Tactic help: worked pre 15.2.0, now its rubbish

[designerx]

Hi all,

Is someone able to take a look over my tactic, was having a great save prior to the new patch and now my tactic is useless.

I had the best defense in the league and was decent scoring goals. was 3rd in the Championship with Huddersfield.

Since the patch it seems im being bombarded with shots on my goal, and naturally conceding as a result, and now have hardly any shots of my own on the opposition goal when i had a good amount previously. Wasn't prolific, but scored in most games, Now i have 0 in 5.

Ive struggled with tactics over the last few releases mainly due to time constants being unable to put in the hours with the game i did previously and finally i thought i had the current tactics system worked out after reading may forum posts on combinations, and how to setup a team. Now i feel like thats all gone, what should i be looking at, what is something that sticks out to people?

And just out of curiosity, what from the new patch has caused this to go from a good tctics to a rubbish one?

Thanks.

[peleJunior]

The thing that leaps out at me is how static your tactic is. The poacher and the CWBa are the only players looking to make consistent runs. The left hand side is incredibly static, all support roles. You are playing a very very slow patient game with those TI's and Mentality and you need to think about how an AI would try to disrupt that?

Your main problem for me is movement, there just really isn't much at all.

[macca72]

Can you describe what sort of goals you have started to concede / and what sort of goals pre-patch you scored. My sense is that with some of the re-balancing in the ME it has exposed a weakness in your tactic, so certain phases of play are working differently.

I would also be tempted to look at having an attacking role in the MC strata, especially if you are using a supporting AMC.

[designerx]

Thats for the replies.

When i originally started with the tactic i had the LW on an attack duty but it left me open on the left, he didnt track back at all to assist the LB. The first thing i done was put the LW to Support and make the LB an attack duty, but then that left too much space in behind the LB so i found, pre-patch at least, having both on support worked best which irked me somewhat at the time but it worked so i settled for it, but thats a good point, i mighth try either one or the other on attack/support.

As for the type of goals coneding and scored, id say its a variety, but what stands out most since the patch is crosses into the box. causing dramas and either the goal coming from there, or at least as a result of the cross.

Prior to the patch, in terms of my goals, it was spread quite evenly between my STs and Attacking Mids, i didnt often score from croses, or at least headers, any cross in would be from a deep position and scored with the feet, i suppose the rest of my goals came from runs and from inside the box

[peleJunior]

Are you having issues getting out of your own half when the AI pushes up and presses you? I could see your set up coughing up some easy possession in deep areas. I'd reconsider the left hand side again, even moving the winger down to ML/R area for better protection. Also, keep an eye on how well that BWMd protects the spaces left by the CWBa,a BWM isn't the most defensively disciplined player in terms of holding position.

[Jambo98]

I will wheel out my same old advice here......

If you are conceding goals from crosses (either directly, or second balls, or even through balls from wide areas) then consider why you are asking your wide men to have there default defensive position as being so high up the pitch. Remember that your formation is your defensive shape. Your defensive shape here not only does not have a DM, but has only 2 players in the MC strata, one of whom is a ball winners so will get dragged out of position at times.

Try moving your wide men back to the ML/MR slots, but with Attack duty (assuming that is what suits your game) and observe in game how it alters both there defensive responsibility, and how they still attack just as much as you are likely to need.

[macca72]

Crosses from both sides? Also are the passes immediately before coming from the lines between your def & mid?

The reason I ask is that the BWM(d) is quite an aggressive role, he'll try close down quickly. If he get's exposed (coupled with your CWB being on the right) I would say you potentially could get punished down your right hand side.

Could you maybe try changing your BWM to either a CM(d) or DLP(d). You can then try changing the DLP(s) on the left to be a bit more mobile, either an attacking CM or a B2B.

EDIT: Jambo beat me to it. The BWM(d) can be quite a misleading role in my view, you may expect him to sit and protect like an Anchor in the MC strata, but he doesn't. I think a little re-shuffle here will make a difference to you.

[designerx]

Are you having issues getting out of your own half when the AI pushes up and presses you?

Im only watching highlights on extended but i would say yes, since the patch, rarely do i see i highlight of my team in the opposition half.

Also, keep an eye on how well that BWMd protects the spaces left by the CWBa,a BWM isn't the most defensively disciplined player in terms of holding position.

Again pre patch it was fine, in fact my CWB is constantly one of my highest rating players, he never was too exposed at all, ill have to keep an eye on it now in 15.2

Your defensive shape here not only does not have a DM, but has only 2 players in the MC strata, one of whom is a ball winners so will get dragged out of position at times.

I did start out with a 2 DMs and 1 CM and then tried with only 1 DM, and neither worked, it was only when i paired the BWM with the DLP (done this intentionally as im aware the BWM roams from his position as macca also points out) in the CM positions that things clicking the in middle, both in terms of retaining possession and surprisingly, defensively.

[thomas_e]

Mahamadou Diarra's career really has taken a turn for the worse since leaving Madrid.. now averaging a 6.7 with Huddersfield

[designerx]

Mahamadou Diarra's career really has taken a turn for the worse since leaving Madrid.. now averaging a 6.7 with Huddersfield

Just as well for Anelka or Trezeguet that i didnt sign them when i had a striker injury crisis recently lol.

[Jambo98]

I would say that the BWM was the secondary point for me. The problem is your wide men i would wager. You are effectively playing 4213 in this set up, with 3 attackers. They wont track back or give you the defensive positioning you need to prevent other teams taking advantage down the flanks.

[designerx]

Thanks guys, Ive switched the AML to an attack duty, my CWB to a FB/a and my BWM to a CM/d. cant say its going to well at the moment though.

Better possession wise and getting more opportunities in the opposition half, but 3-0 at the moment

[thomas_e]

Just as well for Anelka or Trezeguet that i didnt sign them when i had a striker injury crisis recently lol.

Well at least Diarra seems like a nice guy. Wouldn't take long for that idiot Anelka to completely tear up that dressing room

[peleJunior]

Thanks guys, Ive switched the AML to an attack duty, my CWB to a FB/a and my BWM to a CM/d. cant say its going to well at the moment though.

Better possession wise and getting more opportunities in the opposition half, but 3-0 at the moment

It's not all roles and duties, you have to have sound match strategies too. This is the more time consuming part of the game, studying the oppositions approach, but ultimately, the most rewarding. I would seriously heed Jambos advice about the inherent weakness of this formations defensive shape, in FM the formation IS the defensive shape, if you look at the 4231 then the wings and behind the central two are ripe for exploiting!

[Noel Gallagher]

The other guys have already talked about the player roles so I won't go into those, but from what I can see your team instructions kind of conflict your mentality.

You've set the mentality as counter but then added team instructions to retain possession and slow the tempo down. In my opinion those two things go against what a true counter attack should be which is a quick, direct transition from defence to attack to exploit the opponent when they're on the attack but have lost the ball.

Touching on what the other guys said you will need players with duties assigned to them who are willing to run into spaces when counter attacking. At the moment it is quite static with all the support duties.

Just some more food for thought

[designerx]

The other guys have already talked about the player roles so I won't go into those, but from what I can see your team instructions kind of conflict your mentality.

You've set the mentality as counter but then added team instructions to retain possession and slow the tempo down. In my opinion those two things go against what a true counter attack should be which is a quick, direct transition from defence to attack to exploit the opponent when they're on the attack but have lost the ball.

Touching on what the other guys said you will need players with duties assigned to them who are willing to run into spaces when counter attacking. At the moment it is quite static with all the support duties.

Just some more food for thought

I agree with this. My original intent when creating the tactic was for quick counters, The tactic was originally made with a higher tempo but it didn't work at all pre-patch, possession was being gifted away, slowing it down seems to correct that quite a bit.

With regards to the comments of moving my AML and Rs back to flat left and right mids, the problem is my 1st team wingers and inside forwards are only natural in those positions, only 1 of them can actually plan as a standard wide midfielder.

[peleJunior]

I agree with this. My original intent when creating the tactic was for quick counters, The tactic was originally made with a higher tempo but it didn't work at all pre-patch, possession was being gifted away, slowing it down seems to correct that quite a bit.

With regards to the comments of moving my AML and Rs back to flat left and right mids, the problem is my 1st team wingers and inside forwards are only natural in those positions, only 1 of them can actually plan as a standard wide midfielder.

The effect of moving natural AML/R to the ML/R slot is virtually zero. So have at it