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Need help for counter attack


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Hello people. I would like to play a counter attack style of football in my away matches. I play a 4-4-2 and use the default settings because I heavily use shout combos to adjust the play style during the game. When I want to play counter attack I change my strategy to Counter attack and use the shouts:

Drop deeper, stay on feet, stand, pass into space, run at defense, stand off opponents, work ball into box

Now begins the problem :) When I have the ball and there is no opportunity to hit them on counter attack(for example I start my attacking from my goalkeeper). In this scenario I want to retain possession, slow down the game and waste some time...but when I steal the ball and there is an ooportunity to hit them with a counter attack, I would like to quickly play the ball forward.

In the first scenario, I want the retain possession shout, but in the second one I need the get ball forward. So how can I achieve both?since these 2 shouts are against one another. What is the right to use?

Also, when I change my strategy to counter attack, is the counter attack box automatically ticked/enabled?os should I do that manually?because in my attacking strategy I have it off.

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The Counter strategy is a slow tempo, deep strategy so will be more possession based by nature. If you win the ball in and your players deem it a countering opportunity then they will pour forward but other wise try to build up slowly.

With the shouts, I sometimes find that using stand-off, stay on feet and drop deeper can put your defence under too much pressure. I'd only use those shouts against teams that are a lot better than you.

If you're a bit more aggressive and use shouts like Hassle, push up and get stuck in then you might find you get more countering opportunities. You might also give away dangerous free kicks and technical teams will pass around the pressing and drag defenders all over the place.

I had asked for some help with countering recently and got some helpful replies. Have a quick read and see if any of it helps...

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php/345861-Please-Teach-Me-To-Counter-Attack...

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thanks a lot for the link :) it is very helpful indeed!If I use Hassle, push up and get stuck in, my team will lose its shape while I want them to stay back and keep their positions. Although as you said that ads pressure to my defense :( I have seen that FM match engine does not favor defensive tactics as it is alsmost sure that the opposite will score once you go defensive. But I want to play the game as close to reality as possible :) So When I play away with a better or same strength opposition I like to play defensive and counter..same if I play in my home with a strong opponent and I am leading the score, I also like to change to counter attacking.

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Just ticking the counter-attack box means that when you have a counter opportunity your team will take it and (to an extent) disregard your normal instructions during that phase.

When your team decides to enter a 'counter' phase is a little more difficult and its hard to establish exactly what happens. I would assume its a case of:

* Win back the ball

* Attackers start moving or getting into position to attack immediately

* Ball carrier decides to release those attackers with a pass and initiate the counter-attack or hold the ball, let the counter opportunity pass, and play normally.

If the above is true then it is really up to the intelligence (mainly decisions in this instance) of the ball carrier as to whether a counter is attempted or not, although it may be more complex than this as the attackers might also have to decide whether a counter is applicable (I suspect its the former that happens in FM).

If the counter box is not ticked then there is less opportunity that your team will enter a 'counter' phase so you'll see your normal instructions carried out more often (be those short, patient play or quick, direct, counter-style).

For me all your shouts look pretty logical and well thought out.

I play slightly differently in that I favour a more aggressive defence to win the ball back but then play direct counter-style stuff a lot of the time, although I think this is a different system to what you're after.

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Just ticking the counter-attack box means that when you have a counter opportunity your team will take it and (to an extent) disregard your normal instructions during that phase.

When your team decides to enter a 'counter' phase is a little more difficult and its hard to establish exactly what happens. I would assume its a case of:

* Win back the ball

* Attackers start moving or getting into position to attack immediately

* Ball carrier decides to release those attackers with a pass and initiate the counter-attack or hold the ball, let the counter opportunity pass, and play normally.

If the above is true then it is really up to the intelligence (mainly decisions in this instance) of the ball carrier as to whether a counter is attempted or not, although it may be more complex than this as the attackers might also have to decide whether a counter is applicable (I suspect its the former that happens in FM).

If the counter box is not ticked then there is less opportunity that your team will enter a 'counter' phase so you'll see your normal instructions carried out more often (be those short, patient play or quick, direct, counter-style).

For me all your shouts look pretty logical and well thought out.

I play slightly differently in that I favour a more aggressive defence to win the ball back but then play direct counter-style stuff a lot of the time, although I think this is a different system to what you're after.

that was very helpful. I understand it now :) If the players see the opportunity they will get it no matter what the shouts will be about tempo and passing.So what I can do with the shouts is to try and create the opportunity of a counter, not exactly how they will perform the counter attack...I understand the players attributes also..the player that will have the ball need to have creativity and anticipation to see the opportunity and also need to have decisions in order to decide if will benefit the team or not. I guess a ball playing defender will be much of help here for this role. Also my striker need to have good anticipation and off the ball to create a passing option for the ball carrier..I think I pretty much understand all the attributes well except the teamwork and work rate to be honest :) I mean I cannot "see" them inside the match..

So basically I drop deeper to drag them away from their own area, stay on feet to keep the shape of my formation and don't give them space to exploit. with these I create the opportunities to have a chance for a counter attack and after that it depends mostly on my players to use the opportunities right? So doesn't matter if I play a pass to feet/retain possession football because if I have the counter attack ticked and there is an opportunity and my players decide to grab it, they will ignore the pass to feet/retain possession and they will "pass into space/get ball forward"..am I understanding it right?

Get Ball Forward might be a good shout to use, to encourage those quick, incisive strikes. I have found it to be a great combo with Pass Into Space, which you're already using, when trying to hit an opponent on the break.

but that will mean that when I have the ball I will play it in a quick tempo and against a stronger opponent (which I want to use the counter strategy) will mean that I will give up ball very easy and I don't want to :)

PS. Sorry for my bad english :)

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So basically I drop deeper to drag them away from their own area, stay on feet to keep the shape of my formation and don't give them space to exploit. with these I create the opportunities to have a chance for a counter attack and after that it depends mostly on my players to use the opportunities right? So doesn't matter if I play a pass to feet/retain possession football because if I have the counter attack ticked and there is an opportunity and my players decide to grab it, they will ignore the pass to feet/retain possession and they will "pass into space/get ball forward"..am I understanding it right?

That's my understanding of it, but it really is constrained to the 'counter' phase. It's different when people say their team play a counter style.

The counter attack ticked box refers only to the 'counter' phase i.e. the phase immediately after winning back the ball, and it only happens if your team then initiate it. It's really a high risk/high reward strategy because if you do the counter poorly then you'll just be giving the ball back, although, if you're the smallest team with odds stacked against you then it's probably worth it!

A counter style, for me, is different in that it is a dedicated style of play that is direct, playing into space. You'll lose the ball and give it back sometimes, but when it works out you'll be on the ball, near their goal, probably in space so, again, high risk / high reward.

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but that will mean that when I have the ball I will play it in a quick tempo and against a stronger opponent (which I want to use the counter strategy) will mean that I will give up ball very easy and I don't want to :)

PS. Sorry for my bad english :)

Fair enough. Difference in strategy.

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