Player transfer fees are way too high?

[ivanro]

Hi guys, sorry it this has been addressed before, but I haven't been back to these forums for a long while now, just playing the game year after year, never even bothered with the forums unless to get a tactic or two.

Anyway, something about this year's version is bothering me : players' transfer fees.

I'm in the summer of 2014, just finished 2013/2014 doing the double with Liverpool, finally reclaiming the league and winning the Euro. Anyway, I'm trying to strengthen my squad and the transfer fees asked by my targets' clubs are so astonishingly high they're dumb and unrealistic.

For example, I wanted to get Jack Butland to cover for Reina. His current value is around 4-ish million dollars. I thought that around 10-ish would be an acceptable value, I was even willing to go as high as 20 for a goalie. So I kept tabling offer after offer and they kept rejecting and rejecting until somewhere around 15, they said that they wanted 38 for Butland. Thirty-friggin’-eight! That value, to me, is just very unrealistic. This is a goalie, after all, and not even among the best goalies in the world, such as ter Stegen, Courtuis, etc. I offered 20 take-it-or-leave-it, and they left it. And this is after Butland had submitted transfer request, and still Stoke wouldn't budge.

I tried for John Ruddy, and they (I don’t remember the club) asked for 26. Nope, that wouldn’t do.

I tried for ter Stegen, of course, and they wanted somewhere in the 40’s for him. I gave up.

Then I tried to sign Christian Eriksen from Ajax, and he finally moved to Man City for 48 million. I didn’t want to pay that much since I believed it to be too unrealistic. Somewhere in the 30s, sure, but not close to 50.

I put in a cheeky bid for Neymar, who was unsettled at Santos, and Santos would let him go for 78 million. I would’ve willingly given in 50 for a player of his caliber, but not 78.

I guess what I’m trying to say is that the above numbers are just too unrealistic and inflated, in my opinion. And it’s not exactly uncommon, because I see other (big) clubs signing players at seemingly high numbers : Falcao moving for 40s or 50s, M’Villa moving for 30s, basically I see a lot of fees in the 40s and above flying around, and my common sense can’t accept that. Yet.

Anyway, any of you guys feeling the same way? Is it because I just won the double, my budget now in the 70s so every club hikes their prices when they deal with me? Or is it something else?

Cheers.

[podunkboy]

I'm sure they know what's in your pocket and they all want a big part of it. Maybe they don't have a favorable opinion of you yet. I don't know any sport where a team won't try to maximize their fees for giving up a valuable player.

[Guest]

As usual there are a number of factors at play.

One of the major issues is money as by & large the clubs that have the best players tend to become cash rich or have a chairman who allows a large transfer budget, this creates a situation where the club does not need to sell which then hikes up the asking price for players.

Other factors include players not being strong enough to force the move & clubs not looking forward to realise that if they sell player A they can reinvest that money to get players B & C.

Contrary to what some people might say the AI club has no knowledge of your exact transfer budget, they will be aware of you having a large budget & this might see them pushing their luck but how is that any different to how clubs deal with PSG, Monaco, Man City & other super rich clubs?

[Smurf]

Usually it's because the club don't want to sell a player, so they'll hike up the price. You have to haggle keep going back and forth.

For a 20m rated player I'll offer 20m upfront. When that gets rejected I try 15m up front and 10m over 48 months.

Then 10m up front and 15m over 36 months

Then 9m up front and 17m over 36 months

etc. until I get the player.

Note I am only going up by 1m each time, by reducing upfront payments by 1m and upping the 36month by 2m.

On another note - I sold Jordi Alba for 48m last night - was well chuffed with that - offered him for 50m and Man Utd, Many City and one other went for him. I rejected Many City because they only offered 30m.

The Board reaction thing said the Fans were surprised with Albas departure by couldn't complain because of the fee received.

It's ok I have David Alaba and Baines and just got Chielini - Alba couldn't get a look in for the last 2 seasons anyway.

[Jean-Luc]

If I look at the "highest transfers of the year" stats in my saves, they are mostly in the range of 30 to 50 million.

That's less than in real life, where we have the famous 90 million or 60 million transfers. You mentioned Falcao. He just switched to Monaco for 60 million, so what you experience is actually very realistic.

So from that point of view, transfer fees are just about right or even too cheap.

As somebody mentioned, this is also about teams not really wanting to sell their players. Which is also a very smart and realistic behaviour, similar to Human players. If I have a wonderkid in my team, I would not let him go for market price. I also would not let him go for tripled market price. If somebody comes in with an insanely huge bid, then I'd probably consider.

Buying "the big boys" is always more expensive. There's a price tag on the attributes as well as on the name of the player. Quite often, you can get just as good players for much less money if they are not yet famous. I think FM captures that spirit quite well, actually.

[Smurf]

Also down to contract length - if they've only signed a new deal or on a long term deal it costs a lot more to buy a player. If they are valued at €30m and have 5 years left on their contract then the AI won't sell them for market price, and ask for a lot more.

If they have only a year left you can usually get them at a good price. Very much like real life, we see Ronaldo going for €80m, Falcao for €60m, Cavani touted at €68m etc. But the likes of Van Persie went for $20m to Man Utd cos his contract was coming up and it was sell now or lose him for nothing scenario. Even Andy Carroll went for £35m because Liverpool needed a striker and it was very last minute so the price went up on a player Newcastle didn't want to lose.

[BiggusD]

I think the prices of top players aren't overexaggerated in FM13. The problem is more the cost of buying players that are not highly regarded by their clubs, and players at smaller/poorer clubs.

A player from the Norwegian league will go for £2-3m max regardless of age and how rich the club is. The same should be the case with other comparable leagues around the world, but these clubs also want 20-30m for their players in FM - often much more than the entire club is worth. That is unrealistic.

First Team keepers of other clubs in the same league will be very expensive to buy, just as they are in RL.

By the way, why would you want to use that much money for a backup player? Sign a 17-year-old supertalent instead and let him play for the youth and reserves and in cup matches. When it is time for Reina to step down he will be ready and homegrown. I don't have backup players at my club. Only First, Rotation (playing roughly the same amount of matches) and hot prospects. As long as the young keeper is of Premier League quality (CA) he will do well enough when given the chance in the right matches.

[Jean-Luc]

Actually, I have a much bigger problem with stuff happening like Dortmund selling Götze for €40m to Man City, Schmelzer for €30m to Chelsea and Großkreuz for €30m to PSG... and then not buying any new players.

In general, I wouldn't mind certain clubs holding on to their players even more tightly. Bayern would not sell 3 out of their Back Four, as they quite often do in my saves. They would keep Badstuber, even if Chelsea offers €50m.

[andyinuk]

Also I think in the game, after a few seasons most clubs are cash rich or at least secure. While in RL the situation seem to be much different.

[Smurf]

A player from the Norwegian league will go for £2-3m max regardless of age and how rich the club is. The same should be the case with other comparable leagues around the world, but these clubs also want 20-30m for their players in FM - often much more than the entire club is worth. That is unrealistic.

Well Newcastle held out for £35m for Carroll and got it.

Alan Shearer was a record £15m at the time.

If you want top player quality you pay top price http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transfer_%28association_football%29

If you sort that list by year, you'll see top players going for extraordinary amount of money - in 1999 to pay £45 for any player was mad money.

You'll notice that the price of top players in the last 10 years is around £35-90m

[ivanro]

Thanks, guys, for your responses *thumbsup*

I get what you're all trying to say, with the examples that you're giving.

But returning back to the case that I have :

Butland -- The club asks for 38, is it really realistic? I'm willing to go for 20. If IRL any club offers 20 for Butland, then Stoke will bite their hands off.

ter Stegen -- Really worth 40? Really?

Eriksen -- Sure, Falcao, Cavani and the likes are worth upwards of 50, but Eriksen at 48? Really?

[Cougar2010]

Thanks, guys, for your responses *thumbsup*

I get what you're all trying to say, with the examples that you're giving.

But returning back to the case that I have :

Butland -- The club asks for 38, is it really realistic? I'm willing to go for 20. If IRL any club offers 20 for Butland, then Stoke will bite their hands off.

ter Stegen -- Really worth 40? Really?

Eriksen -- Sure, Falcao, Cavani and the likes are worth upwards of 50, but Eriksen at 48? Really?

You are misunderstanding the game and sales technique in general.

They aren't wanting £38m for Butland as such, they are trying to say "Not for sale" and want you to stop bidding/move onto other targets.

In terms of sales technique what generally happens is that bidders start low, sellers start high and they meet somewhere in the middle. What was your first offer (£10m?), why are you making a starting bid that high for a keeper valued at £4m? Your starting point should be £4m at the most (I would have started at £2m) or made an enquiry. With this in mind sellers almost never accept the first offer and presume bidders will always start lower than what they are willing to pay.

If we look at the Butland case further, you say you've had £20m rejected and that IRL Stoke would bite their hands off but the game is slightly different. How long does he have on his contract? Is he happy at Stoke? Do they need the money? Can they replace him? Do they really want to sell him to a league rival?

Now that he has handed in a transfer request the situation changes and if you use the media interaction you should be able to get an offer accepted in the £10m-£15m region I would say.

[Kenco]

Clubs are asking for a lot to ward you off because they don't want to sell.

The best thing to do is try to unsettle the player by using the occasional bid and making media comments saying how much you admire him/want to sign him. If he wants to join you, he may put in a transfer request or force the club to transfer list him, which will bring the price down considerably.

The fact is, it's hard to just go out and buy a player like older versions. Sometimes it can take months or even years to land some of your targets, which is realistic and I'm glad the game works like this.

[Smurf]

Thanks, guys, for your responses *thumbsup*

I get what you're all trying to say, with the examples that you're giving.

But returning back to the case that I have :

Butland -- The club asks for 38, is it really realistic? I'm willing to go for 20. If IRL any club offers 20 for Butland, then Stoke will bite their hands off.

ter Stegen -- Really worth 40? Really?

Eriksen -- Sure, Falcao, Cavani and the likes are worth upwards of 50, but Eriksen at 48? Really?

You can unsettle players. Take to the Media and say you'll do anything to sign Eriksen. You'll see Eriksen respond that he couldn't turn down your club. A day later he'll become unhappy or hand in request - then you can get him cheaper.

Same would happen for Butland

And I just signed Stegen in my game for €38m - but I don't mind he's 21 and will mind the posts for the next 15 seasons.

But you could probably unsettle them by going through the media.

[Mattias333]

Actually, I have a much bigger problem with stuff happening like Dortmund selling Götze for €40m to Man City, Schmelzer for €30m to Chelsea and Großkreuz for €30m to PSG... and then not buying any new players.

In general, I wouldn't mind certain clubs holding on to their players even more tightly. Bayern would not sell 3 out of their Back Four, as they quite often do in my saves. They would keep Badstuber, even if Chelsea offers €50m.

Agree, I've seen similar things with other clubs...but it does happen in real life to. Quite often as fans, people question how the club has sold its main players and not re-invested.

God im a life long home and away Norwich fan and I remember the early Premier League years when (believe it or not) we were a regular top quatre of the table side even reaching the dizzy heights of 3rd....then we suddenly sold all our key players like Sutton, Fox etc....and never replaced them and we dropped like a lead ballon.

[janesy20]

I agree with the OP to an extent and i was just thinking this. Tom Ince my scout reports around £20m for him yet IRL he's going for £8m. but 99.9% of the time on football manager the player you want to buy is good, i often get £40m+ for tomas muller on a Bayern game but reject it because i want to keep it.

Although i do think it's unfair that the AI want £38m for butland, but if it was the other way round and they had offered you £10m butland and you had gone to negotiate even £5m more they usuallly withdraw. Or when you transfer list players they are reluctant to pay the value sometimes. Who knows, all I know is i'm addicted to FM!

[Guest]

That's the think with transfer AI, people are quick to claim that prices are too high but I think just as many people were more than happy to use the asking price bug to stop AI sides bidding for their players.

It often comes across as a case of one rule for them but another for us kind of approach from FM'ers.

[Sikker]

I agree that players in general are too expensive. On the other hand, though, it's also too easy to keep players at own club when AI bids good money. When you reject the offer the player's agent demands a better contract. You reject, now player demands a new contract, you reject again and tell the player he still has time left on his contract. Case closed.

Imo opinion money should matter more. Lower offers should be accepted because the player wants to be able to get a higher salary than at current club (not just because of higher club rep - maybe you should be able to negotiate a contract with a player even before a deal has been made with the club).

Also it seems there are too much money in FM. Too often mid level clubs don't need £20-30M for mediocre-good players.