Domestic success but European woes

[krljacob]

Hi there all,

this is my first post so don't hesitate to tell me if I did something wrong.

Let me just start by saying, I love football manager but I can't seem to get it right. I have been playing FM since it was CM, but the last 5 years or so I have not been able to create a good tactic. Back in the 2005 game I was really winning a lot, Champions League, domestic cup and league,... Even after only a few seasons. I realize that is not realistic playing as a very average team (Club Brugge). I only play with this team to be honest.

For the past couple games I have not been able to win any big titles but this one I did manage to win the title 3 times in a row so far. You would think, that's great, but to be honest it wasn't always that great. I have not been able to get consistent wins for a longer period of time, but I always ended up winning the league. So all in all, this is not such a big problem to me cause it adds to the realism I guess. The big "problem" is there when it comes down to European matches. So far I can't seem to get the most out of my players. The first season I did quite well in the Europa League and I ended up second with 3 wins and 3 losses in a group which contained Litex, Young Boys Bern and Atletico Madrid. The first knockout round I lost to Ajax 5-2 on aggregate. Not a bad performance given my players were very very average.

Second year in charge I ended up third in the league, giving me a ticket for the Europa League. Again, I still have my same very average group of players. This time I end up as winners of my group winning 5 times and only lost once in a group with Rangers, AaB and Trnava. Nothing spectacular, both AaB as Trnava are sub-par teams. I lost to Rangers (obviously). I lost 5-4 on aggregate again in the first knockout round to Osasuna. I should have won but at the end I did not. Again, nothing unusual given my team was very average.

Third season I ended up with a improved squad as I was able to attract couple of big names on free transfer. Pranjic, Drenthe, Pasanen, Antonio Lopez, Tiago, Jô, Aisatti, Topal (on loan), Stuani and Wright-Phillips. I bought Bradley from Mönchengladbach. So these are pretty impressive names for a average team like Club Brugge. I won the title and I ended up third in my CL group amongst Benfica, Inter and Kobenhavn. I won twice from Kobenhavn and drew twice, 1 time against Inter (3-3) and one time against Benfica (0-0), both times at home. All in all good results. I lost in the first knockout round of the Europa League to Tottenham (1-4 on aggregate). As you can see, I am conceding quite a lot. This is not only against big teams, but also against smaller teams.

Fourth season I ended up with another improved squad, signed Lazovic, Gago Fernando and Arshavin on a free while only selling Tiago and lending out Drenthe for 6 mil. I won the domestic league albeit not with ease. It was the hardest time only sealing the title at the last matchday. Back in the CL I ended up playing badly. I lost to Barcelona (2-1 and 1-6 at home), lost to Milan (0-3 at home and 2-0 away) and I only managed to get a draw at Mainz (2-2) but won at home (5-2). So you see, that are 17 goals against and 9 goals for. This time I ended up last cause Mainz won at Barcelona, so no European football after new year. You would think I would be improving year over year or so but instead it went worse. And I don't know why. I get a lot of goals against but I can't seem to fix it. When you compare the squad I had in the first 2 seasons compared to the ones after that, you would think I should have improved quite a bit. But in fact, I have not so far.

Currently I am in my fifth season and I was able to sign a couple of new players on a free transfer Eduardo (ex-Arsenal), Dries Mertens, Romeu Oriol, John Arne Riise, and Cristian Chivu (Inter). So as you can see, I have significantly invested in defenders. In the league I have played 7 matches so far, drew my first one but won the last 6. Conceded only 1 goal. Not bad, I agree. My first CL match is just done and I lost to Hoffenheim with 1-0 and I lost my second match too at home against Man City (1-0 loss). My third match, same story. Lost 1-5 at home to Atletico Madrid. I can't believe this. I am out of answers. I did not create any good chance and they kept piling up the pressure. I don't know why and I don't know how I can fix this. I have invested significantly in my defence and my attack is also not that weak but when I play in Europe, I can't seem to win, even when playing against teams like Hoffenheim which are, with all respect, no Barcelonas or Man Utds... My other teams in the group are Man City and Atletico Madrid so it is not looking good again for me.

I get there is a difference between my small domestic league and the CL but when you see I can play quite well and achieve a good position in a tough group with a very average team, why can't I do the same with a significantly improved squad? I'm not saying I should win my group easily but a third place and at least win one knockout round would be the minimum to expect. And now that I am in the season I am scared of changing anything. I have been looking at some tactics from people on here as well but so far not used any cause last couple of games I ended up using them but to no avail.

Here is my tactic I am using atm:

---------------------------------ST (Eduardo/Stuani/Jô/Pablo - huge talent)-------------------------------------------------------------------

--AML (Drenthe/Mertens/Dirar as backup)------------------AMR (Touré - big talent and plays in smaller matches or cup/Arshavin/Dirar as backup)--

----------------MC (Perisic/Pranjic)--MC (Aisatti/Kuzmicki - big talent)-------------------------------------------------------------------------

---------------------------------DMC (Maduro/Gago)-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

--DR (Riise/Antonio Lopez)--DC (Chivu/Romeu/Van Gijsegem as backup)-- DC (Van Gijsegem/Romeu/Maduro) - DR (Jonathan/Pasanen as backup)---

---------------------------------- GK (Pyatov/Boucher as backup)----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Also a quick note, I use the match preparation as follows: I put team blend on during week but before the match I switch mostly to Defending positioning. During the match I switch to controll when I am up 1 goal and to counter when up 2. Contain when I am up by 1 or more goals in the last 15 min. I use the option to Clear to flanks, pass into space, play wider, retain possession, exploit flank and hassle opponent. I switch to take a breather when I am up a goal. I put the workload of the SFA to average cause I have 2 injuries every game on average. Most of the time I always have 4 to 7 players injured.

I will post some screenshots later.

[krljacob]

Little update, I just lost again in Europe. 4-1 this time away at Atlético Madrid. This is getting f*cking irritating. Nothing I do helps.

[ZdlR]

Without seeing the attributes of your players, I would say they're probably pretty good and potentially could achieve what you are hoping for - perhaps even going further than the first knock-out round, depending on who you draw.

You haven't said how you start games (philosophy, strategy, other Tactic Creator settings). Also, you state that you use the options 'Clear to flanks', 'Pass into space', 'Play wider', 'Retain possession', 'Exploit flanks' and 'Hassle opponent'. Do you use these at all times, all at once? Or do you use some of them some of the time?

[krljacob]

Could anybody recommend a good tactic?

Just finished my last group match. Lost again 3-0 to Man City. I created 2 chances the whole match... I ended last in my group match, 1 point (0-0 draw against Hoffenheim). I only managed to score 2 times in my 6 games and I ended up with 14 goals against me. What the **** is wrong with my game..

[ZdlR]

Sad to say that it really isn't the game.

Using someone else's tactic is not the answer, either. While it might give you some success for a time, it is unlikely to provide sustained success because it will not be tailored to the players at your disposal. Developing your own tactical understanding is the only way to ensure sustainable success - you will be able to spot what is going wrong and, more importantly, correct it.

I would say that your form over the previous 5 games probably didn't help you in your game against Man City. By that point you had 1 point from a possible 15, so you were very much off form. This is reflected in how the opposition treat you, how your players approach the game, etc. Generally, such poor form makes it much harder to turn it around. Happily, the converse is also true: sufficiently strong form can be self-perpetuating.

[krljacob]

I have been using my own tactic all alone.

I just started a new season, I have changed tactics to a bit more defensive one and guess what. Now I keep losing in the league but I won all my CL games in a group with Man Utd, Juventus and Galatasaray..

And keep in mind, this is a game for me. I don't have the time to play it every day for 2 hours or more.

[ZdlR]

That makes perfect sense when you consider it. You are a big fish in the league, having won it recently, so people will defend against you and the test for the team will be whether you can break down the defences of the opposition. This will be especially true at home.

In European competition, you are small time, so the opposition will naturally come out and attack you.

When you were playing an attacking tactic, you were able to win domestically against defensive opponents but lost in continental competition to better teams that also attacked.

Now that you are playing a defensive tactic, you are no longer able to win domestically against defensive opponents but you are winning in continental competition to better teams that are attacking.

The answer is to play differently depending on the difference between your standing and the opposition's standing. At the moment, that means you should attack in the league but defend on the continent. In some games you will need to play a little more defensively (like against a title rival away from home) while you might also be drawn against a worse team that you can comfortably attack against.

For the record, I play a couple of times a week for about an hour at a time.

[fman1]

In europe you could bring one of your AML or AMR back and set as a defensive winger, or a wide midfielder. Leave the other one as the AML or AMR and focus passing down their flank. So if you leave Arshavin as the AMR then focus passing to the right flank, direct passing and counter attack.

As the bigger teams are coming at you, and i expect their fullback also, it could be good to hit them on the counter.