Training related questions

[MTM1977]

I have read quite a few guides about training, but i am still unclear about some aspects.

1. Individual training for older players?

Should they be on role specific training, certain attribute training, or without individual training?

I have kept my players on role specific, hoping that their key stats would decline slower.

2. Improving player suitability for role?

Let's say that i have a left defender, who is 4 star in limited full back, but only 1 star in full back.

What is the best way to make him more efficient as full back?

I have usually set individual training to full back and then played him in that position, regardless that he is not very good at it (at least not yet).

3. Training intensity during season?

I am currently managing semi-pro team, so training days per week are not that many. In fear of injuries i have set the training level to average. Would it make sense to set it higher?

What about with pro teams training during season, what is good level?

I am only at start of the season, so my team training has been only tactics so far, as these semi-pro teams seem to be quite slow in adapting the tactics.

[Steve Odom]

1 Choose what you think is necessairy: if he really is decling physically: choose some physical so he would at least have enough stamina to finish the game. More game time will mean he declines less in the future.

2 Choose the attributes he is lacking in to fulfill that role to focus on. You can see those when first choosing the desired role. Don't focus on the stars for each role too, they might have a lot of impact in your team if they lack the 'stars' but fulfill the requirements of your tactics.

3 Managing semie pro's or Pro's doesnt matter for the intensity. Just train the way CLeon does in this thread. The only differnce is the match training, but that doesn't affect your intesnity as a whole.

[petergoddard]

what about general training intensity ? does it influence how much time a player takes to have a ppm ???

[Rob4590]

Following Cleon's advice - the total training = general training plus individual training (of which PPM training is part). Therefore if you put general training to low - that then allows more individual training - and therefore more PPM training by deduction.

[petergoddard]

Thanks Rob. I have already set general training to low and in each player I have set individual training to light, so each of my players have individual training 20% and ppm training 80% but still they take too long to have the ppm's.

[phnompenhandy]

Thanks Rob. I have already set general training to low and in each player I have set individual training to light, so each of my players have individual training 20% and ppm training 80% but still they take too long to have the ppm's.

That seems unbalanced to me. I put General on low and all individual training on heavy - it still leaves to overall training schedule as light and keeps injuries down. You seem to be sacrificing everything to the altar of PPMs. PPMs aren't much use if the player has rubbish attributes (e.g. Likes to lob the keeper: finishing 4)

[Cleon]

Agree with Phnom above.

Also you can't speed PPM training up.

[MTM1977]

That seems unbalanced to me. I put General on low and all individual training on heavy - it still leaves to overall training schedule as light and keeps injuries down. You seem to be sacrificing everything to the altar of PPMs. PPMs aren't much use if the player has rubbish attributes (e.g. Likes to lob the keeper: finishing 4)

This was a good piece of information.

Although, i think that with my current team (semi-pro, not so talented players) could be better to keep the general training higher and individual on lower?

[Cleon]

This was a good piece of information.

Although, i think that with my current team (semi-pro, not so talented players) could be better to keep the general training higher and individual on lower?

Even though you are low level and have rubbish players, you can still try and make them the best player they possibly can be surely?

[Rob4590]

Thanks Rob. I have already set general training to low and in each player I have set individual training to light, so each of my players have individual training 20% and ppm training 80% but still they take too long to have the ppm's.

Wasn't quite what I meant - the first bit - yes - put general on low. But then put individual on heavy (so more time / energy is spent on it).

I'd look at it in terms of 'hours spent' on each part: (please note figures are made up examples):

If you do LOW training level (either team or individual) = 10 hours spent per week

Medium = 20 hours, heavy = 30 hours

So a 'normal' working week (40 hours) would sensibly be divided as either Team Low (10) + Ind Heavy (30) = 40 total, or both on Medium (2 * 20) etc

So assuming we go with the first option (as Cleon tells us is best) - Team Low, plus Ind Heavy.

This means that we have 30 hours on the individual bits (training role or skill, plus new position, plus PPM). If we want role + PPM, I believe (don't have FM in front of me) that it is 43% role, plus 57% PPM - so logic says about 12/13 hours (43% of 30) on role plus 17/18 hours on PPM (57% of 30)

If you went both at medium, logic would say you then only spend 12 hours (57% of 20 hours) on PPM.

@Cleon - your post contradicts (LOGICALLY) your advice in your training threads. However - you know the system better than I do, so I'm not going to argue with you that it is actually correct (in game) - FM and logic don't ALWAYS go hand in hand!

[Cleon]

@Cleon - your post contradicts (LOGICALLY) your advice in your training threads. However - you know the system better than I do, so I'm not going to argue with you that it is actually correct (in game) - FM and logic don't ALWAYS go hand in hand!

No it doesn't contradict at all. How does is contradict? Please explain.

[MTM1977]

Even though you are low level and have rubbish players, you can still try and make them the best player they possibly can be surely?

True

I will try to focus more on the individual training and see what kind of results i can get with that.

I actually just started a new game, so it gives me good platform to test it.

Pre-season going now, i have general training in Fitness (very high) and match training in tactics. All individual training on roles (average).

After pre-season i will change the training balance to focus more on the individual side.

Based on your guide, i booked friendlies only with opponents which are even weaker than my team. (morale building).

[Rob4590]

No it doesn't contradict at all. How does is contradict? Please explain.

Sorry but it DOES contradict - your training threads basically state that doing low general training allows you to do more individual training without increasing the total workload. If you are doing more individual workload (which includes a %-age of that time spent on PPMs) then LOGIC says you are doing more work on your PPMs - which again LOGICALLY says that the PPM should be learned quicker. You have now stated above that they are NOT learned quicker - therefore the contradiction.

[Cleon]

Sorry but it DOES contradict - your training threads basically state that doing low general training allows you to do more individual training without increasing the total workload. If you are doing more individual workload (which includes a %-age of that time spent on PPMs) then LOGIC says you are doing more work on your PPMs - which again LOGICALLY says that the PPM should be learned quicker. You have now stated above that they are NOT learned quicker - therefore the contradiction.

No its not a contradiction you just got mixed up.

Spending more time on a PPM does not mean its learnt faster, it means more chance of it being successful and not learning it faster. I have never said this in any thread ever, so before saying I've said something when I've not be sure what you are saying because this is how rumours start.

You can train a Focus, Position and Preferred Move if you wish to, but they will eat into each other's time, rather than into general training. Individual training does NOT come out of general training - it is added together to create an overall workload

Having both high would mean a higher workload which increases the chance of injuries because the workload is higher. So you choose low for general to lower the overall workload so the players can handle it.

So please don't say I've said something when I've not and you've misunderstood

[petergoddard]

Wasn't quite what I meant - the first bit - yes - put general on low. But then put individual on heavy (so more time / energy is spent on it).

I'd look at it in terms of 'hours spent' on each part: (please note figures are made up examples):

If you do LOW training level (either team or individual) = 10 hours spent per week

Medium = 20 hours, heavy = 30 hours

So a 'normal' working week (40 hours) would sensibly be divided as either Team Low (10) + Ind Heavy (30) = 40 total, or both on Medium (2 * 20) etc

So assuming we go with the first option (as Cleon tells us is best) - Team Low, plus Ind Heavy.

This means that we have 30 hours on the individual bits (training role or skill, plus new position, plus PPM). If we want role + PPM, I believe (don't have FM in front of me) that it is 43% role, plus 57% PPM - so logic says about 12/13 hours (43% of 30) on role plus 17/18 hours on PPM (57% of 30)

If you went both at medium, logic would say you then only spend 12 hours (57% of 20 hours) on PPM.

@Cleon - your post contradicts (LOGICALLY) your advice in your training threads. However - you know the system better than I do, so I'm not going to argue with you that it is actually correct (in game) - FM and logic don't ALWAYS go hand in hand!

I'm assuming that more time spent in percentage means more hours of training, its logic. So if I set individual training to medium or heavy this will decrease the time spent on ppm training and increase the individual training. I'm already setting 80% on ppm training but still players take too long to get the ppm, generally almost 2 months.

I don't have players with rubbish attributes :-)

[MTM1977]

Another question.

This time about general training.

Would it be better to have it set for example:

1 month attacking, 1 month defending and so on.

or would it be better to have 1 or 2 weeks per area?

Or would something else be much better

[swallow1050]

You could just do balanced, I think it would be the same effect over a season?

[Cleon]

Another question.

This time about general training.

Would it be better to have it set for example:

1 month attacking, 1 month defending and so on.

or would it be better to have 1 or 2 weeks per area?

Or would something else be much better

Well if you're trying to create a balanced all round schedule you'd just leave it on balanced all the time. It's pointless putting it on one month cycles.

You should read this, it explains everything to do with training and how it works;

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php/375145-The-Santos-Project-Tactical-and-Player-Development

[remembertofeedthecat]

Apologies to the OP for hijacking their thread but I have a question that ties into their first question above.

I often wonder what to do with older players in terms of training. Just started a Man City save and I'm in a bit of a quandry as to what I should do with Jesus Navas.

I intend playing him as a winger. His balance attribute (9) is terrible but the rest of the important attributes are very good.

https://imageshack.com/i/3oxtm3j

I'm kinda thinking it's going to be difficult for an older, well developed (CA stars = PA stars) to improve this stat much.

He's a quality player but he's no Messi. If I put him training balance then he'll be redistributing CA from some of his strengths.

Not sure it's worth it - maybe I should just be happy with his stats as they are and get him to train for his role of Winger-Support?

What ye reckon?

[ntw001]

1. Definitely depends. I have 2 great CBs in my team. 1 is 30 the other is 32. Both are starting to decline physically. They were never the quickest in the first place. I put them on individual training for 'quickness', and their acceleration and pace actually went up rather than declining! On the other hand I have a 35 yr old RB who is a machine, so I keep him on role training.

In short - I don't think individual attribute training is wasted on older players.

[remembertofeedthecat]

1. Definitely depends. I have 2 great CBs in my team. 1 is 30 the other is 32. Both are starting to decline physically. They were never the quickest in the first place. I put them on individual training for 'quickness', and their acceleration and pace actually went up rather than declining! On the other hand I have a 35 yr old RB who is a machine, so I keep him on role training.

In short - I don't think individual attribute training is wasted on older players.

Cool - I'll give it a shot so. Will be interesting to see how it goes over a season or two. Of course he may have been replaced by a Wunderkind by then!

[TheeDonSimon]

Does anyone have any hints / tips on pre season training? The best way of getting players as fit as possible for the new seasons whilst still ganing good familiarity levels with tactics?

[Steve Odom]

just read Cleons thread, all is explained there.

[TheeDonSimon]

Brilliant, thanks! (Any clue as to where I can find Cleons thread? Im a forum newbie!)

[phnompenhandy]

Brilliant, thanks! (Any clue as to where I can find Cleons thread? Im a forum newbie!)

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php/375145-The-Santos-Project-Tactical-and-Player-Development

This is the original one, which he closed after a while. Now there are loads of training threads and Cleon contributes to most of them, although by now he's just repeating what he's said a dozen times!

[Steve Odom]

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php/380395-Ajax-When-Real-Life-Meets-Football-Manager-FM14 the new one.