The Manchester United thread 2006/2007 - featuring BBB leaving early

[Young Jimlad]

Or if I'd hit refresh I'd have seen Nick post basically what I wanted to say.

Not sure anyone can have a convo about best world starlets without taking Messi very firmly into account but its a big plus that we've got two of the top 3/5.

[mark g]

Check the post times

[Young Jimlad]

Although I will say one thing Mark, I'd rather have a debate with the majority of the people that populate this thread than wade out into the deeper waters of OTF when dealing with such topics.

Might not solve anything but I think it would at least have a semblance of a chance to remain relatively constructive.

But maybe thats pie in the sky thinking.

Or we could just blame Fergie for making a questionable statement to begin with and Mika for expanding upon it.

[Young Jimlad]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by mark g:

Check the post times </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

How did that happen?

[mark g]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Nick OGS20:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by mark g:

Ronaldo's got more out and out flair, but i wouldn't say he's more talented than Rooney, or has more potential. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

There's little between them in terms of footballing ability. I'd give Ronaldo the slightest of edges but it's negligible really. I think Ronaldo's got a lot more to learn on the mental side of the game, whereas I think Rooney has had that sorted (temperament aside) since an unusually young age. If (and it's a sizeable if) Ronaldo has it in him to mature mentally, learn to sometimes be a bit less instinctive (whilst retaining his unpredictability) and improve his decision making, I personally think he's got the greater potential as a match-winner. I think Rooney will turn out to be more consistent and infinitely less infuriating along the way.

</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

In terms of things that are completely instinctive and that i'd call footballing genius, the things that most players wouldn't even try, i'd actually put Rooney ahead. The same in terms of Jimlad's "managing the ball". On top of that, to have the decision making and vision parts of the game to such a degree at such a young age is a huge factor. Some players, especially flair players, never get that side sorted, or at least not until they are much later in their careers.

That's not to say that players all develop at the same rate, or that Ronaldo can't be better than Rooney. But i'd put Rooney significantly ahead in terms of where they are now, and still with a lead in terms of potential as well.

[Nick OGS20]

i'd still take both Ronnie and Rooney ahead of Messi, personally. suppose it would only be right to consider him though.

[Gazz22]

It's funny how people forget about Rooney consistently putting in match-winning performances for the last few seasons. Obviously we can't use the past to base players on but surely Rooney has earned a bit of leeway?

Both are superb players. We're lucky to have them.

[mark g]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Young Jimlad:

Although I will say one thing Mark, I'd rather have a debate with the majority of the people that populate this thread than wade out into the deeper waters of OTF when dealing with such topics.

Might not solve anything but I think it would at least have a semblance of a chance to remain relatively constructive.

But maybe thats pie in the sky thinking.

Or we could just blame Fergie for making a questionable statement to begin with and Mika for expanding upon it. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Sorry, meant to reply on that subject.

First of all, obviously anyone can debate what they like, it's only my personal opinion. I'm not trying to set myself up as some sort of egomaniac godfather in here ( or a James07? as we like to call them for short).

Secondly, i've no problem with the debates on the merits of various players past and present. It's when it gets bogged down in the minutia of "does world class mean best in their position at any one time", or "they have to have been true greats", or "they have to be able to get into the world XI in their position" that you end up not even talking about the players themselves.

[Young Jimlad]

Mark I respect what you're saying but I disagree for the reasons stated above.

Nick, imagine if we had all three though! *drool*

A critique isn't neccessarily a criticsm Gazz.

[Nick OGS20]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by mark g:

In terms of things that are completely instinctive and that i'd call footballing genius, the things that most players wouldn't even try, i'd actually put Rooney ahead. The same in terms of Jimlad's "managing the ball". On top of that, to have the decision making and vision parts of the game to such a degree at such a young age is a huge factor. Some players, especially flair players, never get that side sorted, or at least not until they are much later in their careers.

That's not to say that players all develop at the same rate, or that Ronaldo can't be better than Rooney. But i'd put Rooney significantly ahead in terms of where they are now, and still with a lead in terms of potential as well. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

we'll have to agree to differ because i'm off out to get drunk, but i'd quibble with the last paragraph especially - i don't think there's a significant difference at all in their current ability. if anything, Ronnie's been the better player by a fair distance this season so far (there are obviously mitigating circumstances you could cite in Wayne's favour, but i still think the point stands).

i'd have strongly agreed with you this time last season, but i think the gap's closed so much so as to almost be non-existent now.

[Young Jimlad]

The problem of course with the notion of debating the merits of particular players relative to a specific form of categorization is that the parameters used to define said category inevitably play a part in the discussion.

[Nick OGS20]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Gazz22:

It's funny how people forget about Rooney consistently putting in match-winning performances for the last few seasons. Obviously we can't use the past to base players on but surely Rooney has earned a bit of leeway?

Both are superb players. We're lucky to have them. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

where's anyone criticising him or forgetting anything? :////

[mark g]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Nick OGS20:

we'll have to agree to differ because i'm off out to get drunk, but i'd quibble with the last paragraph especially - i don't think there's a significant difference at all in their current ability. if anything, Ronnie's been the better player by a fair distance this season so far (there are obviously mitigating circumstances you could cite in Wayne's favour, but i still think the point stands).

i'd have strongly agreed with you this time last season, but i think the gap's closed so much so as to almost be non-existent now. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I think the one think i'd say on that (which is probably one of your mitigating factors) is that you're comparing at a point where Ronaldo is playing the best, most consistent football of his career, whereas Rooney is a level below his best at the moment. That's still about 3 levels above everyone else, but in judging this i'm comparing them both with their best, most consistent spells. So it's the Ronaldo of this year with the Rooney of the last couple of years, working on the (i think) reasonable assumption that Rooney is still not 100% out of his blip in form, rather than having become a worse player since the summer. And taking them on that basis, i'd put Rooney ahead.

I do think maybe saying "significantly ahead" is overdoing it a bit, i'll grant you. Put even given this seasons upsurge, i'd put Rooney at his best above Ronaldo at his so far.

[mark g]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Young Jimlad:

The problem of course with the notion of debating the merits of particular players relative to a specific form of categorization is that the parameters used to define said category inevitably play a part in the discussion. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I agree with you. the problem is, having done this debate a number of times before, they always become the discussion.

Maybe pose the question while setting the parameters yourself, rather than sticking with Fergie's vague "world class" term?

[Coldberg]

This discussion is boring, can we go back to bullying Martin or singing scouse songs?

[mark g]

Finally, we have a rival for the "dodgy excuses to avoid driving ban" awards

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">"I would not know if I can trust that person. We are targets. There are criminal gangs who wait and follow you before making a move" - in-no-way deluded West Ham captain Nigel Reo-Coker tries in vain to convince a judge to overturn his driving ban for speeding - because he just couldn't trust a chauffeur. No, really. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

[BBB]

you're all twats, I was at work ffs, look at the time. idiots

[Young Jimlad]

Regret email for Villa in the league...

[Coldberg]

I have given up applying through the ticket office. You really do have more chance asking around for tickets this season.

[Nick OGS20]

ticket office has been surprisingly helpful the last couple of times i've rung them. must be a blip.

[Coldberg]

My last two appliations have done the usual trick of having no evidence of me applying so I have wiped my hands of the ticket office now.

I am sorted for Wigan, Reading & I think Villa at home already with the minimum of fuss

Need a Vila cup ticket though. Not too bothered if I don't get one.

[Weststandred]

So the Champions League draw is tomorrow and we can draw:

PSV, Porto, Barcelona, Inter Milan, Real Madrid, Lille and Roma.

Personally, I would prefer it if we didn't draw Barcelona or Inter Milan at this early stage. I see PSV, Lille and Roma as very winnable games. I also don't fear Madrid and think we could beat them over two legs, especially due to the form of our defence. A return of Ruud and Beckham to Old Trafford would also be nice, I really don't want to get drawn with Porto, because these Portugese teams are starting to annoy me.

[BBB]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Coldberg:

My last two appliations have done the usual trick of having no evidence of me applying so I have wiped my hands of the ticket office now.

I am sorted for Wigan, Reading & I think Villa at home already with the minimum of fuss

Need a Vila cup ticket though. Not too bothered if I don't get one. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

stripeylad?

[gonch19]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Ladle:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by RedBlood:

My best fiver came this morning

it's fb

Thanks again </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

oh ****! totally forgot about this. does the offer still stand?

[Coldberg]

Good call Martin, not totally useless after all

Don't forget to pay for our fivers btw.

[gonch19]

double ****, chubbed for west ham (so it seems)

mark

[ACou2000]

yas, for the Villa Cup game:

"The deadline for Season Ticket holders and Members to make an application has now passed and all Members will be successful subject to payment being debited." COME ON

Also no "regret email" yet for Villa in the league the week after..... COME ON

[Nick OGS20]

The United Thread Stat-tacular 2006-7: post-citeh

Appearances:

<pre class="ip-ubbcode-code-pre">

| Prem | ECL | FAC | TCC | Total |

| | | | | |

1. Edwin VAN DER SAR | 16 | 6 | | | 22 |

2. Gary NEVILLE | 14 | 4 | | | 18 |

3. Patrice EVRA | 10(2) | 2(2) | | 0(1) | 12(5) |

4. Gabriel HEINZE | 5(3) | 3(1) | | 2 | 10(4) |

5. Rio FERDINAND | 17 | 4(1) | | | 21(1) |

6. Wes BROWN | 6(3) | 3 | | 2 | 11(3) |

7. Cristiano RONALDO | 15 | 5 | | 1 | 21 |

8. Wayne ROONEY | 14 | 6 | | 1 | 21 |

9. Louis SAHA | 14(1) | 5 | | | 19(1) |

11. Ryan GIGGS | 12(1) | 3 | | | 15(1) |

13. PARK Ji-Sung | 1(3) | | | | 1(3) |

14. Alan SMITH | | 0(2) | | 2 | 2(2) |

15. Nemanja VIDIC | 11 | 5 | | | 16 |

16. Michael CARRICK | 13(1) | 6 | | | 18(1) |

18. Paul SCHOLES | 13 | 5(1) | | | 18(1) |

20. Ole Gunnar SOLSKJAER | 3(4) | 1(3) | | 1 | 5(7) |

22. John O'SHEA | 7(8) | 3(2) | | 1 | 11(10) |

23. Kieran RICHARDSON | 3(1) | 0(2) | | 2 | 5(3) |

24. Darren FLETCHER | 8(5) | 3(2) | | 1 | 12(6) |

25. David JONES | | | | 2 | 2 |

27. Mikael SILVESTRE | 4(4) | 2 | | 2 | 8(4) |

29. Tomasz KUSZCZAK | 1 | | | 2 | 3 |

34. Ryan SHAWCROSS | | | | 0(2) | 0(2) |

35. Kieran LEE | | | | 0(2) | 0(2) |

36. David GRAY | | | | 1 | 1 |

41. Philip MARSH | | | | 1 | 1 |

42. Michael BARNES | | | | 0(1) | 0(1) |

49. Ritchie JONES | | | | 1 | 1 |

</pre>

Goalscorers:

<pre class="ip-ubbcode-code-pre">

| Prem | ECL | FAC | TCC | Total |

| | | | | |

9. Louis SAHA | 8 | 4 | | | 12 |

8. Wayne ROONEY | 8 | | | | 8 |

7. Cristiano RONALDO | 6 | | | | 6 |

20. Ole Gunnar SOLSKJAER | 4 | 1 | | 1 | 6 |

11. Ryan GIGGS | 2 | 1 | | | 3 |

15. Nemanja VIDIC | 2 | 1 | | | 3 |

18. Paul SCHOLES | 1 | 1 | | | 2 |

22. John O'SHEA | 1 | 1 | | | 2 |

24. Darren FLETCHER | 2 | | | | 2 |

3. Patrice EVRA | 1 | | | | 1 |

5. Rio FERDINAND | 1 | | | | 1 |

23. Kieran RICHARDSON | | 1 | | | 1 |

27. Mikael SILVESTRE | 1 | | | | 1 |

35. Kieran LEE | | | | 1 | 1 |

Own Goals | 1 | | | | 1 |

| | | | | |

Totals | 38 | 10 | | 2 | 50 |

</pre>

Penalties:

<pre class="ip-ubbcode-code-pre">

9. Louis SAHA 3/4

</pre>

Penalties won:

<pre class="ip-ubbcode-code-pre">

7. Cristiano RONALDO 2

8. Wayne ROONEY 1

11. Ryan GIGGS 1

</pre>

Assists:

<pre class="ip-ubbcode-code-pre">

9. Louis SAHA 7

11. Ryan GIGGS 7

8. Wayne ROONEY 6

7. Cristiano RONALDO 6

2. Gary NEVILLE 2

3. Patrice EVRA 2

6. Wes BROWN 2

24. Darren FLETCHER 2

4. Gabriel HEINZE 1

13. PARK Ji-Sung 1

14. Alan SMITH 1

15. Nemanja VIDIC 1

16. Michael CARRICK 1

18. Paul SCHOLES 1

49. Ritchie JONES 1

</pre>

At Fault For Goal:

<pre class="ip-ubbcode-code-pre">

4. Gabriel HEINZE 2

27. Mikael SILVESTRE 2

2. Gary NEVILLE 1

3. Patrice EVRA 1

5. Rio FERDINAND 1

6. Wes BROWN 1

7. Cristiano RONALDO 1

16. Michael CARRICK 1

22. John O'SHEA 1

</pre>

Clean Sheets:

<pre class="ip-ubbcode-code-pre">

Charlton away (EPL)

Tottenham home (EPL)

Benfica away (CL)

Newcastle home (EPL)

FC Kobenhavn home (CL)

Liverpool home (EPL)

Bolton away (EPL)

Portsmouth home (EPL)

Blackburn away (EPL)

Everton home (EPL)

</pre>

Yellow Cards:

<pre class="ip-ubbcode-code-pre">

| Prem | ECL | FAC | TCC | Total |

| | | | | |

18. Paul SCHOLES | 4 | 2 | | | 6 |

3. Patrice EVRA | 3 | 1 | | | 4 |

8. Wayne ROONEY | 2 | 1 | | 1 | 4 |

6. Wes BROWN | 2 | | | 1 | 3 |

15. Nemanja VIDIC | 3 | | | | 3 |

11. Ryan GIGGS | 2 | | | | 2 |

16. Michael CARRICK | 1 | 1 | | | 2 |

22. John O'SHEA | 2 | | | | 2 |

4. Gabriel HEINZE | | 1 | | | 1 |

5. Rio FERDINAND | 1 | | | | 1 |

7. Cristiano RONALDO | | 1 | | | 1 |

9. Louis SAHA | 1 | | | | 1 |

23. Kieran RICHARDSON | 1 | | | 1 | 1 |

24. Darren FLETCHER | | 1 | | | 1 |

25. David JONES | | | | 1 | 1 |

27. Mikael SILVESTRE | | 1 | | | 1 |

35. Kieran LEE | | | | 1 | 1 |

</pre>

Average Goals Per Game: 2.64 (66 in 25)

Average Goals Scored Per Game: 2 (50 in 25)

Average Goals Conceded Per Game: 0.64 (16 in 25)

Games Won When Scoring First Goal: 15/16 (93.75%)

Games Drawn When Scoring First Goal: 1/16 (6.25%)

Games Lost When Scoring First Goal: 0/16

Games Won When Conceding First Goal: 4/9 (44.44%)

Games Drawn When Conceding First Goal: 1/9 (11.12%)

Games Lost When Conceding First Goal: 4/9 (44.44%)

Games Won When Leading At Half-Time: 11/12 (91.67%)

Games Drawn When Leading At Half-Time: 1/12 (8.33%)

Games Lost When Leading At Half-Time: 0/12

Games Won When Drawing At Half-Time: 7/11 (63.64%)

Games Drawn When Drawing At Half-Time: 1/11 (9.09%)

Games Lost When Drawing At Half-Time: 3/11 (27.27%)

Games Won When Losing At Half-Time: 1/2 (50%)

Games Drawn When Losing At Half-Time: 0/2

Games Lost When Losing At Half-Time: 1/2 (50%)

Time of Goals Scored:

<pre class="ip-ubbcode-code-pre">

| Prem | ECL | FAC | TCC | Total |

| | | | | |

0 - 15 mins | 8 | | | | 8 |

15 - 30 mins | 5 | | | 1 | 6 |

30 - 45 mins | 5 | 4 | | | 9 |

45 - 60 mins | 3 | 3 | | | 6 |

60 - 75 mins | 10 | 2 | | | 12 |

75 - 90 mins | 7 | 1 | | | 8 |

Extra Time | | | | 1 | 1 |

</pre>

Time of Goals Conceded:

<pre class="ip-ubbcode-code-pre">

| Prem | ECL | FAC | TCC | Total |

| | | | | |

0 - 15 mins | 2 | | | | 2 |

15 - 30 mins | | 2 | | 1 | 3 |

30 - 45 mins | 2 | 1 | | | 3 |

45 - 60 mins | 1 | | | | 1 |

60 - 75 mins | 3 | 1 | | 1 | 5 |

75 - 90 mins | 1 | 1 | | | 2 |

Extra Time | | | | | |

</pre>

Manner of Goals Scored:

<pre class="ip-ubbcode-code-pre">

| Prem | ECL | FAC | TCC | Total |

| | | | | |

Left foot | 10 | 5 | | | 15 |

Right foot | 22 | 2 | | 2 | 26 |

Head | 5 | 3 | | | 8 |

Opponent | 1 | | | | 1 |

| | | | | |

Inside area | 33 | 8 | | 1 | 42 |

Outside area | 5 | 2 | | 1 | 8 |

| | | | | |

Open play | 32 | 6 | | 2 | 40 |

Set piece | 3 | 3 | | | 6 |

Direct freekick | 1 | | | | 1 |

Penalty | 2 | 1 | | | 3 |

</pre>

Manner of Goals Conceded:

<pre class="ip-ubbcode-code-pre">

| Prem | ECL | FAC | TCC | Total |

| | | | | |

Left foot | 2 | 4 | | | 6 |

Right foot | 4 | 1 | | 2 | 7 |

Head | 2 | | | | 2 |

United player | 1 | | | | 1 |

| | | | | |

Inside area | 6 | 2 | | | 8 |

Outside area | 3 | 3 | | 2 | 8 |

| | | | | |

Open play | 6 | 3 | | 1 | 10 |

Set piece | 1 | | | | 1 |

Direct freekick | 1 | 2 | | 1 | 4 |

Penalty | 1 | | | | 1 |

</pre>

Form

<pre class="ip-ubbcode-code-pre">

Last Six (All comps): LDWWWW

Last Six (Prem/ship): WWDWWW

Home (All comps): WWDWWW

Home (Prem/ship): WWWDWW

Away (All comps): LLWWLW

Away (Prem/ship): DWWWWW

Games Unbeaten: 5 (all comps), 12 (premiership)

Consecutive Wins: 4 (all comps), 3 (premiership)

</pre>

Attendances:

Highest - 76,004, vs Portsmouth (Premiership, 4/11/06)

Lowest - 72,020, vs FC Kobenhavn (Champions League, 18/10/06)

Total - 902,194 (12 games)

Average - 75,183

Mart Leaving Early:

Sevilla home

Dubiously-legal female charity collectors ogled from the wall

Ten

Forthcoming Fixtures

<pre class="ip-ubbcode-code-pre">

17.12.06 West Ham United (A) Premiership

23.12.06 Aston Villa (A) Premiership

26.12.06 Wigan Athletic (H) Premiership

30.12.06 Reading (H) Premiership

01.01.07 Newcastle United (A) Premiership

07.01.07 Aston Villa (H) FA Cup Third Round

</pre>

--------------------------------------------------------------

Reserves Update

Appearances: Kieran Lee 11, Daniel Rose 10, Ryan Shawcross 9, Craig Cathcart 8(2), Ritchie Jones 8, Aaron Burns 8, Michael Barnes 7(3), Philip Marsh 7(3), Tom Heaton 7, David Gray 7(1), Michael Lea 6(1), Alan Smith 6, David Jones 6, Jamie Mullan 5(2), Séan Evans 4(2), Tomasz Kuszczak 4, Floribert N'Galula 2, Sam Hewson 1(1), Christopher Eagles 1, Liam Miller 1, Giuseppe Rossi 1, Ji-Sung Park 1, Kieran Richardson 1, Febian Brandy (5), Christy Fagan (2), Daniel Drinkwater (1), Magnus Wolff Eikrem (1),

Scorers: Philip Marsh 7, Aaron Burns 6, Febian Brandy 2, Giuseppe Rossi 2, Michael Barnes 2, Kieran Lee 1, Christopher Eagles 1, David Jones 1, Ryan Shawcross 1, Daniel Rose 1, David Gray 1, Kieran Richardson 1, Alan Smith 1, own goals 1 (Webster, Wigan)

Premier Reserve League North Table:

<pre class="ip-ubbcode-code-pre">

P W D L F A GD Pts

1. M'boro Res 8 6 1 1 19 6 +13 19

2. Man Utd Res 7 5 0 2 15 7 +8 15

3. N'castle Res 6 3 2 1 12 9 +3 11

</pre>

Next Fixture:

17.01.07 Bury (A) - Manchester Seniors Cup

--------------------------------------------------------------

Academy Update

Appearances: James Chester 15, Christy Fagan 14(1), Febian Brandy 13(1), James Derbyshire 11(3), Daniel Drinkwater 11(3), Magnus Wolff Eikrem 11(2), Craig Cathcart 10, Richard Eckersley 10, Sam Hewson 10, Benjamin Amos 10, Daniel Welbeck 8(6), Antonio Bryan 8(4), Conor McCormack 8(2), Michael Lea 6, Daniel Galbraith 5(1), Ron-Robert Zieler 5, Thomas Cleverley 4(1), Corrie Evans 3(3), Kenny Strickland 3(1), Oliver Norwood (2), Matthew James (2)

Scorers: Brandy 9, Fagan 5, Welbeck 5, Bryan 2, Galbraith 1, Hewson 2, Cathcart 1, Eikrem 1, Lea 1, Chester 1

U18 Academy Group C Table:

<pre class="ip-ubbcode-code-pre">

P W D L F A GD Pt

4. B'burn Yth 14 6 2 6 21 16 +5 20`

5. Man Utd Yth 15 5 3 7 28 29 -1 18

6. WBA Yth 14 5 2 7 20 23 -3 17

</pre>

Next Fixture:

16.12.06 S****horpe United (H) - FA Youth Cup, @ Ewen Fields, Hyde

--------------------------------------------------------------

Assists and at-fault-for's up for debate ofc. Suggestions for further stats welcome.

[Coldberg]

Cup game will go on general sale.

[ACou2000]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Coldberg:

Cup game will go on general sale. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yeah.

[ACou2000]

10 clean sheets not bad

[BBB]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> "The internal dynamics of Manchester United have changed over the time I've been here. Martin Edwards, who was an integral part of the club, retired, so there were key changes internally. When I joined it was a shareholding company, and the shares were predominantly held by institutions and Martin Edwards himself. Martin sold down and a lot of those shares were bought by wealthy individuals, so the actual shareholding structure changed considerably, culminating in the takeover by the Glazer family in May 2005. It has been suggested that it's easier to get decisions made under the new ownership structure, and I think that's right. I'll speak to Joel (Glazer) whenever he calls and say: `Look, this is where we're going with this player or that player.' It works well. The transition from a quoted environment to a private environment is a learning process for me, the owners, for the other key staff. Before, corporate governance meant we had to have regular board meetings, various committees and produce formal written reports. The Glazers get involved in decisions, of course, and all the important decisions are still taken with the same degree of rigour and analysis, but it's not through a tortuous process of getting approval from each committee. "I think, personally, that the private structure of a football club is the right structure, insofar as most of our key competitors are not quoted. It's not like if you're M&S and you're up against Tesco, when to a degree you're working to the same set of returns. In football, very few of the top clubs are quoted. Arsenal aren't really, Chelsea clearly aren't, Milan aren't, Barcelona aren't, Real Madrid aren't. Each of those has got different criteria, and if you're not working to deliver the same returns it's difficult to compete. It was becoming ever more demanding for United to increase profits and dividends each year, because most of our key competitors weren't under the same restrictions. It's more of a level playing field now. The owners have been true to their word in getting involved in areas where they feel they can add value and not getting too involved in other areas. For example, they wouldn't second-guess which player we want to go for. But on ticket pricing, on the commercial side, if they think they can add value then they like to get involved. It's worked out well for everyone involved. But also, everything's not done in the public glare. Don't get me wrong, at Manchester United we like to be in the public glare. We've got to understand that everything we do will have a degree of scrutiny that is many times greater than most other clubs, and we can't complain about that. But it's no longer played out in the business pages and the stock exchange implications of it aren't there, so it's a better situation. And you undoubtedly save a lot of overheads by not being quoted. We've seen the competitive landscape change, in this country and overseas. In this country Roman Abramovich has come in and changed the landscape dramatically. It's an exciting time to be involved."

[20] Gill interview with MEN

Thursday, December 14, 2006

"At Manchester United we're mainly talking about buying new players, we're not a selling club. The profile of Manchester United is such that every time there's a rumour about a top player considering a move in this country or abroad we are bound to be mentioned. I don't find that frustrating. I'd be concerned if we weren't involved, because it sends a message about the best clubs and their position in football. The only aspect that's frustrating is that if it's rumoured that Manchester United are involved, it ramps the price up. Fortunately, our scouting set-up here is excellent. It's had to be, because the worldwide search for talent is becoming more competitive. Throughout the season, Alex and I have regular discussions about the squad, the senior players, the ones coming through from the reserves, the youngsters. He works on a day-to-day basis with the scouting department discussing who we're looking for, what positions. We'll have a discussion as to where we think we're going to have to do things, either in the January transfer window or in the summer one. We'll also look at the contracts of current players to see who we'd like to extend new contracts to if necessary, and whose contracts we're going to allow to run down, then we target replacements. I keep the owners informed as to those discussions in broad terms which positions we're looking at. For each position we might have one, two, three players we're looking at, and then I'll give them broad parameters about what the transfer value might be or our assessment of that value and what we think the player's wages would be. Then we target the particular players, which involves speaking to the other clubs. Then you have agreement to speak to the agents and try to do the deal. I'll keep Alex informed about what's going on throughout the negotiations and discussions, because ultimately we're trying to do the best deal we can, but he'll assess whether he thinks that player's worth £10m, £15m or £20m. Obviously, it's not an open chequebook. There are the capital costs of the player, and then you have budgets on the wages that we have to adhere to each year. It's not a science, it's trying to get in players who want to come here at the cheapest possible price." </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

[deanb291186]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Ladle:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by RedBlood:

My best fiver came this morning

it's fb

Thanks again </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Mine too, cheers

[14AlanSmithifb]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Coldberg:

Cup game will go on general sale. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Hope so not got mine yet.

[SLO_Fila]

Seems that Vida really is a monster \o/

Le Monster

[Nick OGS20]

we drew Porto in the rehearsal draw. please don't be an omen

[Nick OGS20]

another day, another chelsea player tries some mind-games. love it:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">"Manchester United are probably playing the best football they can play at the moment. They've had very few injuries so far. Whereas we know as a team we've got another level to go to. We need to take the game to teams and then no-one can live with us. We must go on a run of games and keep winning. We must keep the pressure up. Christmas is a difficult period. United have got tough games. We must just keep winning and keep on like we know we're capable of." </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

john terry that is, btw. pressure's getting to 'em :*)

[alilaw]

Why don't people want Porto?

Still pushing my 'anyone but Real' line for the moment.

[James07?]

He's said what we all think?

[Nick OGS20]

of course, but Johsay's said the same thing (amongst other ramblings) in the last few days. just revelling in the fact they're spending so much time talking about us.

[Saha]

because we've had enough of portuguese teams for awhile ali

[James07?]

I'm sure they're talking about lots of other things too. Every single tiny little comment is going to be seized upon an sensationalised as long as the press think there might be a title race for them to hyperventilate over.

[Nick OGS20]

it's more jose that amuses me, because he can't stop randomly mentioning us in post-game interviews which obviously aren't as spun. i genuinely think he's liable to do a keegan if we can somehow keep our form until april-time.

[mark g]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by James07?:

He's said what we all think? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Pretty much word for word what i was going to say.

Everyone's praised Fergie for the upturn so far and getting us back, but while there certainly have been areas of improvement such as Carrick coming in (although you could put a significant part of that down to the fact that we've simply got an actual midfielder playing rather than O'Shea), and Ronaldo's form (which has been partially offset by Rooney being at various levels below his best so far), the biggest single factor, and the thing that we're still most susceptible to derailing us, is that not only have we had fewer injuries than in previous years, we've also had as few injuries to first teamers as i can remember for a long time. We've whinged about injuries in previous years, but i think up to a point that's just something that you have to accept and have the squad to deal with, and that the level of injuries this year has actually been the exception rather than the rule. So while it may seem churlish given our start, i do wonder how much of our position can be put down to luck, in that Fergie has gambled more than he should with the level of the squad, and he's been a bit lucky so far that we've got away with it.

[Pickles]

It's only a matter of time (i.e. 1st February when we didn't bother making any more signings) before we get 3 or 4 crucial first team players injuring themselves and we struggle for a month or so and lose track.

I'm keeping my fingers crossed our form stays as it is, injuries keep to a minimum and Fergie makes a couple of signings to bolster the squad - nothing like a bit of competition for places, which I think certainly players know there isn't at the moment.

I think Saha's pulled his finger out a little bit sinced we announced Larsson coming, although I still feel Louis will be picked ahead of him.

Centre midfield is where we need a kick up the arse, Scholes has done a good job this year, but Carrick, O'Shea, Fletcher et al. have looked disinterested to say the least. Someone to sit in front of the back four would do me very nicely and maybe another left back

[Nick OGS20]

on the injuries point, it may be a bit of luck on our part (so far, touch wood etc), but it's long overdue imo - we've had a couple of seasons of bad luck with injuries while chelsea's key players have been virtually unscathed. chelsea have had very few injuries this season as well really (joe cole and petr cech the only real long-term absentees i can think of), so terry's implication that we might not be so lucky with injuries in the second half of the season goes for them too.

and yes, i know that they're better equipped to deal with it, but not by that much (and not by as much as in previous seasons imo)

[pjburrage]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Manchester United assistant Carlos Quieroz has emerged as the number one choice to become the USA's coach. (The Sun) </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Come on the Sun getting at least one story correct, and it being this one.

[mark g]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Nick OGS20:

on the injuries point, it may be a bit of luck on our part (so far, touch wood etc), but it's long overdue imo - we've had a couple of seasons of bad luck with injuries while chelsea's key players have been virtually unscathed. chelsea have had very few injuries this season as well really (joe cole and petr cech the only real long-term absentees i can think of), so terry's implication that we might not be so lucky with injuries in the second half of the season goes for them too.

and yes, i know that they're better equipped to deal with it, but not by that much (and not by as much as in previous seasons imo) </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

So that's the best goalkeeper in the league out for a minimum of 3 months, with the second best backup (after Steve Harper obviously) out for a number of those games as well, and their most creative player over the last 12 months out for virtually the whole season so far. I'd say that was already pretty significant.

What have we had in comparison (in terms of first XI)? Giggs out for a month-ish, which was compounded by Park also being out. Other than that, Gary Nev and Saha have missed a couple of games each, but i don't think there have been many others have there?

[Keyser]

Hasn't G Nev got an injury that he requires an operation on?

[pjburrage]

good draw