Pakito Posted June 10, 2014 Share Posted June 10, 2014 I was wondering whether anybody gave a shot at something along these lines. One thing: I do 4-3-3, flat or with anchor and inside forwards. I wouldn't know how to make anything else work to save my life. Another thing: I haven't actually given this a shot yet, this is a throw-an-idea-out-there-and-see-what-people-make-of-it kinda thread at this stage. Some background: 1. Standard Operating Procedure, and the Coherence Theory of Truth I moved from FM11 to FM14, and never really got into it tbh. So, borrowing from FM11, my signature tactic is: ------------ TQa ------------ IFa --------------------- IFa ------- APMs - DPMs ------- --------- AMd/HBd --------- FBs/a - DCd - DCd - FBs/a when controlling, ------------ CFa ------------ IFa --------------------- IFa ------- APMs - DPMs ------- --------- AMd/HBd --------- FBa --- DCd - DCd --- FBa when forcing, and ------------ CFa ------------ IFs/a ----------------- IFs/a ------- APMs - DPMs ------- --------- AMd/HBd --------- FBd/s - DCd - DCd - FBd/s when countering. My creed: the inside forwards should be our go-to offensive threats. Yes, the CFa is meant to be an added threat when forcing, and the spearhead when countering, but our standard operating procedure is controlling, and we do that with a TQa playing as the vertex of a "Dutch diamond”, subservient to the inside forwards. And if we're a man down, we go strikerless. Cause I'm the manager, and I say so. 2. Hit and Run -or- Run and Hit. And Run. And Hit Again. Back in FM11, in one of my last serious runs I was managing Panathinaikos, had great wingers with crappish finishing (Sidney Govou and Sebastián Leto), an out-and-out poacher with absurd pace (Djibril Cissé), and was in the awkward situation of dominating every single domestic game bar those against Olympiakos, while being an underdog in Europe. Given my stile, the situation, and the players available, I ended up with these two tactics: ------------- Pa ------------- Wa ---------------------- Wa ------- APMs - DPMs ------- ------------ AMd ------------ FBs/a - DCd - DCd - FBs/a for domestic games, and ------------- Pa ------------- ------------------------------ Ws --- APMs - DPMs --- Ws ------------ AMd ------------ FBd --- DCd --- DCd --- FBd for Europe. Now, this obviously went against my creed, as I was forced to play a poacher and make it the focal point of the team - gone was the Dutch diamond and gone were the inside forwards. But, oh well, we won the league and pulled off some capers in the Champions League, including a 0-2 away win against then-stellar AC Milan in San Siro. That's when I discovered the beauty of countering at speed: get the ball, clear to the flanks, cross early behind the defense for a poacher to run onto ball, rape giants, rinse, repeat. Now, fast forward to 2014. 3. The Dutch Diamond Meets the Brazilian Box I was thinking about how to make a 4-4-2 variation work in our day and age without ending up with a de facto 4-2-3-1. I really dislike 4-2-3-1s. Actually, "dislike" is a bit of an understatement. I despise it. Actually, "despise" is also an understatement. Anyways, staring at the screen, I had one of those "what if...?" moments: What if I take my standard operating procedure, ------------ TQa ------------ IFa --------------------- IFa ------- APMs - DPMs ------- --------- AMd/HBd --------- FBs/a - DCd - DCd - FBs/a replace the anchor with another striker subservient to the inside forwards, --------- TQa - TQa -------- IFa --------------------- IFa ------- APMs - DPMs ------- ------------------------------ FBs/a - DCd - DCd - FBs/a make the playmakers more defensive to compensate for losing the anchor, --------- TQa - TQa -------- IFa --------------------- IFa ------- DPMs - DPMd ------- ------------------------------ FBs/a - DCd - DCd - FBs/a and make the upfront duo drop even more to close the gap with the now-deep midfield? --------- F9s - F9s -------- IFa --------------------- IFa ------- DPMs - DPMd ------- ------------------------------ FBs/a - DCd - DCd - FBs/a The result should be some sort of bizarre hybrid between a Dutch diamond - my standard tactic, point of departure - and a Brazilian box, in which the trequartistas are pushed upfront and made to drop, while the strikers cut in past them starting from the wings. I just decided I'll call it the "Dutch box", as for you, feel free not to. What am I worried about? 1. congestion in the hole. But I can't push the IFa's further up or the fullbacks would be left to their own devices far too often for my taste; and 2. allowing space in the hole. But I can't push the playmakers further down or the team would be broken in two. (see next section) All in all, I think that I'd take a chance with this quasi-strikerless 4-4-2 setup in those matches in which I'm favourite, or when chasing. But for when we need to pull one of those Panathinaikos-style upsets, maybe there's something different we can do... 4. Mending the Schism: an Actually-Strikerless 4-4-2 So, say we're up against the big boys. I really want the hole covered. I love my anchor/half back; and, as a rule, if I'm to set up a 4-4-2, I'd want both my central midfielders withdrawn into the hole: as I won't win the possession battle against a 3-men midfield, at least I'll negate them space in front of the defence and force them either to attack down the wings, or even better, to stand with their collective **** in their hands passing the ball around for 90 minutes trying to find a non-existing opening in the middle. Trouble is, as I said in the previous section, that if I drop the playmakers into the DM spots, I'll break the team in two. But I'm not willing to allow space when I'm already sure that I'll lose the possession battle, AND that they're better than my players. So let's take the Dutch box, --------- F9s - F9s -------- IFa --------------------- IFa ------- DPMs - DPMd ------- ------------------------------ FBs/a - DCd - DCd - FBs/a go ahead and break the team in two, --------- F9s - F9s -------- IFa --------------------- IFa ------------------------------ ------- DPMs - DPMd ------- FBs/a - DCd - DCd - FBs/a take a cue from the Panathinaikos experience: sacrifice the inside forwards, --------- F9s - F9s -------- Wa --------------------- Wa ------------------------------ ------- DPMs - DPMd ------- FBs/a - DCd - DCd - FBs/a actually, withdraw them, and make both them and the fullbacks more careful, --------- F9s - F9s -------- ------------------------------ Ws/a ------------------ Ws/a ------- DPMs - DPMd ------- FBd/s - DCd - DCd - FBd/s then think: what can efficiently replace the lone poacher in this tactic, while at the same time providing better defensive positioning, and possibly even mending the break caused by dropping the playmakers? What about... ------------------------------ --------- SSa - SSa -------- Ws/a ------------------ Ws/a ------- DPMs - DPMd ------- FBd/s - DCd - DCd - FBd/s Shadow strikers?! Conclusions There you go, this is more or less what went on in my head when trying to figure out what a 4-4-2 that respects my canons of good football could look like. The result: two tactics for different scenarios, the "Dutch box" and a strikerless 4-4-2. This, as I said at the very beginning, is even less than a work in progress right now. It's much more like a collection of previously scattered thoughts, arguably more useful for myself than for you In any case, I would love to hear your thoughts, if you already gave this a shot, if you see any blatant mistake in my reasoning, etc. I'd love any sort of suggestions and annotations, really. Roles, shouts, team and player instructions, everything. Also, do you know of any team in the game (possibly in the original database - I always prefer to start in september with the september roster) with like 4 players able to play both as F9 and as SS? It'd be pretty challenging to have 6 or 8 players for two spots otherwise. Inside forwards/wingers, on the other hand, are more readily available, so they shouldn't be a problem. Thank you for your time and attention if you made it all the way down here! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pakito Posted June 10, 2014 Author Share Posted June 10, 2014 Also, a few things that gave me ideas: Cruyff on his diamond (pretty much my 4-3-3) Bilic's 4-4-2 vs. 4-3-3 (negate the 2 vs. 3 by filling the hole) http://www.zonalmarking.net/2011/11/12/turkey-0-3-croatia-tactics/ Modric + Alonso in the 4-0 trashing of Bayern (two deep playmakers in holding role) http://www.zonalmarking.net/2014/04/30/bayern-munich-0-4-real-madrid-real-go-ahead-through-set-pieces-ensure-thrashing-with-counter-attacks/ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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