Rage Quit but trying again

[boblardo]

So much like FM15, I rage quit the game uninstalled it and vowed to never play this stupid game again. It lasted 2 hours, I returned and vowed to give it a real go.

Choosing Maidenhead United, its Lower League with reasonable expectations so I wasn't worry about getting sacked.

How Do I Want To Play?

My favoured formation is the 4-1-4-1, its a solid base but with PI's can become quite flexible. I want to be hard to beat with goals coming from a number of different areas inc Set Pieces. I want my MR to be a goal threat, almost a second striker.

With this in mind I decided upon Counter and as I have 2 specialist roles chose Fluid. I understand this also makes the team more compact, please correct me if am wrong here

Tactic

Counter / Fluid

I initially had no TI's and the only PI's were

GK - Roll it out, Fewer Risky Passes and either Pass to Centre Backs or Pass to Full Backs depending on opponents

MR - Get Further Forward & Cut Inside

ML - Get Further Forward

I played two fixtures, won one and lost one. The defeat occured when we conceded in the 91st minute. I reviewed the stats and noticed and in both games we had 18 shots but with only 6 on target in the 1st game and 2 on target in the 2nd game.

I added Work Into Box to try and prevent long shots, and for the next game we had 10 shots with 5 on target in a game we maybe should have won but another clean sheet.

I remember reading that with a counter mentality defenders play longer passes, this may explain the low pass % for defenders, so I ticked play of out defence

Over the next 4 games we had 2 wins and 2 draws, both draws were 1-1 and both goals were from crosses from deep. To counter this i added Close Down More to my Full Backs so that they engage the opposition a little higher up the pitch. This seemed to work as the in the next game, a 2-1 win the goal came from a corner!

Fixtures

10 game review

A decent start and I have highlighted some issues out wide. I am not sure if Play Out of defence is a TI i need to us so will continue to monitor

I also have a dilemma with my left ML, I want him to do something different to the other side and having him cut inside would probably mean he collides with the BBM who is expected to surge forward.

Not sure if crossing is useful in a single striker formation, once consideration is to remove the get further forward PI and add sit narrower. this would allow me to change the BBM to a CM(a) or even an AP(s)

Any comments, thoughts or feedback around obvious flaws or even if you have suggestions for me to chew over it would all be appreciated

[boblardo]

I played another 10 games

A steady set of results, the 3-0 loss v Forest Green was an expected defeat although not by 3 goals. I rested a few "regular" players and changed from Fluid to Very Fluid. I left it at very fluid for the Sutton game but was 2-0 down, changed back to fluid at half time and recovered to draw 2-2.

Stats

My striker is my main goal threat but I am getting goals from my right side WM(s). I am also 3rd in the goals from corner charts. I have conceded just 12 goals in

Based on my original objective of "How Do I Want To Play?

My favoured formation is the 4-1-4-1, its a solid base but with PI's can become quite flexible. I want to be hard to beat with goals coming from a number of different areas inc Set Pieces. I want my MR to be a goal threat, almost a second striker. " I am fairly happy with how things are going

Further Observations

How do I score more goals, I have only scored 18 goals in 17 league games, obviously I want to increase this without affecting the goals against column

My full backs are not contributing to goals and they have very low assist counts.

My left WM(s) is also not contributing to goals. I need to think about how I want him to play here

[summatsupeer]

I also have a dilemma with my left ML, I want him to do something different to the other side and having him cut inside would probably mean he collides with the BBM who is expected to surge forward.

Why would he "collide" rather than "link up with" ?

I would try to slow down on the changes and make sure you account for the tactics your playing against. One team might push high up and be pressing you forcing your defence into rushed passes. Another might be playing the same way as you so you struggle to counter attack.

[Jyuan83]

Since you would like your MR to be the main goalscorer how about giving him the following PIs? Get further forward, roam from position, sit narrower, cross less often and run wide with ball. Basically it is easier to make a raumdeuter out of a WM and has turned mine into quite a menace in the 3rd bundesliga. Scored 3 braces in 6 games so far. Give it a go and see how it goes for you.

[boblardo]

Why would he "collide" rather than "link up with" ?.

Surely if he is cutting inside that would mean he enters space that the BBM is going to move into? Something to test though

Since you would like your MR to be the main goalscorer how about giving him the following PIs? Get further forward, roam from position, sit narrower, cross less often and run wide with ball. Basically it is easier to make a raumdeuter out of a WM and has turned mine into quite a menace in the 3rd bundesliga. Scored 3 braces in 6 games so far. Give it a go and see how it goes for you.

I want my MR to be a goal threat, which he is and he already has the PI's Get Further Forward, cross less often and cut inside with ball.

I will note down your suggestions

[summatsupeer]

Surely if he is cutting inside that would mean he enters space that the BBM is going to move into? Something to test though

How small is the pitch your playing on for two players to not be able to be near each other? How bad mentally would the IF have to be to run at his teammate? Would the BBM with his roaming not be more likely to make a run for a through ball or move to support the run?

I used to do the same thing, I would make those same assumptions from the tactics screen and not try things and see what actually happens on the pitch. My tactics were all a bit disjointed with very little link up play and just relying on individual skill.

[boblardo]

I have been watching matches although not every single minute of every single match

there is no assumption being made, I watched the two players occupy the same space hence the reason I mentioned it. I will try and post screenshots later so you can see what I mean

[boblardo]

My next game is against Weston Super Mare, they are lining up in a 4-3-3 formation

My thoughts are;

* They will probably get their full backs forward so I really want to try and engage them higher up

* We out number them in the midfield

*

As a result I made two changes, I pushed my DL up and played wider.

At half time we were 1-0 down their goal coming from a corner and we had just 2 shots compared to 5 for WSM

I pushed the DL up as high it would go and the second half was a different game. They had 0 corners 3 shots compared to my 7 and we equalised midway in the 2nd half. I kept an eye on the formation widget and noticed no obvious changes

[RTHerringbone]

Your form looks OK to me. The Football League is a pretty relentless place where you can go on pretty streaky runs of form; you're certainly more consistent than my current Stevenage (now Peterborough) save where I had runs of 2 or three losses followed by a similar run of wins. Where are you in the league? What's the media prediction?

[boblardo]

Next game is against Wealdstone

I kept the previous changes, Slightly Higher and Fairly wide.

Midway through the first half we had hardly got out of our half having just 2 shots to Wealdstones 5. I added More Direct Passes to try and exploit the space being left. this got us forward quicker by half time we had evened things out

second half we scored on 58 minutes and wealdstone went attacking, i pushed higher up to and played offside. we grabbed a second goal to seal it late on

[Overmars]

I would give the RM an attack duty. I suppose you can achieve success with zero attack duties, but you can't be surprised if you score just one goal per game when adopting such a conservative tactic.

[boblardo]

I would give the RM an attack duty. I suppose you can achieve success with zero attack duties, but you can't be surprised if you score just one goal per game when adopting such a conservative tactic.

The right sided WM has a get forward PI and with the Cut Inside PI is playing a bit like a second striker. I also need him to be part of the defensive unit and i am not sure an attack duty will get him back as quick or as often.

Your form looks OK to me. The Football League is a pretty relentless place where you can go on pretty streaky runs of form; you're certainly more consistent than my current Stevenage (now Peterborough) save where I had runs of 2 or three losses followed by a similar run of wins. Where are you in the league? What's the media prediction?

Board expectations are top half finish, media predict us 10th I believe. From memory I think I am 4th but only trail 1st by a few points.

I am pretty pleased with how this save is panning out, writing down my thought process for some of the games is helping. We are creating a bunch of chances and our possession is decent, to improve here may simply be a player thing!

With regard my Further Observations above

How do I score more goals, I have only scored 18 goals in 17 league games, obviously I want to increase this without affecting the goals against column - still a work in progress

My full backs are not contributing to goals and they have very low assist counts. - My FBL has some assists, usually crossing from deep to the forward running MR who is unmarked and able to have a clear shot at goal. Would a WB(s) be better behind my WM(s) who has the get further forward PI?

My left WM(s) is also not contributing to goals. I need to think about how I want him to play here - he's next to a BBM so I probably do need him to be a steady player rather than a maverick, I am not sure a winger is appropriate as my F9 drops deep so there won't be many people in the box to aim for!!!

[Conflictinbanno]

The right sided WM has a get forward PI and with the Cut Inside PI is playing a bit like a second striker. I also need him to be part of the defensive unit and i am not sure an attack duty will get him back as quick or as often.

Board expectations are top half finish, media predict us 10th I believe. From memory I think I am 4th but only trail 1st by a few points.

I am pretty pleased with how this save is panning out, writing down my thought process for some of the games is helping. We are creating a bunch of chances and our possession is decent, to improve here may simply be a player thing!

With regard my Further Observations above

How do I score more goals, I have only scored 18 goals in 17 league games, obviously I want to increase this without affecting the goals against column - still a work in progress

My full backs are not contributing to goals and they have very low assist counts. - My FBL has some assists, usually crossing from deep to the forward running MR who is unmarked and able to have a clear shot at goal. Would a WB(s) be better behind my WM(s) who has the get further forward PI?

My left WM(s) is also not contributing to goals. I need to think about how I want him to play here - he's next to a BBM so I probably do need him to be a steady player rather than a maverick, I am not sure a winger is appropriate as my F9 drops deep so there won't be many people in the box to aim for!!!

Boblardo, just to let you know, a WM on an attack duty will still get back and defend, it just means his starting position will be a bit higher than that of the ML. Just like an AMR would still defend on attack duty, it's just his starting point is even higher than an AMR on support or a MR on attack. I'd personally try out an MR on attack, I find it works okay and shouldn't hurt your defence.

In regards to your FB's, for the LB you mentioned most of his assists are from crossing from deep, which a FB/S has so I'd keep that but maybe you could add a PI of cross more often to get him to get a few more into that area? Or another option could be to give him an attack duty to try and get him up there, but if you do the attack duty I'd make sure your defence is covered by the DM when this happens.

For the left midfield you could try a different role, possibly a wide playmaker? Although you'd want to make sure the player can do the role okay.

[boblardo]

Just a small update, I am still in the top 4. An 11 game unbeaten run saw me flirt with top spot but then a 5 game winless run saw me drop to the play off places.

I have changed my F9 to a DLF(s), my striker is scoring goals which is his primary goal but as the F9 has a dribble more PI and my striker was a rubbish dribbler i changed to a dlf(s)

Changed my right sided WM(s) to WM(a) and this has seen him score a few more goals which is great

My left sided WM(s) is told to sit narrower, more risky passes, shoot less eventually i want to give him cross more often too. He needs to do the opposite of the right sided WM(a), (ie be a threat outside the box)

I have given my left full back an attacking mentality, going to try as wb(a) also

all but one of my defeats have been 1-0 or 2-1. the 2-1 was a last minute penalty. I am conceding a few "worldies" from outside the box this may be down to the goalkeeper

[boblardo]

A terrible run of form saw me drop down the table,

I managed to turn it around a sneak into the final play off places. I had to match Ebbsfleets result to overtake them and I am little relieved that we managed it

For the last 4 games I put my left FB back to a FB(s), increased the tempo, removed play out of defence and pushed higher up. These were done as we just seemed to be "plodding" our way through games playing slow, lethargic football. I believe counter has a low tempo anyway so upping the tempo seemed logical

Playing out of defence was unticked, while it increased our possession stats I am not sure it was actually helping us. Will need to review this further

I pushed higher up as Counter is fairly deep and the presence of a DM also makes us that little bit deeper, we seemed to be inviting pressure so want us up the field a bit higher

On to the play offs now

[boblardo]

The Play Off semi finals saw us up against Margate who had beaten us in both games in the regular season. First game at home lined up as above but with push higher and higher tempo unchecked, won 2-0 with a goal late in each half

Second leg we lost 1-0 which meant we progressed to the final 2-1

The final matched us against Dartford against whom we were yet to score. Setup the same as in the semi final but were soon 1-0 down and being dominated at half time we had registered just one shot. I pushed us higher up and had us close down more to try and get us winning the ball higher up the pitch and we found ourselves 2-1 up. Dartford equalised 8 minutes later from a set piece and the game headed for extra time

The team were looking tired so I removed close down more and clicked retain possession. Dartford seemed to be taking control but on a rare venture forward they conceded a penalty which was duly converted. Immediately I lowered the tempo and we saw the game out to get promoted

Next year is going to be super tough with relegation a real possibility.

I definitely need a bit more analysis in the matches next season

[RTHerringbone]

Congratulations

Promotion via the play-off Final is such a rush when it works out (and a kick in the ass when it doesn't). Scouting is the key thing after a promotion; if you're settled with the system then scour the market for listed and unhappy players from the league or two above. There are always bargains galore.

[boblardo]

Thanks, I am so pumped about winning the play-off, i have lost in the semi finals and the finals so often in the past that I end up moving clubs through frustration. One previous save I was in the VCS for 5 seasons, making the play offs 4 times losing every single one

This season has been a different approach but its paying dividends. Need to take a little more care and "guess less" but certainly expecting a tough season next year. be happy with a 18th place finish

[boblardo]

I have tried to buy players that improve the squad but I still expect a tough season

Left Push Higher Up selected as it worked in the last few games last season and it seems sensible if I want to restrict space.

First game I faced Boreham Wood, I decided to tick Be More Disciplined as I understand Fluid allows for greater creative freedom so thought to add this to make us more rigid!

Boreham Wood lined up in a 3-2-2-1-2 formation

First half we were being totally dominated and didn't even register a shot on target whereas Boreham Wood had 5 scoring just before half time to lead 1-0. I removed Be More Disciplined for the second half and this seemed to make a difference, we came into the game and registed 4 shots, 3 on target compared to the 3 for Boreham Wood

Decent possession but we probably got away with it first half. I will be leaving Be More Disciplined off for the next game.

[boblardo]

Woking finished 2nd the previous season so we were massive underdogs,

I left my TI's as above and make one change to a PI for the GK setting his distribution to centre backs rather than full backs.

We won the game 1-0 and restricted them to shots behind the penalty spot.

I need to keep an eye on the defensive line to make sure I don't get beat by balls over the top as I am currently playing with a GK(d) but so far a good start

[summatsupeer]

When modifying your line depth I would recommend looking at the effect on both your attack and defense. Where you restrict space to defend may have a knock on effect on space for you to attack. Try and reason why something is working or not rather than accepting it due to results, it will help you in future deciding if you should use that instruction.

Good topic, I hope you stick with it and continue to learn.

[boblardo]

6 clean sheets in 11 games is not too be frowned at, and my only defeat was a 1-0 loss to Cheltenham. Nothing overly wrong defensively but we need to score a few more games.

I read that Fluid makes the team more compact and playing counter means defenders pass more direct and attackers pass shorter. With that in mind, a correct me if I am wrong here, I clicked More Direct Passing. The thinking here is that it will spread the team out a little more.

So for the next game against Aldershot we had the following TI's

A 3-1 Win in a game we dominated.

I know 1 game is a little premature but we seemed to be a little quicker getting the ball forward whist being sensible rather than just needless punts upfield.

[boblardo]

the next game was against FC Halifax who were struggling and lingering near the bottom of the table

This was so one sided up until the 65 minute

0-0 at half time, i hadn't registered a single shot at goal nor completed a cross. I pushed higher up without really understanding why and shortly after half time, on 50 minutes halifax took the lead.

I paused the game and checked the analysis tab for average positions of FC Halifax

This tells me they were pushing higher up so I moved my MR to AMR position and my ML to AML position. We also went wider.

We scored an equaliser on 80 minutes and the winner followed in the 93rd minute

[boblardo]

a 6 game unbeaten run comes to an abrupt end and I am now 3 games without a goal, losing 2 and drawing one

[boblardo]

Uploaded some highlights of goals concede, not sure if we can get too much information from the brief highlights but if anyone has the time to take a quick peak and feedback any glaring problems it would be appreciated

Maidenhead 0-2 Bromley -

- First Bromley goal looks like poor marking and/or the left FB being to far forward. 2nd goal is confusing, my right FB is set to tight marker so I would expect him to go over and shut down the cross. same scorer as the first one pops up to head in

Southport 1-0 Maidenhead -

- This was a lucky goal, I put it down to goalkeeping error. We could probably have done more to prevent the cross but once they were 1-0 up they became incredibly difficult to break down

Maidenhead 2-1 Bristol Rovers -

- 2nd place Bristol Rovers - Their goal from a corner to make it 2-1. Don't concede too many set pieces so not overly concerned

FC Halifax 1-2 Maidenhead -

- Talked about this game above

[boblardo]

I realised that throughout, I haven't listed any PI's for players

GK - GK(d) - roll it out, pass to fullbacks/centre backs, fewer risky passes

LB - FB(a) - Pass it shorter, Fewer Risky Passes, Cross more often, Get further forward

My intention is to mix up my attacking options however I notice that as default the FB(a) has Cross More Often & Get Further Forward selected. This is fine as I want him to overlap the ML in front of him and offer crossing options. This is working quite well as he has a number of assists, usually crossing for the WM(a) to slot home. However, the left side of the pitch is overloaded with crossing so maybe needs a review

CD - DC(d) - Both standard settings

RB - FB(s) - Mark Tighter, Cross from deep

Support the midfield when the WM(a) in front of him is playing further forward but still overlap when required.

DM - DM(d) - standard settings

Support the midfield

MCL - BBM(s)

MCR - CM(s) - Tackle Harder, Close Down Much More, Move into Channels

I want this player to behave like a BWM but have a little flexibility in how he plays depending on selected personnel. I have chosen Move Into Channels to offer some variety vertically!

ML - WM(s) - More Risky Passes, Cross More Often, Sit Narrower

this is my steady player, I want him to be a little beckhamesq, so crossing more often, no dribbling, looking for through balls. They player i have here has cross 12, pass 12, decision 10. Sit narrower to allow for the FB overlapping

MR - WM(a) - Sit Narrower, Cut Inside with Ball, Dribble More, Cross Less Often, Close Down Much More, More Risky Passes, Get Further Forward

My "Second" striker. Get forward support the DLF and generally scare the crap out of people. Close down much more selected to try and win the ball back from full backs higher up the pitch

CF - DLF(s) - Tackle Harder, Close Down Much More, Hold Up Ball, More Risky Passes

Play like a Defensive Forward, harrassing the back line but help out in attack also

[boblardo]

Now its written down the PI's have prompted some questions

Could the FB be given a support duty which removes the cross more often and get further forward PI's.

Could the FB on a support role be told to get further forward instead?

Is Move into Channels really needed on the CM(s), what's it causing him to do in game?

[RTHerringbone]

Could the FB be given a support duty which removes the cross more often and get further forward PI's.

Yes - if you feel you are suffering from poor cross completion or don't especially want a game with lots of crosses. If you watch a FB (S), you'll see that he moves up field at a more measured rate than an Attack Duty version.

Could the FB on a support role be told to get further forward instead?

Yes. Gauge how he moves without the PI, but he is editable to suit what you need from him.

Is Move into Channels really needed on the CM(s)' date=' what's it causing him to do in game?[/quote']

It just encourages him to move horizontally into the space between a DC and full back. Again, depends what you want from him. If you want more vertical support from him, this could hinder his progress up field. Plus it will be affected by the positioning of the players either side of him when you attack.

[boblardo]

I watched some games back, read some of the notes I made earlier in this thread

I think I have been a little blase with the PI's and TI's

I am still playing 4-1-4-1 but now have both full backs on support, my two MC's are AP(a) and BWM(s). right side WM on attack and left on support

Only PI's are on wide players, right set to cut inside, dribble more and cross less often. other side set to cross more often and shoot less. I did have sit narrower on both wm as I thought it would allow the FB space to advance but wasn't able to see this happening so took it off

with regard to TI's i have 2 selected, close down more and push higher up, I occassionally turn on retain possession or if using counter I choose play out of defence

I use either a counter or standard mentality but with a dm my dline needs to be pushed up. i am not noticing any over the top balls

I have also changed to Flexible. I don't want loads of creative freedom in my team but also don't want them too far apart so flexible seems like a sensible choice.

Stats wise my form is a little better but I am scoring more goals than before and just beat Walsall 4-1 in rd1 of the fa cup

[boblardo]

Season 2 and after winning promotion via the play offs I wasn't expecting too much

I finished 5th conceding just 36 goals although I did only score 48.

I wasn't convinced I had this tactic right, I am happy with the 4-1-4-1 shape but think the roles need a review. We could also probably lose some TI & PI's. This was clear as looking at some of the notes I made I changed roles so many times I didn't really know which ones had been successful and which ones had not for example my highest scorer last season was a midfielder who scored 8!

Season 3 - As preseason approached I just arranged 9 easy friendlies I knew I would win and set the training to fitness Very High. I rotated all players to give as much game as possible to as many players as possible.

I played the first league game against Cheltenham, it finished 0-0 but while we dominated possession it wasn't really positive possession and by looking at the Final Match Stats it was clear we probably got lucky

So we nicked a point and probably got away with it! Its clear against better teams, and as we are tipped for relegation that would probably mean most of the league, we maybe shouldn't be looking to dominate possession!

Small tweaks were needed rather than a complete overhaul. I want to be difficult to break down defensively while offering different options going forward. I don't have anyone good enough for a wide playmaker role and I am not convinced by a AP(s) / BWM(s) combo. I also tried to retain possession quite a bit and while this was good for games where teams sat back, I often felt we were parked in our own half passing the ball sideways and backwards rather than forwards with purpose. So I stayed with my 4-1-4-1 which has been relatively successful for me and decided on this formation.

Using these Team Instructions

The idea of using More Direct, is to get the ball forward as quickly as possible rather than try and dictate tempo via retain possession/short passing

The only PI's used are the DLF(s) has Close Down Much More and the GK(s) has Roll it Out/Fewer Risky Passes and depending on formation of the opposition Distribute to full backs/centre backs is also ticked

So how does it play?

I know stats don't give the whole picture but

Game 2

Game 3

Game 4

Game 5

Game 6

Possession still good but importantly we are creating good chances and reaping the rewards

[boblardo]

Next Up second place Braintree, we somehow got away with a 2-2 draw scoring our only two chances

1-1 at half time, mid way through the second half we changed to a control mentality and pushed higher up

we went 2-1 up but ultimately we were pinned back and I was unsure how to change it

On the plus side my striker has already scored 4 goals 1 less than the whole of last season

I really struggled to understand what I needed to change so would be great if anyone has the time to take a look at a pkm. http://www.filedropper.com/braintreevmaidenhead

[boblardo]

I'm so frustrated with this game now, I have tried and tried and tried but I just cannot get my head round it

This is potentially goodbye from me!!

[jomo]

I'm so frustrated with this game now, I have tried and tried and tried but I just cannot get my head round it

This is potentially goodbye from me!!

Shame, I'm in a similar situation (I never rage quit but I am struggling!) and this thread is one of the ones that inspired me to carry on!

[boblardo]

I wont quit, I always say I will but I always come back. However, you suddenly think "Eureka" but then you can't buy win regardless of who you play.

[boblardo]

It turns out I didn't save the game after drawing with Braintree, so had to replay. Lost the game 4-2 and it was pretty relentless much similar to the original game. However, I then went on a 6 game unbeaten run again before losing to Dagenham & Redbridge

Only changes that have been made is to either play with Retain Possession or Play more direct selected and rather than have a CM(a) have replaced him with an AP(a)

Braintree are top, Dagenham are 2nd so maybe its my expectations that are the problem here

[boblardo]

I don't know why I'm winning I don't know why I lose

I have tried watching games but my simple brain clearly can't process the information

It shouldn't be this hard

Thanks to all those that took time to help but I'm not sure this is the right game for me

Such a shame as I love this series