What does the AI Guardiola's 3-1-3-1-2 look like

[Uncle_Sam]

I asked this in the stupid questions thread but I suppose not enough people read that, or maybe nobody knows the answer. Anyway, I was poking around in the editor and I come across Pep Guardiola and it has his second preferred formation as a 3-1-3-1-2. Then I realized that I have never come across that tactic in my days with FM. My question is, what does the formation look like in FM. My guess was something like this:

DC--DC--DC
----DM----
MCR-MC-MCL
----AM----
--FC--FC--

But I would really like to see a screenshot of the AI using it in the game (not someone else's guess), or at least confirmation that that is what it is.

EDIT: The only other conceivable alignment would be if MR and ML instead MCR and MCL.

[yonko]

I don't think I've seen Guardiola use that formation in FM. Are you asking a question of what it could potentially look like in FM terms?

IMO it would look like this:

DR = FB-D

DC = BPD-C

DL = FB-D

DM = A-D

MCR = DLP-S

MCL = AP-S

AMR = W-A

AMC = AM-A

AML = W-A

STC = Treq

[Uncle_Sam]

No, it is listed as his second preferred formation. And if you get a team report from FC Bayern (or any club he is managing I assume) it will list it in the tactics bit, unfortunately it does not offer a picture of the formation in the Team Report. So he does use it. But I have never played against Pep in the game, and was hoping someone else had seen him use so that I didn't have to setup a game just to watch in the hopes that he switches to it during the match.

[DBurns]

Something like this?

[Uncle_Sam]

I'm running out ways to say it. I'm not looking for an analysis of what it is in real life, I'm looking for what the formation looks like in FM.

[majorkong]

I'm running out ways to say it. I'm not looking for an analysis of what it is in real life, I'm looking for what the formation looks like in FM.

Caught him using it, but he was down to 10 men, so I'm not certain where one player lines up. But it was like this:

GK

DC - DC - DL

DMC

MR - MC

AMC

ST - ST

My guess is that with 11 men, there's another MC but it could be an ML. He used it against a flat 3-4-2 that was also down to 10 men.

Incidentally, this thread interested me because I created a 3-1-3-1-2 tactic myself which lines up the same way as Pep's formation except the AMC is an AML in my tactic, and there are two MCs.

[majorkong]

Here's a screenshot.

[Uncle_Sam]

I was hoping it was with an MR and ML instead MCR and MCL. Thanks, I appreciate it.

[SnUrF]

Caught him using it, but he was down to 10 men, so I'm not certain where one player lines up. But it was like this:

GK

DC - DC - DL

DMC

MR - MC

AMC

ST - ST

My guess is that with 11 men, there's another MC but it could be an ML. He used it against a flat 3-4-2 that was also down to 10 men.

Incidentally, this thread interested me because I created a 3-1-3-1-2 tactic myself which lines up the same way as Pep's formation except the AMC is an AML in my tactic, and there are two MCs.

Funny looking thing. Doubt I have ever seen the AI use asymmetrical formation.

-SnUrF

[soccer.joel]

Weird formation

[Puni]

Looks like an attempt to recreate Barcelona's formation. Two central defenders and a left back, Alves high up the pitch (hence the MR), a DM to link up play, two central midfielders (Xavi - Iniesta) someone in the hole (Messi) and the two strikers should actually be all the way out wide.

[majorkong]

Looks like an attempt to recreate Barcelona's formation. Two central defenders and a left back, Alves high up the pitch (hence the MR), a DM to link up play, two central midfielders (Xavi - Iniesta) someone in the hole (Messi) and the two strikers should actually be all the way out wide.

Yup, exactly what I thought. In fact I had where Alves plays in mind when I created my 3-1-3-1-2 formation. I had a newgen MR/AMR who was going to amazing, but I normally play a narrow formation that doesn't use those positions, so I tried to retrain him to DR. But he must have Adaptability of 1 because he didn't learn even the first tick of DR after a long time. But he had the physical and defensive stats to get by, so I just made him a WM(d) and dropped the right back still playing only two center backs. It works great. The guy is a monster on the right. Tracks back (mostly) on defense and bangs in assists.

Like you said, I think the AI's system is a little bit off up front. IMO, the AMC should play out wide to AML, and one of the two guys up front should play as a DLF or TREQ. Probably the left striker role should be the "Messi" role and withdraw, but I did it the other way.

If anyone is curious to try the formation out, here are the roles I used

-------- SK ---------

---- DCd - DCd - FBs

------- DLPd --------

WMd-CMs-CMa-------

------------------Wa

-----DLFa--Pa-------

[yonko]

No, it is listed as his second preferred formation. And if you get a team report from FC Bayern (or any club he is managing I assume) it will list it in the tactics bit, unfortunately it does not offer a picture of the formation in the Team Report. So he does use it. But I have never played against Pep in the game, and was hoping someone else had seen him use so that I didn't have to setup a game just to watch in the hopes that he switches to it during the match.

I didn't know that such formation is listed as his second preferred formation.

Well, as you know I have a Dortmund save going on and I'm in the 3rd season, so I'll be looking out if he uses it against me. So far he hasn't. Last season I played 4 times against his Bayern M side - won both league games 2-1, tied 0-0 the 1st CL quarter-final leg and won the return leg 1-0.

[Chr1s Lawson]

Isn't that the early/mid 90's Barca formation, where they had a DMC playing in AMC (Bakero I think) with the objective being to close down opposition defenders as quickly as possible? Guardiola would've played under that!

[Uncle_Sam]

Ive been playing around with it, it's pretty effective. I set it up as such:

DC - Central Defender/Defend

DC - Central Defender/Defend

DL - Wingback/Attack

DM - Defensive Midfielder/Defend

MR - Winger/Attack

MCR - Deep Lying Playmaker/Support

MCL - Center Midfielder/Support

AM - Attacking Midfielder/Attack

FCR - Deep Lying Forward/Support

FCL- Deep Lying Forward/Attack

[steakfaced]

Isn't that the early/mid 90's Barca formation, where they had a DMC playing in AMC (Bakero I think) with the objective being to close down opposition defenders as quickly as possible? Guardiola would've played under that!

http://www.barcablaugranes.com/2012/2/7/2781755/sergio-busquets-as-a-false-enganche

[ModernLefty]

Nice article steakfaced, another interesting tactical idea to add to the repertoire

[Chr1s Lawson]

http://www.barcablaugranes.com/2012/2/7/2781755/sergio-busquets-as-a-false-enganche

Nice one Steakface, glad to know my memory serves me correctly!

[Cleon]

http://www.barcablaugranes.com/2012/2/7/2781755/sergio-busquets-as-a-false-enganche

Nice article steakfaced, another interesting tactical idea to add to the repertoire

Nice one Steakface, glad to know my memory serves me correctly!

There is actually a post on here about it;

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php/348276-Mechanising-the-Play-The-Defensive-Enganche

[steakfaced]

There is actually a post on here about it;

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php/348276-Mechanising-the-Play-The-Defensive-Enganche

I think that's how I found the article originally, too. It's a fun tactic to play around with especially when you get more regens at AMC capable of good defending.

[ModernLefty]

Cleon, read that before, missed the article, so I was glad he brought it to my memory, because then I re-found that tactical post and this time its stored and bookmarked, lovely circle.

[SnUrF]

Playing ATM against At. Madrid managed by Guardiola and they started with 31312. Thats 3 CDs, 1 DM, ML-MC-MR, AM & 2 STs. So to the question in the op I believe thats the answer.

-SnUrF

[ModernLefty]

Uncle_Sam if you're still interested, the shape is found in post 60, of this thread, Guardiola is managing Granada. As proved by the post below it.

[RTHerringbone]

As per ModernLefty's post above, the formation on the right is Guardiola's 3-1-3-1-2, fairly obvious how to nullify and beat it:

[grimness]

Yep. One on the right is also Bielsa's second or third formation. Might seem weird but it's not depicting RL starting shape, but rather end of the move positioning of 4-3-3 with inside forwards and deep lying central forward.

[Uncle_Sam]

Uncle_Sam if you're still interested, the shape is found in post 60, of this thread, Guardiola is managing Granada. As proved by the post below it.

Awesome, thanks

[oguzcan11]

Ive been playing around with it, it's pretty effective. I set it up as such:

DC - Central Defender/Defend

DC - Central Defender/Defend

DL - Wingback/Attack

DM - Defensive Midfielder/Defend

MR - Winger/Attack

MCR - Deep Lying Playmaker/Support

MCL - Center Midfielder/Support

AM - Attacking Midfielder/Attack

FCR - Deep Lying Forward/Support

FCL- Deep Lying Forward/Attack

Could you tell your team instructions?

[Uncle_Sam]

Could you tell your team instructions?

Nothing special.

Passing: Shorter

Creative Freedom: Default

Closing Down: Default

Tackling: Default

Marking: Zonal

Crossing: Float

Roaming: More Roaming

I have playmakers ticked as none because I don't want the ball being forced to anyone. I also have Focused Passing ticked as mixed because of the shouts I use, which are: Play Narrower, Play Through Defense, Work Ball Into Box, Retain Possession. The shouts are to give my team a short passing, possession style of football. They keep my players close together and reduce the dribbling and shots from distance.

[Barkers]

im guessing its only in his profile as he was a big fan of and mentored a little by Bielsa at Bilbao and that is his go to setup since the days he was coaching Chile.