweaks in February; the main one defensively being to shift the DL one notch higher).

At the end of the season I might review every goal conceded to see exactly how/why I'm conceding. One possibility I'm considering is to change the CBs (and maybe FBs, not decided) by removing 'tight marking' - and, a little less likely, reducing their closing down slightly. I do see a few goals where the CB challenges immediately the ball comes into a striker and gets spun by the striker. However, I'm also seeing some goals conceded to through balls and basic errors. I can put 3 goals all season down to Reina coming out too far/too quick, but that's a risk of the tactic - I would have conceded more from through balls if he didn't. There are twice as many I can put down to basic errors by Carragher, for instance. Some of it appears to be 'complacency' almost - we concede a soft goal when 4-0 up, etc. We've also had a few 3-2, 4-2 'thrillers'.

[redmark]

Having been 9 points clear at one point I managed to stutter over the finishing line with a 0-0 at Stoke to win my second title on goal difference. Chelsea put a great run together towards the end of the season while my injury ravaged and tired squad lost 2 more games, away at Arsenal and at home to mid table Newcastle.

I lost Torres for the season with an injury that also meant he failed to learn his PPM . He's hardly played this season and I also lost Lukaku to a broken leg early on so N'Gog and Nemeth have had to share the workload up front. I've got the CL final against Chelsea next with Torres and Sneijder out and Gerrard only 85% fit after being out with an injury.

The tactic has stood up well I think. Carragher's loss of form and injuries to key players caused us to struggle towards the end of the season. I think the squad needs a bit of a shakeup in the summer. I'll be shopping for a world class centre half, if Agger is still unhappy then he can go. Right midfield needs some new blood which means Maxi or Kuyt can go or maybe both as they aren't getting any younger, Benayoun's versitility might just save him from the chop.

Pacheco and Nemeth both did well when called on but I think I'll be on the look out for some youngsters too with Darby, Irwin and Spearing making way.

The season's highlight a 6-1 home win in th CL semi final against Barcelona. Lost 1-0 away and went 1-0 down at Anfield before roaring back to smash Barca. Everything just clicked. I made the suggested changes to the tactic and while it's hard to tell just from the highlights I certainly don't think they did any harm.

I am considering starting a new save, especially if the glitch on this one means I'm entered into the FA VAse again. >_>

I thumped West Ham (not exactly Barcelona, granted) 7-1 (1! they just couldn't keep a clean sheet!); 5-0 at half time, I was very tempted to use 'don't let performance drop' to see how many we could get, but I've upset players previously doing that when playing well; used 'pleased'. The 'time wasting' tactic doesn't seem to be reducing long shots (at least, not in every game), but has seen my pass completion and possession %'s improve, players finish games with better condition (high 70s to mid 80s except during 3-games-7 days runs) and from the highlights certainly hasn't 'killed' the tempo in attacking phases.

I've certainly been lucky with injuries; one thing I've noticed is that since employing the 'time wasting' bit, I've had only one 'knock' in about 10 games. Not sure if it's related, but it seems possible (not tearing around at full pace all the time). Torres missed two games with a knock in February (barely noticed, Ngog slotted in perfectly), the first since his two injuries early in the season. He's currently on (from memory) something like 40 goals in 28 starts all comps; phenomenal output, and it doesn't appear to be 'ME flaws', as the next best strikers in the PL are on about 20 in 30. Gerrard is just shy of 20 goals/20 assists with 7 PL games (and I don't think has had a single knock all season), CL & FA semis still to come (had some nice draws in the cups, not been tested yet; Chelsea and Arsenal both failed in the group stages; United beaten in the 1st knockout; RM beaten in the quarters by Marseille, etc).

My big decision for the summer will be in central defence, I think. I'm half expecting Agger to 'want a new challenge', but won't be terribly upset if he does - Wilson has the attributes to fit in (coach reports suggest he's not quite the finished article yet, but he'll still be 18 at the start of the season). I am thinking about replacing Carragher with a quicker player - Kelly might actually be good enough; Jorgensen has worrying mental stats; alternatively, it would be my only 'first team' signing required. At AMC, it's no longer a big decision - Augusto is outplaying Gourcuff quite comfortably, in terms of team play and assists, though Gourcuff cracks the odd screamer. I don't want to have someone of Gourcuff's ability as 'cover', so will sell him. Aquilani will also be leaving, though Lucas can stay if he's happy as backup for Gerrard and Milner - who has slotted into CM perfectly. The likes of Pacheco, Shelvey, Palsson (developing nicely) and others should be ready to step up as backups too. I'll try to avoid signing every promising newgen, and hopefully go more 'UK' based.

[gfvfbbv]

It's odd, in my first season-long save, I conceded only 15 PL goals, and 33 or so in all competitions (conceded a few in the CL for some reason); this time around, I'm conceding at about the same rate as you, though it is gradually declining. The defence is exactly the same personnel; there were no tactical changes at all for the first half of the season (not played all that many games after the minor tweaks in February; the main one defensively being to shift the DL one notch higher).

At the end of the season I might review every goal conceded to see exactly how/why I'm conceding. One possibility I'm considering is to change the CBs (and maybe FBs, not decided) by removing 'tight marking' - and, a little less likely, reducing their closing down slightly. I do see a few goals where the CB challenges immediately the ball comes into a striker and gets spun by the striker. However, I'm also seeing some goals conceded to through balls and basic errors. I can put 3 goals all season down to Reina coming out too far/too quick, but that's a risk of the tactic - I would have conceded more from through balls if he didn't. There are twice as many I can put down to basic errors by Carragher, for instance. Some of it appears to be 'complacency' almost - we concede a soft goal when 4-0 up, etc. We've also had a few 3-2, 4-2 'thrillers'.

Yeah a few easy goals or the other way around conceding early. most seem to be from a CB coming up to high or a striker running through and the defenders not making any challenge. The other thing is rebounds which makes me wonder about the keeper.

At the other end we create plenty of challenges but even having 20+ shots we get less than 10 on target.

Edit: I have 5 league games left and 12 points up so 1 win and a draw and the title will be secured.

Liverpool in Qtr final of champions league will be the big test.

[davehibb]

Torres missed two games with a knock in February (barely noticed, Ngog slotted in perfectly), the first since his two injuries early in the season. He's currently on (from memory) something like 40 goals in 28 starts all comps; phenomenal output, and it doesn't appear to be 'ME flaws', as the next best strikers in the PL are on about 20 in 30.

I wish I could get that kind of output from Torres on this save.

I did start a new save last Sunday and inspired by you efforts here I ventured onto the tactics wizard for the first time in a bid to try and recreate the 'next generation' tactic. i.e. The Dalglish era with the same 4-4-1-1 formation, with the 'Beardsley' role in behind the central striker and a pure left winger (Barnes) rather than an ML.

The way the tactic actually set us was quite interesting in that the position next to and immediately behind or infront of a more attacking player was a more defensive player and vice versa.

For instance the left winger (Barnes) has the slightly more defensive CM (Whelan) inside him and the more defensive full back (Staunton) behind him. On the right the RM (Houghton) has the more adventurous CM (McMahon) inside him and the attacking full back (Nicol) behind him. I set the LCB as the ball player so if he comes out of defence then the LCM (Whelan) should cover etc. It struck me as being quite asymmetrical... I wonder if that's how Dalglish saw it.

I've only toyed with the save, playing a few of the friendlies and doing well but I might keep it going in and amongst to see how the tactic bears up and to try and implement some of the findings from here. Not that I want to steal your thunder or anything but it'd just be interesting to see if it works as well.

[gfvfbbv]

Just been thrashed 4-1 by Liverpool although more because we played the last 25 mins with 10 men due to injury they scored 2 in this time. Means we are out 6-4 on aggregate. Seems to be mainly late goals killing me atm.

[redmark]

Just been thrashed 4-1 by Liverpool although more because we played the last 25 mins with 10 men due to injury they scored 2 in this time. Means we are out 6-4 on aggregate. Seems to be mainly late goals killing me atm.

Are you using the increased time wasting? Late goals can be a result of deteriorating condition of players; using the time wasting may keep your condition higher.

[redmark]

I wish I could get that kind of output from Torres on this save.

I did start a new save last Sunday and inspired by you efforts here I ventured onto the tactics wizard for the first time in a bid to try and recreate the 'next generation' tactic. i.e. The Dalglish era with the same 4-4-1-1 formation, with the 'Beardsley' role in behind the central striker and a pure left winger (Barnes) rather than an ML.

The way the tactic actually set us was quite interesting in that the position next to and immediately behind or infront of a more attacking player was a more defensive player and vice versa.

For instance the left winger (Barnes) has the slightly more defensive CM (Whelan) inside him and the more defensive full back (Staunton) behind him. On the right the RM (Houghton) has the more adventurous CM (McMahon) inside him and the attacking full back (Nicol) behind him. I set the LCB as the ball player so if he comes out of defence then the LCM (Whelan) should cover etc. It struck me as being quite asymmetrical... I wonder if that's how Dalglish saw it.

I've only toyed with the save, playing a few of the friendlies and doing well but I might keep it going in and amongst to see how the tactic bears up and to try and implement some of the findings from here. Not that I want to steal your thunder or anything but it'd just be interesting to see if it works as well.

That's cool .

I had thought about doing a 'Paisley/Dalglish' version (i.e. as uploaded) and a 'Dalglish/Beardsley (Barnes)' version of the tactic; but hadn't yet decided on exactly what the differences should be other than some details of the AMC role (run with ball more, etc). For example, while I agree about the 'assymetrical' nature of the system, does that actually need a different tactic, or could it be replicated with the uploaded tactic, but choosing different types of players in the different roles? Is there enough 'freedom' in the roles for a Barnes-type to play like Barnes, while a Houghton plays like a Houghton, but with the same overall instructions? Certainly Barnes' should probably have crosses set to higher than 'rarely' (the best crosser of a ball I've ever seen, to this day), but he did also cut inside a lot, interchanging with Beardsley at times or bursting into the box to score. What might be an interesting way of doing it would be for more of the instructions to be (symmetrically) set to 'sometimes' (to simulate a 'make your own decisions' framework), and see how that plays out with 'assymetric players'.

[davehibb]

I think it's a little bit both in terms of tweaking the roles and getting in the right players with the right skillset. Basically I guess it would be easy enough to adapt the exisiting tactic to make the ML more of a winger, the AMC as perhaps more of a dribbler and to set one CM and the LB to be perhaps a little more defensive than the other.

I think how both teams played the game and the general pass and move philosophy things were fairly constant, although the Dalglish era team possibly had a little more flair and individual skill in Barnes and Beardsley and a full back in Nicol who played out of his skin for a year or two.

I was just messing about with the tactics wizard but your tactic could certainly be the basis just as it was in real life foe the next era. Can we just skip the Souness era though. :o:D

[redmark]

The Souness era is easy. The tactic isn't important, as you'll be buying such rubbish players that the tactics will be unrecognisable .

[RT--]

You know, I wonder if you could achieve the settings you've got in the original tactic within the confines of the Tactic Creator and touchline shouts.

Certainly 'play narrower' would get your width and passing focus near enough, coupled with 'push higher up' for perhaps achieving the defensive line. The only thing I reckon would be difficult/impossible to achieve is the cut inside settings for the wide midfielders (although arguably with the right PPM and being 'wrong' footed, that would happen naturally).

Might be an interesting challenge, and would ensure that any in-game shouts had the full effect.

(This is only 'cause I'm a bit OCD about only using the creator to convince myself that I'm on a level playing field with the AI. Though I realise, also, that applying the same shouts before each game would be a bit of a chore )

If anyone from SI's reading, auto shouts/over-rides please!

[gfvfbbv]

Are you using the increased time wasting? Late goals can be a result of deteriorating condition of players; using the time wasting may keep your condition higher.

Yeah using the time wasting player condition doesnt seem to be a problem. Just about finished the season Ochoa may be shoved into a backup role next season, conceded 10 in his last 5 games:( Will be good to have Kroos next season as I think the AMC spot has been a weakness this season despite scoring the most goals in the division.

Will post up a couple of screens in a bit. Thinking I need an Adler or Neuer type keeper dont think Ochoa is quick enough.

[gfvfbbv]

Here is the overview of my season with this tactic

and the league table

Obviously conceding a bit to often im hoping to improve this with a couple of players that are a little more suited to this tactic. Mainly a GK as mentioned above. Possibly a different striker as well, Olic scored a few but I have a feeling we may have scored more with a guy that could finish a bit better

[davehibb]

I sneaked passed Chelsea 5-4 on penalties to win the CL final after a 1-1 draw. They took an early lead through Lampard before captain for the night Kuyt equalised. I had Sneijder & Torres out injured and Gerrard only made the bench. Chelsea had Mikel sent off with 15 mins to go and Cech to thank for keeping them in it during extra time. Agger converted our 5th penalty to win the cup. Possibly his last meaningful act for the club as i look to offload him in the summer.

I was given a further £7m to spend before the end of the season, even though I still had £45m left in the kitty so I splashed out £11m on Kjaer, Palermo's young Danish centre half as a ready made replacement for Agger.

I offered Agger to clubs after some more tapping up by Barcelona but only AC Milan made a reasonable bid but he refused their contract offer. Heh. He's kicking his heels in the reserves now as I just signed a young Greek centre half too, who's name I'm not even going to attempt.

To solve my right hand side problem I raided Inter for the second season running to sign Afellay for £22m. He can play anywhere across the midfield, the same as Milner so I wonder how having my two wide men swap position would affect the tactic?

I holidayed my first pre season friendly and checked the analysis screen aftwards. Torres had 5 shots, 4 on target and 2 dribbles, all inside the penalty area which was pleasing. As was the fact that to 2 MCs and the AMC only had 4 shots between them, all on target.

However Milner had a massive 9 shots with only 1 on target from the ML position. I hope the massive number of attempts and the low percentage on target were just some kind of fluke.

[redmark]

I had a bizarre end to the season; we went 6 points clear of Spurs with 8 games left, with the rest of the big 3 trailing a little further. We then lost 3 games on the trot (with a mini injury crisis) - 1-2 twice by Bayern in the CL Quarters and at Villa in the PL. We stuttered in the league after that, but so did the rest of the top 5 - despite another couple of draws/defeats, we were never less than 6 points clear. On the last day of the season, 2nd to 5th had all bunched up to within a point of each other and it was United, drawing their last game, who will miss out on CL football next season. We recovered enough form to beat Everton (who were probably the form team in the PL over the last 2 months) in the FA Cup final to do the double.

I'm going to add a couple of downloads to the OP later today, the one I used for this season, plus one with a couple more tweaks I'll be using for the coming season to try and firm up the defence. As the 'time wasting' settings seems to have improved player conditions by several points over a game, I'm going to raise closing down throughout the team (as back in the OP, this was one area I'd had to compromise due to condition problems) - essentially, putting all of the players on their default for the overall tactic (player closing down instructions were mostly slightly below default). I might also make a tweak to the b2b midfielders, so that they're not making runs ahead of the play (and wide) quite so often, and make both CB's 'ball playing', in anticipation of Carragher's easing out. To some extent, regarding RT's comments above, making more of the positions use the default settings more.

In terms of personnel, I've sold Gourcuff and Aquilani, both for a small loss, Skrtel, Cavalieri and a couple of reserves. Jovanovic was packed straight off to Barcelona on loan. I've now got Charlton as an affiliated club, so may send a few yotungsters there on loan - I don't generally like loans, but Charlton seem about the right level to actually start 3 or 4 of my youngsters together, with decent facilities etc. Because I wanted something very specific at MR/ML this game, my backups in those roles aren't ideal - they actually need the sort of attributes found more in MCs, so some retraining required; or putting my young attacking wide players on a defensive training routine for a while. Alternatively, I might bring in a couple of young 'winger' types for a 'plan B' off the bench.

Asamoah has been 'a revelation' and 'signing of the season'. Ireland has been solid and consistent rather than spectacular; Milner excellent both at ML and when moved into central midfield. Ngog's handful of goals appears to have put him into the fans 'favoured personnel' list, which seems odd. Torres won every award going, with 51 or 52 goals in about 35 starts. Carragher is a bit of a concern, mistakes throughout the season and ended the season in very poor form (6.5 or so); I've extended his contract as a 'rotation' player, which should allow me to blood a replacement, though still not certain if any of the options I have (Jorgensen, Addison, Kelly, Ayala, N'Diaye) is going to be quite good enough. I don't want to spend big money in the position just yet. Real Madrid are sniffing around Agger, but apparently my £35m response to their enquiry was too much . Wilson would probably benefit from another year as backup, so not settled on selling off Agger just yet (his current 'star rating' is quite a bit higher than Wilson's), unless he wants to move.

[gfvfbbv]

The version you are going to use next season sounds interesting as this was where I had problems.

Let me know how it goes

[RT--]

Asamoah's effectively the box-to-box prototype, isn't he? In the 10.3 database, Moussa Sissoko seems to have developed a mean long-shot and become a great box-to-boxer as well.

[redmark]

Asamoah's effectively the box-to-box prototype, isn't he? In the 10.3 database, Moussa Sissoko seems to have developed a mean long-shot and become a great box-to-boxer as well.

He is, though I'm playing him left and Milner in the centre - basically, I wanted that 'box-to-box' type all across the midfield. With Gerrard and Ireland also, it's a very fluid and 'powerful' midfield. I'm almost tempted to give them all different 'swap position' instructions to basically interchange at will.

[redmark]

OP updated with the new download. I've just done the one; it's basically the one used in my last season, plus the higher closing down (not quite defaults by position, as condition was still being depleted too quickly, but higher than on the original tactic).

Made a good start to the season with it, beating Spurs 4-0 in the CS and the first four league games (including Everton) with a 13-1 record.

Apart from a few newgens, I brought in Junior Stanislas and Fabian Delph to be 'trained up' for the wide positions; also then got Jamie O'Hara, who was available rather cheap. Of course, Agger then decided a week before the deadline closed that he wants a new challenge; off to Barcelona (£22m) he goes.

[batata169]

Why did you remove the roam from position instruction from Torres and the wide midfielders ?

[redmark]

Why did you remove the roam from position instruction from Torres and the wide midfielders ?

Torres, to keep him central as much as possible; even without the setting, he drifts wide plenty - which is fine, but as the tactic uses the 'threat' of the through ball constantly, it's more potent if he's reasonably central and right on the shoulder of the CB much of the time. As for the wide midfielders, I don't actually remember doing it - but for the same sort of reason; they're designed to play narrow and cut inside - I find they do go wide naturally at times anyway, don't want them to overdo it. I think I do recall unticking some of the individual 'roam from position' settings and then wondering why I had 'roam more' selected in team positions anyway - as I don't think many others actually do it either.

[davehibb]

I've started season three steadily if unspectacularly. Defeat to Arsenal in the CS followed by some unimpressive wins but wins none the less. It took a handful of games for Kjaer to settle in next to Shawcross in the centre of defence but he had a breakout game against Man City in the 1-0 Super Cup win. My other new starter, Afellay has played well. About 4 goals in 10 games but he's only played 1 game on the right as Milner was injured for 2 months against Arsenal in the curtain raiser so he's played mostly on the left.

Torres has started brightly. 4 goals in 5 EPL games but I've lost him to yet another niggling injury. He's had 9 injuries, all picked up during games, in just over 2 seasons, ranging from 12 days to 2 months out. I don't think there's much chance of him breaking the LFC scoring record now.

I downloaded the updated version of the tactic last night and I've continued to win, a little more convincingly. That's coincided with Gourcuff's return to action after injury too. Gerrard has underperformed so far but he's been out with injury too along with Benayoun. I think I'm having my injury crisis now rather than in February like I have the last two seasons.

Highlight so far is a penalty shootout win away to Arsenal in the LC with a team full of squad men and reserves along with a 3-0 win against Feyernoord in the CL groups.

I've not tries my wingers swapping positions with Milner being injured from the off. I don't what's different with the corner routine as I haven't checked the assignments but I do seem to be getting a bit more joy from them rather than the corner just being cleared all the time.

[redmark]

I've started season three steadily if unspectacularly. Defeat to Arsenal in the CS followed by some unimpressive wins but wins none the less. It took a handful of games for Kjaer to settle in next to Shawcross in the centre of defence but he had a breakout game against Man City in the 1-0 Super Cup win. My other new starter, Afellay has played well. About 4 goals in 10 games but he's only played 1 game on the right as Milner was injured for 2 months against Arsenal in the curtain raiser so he's played mostly on the left.

Torres has started brightly. 4 goals in 5 EPL games but I've lost him to yet another niggling injury. He's had 9 injuries, all picked up during games, in just over 2 seasons, ranging from 12 days to 2 months out. I don't think there's much chance of him breaking the LFC scoring record now.

I downloaded the updated version of the tactic last night and I've continued to win, a little more convincingly. That's coincided with Gourcuff's return to action after injury too. Gerrard has underperformed so far but he's been out with injury too along with Benayoun. I think I'm having my injury crisis now rather than in February like I have the last two seasons.

Highlight so far is a penalty shootout win away to Arsenal in the LC with a team full of squad men and reserves along with a 3-0 win against Feyernoord in the CL groups.

Funnily enough I've just lost Torres for 6 weeks at exactly the same stage (season 2) and the same goals/starts numbers, I think. Started the season very brightly; 8 straight wins in the PL, before finally a 1-1 draw (which was a 0-1 defeat until Asamoah scored in stoppage time). Began with 5 clean sheets too, but have leaked a few daft goals in otherwise good wins since then. Still, 26 goals scored and 6 conceded after 9 games is a decent start, particularly as Milner, Asamoah, Gerrard and Torres have all missed some of those games. Wilson has stepped in brilliantly since Agger left; young player of the month for September and a rating not far off 8 for the month; though coincidentally some of those soft goals came after he replaced Agger.

An update on my squad; not to turn this into a 'good player' thread, but I saw another tactic claiming how wonderful it was while the world class team was stocked with even more world class players (including Aguero not in the starting XI). I've tried to do this with as many of the original squad as possible (but with the MR/ML/AMC positions needing an overhaul) and decent UK youngsters as backups rather than world class talent kicking their heels (my transfer budget is over £100m, spent very little in the summer). Lucas in particular perhaps deserves a starting role, but he's not quite done enough to rejuggle Milner/Asamoah/Ireland; Agger has gone only because of the 'wants a new challenge' thing.

GK - Reina (Smithies, newgen)

RB - Johnson (Jonsson, Clyne/Hodson)

CB - Carragher (Addison, Kelly/Ayala)

CB - Wilson (Jorgensen, newgens)

LB - Insua (Wallace, van Aanholt)

RM - Ireland (Stanislas, Spearing/)

CM - Gerrard (N'Diaye, Palsson/Fyvie)

CM - Milner (Lucas, Fyvie/Cristieg)

LM - Asamoah (Delph/O'Hara, Fleck/Bostock/Kacaniklic sp?)

AMC - Augusto (Pacheco, Shelvey/Fleck, maybe Nemeth)

ST - Torres (Ngog/Gameiro, Dalla Valle, newgen)

Quite interested to see how Palsson and Fyvie develop, could be an excellent partnership for the future. I've also put Jorgensen on an individual training schedule with heavy emphasis on tactics, to try and boost his mental skills; he and Wilson could be a brilliant partnership, but Jorgensen a little weak in a couple of key attributes still at the moment. Having said that, I have a 16 year old English DC/DM/MC newgen, who already has loads of attributes in the teens, and 18 for passing, heading and positioning. The only thing he lacks is pace (8 or 9, I think). Nicked him from Blackpool, of all places, but Purslow has upgraded my youth facilities to 'state of the art', so hopefully will bring through a few of our own too.

I've not tries my wingers swapping positions with Milner being injured from the off. I don't what's different with the corner routine as I haven't checked the assignments but I do seem to be getting a bit more joy from them rather than the corner just being cleared all the time.

I do fiddle with the corner routine occasionally; if I remember right, the one in the upload has a few of the midfielders on 'default', which seems to put them in decent positions in the box, without triggering the corner bug. A previous version had about 3 players on 'attack from deep', which seemed to generate a lot of easy clearances for the opposition.

[davehibb]

Funnily enough I've just lost Torres for 6 weeks at exactly the same stage (season 2) and the same goals/starts numbers, I think. Started the season very brightly; 8 straight wins in the PL, before finally a 1-1 draw (which was a 0-1 defeat until Asamoah scored in stoppage time). Began with 5 clean sheets too, but have leaked a few daft goals in otherwise good wins since then. Still, 26 goals scored and 6 conceded after 9 games is a decent start, particularly as Milner, Asamoah, Gerrard and Torres have all missed some of those games. Wilson has stepped in brilliantly since Agger left; young player of the month for September and a rating not far off 8 for the month; though coincidentally some of those soft goals came after he replaced Agger.

An update on my squad; not to turn this into a 'good player' thread, but I saw another tactic claiming how wonderful it was while the world class team was stocked with even more world class players (including Aguero not in the starting XI). I've tried to do this with as many of the original squad as possible (but with the MR/ML/AMC positions needing an overhaul) and decent UK youngsters as backups rather than world class talent kicking their heels (my transfer budget is over £100m, spent very little in the summer). Lucas in particular perhaps deserves a starting role, but he's not quite done enough to rejuggle Milner/Asamoah/Ireland; Agger has gone only because of the 'wants a new challenge' thing.

GK - Reina (Smithies, newgen)

RB - Johnson (Jonsson, Clyne/Hodson)

CB - Carragher (Addison, Kelly/Ayala)

CB - Wilson (Jorgensen, newgens)

LB - Insua (Wallace, van Aanholt)

RM - Ireland (Stanislas, Spearing/)

CM - Gerrard (N'Diaye, Palsson/Fyvie)

CM - Milner (Lucas, Fyvie/Cristieg)

LM - Asamoah (Delph/O'Hara, Fleck/Bostock/Kacaniklic sp?)

AMC - Augusto (Pacheco, Shelvey/Fleck, maybe Nemeth)

ST - Torres (Ngog/Gameiro, Dalla Valle, newgen)

Quite interested to see how Palsson and Fyvie develop, could be an excellent partnership for the future. I've also put Jorgensen on an individual training schedule with heavy emphasis on tactics, to try and boost his mental skills; he and Wilson could be a brilliant partnership, but Jorgensen a little weak in a couple of key attributes still at the moment. Having said that, I have a 16 year old English DC/DM/MC newgen, who already has loads of attributes in the teens, and 18 for passing, heading and positioning. The only thing he lacks is pace (8 or 9, I think). Nicked him from Blackpool, of all places, but Purslow has upgraded my youth facilities to 'state of the art', so hopefully will bring through a few of our own too.

I do fiddle with the corner routine occasionally; if I remember right, the one in the upload has a few of the midfielders on 'default', which seems to put them in decent positions in the box, without triggering the corner bug. A previous version had about 3 players on 'attack from deep', which seemed to generate a lot of easy clearances for the opposition.

Yeah, I've tried not to make wholesale changes. Just one or two big signings each season with some youngsters coming in too. On the whole i've been very happy with my signings only really Buonanotte and Lukaku (so far) that have been disappointing and I sold Buonanotte on for a profit and Lukaku is still only 18 and I might farm him out on loan in January.

My team (squad) is something like this:

GK - Reina (Smithies, Dudek)

DR - Johnson (Harvey (regen))

DL - Insua (Mattock)

DC - Shawcross (Skrtel, Carragher)

DC - Kjaer (Greek guy)

MR - Affelay (Kuyt, Marquinhos)

ML - Milner (Benayoun, Scottish regen)

MC - Gerrard (Lucas, Pepper)

MC - Sneijder (Aquilani)

AMC - Gourcuff (Pacheco)

FC - Torres (N'Gog, Lukaku, Nemeth)

I'm keeping an eye on Asamoah. He came up in a search when i used Gerrard as the filter looking for his long term replacement and cover for both MC positions. The fact he can play on the left too means that he'll make a good bench man. Hopefully I can bring him in at the end of the season and let Benayoun go, maybe Aquilani or Lucas too as i have a promising Portugese MC regen in the reserves.

[davehibb]

Just an update after last night's play:

Well having said that I don't like to make wholesale changes I felt the need to bring in some reinforcements during the January transfer window. Seeing as Torres is as injury prone as ever and went over 700 minutes without a goal I decided I needed more 'qual-ity' off the bench to back him up so I splashed £21m to activate the release clause in Iker Muniain's contract. Let's hope the 'next' Torres can provide decent support for the current one.

My other signing was kinda forced upon me. Sevilla had an offer accepted for Asamoah so I had to bid or lose out on a target that I see as a possible long term replacement for Gerrard, who's form this season has dropped almost as drastically as Carragher's last season. £15m was enough to secure his services, though after a few sub appearances his off to the African Nations Cup.

This meant the end for N'Gog. Never really let me down, but never really good enough either. £7.5m to At. Madrid. I also offered Benayoun to clubs but his contract is up at the end of the season so I doubt I'll get any money for him.

In the league I'm 2nd, 3pts off top spot with about 4 games in hand. I've lost just once, 4-0 at Old Trafford where we were second best all over the field. Even Pepe had a bad game. We beat Internacional 1-0 in the World Club Cup and all in all we've been bossing teams but only scraping wins, though the last game before I saved last night wasn an impressive 3-0 win away at Reading.

Torres has finally mastered the 'beat offside trap' PPM so we'll see if that kickstarts his season and I feel confident in the guy coming off the bench to replace him now. I'm hoping to farm Lukaku out on loan but he's already rejected AEK. I might keep Nemeth at the club but I'm tempted to loan or even sell him too. Aaron Spear has broken into my 'cup team' and I also have Kuyt, Pacheco and Marquinhos who can play up front if needed.

I still haven't been able to try the ML & MR swapping positions as Milner has struggled to get back into the team after injury due to some good form by Kuyt on the right. Gerrard and Sneijder have disappointed a little at MC so far this season but Gourcuff has been as goos as ever, popping up with some vital goals.

[redmark]

I've made a change to the time wasting setting; I've basically put it to 'default' (which is a couple of clicks below centre, for 'control'). The play seemed a little too slow at times; and using 'attacking' on the quick menu didn't override the timewasting setting, because it wasn't on default. Setting it back to default allows that to work as a 'quick' instruction. Keeping an eye on it, as I expect I may need to reduce closing down settings a little again to compensate.

Suffering some stuttering form at the moment, with lots of niggling injuries and unable to start a settled team - but still getting the results; 12-3-0 or so in the PL (Spurs again closest contenders), 4-1-0 in the CL. Getting more clean sheets than last season, though could be improved. Lost at home to Chelsea early in the CC. Gerrard has been injured twice - both on England duty (and they say the game isn't realistic...). Ngog has been struggling a bit, but Torres is back in training; overall, still outscoring the rest of the division comfortably. Now that I've sold Gourcuff, Augusto is suddenly looking less effective in the role . Although there's always a massive transfer kitty to go get Aguero, Pato or similar, I could bring Lucas back in CM and move Ireland or Milner behind the striker; if Augusto doesn't pick up.

Wilson is looking imperious and I've given Jorgensen a couple of half-hour stints alongside him; only one horrible glaring error so far. The only annoyance with Wilson is that he doesn't feel 'run with the ball more' would 'add anything to his game'. Idiot, it would turn you into Alan Hansen at the age of 18. The 16 year old DC/DM/MC looks like he could be playing already; I've put him on my standard 'preseason' training, which emphasises aerobic and strength, with pace and stamina to a lesser extent his only weaknesses. I think he's future captain material, too (which is good, as I don't think anyone else is). Also got a very nice 19 year old newgen Ghanaian/English keeper who could replace Reina within a year or two, though I'm not sure I want to. There's a 16 year old Greek newgen striker I'm monitoring, who could leapfrog every other striker on my books to backup Torres, but I want to wait to see what my "state of the art" facilities produce next summer.

[RT--]

You see, it won't be long until you move all the settings back to the Tactics Creator default

I finally got to see Renato Augusto play IRL on the weekend, in the Leverkusen/Schalke game. He looked a neat and tidy player, but very much an attacking wide midfielder rather than an AMC. The Swiss guy on the other flank, Barnetta, looked like he might fit your system quite well actually - two-footed and very hard working!

[redmark]

You see, it won't be long until you move all the settings back to the Tactics Creator default

I finally got to see Renato Augusto play IRL on the weekend, in the Leverkusen/Schalke game. He looked a neat and tidy player, but very much an attacking wide midfielder rather than an AMC. The Swiss guy on the other flank, Barnetta, looked like he might fit your system quite well actually - two-footed and very hard working!

Damn, I've still not seen Augusto IRL - my favourite for two versions of FM now . Though he's gone off the boil... I did look at Barnetta, decent on FM but he'd basically be cover for the three positions.

I was looking at what I could move back to the defaults - partly after your post. I think there are a couple more opportunities, but some things I want them to do too differently...

[DB1]

The Souness era is easy. The tactic isn't important, as you'll be buying such rubbish players that the tactics will be unrecognisable .

Very true.

[RT--]

Damn, I've still not seen Augusto IRL - my favourite for two versions of FM now . Though he's gone off the boil... I did look at Barnetta, decent on FM but he'd basically be cover for the three positions.

I was looking at what I could move back to the defaults - partly after your post. I think there are a couple more opportunities, but some things I want them to do too differently...

Unless you've got ESPN, it's pretty difficult to catch much in the way of domestic German football. But fingers crossed you might the chance to see him in the Champions League next year

To be fair, I think the ML/MR roles are a bit limited in the creator at the moment. No playmaker type option, no cut inside option, so not ideal for the sort of system you're trying to emulate.

[Master kool B]

do u use the same tactic for away games?

[gfvfbbv]

Unless you've got ESPN, it's pretty difficult to catch much in the way of domestic German football. But fingers crossed you might the chance to see him in the Champions League next year

To be fair, I think the ML/MR roles are a bit limited in the creator at the moment. No playmaker type option, no cut inside option, so not ideal for the sort of system you're trying to emulate.

Here in Aus we get at least 1 game free to air every week as well as a 1 hour highlights show

[davehibb]

I've certainly not had any problems with time wasting or anything else since downloading the updated version of the tactic. I smashed through February where I normally have my blip. I lost 2-1 at Man City but apart from that I was winning comfortably home and away, turning my superiority into goals along the way.

Having come back from his latest injury Torres has been on fire. Whether that's coincidence with me bringing in a quality backup and him learning to spring the offside trap who knows but after scoring something like 6 in 20 he's on about 23 in 33 in all comps.

Muniain and Asamoah have both done well coming off the bench and in rotation. Asamoah scored a scorcher to earn a 1-1 draw at Arsenal in the FA Cup and Muniain scored the winner in the replay at Anfield.

Fixtures are piling up due to cup runs and the glitch on this save where the top 5 seem to get entered into the FA Vase. >_> However I drew Arsenal in an early round so my kids got knocked out 3-1 by their first team. I'm 12 points clear with 2 games in hand on 2nd placed Arsenal and between 8-10 games left for most teams.

I sneaked past Inter 1-0 in the first CL knockout stage, Aquilani with an injury time winner at Anfield, then I've just smashed Zenit 4-0 on aggregate to set up a semi with Marseille and I'll meet either Valencia or Arsenal in the final if I get through. Next up is Everton in the FA Cup semis.

After nearly blowing the league last season I'm really pleased with the squad's reaction this term and with the tactics, especially now Torres seems to be firing within it's framework after two injury ravaged and inconsistant seasons. We're also second top scorers from corners which is great seeing as no bug or exploit is being used.

Very happy this season with the tactic and the players I have brought in to fit it.

[redmark]

do u use the same tactic for away games?

Yes, very effective away from home.

[Master kool B]

Yes, very effective away from home.

thank you redman,

am playin with Corinthians in brazil, i did a 442 control base on 4411 as well, for the second striker, what will be the duty and the role?

[davehibb]

After coming back from yet another injury, Torres was sensational. From something like 6 in 20 to finish 39 in 51 in all comps. Now he's mastered beating the offside trap the number of chances he got and converted from little dinked through balls into the area increased considerably. If only injuries hadn't prevented him from learning it sooner. But at least the frustrations of the last season and a half with him should be a thing of the past now. I only hope he can stay relatively free from injury for the rest of his Anfield career and chase down the 144 league goals he needs to break the record. He's 27 so he still has a chance.

We won the Club World Champ., League, FA Cup (3-2 vs. Utd) and retained the CL 2-0 (Torres 2) against Valencia. January signings Muniain and Asamoah both look the part and that could mean the end of the road for Aquilani. He scored a couple of important goals but overall his performances coming in weren't great and Lucas is a more solid backup and I have a Scottish regen AML who's good enough for the 1st team squad so I have plenty of options in midfield.

I can't see where we need strengthening in the summer, barring any long term injuries. Skrtel is unhappy with his playing time and Carragher is another year older so I might bring in a young centre half if my reserves don't look like they can make the step up. Apart from that I'll just be shopping for regens to bolster the reserves and hopefully come into the team in the next year or two.

It's the Euros coming up and however England do I hope Capello steps down, so that I can apply. I've already turned down mexico, Italy and Ivory Coast this season. Though if the Spain or Holland jobs come up i'd be tempted too.

[Denny3009]

Started a Liverpool game using the formation exclusively.

Reira sold to Real for £10.5 million, he wanted to go and we didn't stand in his way.

Leading the league by four points, only points dropped have been a 2-0 defeat at Chelsea who scored twice in the last three minutes and a 1-1 draw at Villa who equalised in the last minute of injury time.

Made the quarter finals of the League Cup with the reserves and play United. Won all three CL games so far.

Looking promising, he even Hicks is wanting to sell up!

[denzil.smith]

just don't work for me just slice through my defenders at ease

playing aston villa at the moment best defence in the premier

[davehibb]

just don't work for me just slice through my defenders at ease

playing aston villa at the moment best defence in the premier

I never had many problems with my defence using this tactic. I was always solid at the back but for the first couple of seasons I struggled breaking the opposition down. There's only really been Arsenal who seemed to be able to pass through me and cut me open at times but I'm just starting my 4th season using this tactic and I've probably had the best defence in the league three seasons out of four.

Do your defenders and keeper fit the criteria set out in the OP? You need a quick keeper to play sweeper and defenders with high concentration etc. as well as the usual stats required of the position.

In my game I finished season 4 with another double and lost AET to Real Madrid in the CL final. I was offered and accepted the England job after the 2012 Euros and since I've won 8 out of 8 WCQ so far. The end of season 4 saw some big changes at the club. We'll be moving to a new stadium named after me at the end of season 5 and Purlsow ploughed a ton of money into the club too so the transfer kitty has gone up from £50m to £130m.

I've resisted to temptation to go crazy. In fact the last few seasons I have more or less managed to break even in my trnasfer dealings. Gerrard has started season 5 well after a below par season previously. He's 33 now but still a 5 star player but he and Sneijder will need to be upgraded in the next season or two.

Torres was top scorer in the EPL with 28 in 32. Missed 6 games with injury and I probably had to bring him off with a knock in another 6 and rested him when we were cruising in 6 more. So it could have been better if he wasn't such an injury risk.