Keeping it simple - FM 16 for dummies

[neonshaker]

Hi guys,

I'm having ups and downs with this year's FM, sometimes I think I've cracked it only to go on a 7 match run without a win. I've had a good read of the stickies and it's clear that a huge amount of work has gone into them but I was just wondering if there are any 'simplistic' approaches people would suggest to help out those of us without a gift for tactics.

I want to start a LLM save with Pisa and was thinking I might pick a formation that suits and have a defensive, standard and control mentality based on match odds (as suggested by loversleap) not use instructions stick with a flexible team shape to see how far it gets me. After playing FM for years I'm hoping with your tips I can prove that FM can still be a pickup and play game for beginners by sticking to some basic rules...

Any suggestions....

[Midnight Rob]

Read whatever you can about 'Shape' and what that means.

Then realise that in Attacking mentalities, defenders pass short; attackers pass direct.

In Defensive mentalities, defenders pass long; attackers pass short.

When considering both the above remember attacking roles have lots of fwd runs whilst defensive roles are more static in positioning.

I suspect this may sound the most ambiguous and meaningless advice you've ever seen but really it isn't. Give it thought fella.

[Guest]

Read whatever you can about 'Shape' and what that means.

Then realise that in Attacking mentalities, defenders pass short; attackers pass direct.

In Defensive mentalities, defenders pass long; attackers pass short.

When considering both the above remember attacking roles have lots of fwd runs whilst defensive roles are more static in positioning.

I suspect this may sound the most ambiguous and meaningless advice you've ever seen but really it isn't. Give it thought fella.

Is there a list of mentalities and how players react in them anywhere?

[neonshaker]

Midnight rob with a mysterious answer :-) but enough to peak the interest. Anybody with anything else to add to our (hopefully) detailed list on FM for dummies?

[herne79]

At its' heart, FM is a pretty simplistic game. However, because it looks complex it is all too often thought of as being complex.

Mountains of statistics, a gazillion different tactical settings, mini games within mini games, and yes even some annoying bugs can quickly leave FMers feeling overwhelmed by it all.

The trick is to filter out all the fluff and focus in on the core simple things:

1) Team Shape is simply about creativity and space. More Fluid systems increase individual player creativity with the team playing in a more compact fashion. More Structured systems are the opposite.

2) Team Mentality is about Risk. More attacking mentalities increase risk, more defensive mentalities reduce risk. So, in FM terms, less risk means in defence your team will stand off more, keep their shape better, drop deeper and defenders are more likely to clear the ball long away from danger areas. In possession, your team will play in a more patient manner, with a lower tempo and shorter passing - looking to create fewer but better quality chances. As you may expect, more risky mentalities are the opposite of this. Each mentality change is merely a step change on this "mentality ladder".

When picking a mentality, these things are set by default. Many people make the mistake of not realising this and so layer on all sorts of Team Instructions when actually all they are doing is adding to settings that have already been defined.

3) Balance. When choosing your formation and player roles, there has to be balance. Wide players need to defend, support the midfield and attack. Your midfield needs to protect your defence and offer options going forwards. Attackers must compliment the rest of the system - it's pointless playing a 4-1-4-1 with a Poacher up front if nobody is going to be able to get near him to offer support for example.

4) Team and Player Instructions. These are essentially for fine tuning only, to help define your style of play - and should only be used once you understand what the default settings for your chosen mentality are. If more people understood this, there would be far far less requests for help on this forum. All too often you see "I want to play attacking football, I choose attacking mentality, and then add in higher defensive line + Close down much more" (for example), without that person realising the attacking mentality already comes with those settings by default. So they have chosen a very risky mentality and added in even more risk.

For me at least, that's it in a nutshell. Everything else is mere distraction.

[sjewitt]

At its' heart, FM is a pretty simplistic game. However, because it looks complex it is all too often thought of as being complex.

Mountains of statistics, a gazillion different tactical settings, mini games within mini games, and yes even some annoying bugs can quickly leave FMers feeling overwhelmed by it all.

The trick is to filter out all the fluff and focus in on the core simple things:

1) Team Shape is simply about creativity and space. More Fluid systems increase individual player creativity with the team playing in a more compact fashion. More Structured systems are the opposite.

2) Team Mentality is about Risk. More attacking mentalities increase risk, more defensive mentalities reduce risk. So, in FM terms, less risk means in defence your team will stand off more, keep their shape better, drop deeper and defenders are more likely to clear the ball long away from danger areas. In possession, your team will play in a more patient manner, with a lower tempo and shorter passing - looking to create fewer but better quality chances. As you may expect, more risky mentalities are the opposite of this. Each mentality change is merely a step change on this "mentality ladder".

When picking a mentality, these things are set by default. Many people make the mistake of not realising this and so layer on all sorts of Team Instructions when actually all they are doing is adding to settings that have already been defined.

3) Balance. When choosing your formation and player roles, there has to be balance. Wide players need to defend, support the midfield and attack. Your midfield needs to protect your defence and offer options going forwards. Attackers must compliment the rest of the system - it's pointless playing a 4-1-4-1 with a Poacher up front if nobody is going to be able to get near him to offer support for example.

4) Team and Player Instructions. These are essentially for fine tuning only, to help define your style of play - and should only be used once you understand what the default settings for your chosen mentality are. If more people understood this, there would be far far less requests for help on this forum. All too often you see "I want to play attacking football, I choose attacking mentality, and then add in higher defensive line + Close down much more" (for example), without that person realising the attacking mentality already comes with those settings by default. So they have chosen a very risky mentality and added in even more risk.

For me at least, that's it in a nutshell. Everything else is mere distraction.

i find your second point interesting i've noticed how most Ti's are all connected going right on 1 (attacking) will make the other go right so if you have balanced selected for width it's not always the same amount of width balanced on direct passing is wider than balanced on short passing even though it is the same option it's almost like there is only 1 bar.

i worry as i go left with some and right with others it's counter intuitive.

i'd be a dummy t the moment

[gunnerfan]

i find your second point interesting i've noticed how most Ti's are all connected going right on 1 (attacking) will make the other go right so if you have balanced selected for width it's not always the same amount of width balanced on direct passing is wider than balanced on short passing even though it is the same option it's almost like there is only 1 bar.

i worry as i go left with some and right with others it's counter intuitive.

i'd be a dummy t the moment

TIs are about either augmenting or mitigating the tendencies of the various mentalities. So, you may decide that if your League 1 side is playing Arsenal at Emirates, you need to play "defensive". But at the same time, you want to allow yourself some counter-attacking opportunities. That's where the TIs and PIs come in (as well as the roles of individual players). Cleon's School of Defensive Arts thread deals with this in detail.

[neonshaker]

At its' heart, FM is a pretty simplistic game. However, because it looks complex it is all too often thought of as being complex.

Mountains of statistics, a gazillion different tactical settings, mini games within mini games, and yes even some annoying bugs can quickly leave FMers feeling overwhelmed by it all.

The trick is to filter out all the fluff and focus in on the core simple things:

1) Team Shape is simply about creativity and space. More Fluid systems increase individual player creativity with the team playing in a more compact fashion. More Structured systems are the opposite.

2) Team Mentality is about Risk. More attacking mentalities increase risk, more defensive mentalities reduce risk. So, in FM terms, less risk means in defence your team will stand off more, keep their shape better, drop deeper and defenders are more likely to clear the ball long away from danger areas. In possession, your team will play in a more patient manner, with a lower tempo and shorter passing - looking to create fewer but better quality chances. As you may expect, more risky mentalities are the opposite of this. Each mentality change is merely a step change on this "mentality ladder".

When picking a mentality, these things are set by default. Many people make the mistake of not realising this and so layer on all sorts of Team Instructions when actually all they are doing is adding to settings that have already been defined.

3) Balance. When choosing your formation and player roles, there has to be balance. Wide players need to defend, support the midfield and attack. Your midfield needs to protect your defence and offer options going forwards. Attackers must compliment the rest of the system - it's pointless playing a 4-1-4-1 with a Poacher up front if nobody is going to be able to get near him to offer support for example.

4) Team and Player Instructions. These are essentially for fine tuning only, to help define your style of play - and should only be used once you understand what the default settings for your chosen mentality are. If more people understood this, there would be far far less requests for help on this forum. All too often you see "I want to play attacking football, I choose attacking mentality, and then add in higher defensive line + Close down much more" (for example), without that person realising the attacking mentality already comes with those settings by default. So they have chosen a very risky mentality and added in even more risk.

For me at least, that's it in a nutshell. Everything else is mere distraction.

Nicely summarised. I'm intrigued that I haven't put enough thought into team shape. I tend to think if I'm not sure what it does, I don't touch it. However I've had pretty disastrous results with my standard flexible 41212. :-/

[neonshaker]

http://www.addictedtofm.com/shape-mentality-and-the-theory-of-relativity/

Having gone away after listening to Midnight Rob, I found this article. Could this be why I have been struggling with my flexible/standard approach. Maybe the players feel I haven´t told them anything and I´ve left them to their own devices?

[neonshaker]

Just a quick update. Interestingly I found it extremely difficult to consistently win with a flexible system and few instructions and contrary to the purpose of the thread actually had a lot more luck with a structured system and ridiculous number of TI s. I found it really tough to create a system that defended deep held its shape and attacked on the counter and therefore ended up going with the tried and tested shorting passing lower tempo pass the opposition to death. Anybody else had any luck with deeper defending tactics?

[jamtheman123]

I am far from an FM expert but I have found a counter attacking method that might suit what you're after. Played about for a while with a direct, high tempo counter attacking team with a slightly deep defence but was too inconsistent.

Switched to a normal passing style and slightly high tempo and it clicked. The key (I think, I'm aware I have none of the knowledge of everyone on this forum) is to have any forward players close down a lot, as with the AI playing (most of the time) possession based attacks I find when I win the ball back I always have players forward. Only extra instruction is to use overlap as an attack method and it seems to work an absolute treat against better teams.

Hope this helps, but as someone who flat out refuses to download tactics and would rather make my own mistakes my advice would be to set up a tactic in pre season and stick with it, avoid tinkering too much and just see what works.

[neonshaker]

Hi Jamtheman,

Thanks for the input. So for example if I was playing a 41221 dm you'd say have those front three closing down more? I ideally want to play 4141 but just find it so blunt attack wise that I needed the wide midfielders in the AM strata.

[VibeTribe]

I've had lots of success with a very simple tactic. Just set to counter and fluid with no instructions, achieved the rest with roles.

I used Inter and a 4-2-3-1.

GK - Handanovic (Goalkeeper, defend)

RB - Santon (Full back, attack)

RCB - Miranda (Central defender, defend)

LCB - Murillo (Central defender, defend)

LB - Telles (Full back, attack)

RCM - Medel (Ball winning midfielder, defend)

LCM - Kondogbia (Box to box midfielder, support)

AMR - Perisic (Winger, support)

AMC - Ljajic (Advanced playmaker, attack)

AML - Jovetc (Inside forward, support)

ST - Icardi (Advanced forward, attack)

[neonshaker]

Hey VibeTribe. I'm guessing with that formation you were probably doing pretty well possession wise and playing a more aggressive defence? I really want to get a tactic working that soaks up pressure and hits teams on the break. However I've found myself always resorting to possession based tactics because they just seem to work better.

How were your games panning out?

[VibeTribe]

Hey VibeTribe. I'm guessing with that formation you were probably doing pretty well possession wise and playing a more aggressive defence? I really want to get a tactic working that soaks up pressure and hits teams on the break. However I've found myself always resorting to possession based tactics because they just seem to work better.

How were your games panning out?

No, this is a tactic that pretty much gives up possession, I would usually be somewhere in the middle or lower on the league possession chart over a season, around 45% IIRC.

But it is effective with the possession it has. I have used it for a about 3 seasons, won 2 Serie A titles and a Champions League. It is a great tactic against the biggest teams, I rarely ever lost a game v Barca or Real, etc.

As I was becoming a bigger team with better players, I shifted to a more possession based tactic.

[neonshaker]

No, this is a tactic that pretty much gives up possession, I would usually be somewhere in the middle or lower on the league possession chart over a season, around 45% IIRC.

But it is effective with the possession it has. I have used it for a about 3 seasons, won 2 Serie A titles and a Champions League. It is a great tactic against the biggest teams, I rarely ever lost a game v Barca or Real, etc.

As I was becoming a bigger team with better players, I shifted to a more possession based tactic.

Interesting. How was it working out defensively? Giving it a second look, I suppose maybe those Attacking mids on the left and right might be helping out defensively making the formation a 4411 in defence? I might give this formation a go. I always find it really funny when I read the stickies and think "Wow that´s a really interesting tactic" then I struggle to set up a 442 :-) lol.

[VibeTribe]

The wingers still remain a bit higher than they would in a 4-4-1-1. Defensively, I conceded the least goals in the league and scored among the top, Icardi was the league top scorer all 3 seasons I think.

Perisic on the right provided bundles of assists, Ljajic in the middle won the best player in the league award and always had 8+ rating, it really brings out the best out of the advanced playmaker. Only player that was mostly average was Jovetic on the left, but he was injured a lot. The fullbacks get lots of assists and great ratings. B2B midfielder is also really important, Kondogbia did great for me. The BWM picks up lots of cards and generally doesn't have a high rating, but does a lot of dirty work.

[neonshaker]

Nice. Great to hear you're having success with a fairly simple setup.

[jamtheman123]

Thanks for the input. So for example if I was playing a 41221 dm you'd say have those front three closing down more? I ideally want to play 4141 but just find it so blunt attack wise that I needed the wide midfielders in the AM strata.

Yes. The front three closing doesn't make a noticeable difference to the types of goals I score, I don't see my team winning the ball in their half and scoring for example. But I find that my tactic as a whole is a lot more solid and successful