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I'm absolutely struggling on FM13! Posted about 10 days ago due to doing so poor with various saves. Now, another save has gone belly-up and I'm still struggling.

Norwich:

Got half-way through the season & got sacked for being in the relegation zone. Understandable as it's quite a hard challenge.

Arsenal:

Made too many signings and was in the bottom half after about 10 games. I quit due to frustration after poor results and no-one performing/improving.

West Brom:

Only made a couple of signings and played a 4-5-1 on counter / control depending on opposition. Ended up in the bottom three after 15 games

Swansea:

Same as West Brom to be honest, had 7/8 original players in the starting line-up and didn't go gung-ho either. Was in 16th place after 15 games.

Summary:

* Only win the easy games

* NEVER upset out of form title challengers e.g. Chelsea in 15th place

* NEVER beat slightly better teams at home e.g. Everton, Fulham and Newcastle with Swansea

* Players not performing consistently / at all

* Defence conceding goals like hell, even when I play a cautious approach e.g. 4-5-1

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Basically what should i do / what team should I manage? I've not done anything too extreme in my last two saves. I've played the game for over 10 years so it's not as if I don't know what I'm doing either.

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Hey man, I think we can all understand your frustration when you can't seem to settle in a game. I know it happens to me every year on release then within a few weeks i am away. The First question you have to ask is what are your expectations? I meant without trying to offend anyones favourite team here:

Norwich: AS you said a hard challenge but not impossible

Arsenal: Ok, Had a bad time but I think every FM'er has messed up big at some point and said what on earth was I doing

Swansea: This is pretty good actually and gives you something to build on for next year. BUt are you expecting a title tilt already??

Fm is a slow building game i find and expecting too much too quickly just leads to dissappointment. Do you think in real life there is a reason Aston Villa haven't beaten Man Utd at home for (i think) 20 years. Its because it doesn't happen often.

All I can say is stick in there with Swansea through thick and thin and evolve the club and look 2 - 3 years in the future that will keep you going

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I agree with Anderson's post here, it's important to remember (as you would know having played the game for 10 years) that FM success is not made over night, but when a new FM is released we seem to forget that sometimes because we want immediate success, which is understandable.

I'm halfway into my 6th season with QPR now and I still spend a lot of time working on my basic tactic: tweaking player instructions, training players in certain roles and skills etc. I think this is the biggest difference in this years game. Regardless of the ME acting up a bit, this game is by far the most realistic FM game ever! I certainly hope that the game will not become easier after the patch. I know a lot of people is struggling with success and will disagree with that statement, but when people start getting used to this game, everyone will relish the challenge and enjoy success! As someone who never upload or download tactics, I love reading threads where people don't get success with so called "unbeatable tactics". This style of playing doesn't give people the true FM experience, but everyone should try and get inspiration from others FM'ers!

I therefore wouldn't say that there are any specific teams you should mange, there are no teams that guarantee success. Swansea got relegated the first season in my QPR save by the way, mate, so 16th isn't that bad. I finished 4th in the Premier League that year, but that was only because I played a tactic that suited my squad, a classic 4-4-2 with defensive wingers. This isn't even a tactic I prefer my teams playing, and after that season I started, slowly, to sign players that would fit into my direct, counter attacking 4-5-1 philosophy. I changed too much the first summer, and finished on a lucky 5th. After that, I havent finished outside the top 4, and I reached the semi finals of the Champions League last year. But I spend a lot of time on this team, and I dont ignore any aspect of it. As an example, I have Christian Eriksen as my advanced playmaker, playing from central midfield position. He is absolutely world class, and sometimes scores some brilliant solo goals (as well as having something like 20 assists in 20 league games so far). I changed "run with ball" from sometimes to often yesterday to see if that would work better. I then watched a large part of my next game against Stoke in full time, only to spot the change in movement from Eriksen. And even though I thought it made sense (still do :)), watching the game in full for about 20 minutes, it became obvious that even though he would probably score some more nice goals this way when trying to dribble through the defense, it would reduce his number of assists.

Do you usually have a go-to tactic that you play with most teams? It seems really important to have more than one tactic to use against different opposition, or at least a tactic that can easily be tweaked to suit opposition in terms of "defensive line", "tempo" and "width" (the last two are the two main key adjustments I do when playing stronger/weaker teams). I now play a 4-3-3 direct style formation and every player I buy suits that style and suits certain roles. I also train my player roles, as well as technical/physical skills to fit into the system.

What kind of goals do you concede? Do you concede the same type of goals when playing, say Everton at home and Man City away? If yes, its your base defensive tactic that isn't working. If it's different, then its probably a sign that you need to adjust your tactics more to the teams you play. And I gotta say its really difficult to beat out-of-form top teams, they seem to find that form when I play them more often than not!

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You need a bit more patience. The first season in FM is always the hardest, if you can get through that then you've done alright. It doesn't matter what team you have, just stick with them and learn from your mistakes as you go along.

Also, watch the games as much as possible and use shouts to change things. This is the best advice I ever took from this forum, it seems obvious but it's amazing how many people set up a tactic and just watch commentary and expect to win. If you don't watch, you don't know what's going wrong.

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I was the same as you when I first started my save as FC united in the BSN I picked up 4 points in the first 12 games and I was on the verge of quitting. I stuck with it settled on a basic 442 tactic and once my players got used to eachother and the tactic we were flying. My FC united is now in it's first season in the premiership. I think this years fm it is very important that the squad are used to playing with each other and learn your tactics. On occasions where I have change tactic for a match I should win comfortably mor often than not I struggle or lose.

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I think perhaps managing in the premier league could be the issue? Perhaps start lower down the pyramid where there isn't as much pressure? Also, what are you setting your experience as at the start of the game? If you pick a low starting experience, the payers won't listen to you as much, your tactics and team talks don't have as much of an impact etc.

I tried a few games in Premier League, but despite having Chelsea top, Spurs 2nd and West Ham 5th around Christmas, I just wasn't enjoying the games. I started again as Luton Town, with Sunday League experience and I am loving every minute of it! Got to the 3rd Round of the FA Cup where I bagged a 2-2 draw with Newcastle United at home before beaing bashed 4-0 at St James' Park.

Try a team in league 1 or 2, give your self international experience and I reckon you will be okay.

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You need a bit more patience. The first season in FM is always the hardest, if you can get through that then you've done alright. It doesn't matter what team you have, just stick with them and learn from your mistakes as you go along.

Also, watch the games as much as possible and use shouts to change things. This is the best advice I ever took from this forum, it seems obvious but it's amazing how many people set up a tactic and just watch commentary and expect to win. If you don't watch, you don't know what's going wrong.

I definitely wish I hadn't of quit the Swansea game, it's just the previous game made me think 'here we go again'...

I wasn't aiming for anything extraordinary, I was just hoping for a comfortable mid-table position (8th - 12th) after strengthening a fairly strong side with Vorm, Williams, Taylor, Dyer, Michu, Hernandez and Graham. I find it hard managing unknowns, I would start with a League One side but I like to know most of the players & rate them so I don't have to sell the side and fail again

Edit: Starting a save with Pompey, solves the player problem as all of them are new players on short contracts :)

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Avoiding the urge to break out with the City High song "What would you do?" :)

I would just stick with it, I have found over the years its always tricky at first but then it clicks and starts to work and players play well enough for you...

When I buy the game I am going to start with either Cambridge utd or Lincoln. Either way I intend to stick with it!

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Just tried again with West Brom. 6 saves in and another failure. What is it with poor results at the start of EVERY save? Doing my head in, I pay for a game and it turns into yet another failure. I'D RATHER PLAY FIFA MANAGER FOR GOD SAKE!

You've clearly ignored all the advice you've been given, you may as well go and play FIFA as it sounds like FM is not for you.

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Have you set your management experience to International? Prem players aren't usually too happy about a complete unknown taking over for the first season. You also need to give the players (especially your new signings) time bed in, gel with each other and get used to your tactics.

FM, this year especially, is a slow burner and it can take a good season or two to reach your stride. Though given you've spat your dummy out in this thread already, I'm not sure if you have to perseverance needed to succeed this year.

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Yeah listen to the advises m8 - there are flaws in the ME though - I just lost yet a game to defensive bug and they are aware of it, but you cant blame it all on the ME tbh. Some cases it is tactics, morale, motivation, generel understanding of football and analyzes going wrong from a manager/you and sometimes not. It will be better I guarentee it - give it some time to fix what needs fixing.

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You've clearly ignored all the advice you've been given, you may as well go and play FIFA as it sounds like FM is not for you.

- I've already set my experience to international player

- Why should I manage in lower leagues? A) It shouldn't make a difference on how poor I do B) I want to manage in the PL and have every FM since CM01/02

- I'm not expecting to set the world alight in my first season, just to get a good set of results when I play against the worst teams in the league as I can't beat anyone else : Struggling to beat Norwich and Wigan on basically every save is not realism.

- In all of my saves one of them SHOULD have taken off; it's not realistic. How many managers make an instant impact as soon as they are appointed in the first 5/6 games? I'd say over 70% of them!

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One of the main problems I've found with the matchday is that my players take about 10 shots outside the box EVERY game and they always go horribly wide every time. Apart from changing player instructions to shoot less, is there a shout/way to get them to not do this so often??

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One of the main problems I've found with the matchday is that my players take about 10 shots outside the box EVERY game and they always go horribly wide every time. Apart from changing player instructions to shoot less, is there a shout/way to get them to not do this so often??

Nope. Happens to all of us.

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I can't get an Arsenal game going. I finished 6th on the pre-purchase beta, but 13th in the retail version which lead to me getting the sack. I did get sacked with AC Milan after 15 games though. I had great success with Stevenage (promoted in the first season after play-offs and ended 11th in my first season in the Championship, then signed too many players and ended 20th in my first season in the Championship), ended 6th with Udinese, won the league with Porto, but I stand no chance with Arsenal. I have copied the exact tactic and player instructions that I used with much success in FM12, but then again I had van Persie back then! :rolleyes:

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another game that has failed.

Managing swansea in january 2013, disabled window budgets so had to make do with my squad. Sitting in 15th place my record is now w-2 d-2 l-7.

Started okay, haven't said anything bad to my team - raised morale loads - team meetings, player meetings, positive in press conferences and team talks yet everyone has very poor morale and are playing awful!

Literally the worst FM ever. It's easy for someone to reply to this and say 'You're spitting your dummy out' or 'Its A or B', but I've never experienced anything like this on FM in over 10 years.

Can't believe how poor it is

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...How is that failed?

you've played a handful of games and aren't even in the relegation zone with the starting squad...

Absolutely terrible form, morale and results against average opposition.

Lost the last 5 games in a row including at home to QPR and Villa. If thats not failure I don't know what is, I steadied the ship in the first few games and it's impossible to get a decent result now with players consistently playing shocking or my previously good players turning shocking; I can't win - both on the game and in a literal sense.

EDIT - Nothings changed. After my first five games where I had 2 wins, 2 draws and a loss I signed 2 players: Anderson and Guidetti on loan. Anderson's started because Michu was awful and Guidetti on the bench. I update my training every week and make sure players aren't being trained too hard. My tactics aren't even unrealistic either

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another game that has failed.

Managing swansea in january 2013, disabled window budgets so had to make do with my squad. Sitting in 15th place my record is now w-2 d-2 l-7.

Started okay, haven't said anything bad to my team - raised morale loads - team meetings, player meetings, positive in press conferences and team talks yet everyone has very poor morale and are playing awful!

Literally the worst FM ever. It's easy for someone to reply to this and say 'You're spitting your dummy out' or 'Its A or B', but I've never experienced anything like this on FM in over 10 years.

Can't believe how poor it is

so you want it to be easy,its quite obvious you have zero patience 6+ saves in what 2 weeks(or 4)if you had the beta.

If and when the game gets near playable by your standards and you start winning on a regular basis you will moan its too easy.

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Still not sure how you can justify calling it bad on the basis that you aren't winning... when it's abundantly clear that other's are winning in the game fine..

On my experience. Do I have a notepad with a list of everyones saves? The law of averages/experience would at least show that one of these saves would not be a complete disaster.

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so you want it to be easy,its quite obvious you have zero patience 6+ saves in what 2 weeks(or 4)if you had the beta.

If and when the game gets near playable by your standards and you start winning on a regular basis you will moan its too easy.

Yes I had the better, I don't have zero patience; I just don't have any after a month of playing the game. I have paid my money so expect some sort of return. If you read the summary of my saves you would see that it's not just a matter of winning or losing. I'm not looking to win on a regular basis, I've roughly played around 120 games and won about 15 and that's managing Arsenal, West Brom twice, Swansea, Norwich twice.

Standards are drawn from experience. My experience of playing FM is a struggle half of the time, not every time I play.

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I understand the frustration.. and I swear this isn't me claiming to be a tactical genius or anything of the sort.

But i've got 3 or 4 saves on the go and i'm not seeing anywhere near the frustration you are having.

To suggest it's your tactics is a poison pill on the forums these days, and I don't do it lightly I assure you, but there must be something going wrong somewhere.

Have you tried, for experiment sake, downloading a tactic set or reading how others have had success on the Tactical Discussion section of the forums?

I hope you get some joy soon.

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I understand the frustration.. and I swear this isn't me claiming to be a tactical genius or anything of the sort.

But i've got 3 or 4 saves on the go and i'm not seeing anywhere near the frustration you are having.

To suggest it's your tactics is a poison pill on the forums these days, and I don't do it lightly I assure you, but there must be something going wrong somewhere.

Have you tried, for experiment sake, downloading a tactic set or reading how others have had success on the Tactical Discussion section of the forums?

I hope you get some joy soon.

Sorry to be seem a bit arsey, it's just I can't quite believe how nothing's working out for me & its doing my head in trying to get into FM13 with this going on. Cheers for the advice, I will DL one of the tactics and give them a go.

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Nooo not at all, I know what its like, this game is much harder than previous one's where one tactic and a bit of fiddling would win you the title by 20 points.

I just wanted to make sure I wasn't just blankly blaming you and saying 'it's your tactics'.

Give wwfan's stuff a bit of a read and see some of the tactics and give it at least 5-10 games to settle in...

Team cohesion makes a huge difference in this version.

Even for things like goalkeeper distribution... I'd had my GK set to play it short to a defender, and for the first 5 games, he didn't do it once. As the team got used to my tactics (using High team cohesion training, the keeper started listening to instructions and it all went smoother.

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I would do what I would think would happen irl..

I would start at the bottom. Lower league. Learn your trade down there then, learn the basics, take that experience and then try to earn a move to a bigger club by proving yourself at the lower leagues. Earn a reputation. When you are ready to manage the bigger clubs they will aproach you instead.

I think you learn alot about what works and what doesnt doing it that way.

Thats my opinion anyways

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Next two games.

Just lost 4-1 away to Norwich.

Just lost 1-0 at home to Wigan.

Brilliant.

Never again

even if your tactic is decent if your morale stinks results like yours happens.

Also your in first year of management just like AVBish you got to make the players trust and respect you,put up with bad(average)1st season and build from there.

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The problem with this thread is that you are only looking to vent. There is absolutely no usable information in any of your posts in here. If you want help, post pkm's, screenshots and tell us about the ideas behind your tactics in detail. I understand your frustration, even though I am first in L2 with Salisbury now, I have experienced periods of very bad play as well, and very irritating losses. We all do. By the looks of it, you do nothing about it and if that is right you deserve all the "it's your tactics" you can get.

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Indeed.. feel free to upload one of your saves, I'll gladly have a look and give you some feedback.

As will many others I'm sure.

But as Biggus has suggested, if this is merely a venting thread, it will be closed eventually as it serves no purpose here.

Help is to be had in the Tactical Discussion forums and Good player and Team guides.

If you are wanting to report issues or bugs with the game, do so in the Bug Reporting forums.

:)

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The problem with this thread is that you are only looking to vent. There is absolutely no usable information in any of your posts in here. If you want help, post pkm's, screenshots and tell us about the ideas behind your tactics in detail. I understand your frustration, even though I am first in L2 with Salisbury now, I have experienced periods of very bad play as well, and very irritating losses. We all do. By the looks of it, you do nothing about it and if that is right you deserve all the "it's your tactics" you can get.

Apologies, I'll start the second season and see how it pans out. If horrible, I'll post in full detail.

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What is your player moral like? Are you setting up pre-match training to defensive rather than default?

I found that if I had a couple of bad results I would look at my team and want to scream at them, this would often come out in my team talks and did nothing but make matters worse. In the end I had to praise them for doing well but losing, eventually their moral was superb and we went on to play really well. You won't win every game but if you do the prep work (training, man mark particular players and all that), then you'll stand more of a chance.

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Biggest thing to do is just persevere with it. On my Utd game I used the same tactics I did with FM12 and the 1st 2 seasons I finished second and 3rd season finished about 6th I think.

Wasn't enjoying it at all but made a few tweaks to the tactics and things started to turn around and then last season won the quadruple.

I definitely feel that 13 is harder but I just think that that makes it all the more better when you do get some success.

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Yes the game is very challenging, in fact i daresay its been the most challenging in years. In my first game save I won the title with Liverpool on the last day of the season, there were no easy matches; and I had to find myself at least one decent striker for that run to happen. In my second save which is documented on the tactics forums, I've just got my BSN side promoted to the BSP. It was the first time I failed to score 100 goals in one season. This time we managed to score a lot less but we still managed to win the league in our first season. The amount of work that went into that was shocking: twas a lot compared to other FMs. In fact we're now in our first season in the BSP we had a horrendous start failing to win any match in five games, all I did was focus on making sure we defended right.

Once I had discovered why we were struggling (apparently i got a bunch of shorties) I started paying a lot of attention to my game, matches I normally watch on key, became full matches for like 15 minutes. I stopped looking at the TV camera and started focusing on the 2D camera cos that says more about the shape of the team. The team have since climbed from the relegation zone to 10th in the league 5 points away from a playoff berth having playing 22 games.

Its a lot harder I admit, the engine has flaws but they arent game breaking. Defending is harder than usual because of certain "deadzones" on the pitch, but for people who pay attention to all this, they will find a way to manage this. Its very hard I admit, and i daresay i will be a bit sad when the patch rolls out.

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Yes the game is very challenging, in fact i daresay its been the most challenging in years. In my first game save I won the title with Liverpool on the last day of the season, there were no easy matches; and I had to find myself at least one decent striker for that run to happen. In my second save which is documented on the tactics forums, I've just got my BSN side promoted to the BSP. It was the first time I failed to score 100 goals in one season. This time we managed to score a lot less but we still managed to win the league in our first season. The amount of work that went into that was shocking: twas a lot compared to other FMs. In fact we're now in our first season in the BSP we had a horrendous start failing to win any match in five games, all I did was focus on making sure we defended right.

Once I had discovered why we were struggling (apparently i got a bunch of shorties) I started paying a lot of attention to my game, matches I normally watch on key, became full matches for like 15 minutes. I stopped looking at the TV camera and started focusing on the 2D camera cos that says more about the shape of the team. The team have since climbed from the relegation zone to 10th in the league 5 points away from a playoff berth having playing 22 games.

Its a lot harder I admit, the engine has flaws but they arent game breaking. Defending is harder than usual because of certain "deadzones" on the pitch, but for people who pay attention to all this, they will find a way to manage this. Its very hard I admit, and i daresay i will be a bit sad when the patch rolls out.

I find it ironic that SI has done their best to combat those who try beat the ME instead of the AI, and as a result of this effort of "improving the ME structurally" we are now all doing our best to make workarounds of several problems with the ME. Trying to fix the defensive problems by playing 5 men in the back and overloading the central midfield to combat the triangular ultra-possession play of the opposition midfielders is an attempt at beating the ME, not realistic tactical smartness.

It is a completely wrong type of challenge, just like starting with a Sunday-League Reputation is when you're not starting unemployed building a long-term career.

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- I've already set my experience to international player

- Why should I manage in lower leagues? A) It shouldn't make a difference on how poor I do B) I want to manage in the PL and have every FM since CM01/02

- I'm not expecting to set the world alight in my first season, just to get a good set of results when I play against the worst teams in the league as I can't beat anyone else : Struggling to beat Norwich and Wigan on basically every save is not realism.

- In all of my saves one of them SHOULD have taken off; it's not realistic. How many managers make an instant impact as soon as they are appointed in the first 5/6 games? I'd say over 70% of them!

My point about ignoring the advice was primarily my advice to stick with a team, don't just quit after 10 or 15 games if you don't have a brilliant start.

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On my experience. Do I have a notepad with a list of everyones saves? The law of averages/experience would at least show that one of these saves would not be a complete disaster.

It's not about laws of averages as this is not rolling the dice. It's about your ability to understand the match engine and use tactics efffectively. Doing this in previous versions doesn't mean it's exactly the same in FM13.

It sounds like you just want an instant win button to be happy.

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It's not about laws of averages as this is not rolling the dice. It's about your ability to understand the match engine and use tactics efffectively. Doing this in previous versions doesn't mean it's exactly the same in FM13.

It sounds like you just want an instant win button to be happy.

I feel that my side and squad have merited some form of success in my saves, even just mid-table in one of them and I'd be satisfied. Right, my tactics:

Home (4-2-3-1/4-5-1):

yidsx.png

Lesser sides/Similar sides:

Positions - Same as above

Strategy - Attacking against lesser teams and Control on similar sides looking to exploit weak defences below us in league & grind out wins against similar sides.

Shouts - Retain possession, exploit flanks

Better sides:

Positions - Different to picture: CAM moves to CM and ball winning midfielder so 4-5-1 formation

Strategy - Exploit flanks, early crosses

Shouts - Retain possession, counter attacks yes

---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Away (4-5-1):

hvqw03.png

Lesser sides

Positions - Same as above

Strategy - Counter, rigid

Shouts - Retain possession, exploit flanks

Similar Sides/Better Sides:

Positions - Same as above

Strategy - Counter rigid, direct passing, counter attacking yes

Shouts - Retain possession, hit early crosses

---------------------

Overall[/u]

- At home I don't like to go gung-ho regardless of opposition; I like to get most of the ball playing against most sides apart from the Top 4

- Away from home counter is used often regardless of opposition; more of an attacking stance against lesser/similar sides

- I use the ST in the best role and base my tactics around them e.g. Carroll as target man, pumping balls into box often

- These are my standard tactics

- I've found in many of my saves that I have a number of chances yet opposition score from very few chances

Notes

- This is my general strategy on FM13

- Trying to optimise my wingers while controlling middle of the park

- Defence is as important as attack yet I still get carved open

- Team talks are understanding and motivational, mainly what assistant tells me

Anyone offer any help?

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You might want to try -not- using Attacking against weaker sides, since that is the strategy people are using when they experience the same thing you do. Well, everyone experiences the same - the main aim against weaker sides which drops deep and go on the counter is to avoid them scoring. If you manage to do that, you'll win more often than not.

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