Buying a new PC today - a little bit of last minute advice needed...

[Robioto]

I'm buying a new PC today and it will be used for a variety of things but as I play FM more than any other game I thought I would look at spending the remainder of my budget on a few things to optimism my FM experience. My PC knowledge is very average and although I have a basic understanding, I don't really know the details. I'll list the spec I've come up with below and then I will ask some key questions that have been probing my mind. My budget is around £1250, any helpful comments would be greatly appreciated. I feel I need all the help I can get before making the plunge with this kind of money

Processor (CPU) Intel® Core™i7 Quad Core Processor i7-3770K (3.5GHz) 8MB Cache

Motherboard ASUS® P8Z77-V PRO/THUNDERBOLT: PCI-E 3.0 READY,WIFI, SLI, X-FIRE

Memory (RAM) 8GB KINGSTON HYPERX GENESIS DUAL-DDR3 1866MHz X.M.P(2 x 4GB KIT)

Graphics Card 2GB NVIDIA GEFORCE GTX 660 Ti - 2 DVI, HDMI, DP - 3D Vision Ready

Memory - 1st Hard Disk 1TB 3.5" SATA-III 6GB/s HDD 7200RPM 32MB CACHE

SSD CACHE DRIVE 20GB INTEL® SSD 313 SERIES - SLC CACHE DRIVE FOR SYSTEM / 1st HDD

1st DVD/BLU-RAY Drive 24x DUAL LAYER DVD WRITER ±R/±RW/RAM

Power Supply CORSAIR 650W ENTHUSIAST SERIES™ TX650 V2-80 PLUS® BRONZE (£69)

Processor Cooling SUPER QUIET 22dBA TRIPLE COPPER HEATPIPE INTEL CPU COOLER (£19)

Operating System Genuine Windows 7 Home Premium 64 Bit w/SP1 - inc DVD & Licence (£79)

Here are my questions:

1. I looked at the benchmarking topic/thread and I was a little disappointed to see the i7-3770 processor to not be nearer the top of the list. Is there a reason why? I've gone for the i7-3770K, does this make a difference with regards to FM? Is this the great processor I believe it to be?

2. With regards to the RAM I've gone with the higher 8GB 1866MHz Kingston DUAL-DDR3 as opposed to the 8GB 1333MHz Samsung DUAL-DDR3. Am I right to go with the higher MHz? Will this make a big difference with FM (or other applications)?

3. Until recently I didn't realise that the Hard Drive had such a big impact on game speeds. I looked at getting an SSD drive instead of a normal one but they are very expensive. Could I get a small one? Like a 90GB one and just run FM and other demanding applications from that drive and have the normal 1TB for everything else?

Now this is where my knowledge goes to pieces, I see you can get a 20GB SSD cache drive? What is this? Will it work the same way as a SSD drive? Could I run FM from this for improved performance? Any help here would be really appreciated as I don't really have a clue!

I think that about covers it... As said before, any help would be great, just in the final stages of creating my spec before I finally drop my hard earned cash on my first new PC in 5 years (hopefully this evening)! Thanks for reading and thanks for ayn helpful replies. I hope I've made sense!

[Welshace]

few notes...

a cache drive will essentially take note of what you use most and cache it to the SSD for faster usage... for fm this is pretty much a non starter, it will load the game faster and save faster but wont have much of a difference in the actual processing.

The faster Ram is certainly nice... it will zip everything along nicely ... i always recommend decent quality ram for people.

the processor... while the 3770k is great and nice to have... you can get say a i5 3570K for a lot, lot cheaper and the difference is hardly noticeable... 5% or so id say... especially if its for gaming... saying that.. you could also go for an older i5 2500k and still be super fast for a lot cheaper still.

(the k part basically means the multiplier is unlocked and easily overclockable... hardly worth it if you are just a casual day to day person)

in summary... you could knock off around £ 400 on that and still have a top notch fm experience and be happy as larry

[Piethief100]

1) The 3770k is a very good CPU. The difference between it and the 3770 seem a little minimal though. I have no personal experience, but the sole difference seems to be the Base Frequency of 3.5 vs 3.4 GHz. The 3770k is the last one in the Intel Ivybridge range, before you get stomped by diminishing returns (of cost vs power). In fact, some would say that you're already well into the DR with that CPU.

2) Higher RAM frequency is a good thing as you note. RAM is also cheap and easily upgradeable, so it isn't as crucial to get right as the CPU/Mboard combo. Without knowing the RAM timings I can't give you a perfect answer, but I would say it's quite likely that the Kingston will perform better than the Samsung.

3) SSDs are coming down in price, but still quite expensive. It's impractical to have your entire computer running on one, and I think most people use a 80GB boot drive for their OS install, and another larger HDD for storage. As for putting FM on one, you would see a performance increase, but Steam, at this time, doesn't allow you to install each game in a separate location. Each game must go into he same place, so if you have a large Steam library, this could well be a problem for you, especially as you should look at putting your Windows install on the SSD as a first priority rather than FM.

Hope that helps.

Edit - Welshace makes a very good point about the i5 3570K. It's an excellent CPU, that, in gaming, outperforms most of the i7 range for a much cheaper price. I'm about to get a new CPU/Mboard/RAM upgrade, and it's what I'm going with.

You should have no worries about the CPU you have picked though. If you can afford it, it is one of the few i7s that will out perform the i5 3570k in gaming.

[haunted1234]

1. are you seriously asking if theres a difference between like the 3rd best desktop cpu you can buy for money vs the 4th best cpu you can buy for money, while playing football manager? even if you would downgrade half every single component you just listed you would literally kill the game.

[Welshace]

for example...

Id rather one of the below and take the mrs for a holiday

http://www.chillblast.com/fusion-scout.html ...

already overclocked and cooled to a brilliant degree, probably better than the processor you have up there. More RAM, Bigger more useful SSD, Decent enough gfx card and everything you'll need .

oh and just for fun... for the budget you suggested... and you can do a lot lot better than this aswell..

http://www.chillblast.com/Chillblast-Fusion-Thunderbird.html

[Robioto]

few notes...

a cache drive will essentially take note of what you use most and cache it to the SSD for faster usage... for fm this is pretty much a non starter, it will load the game faster and save faster but wont have much of a difference in the actual processing.

The faster Ram is certainly nice... it will zip everything along nicely ... i always recommend decent quality ram for people.

the processor... while the 3770k is great and nice to have... you can get say a i5 3570K for a lot, lot cheaper and the difference is hardly noticeable... 5% or so id say... especially if its for gaming... saying that.. you could also go for an older i5 2500k and still be super fast for a lot cheaper still.

(the k part basically means the multiplier is unlocked and easily overclockable... hardly worth it if you are just a casual day to day person)

in summary... you could knock off around £ 400 on that and still have a top notch fm experience and be happy as larry

Thanks for that.

[Robioto]

1. are you seriously asking if theres a difference between like the 3rd best desktop cpu you can buy for money vs the 4th best cpu you can buy for money, while playing football manager? even if you would downgrade half every single component you just listed you would literally kill the game.

Yes, I am serious. As pointed out, my knowledge isn't all that great. Hence the creation of the topic.

[Robioto]

for example...

Id rather one of the below and take the mrs for a holiday

http://www.chillblast.com/fusion-scout.html ...

already overclocked and cooled to a brilliant degree, probably better than the processor you have up there. More RAM, Bigger more useful SSD, Decent enough gfx card and everything you'll need .

oh and just for fun... for the budget you suggested... and you can do a lot lot better than this aswell..

http://www.chillblast.com/Chillblast-Fusion-Thunderbird.html

Thanks, even I can see that these PCs are far better value, I may have to rethink where I buy from!

Thanks.

[Robioto]

for example...

Id rather one of the below and take the mrs for a holiday

http://www.chillblast.com/fusion-scout.html ...

already overclocked and cooled to a brilliant degree, probably better than the processor you have up there. More RAM, Bigger more useful SSD, Decent enough gfx card and everything you'll need .

oh and just for fun... for the budget you suggested... and you can do a lot lot better than this aswell..

http://www.chillblast.com/Chillblast-Fusion-Thunderbird.html

Thanks for you inpt so far, just one more question. I'm very attracted to the bottom one you listed, the standard price point is great at less than £1000, but I see it is customisable, is there anything essential that you would suggest adding to the raw spec?

[CaptainPlanet]

You can get a good enough i5 machine for about £500 in bits, you really don't need to spend a grand on a new PC these days, especially if it's just for general usage and playing FM.

I know how really tempting it is to spend out on a top quality rig, but you honestly won't see the performance increase.

[haunted1234]

You can get a good enough i5 machine for about £500 in bits, you really don't need to spend a grand on a new PC these days, especially if it's just for general usage and playing FM.

I know how really tempting it is to spend out on a top quality rig, but you honestly won't see the performance increase.

this.

if you are not going to play the newest games and egoshooters and what not, your setup is a total overkill for just playing fm

[Robioto]

I may delay my purchase then and have a serious rethink. I have saved and budgeted £1400 with a monitor, so I can afford it. But if I can save myself a few hundred pounds and not lose much in performance I'd be stupid not to do it.

This is my first proper gaming PC really. I'm a big console gamer but I'm becoming disillusioned with the direction console gaming is going so decided to get into PC gaming.

[MasterOfSuspense]

I looked at getting an SSD drive instead of a normal one but they are very expensive

You can get a 120GB SSD for around £45 now

[trekman]

Well here's my thoughts on your proposed pc.

1. I personally think that getting a pc with a corei7 is overkill especially if the game you mainly play is FM. I have a corei5 2500K 3.3 ghz and although its not the latest processor it handles fm with 30 odd leagues and a large database and anything else I use easily.

2. I also have 8gb ram but I probably could have saved some money and got just 4 because I dont think the game can use the full 8gb but if anyone wants to correct me on that then please do so.

3. Good graphics card and probably better than mine (Radeon HD6670). If you want to use the 3d part of the game then a dedicated card is always preferable to an onboard one.

4. I personally wouldnt go for an ssd just yet. They are still too expensive imo.

[Wizard boy]

i got another 2gb memory stick for 7.62 so i have 4gb. i emailed tech guys at CCL to see if i actually need it. he emailed back that because my graphics card is 512mb and with me only having windows vista32bit which only supports upto 3.5gb, i would be better off getting a 1gb stick, unfortunantely i`d already got the 2gb one but im happy with. I think 8gb of ram is overkill. i`d find out what is the maximum it supports and get that.

[Robioto]

I've now gone for this (below), ordered. With a 24" LED screen, Mouse & Keyboard and couple of minor changes. It's going to cost £1250, it's £150 under my budget so I'm happy. I know may will say I've spent too much and although some will probably say I went overboard, I believe I have a great setup for my transition to becoming a PC gamer.

http://www.chillblast.com/Chillblast-Fusion-Thunderbird.html

[Robioto]

Thanks for all the advice, it's been a great help.

Bring on FM2013!

[stevie_G_32201]

I've now gone for this (below), ordered. With a 24" LED screen, Mouse & Keyboard and couple of minor changes. It's going to cost £1250, it's £150 under my budget so I'm happy. I know may will say I've spent too much and although some will probably say I went overboard, I believe I have a great setup for my transition to becoming a PC gamer.

http://www.chillblast.com/Chillblast-Fusion-Thunderbird.html

Overkill, but im sure it will play fm 5058 fairly easy

[Tyggis]

I still don't quite understand just how much having an SSD will affect game speed. Yes, it will save and load quicker, but will it process faster? If not,, why spend lots of money on it? I'm getting a new PC now, and I'm considering whether to prioritise RAM, processor or SSD. How much difference will I experience if I go for 6gb RAM compared to 4gb?

What would have the most impact on processing speeds in FM of a setup with a decent Sandy Bridge and SSD and a decent Ivy Bridge and HDD?

Thanks alot in advance for any help you guys could give!

[dazbowski]

Processor, Ram, SSD in that order in my opinion. All will speed things up though.

[hehehemann]

Make sure you on a 64bit version of windows to take advantage of RAM over 4GB

[Piethief100]

I still don't quite understand just how much having an SSD will affect game speed. Yes, it will save and load quicker, but will it process faster? If not,, why spend lots of money on it? I'm getting a new PC now, and I'm considering whether to prioritise RAM, processor or SSD. How much difference will I experience if I go for 6gb RAM compared to 4gb?

What would have the most impact on processing speeds in FM of a setup with a decent Sandy Bridge and SSD and a decent Ivy Bridge and HDD?

Thanks alot in advance for any help you guys could give!

For FM, an SSD won't make too much difference. Other games, however, can massively benefit. Not just that, but if you make your SSD your boot drive, your start up time will be slashed, and your desktop will become far more responsive. I'm not sure about somebody quoting £45 for a 120GB SSD, but they are certainly massively coming down in price, so it could well be worth it for you.

Having said that, drives and RAM are easily upgradable throughout the life of your computer. Your CPU is not easily upgradeable. Upgrading the CPU in a few years, will probably require a new motherboard, which will mean you'll have to buy new RAM too. All in all, once your CPU needs upgrading, it's probably time to get an entirely new computer, as such, make sure you get a CPU that will last.

About the RAM, yes FM can only use a fraction of that 4GB, but Windows will be using some of that in the background, so there isn't a full 4GB to go at, depending on what you have running in the background. RAM is so relatively cheap, that you might as well just go for 8GB.

Finally, addressing your Sandybridge vs Ivybridge point, beware that there is little performance difference between the two generations. Ivybridge is a smaller form (from 32 to 22 nm) which means less power consumption, and less heat, but generally the speeds are pretty much the same between the two architectures (I'm basing that on gaming benchmark tests between the two). The difference is of most relevance to enthusiasts who can take advantage of the changes to overclock a little more. You might as well get Ivybridge as I'm not aware of a big price drop on the old architecture, but it's not a huge issue to be concerned with.

[Tyggis]

Great answer. Ta.

[Wizard boy]

I've now gone for this (below), ordered. With a 24" LED screen, Mouse & Keyboard and couple of minor changes. It's going to cost £1250, it's £150 under my budget so I'm happy. I know may will say I've spent too much and although some will probably say I went overboard, I believe I have a great setup for my transition to becoming a PC gamer.

http://www.chillblast.com/Chillblast-Fusion-Thunderbird.html

Well at least its future proof. I got a full system for about £960 in 2008 and it is still capable of running most games at high res which is why i got it. Just got an extra 2gb of memory so fm should run really smooth.

[1984mattyd]

i brought a laptop in april which is an i7-2630 with 6gb of memory and i have about 30 leagues loaded up and it played perfect, no slowing down or anything and this was with flicking between going on the net and playing the game at the same time and the laptop cost me £400

[dazbowski]

I've just upraged from 4gb to 12gb as I tend to have about 100 internet sites open as well as playing FM and listening to music. I noticed a difference. I also got a SSD as I save the game weekly incase of crashes (one bitten and all that) so that also speeds my game up.

[spankie]

Did you go all Incredible Hulk on your RAM then daz?

[dazbowski]

you've lost me.

[spankie]

I've just upraged from 4gb to 12gb as I tend to have about 100 internet sites open as well as playing FM and listening to music. I noticed a difference. I also got a SSD as I save the game weekly incase of crashes (one bitten and all that) so that also speeds my game up.

Does that help?

And the fact that my sense of humor can be a little juvenile at times.

[dazbowski]

Ah I see now!

[Tyggis]

I'm considering getting the Samsung 530U3C-A0SE. It's got the i5-3317U, 6GB RAM, 128GB SSD, Intel HD Graphics 4000. Do you guys think FM will run smoothly on this setup, or do I need to go for a processor that isn't ULV?

[Wizard boy]

My Pc Specs

Windows vista 32bit

Intel Quad 2 Core 6600 2.4Ghz

Motherboard P5K3 Deluxe

Nvidia Geforce 8800 GTS 512

Samsung H/D 300GB

Memory Corsair XMS DDR3 2x1GB

Im thinking of getting windows 7 64bit. Just a few questions.

With vista a folder is created called windows old so old files can be taken out.

Can that still be done if i install windows 7?

Will it be compatible with older games?

How much difference will it make to my computer?