Centre Back Split

[hoppo1982]

This may have been answered in another thread but i have had no luck in finding it.

 

When playing out from the back my centrebacks always stay quite narrow (regardless of a DLP dropping in between) nearly in line with each post.

I have tried changing them to BPD , adjusting the width to "very wide", not playing with a DLP etc but nothing seems to work.

Id like something along the lines of the image below.

 

Anyone any idea's ?

 

[herne79]

A Half Back is probably the closest you'll get.

[Craigus89]

I would have thought that it is almost entirely dependent on the DM who is coming deep to get the ball and what your Fullbacks are doing. You can almost never look at anything in isolation.

Screenshot of your tactic would help...

[hoppo1982]

3 minutes ago, Craigus89 said:

I would have thought that it is almost entirely dependent on the DM who is coming deep to get the ball and what your Fullbacks are doing. You can almost never look at anything in isolation.

Screenshot of your tactic would help...

Posting this in work. Laptop at home. In summary really :

 

               SK(d)

WB(s) CD(d) CD(d) WB(s)

                DLP

W(a) CM(a) CM(s) W(a)

               CF(s)

 

Control , Fluid , Play out of defence, work ball into box.

 

Wingbacks are high and wide which is good. DLP/HB will drop back if needed (If i don't want them dropping back i will change the role)

 

Problem is the narrowness of the CB's which reduces the passing angles for them.

 

4 minutes ago, herne79 said:

A Half Back is probably the closest you'll get.

 

Tried it and it does have an ever so slight affect. However at times i don't want a third player dropping in and would rather the centre backs split and the player in the DM strata stay as a forward passing option.

 

[Lordluap]

You'll find that the presences of FullBacks prevent the CentreBackss splitting wide.  If you use a Regista or Halfback (for best effect) and push the FullBacks up into the WingBack slot (on the tactics creator, not just change roles) you will see the CentreBacks split wide.

[OLLMEISTER1]

1 hour ago, hoppo1982 said:

Tried it and it does have an ever so slight affect. However at times i don't want a third player dropping in and would rather the centre backs split and the player in the DM strata stay as a forward passing option.

 

You say you do not want a third player dropping in between the two centre backs yet the picture you show and say you want does exactly that.

Eric Dier was just that last year a HB and this proved to be very effective. Good role to use if you want to exploit wide areas, creates the so called back 3 with full backs offering width further up as what Rose/Walker did last year so well at Spurs.

[Barkers]

45 minutes ago, Lordluap said:

You'll find that the presences of FullBacks prevent the CentreBackss splitting wide.  If you use a Regista or Halfback (for best effect) and push the FullBacks up into the WingBack slot (on the tactics creator, not just change roles) you will see the CentreBacks split wide.

this - ive only seen the cbs split this way when having the fullbacks pushed forward to wbl/wbr slot too

[hoppo1982]

51 minutes ago, OLLMEISTER1 said:

You say you do not want a third player dropping in between the two centre backs yet the picture you show and say you want does exactly that.

Eric Dier was just that last year a HB and this proved to be very effective. Good role to use if you want to exploit wide areas, creates the so called back 3 with full backs offering width further up as what Rose/Walker did last year so well at Spurs.

 

I then said this :

"Wingbacks are high and wide which is good. DLP/HB will drop back if needed (If i don't want them dropping back i will change the role) "

 

I like a third player to drop back if playing vs a front two. If the two CB's are only up against a lone striker i see little point in creating a 4v1 overload to get out (Keeper , 2 CB's plus a HB or Regista)

 

Perhaps the pictures should be

Picture 1 : No player dropping

Picture 2 : Player dropping

[hoppo1982]

56 minutes ago, Lordluap said:

You'll find that the presences of FullBacks prevent the CentreBackss splitting wide.  If you use a Regista or Halfback (for best effect) and push the FullBacks up into the WingBack slot (on the tactics creator, not just change roles) you will see the CentreBacks split wide.

Will give this a try thanks

[summatsupeer]

Something I noticed last night but didn't have time to test properly is the effect of setting the distribution of the GK to CB's or FB's.  Obviously it changes who the GK looks for, but I think it might affect who tries to make themselves available.  I think this because I kept forgetting to select the FB option and noticed my back 4 just pushing up whilst the GK had it at his feet.  Once I selected the GK distribution it looked like the FB's started to drop deeper to collect the ball from the GK.  Not sure if this is purely co-incidental or if it would affect the CB's movement either?

[Lordluap]

Setting GK Distribution to CB or FB does have the effect of drawing them back closer to the keeper if using Roll Ball Out..  Same as if you Roll Ball Out to a DM or CM they will drop deep (a DM will drop behind the defensive line to receive a rolled out ball).  This can create some very interesting patterns when playing out of defence if you use an off centre DM in a double pivot.

[hoppo1982]

Tried moving the fullbacks/wingback up a strata so they sit in line with the DM,

 

It did not seem to have any affect on the distance between the CB's when the keeper was playing out (goalkicks or in open play)

 

Horizontal movement of players was always a problem for me in FM16 and previous editions.

[Lordluap]

What role did you use in the DM slot?  Only certain roles (like HB and Regista) make the CB's split.

 

I use it every game so I know it works.

[hoppo1982]

Tried each of them as well as a DLP tbh. Whilst there is a split it certainly isn't as pronounced as i would like.

 

They still go almost in line with the posts rather than right to the edges of the 18 yard box.

 

Perhaps i am being overly optimistic but i would also like them to split wide without the presence of a HB or Regista so the person playing in that role is a passing option in midfield.

 

 

[tyler16]

Interesting thread. I also use the 2v1 or 3v2 rule when deciding on shape in playing out of the back. Don't have much to add but I'll report any findings I come across in the future.  

[Lordluap]

how do you play out from the back?  generally as the team advances up the field the CB's drift back closer together.

 

If you play the ball out (roll out) to the HB then you will find the CBs almost on the touchlines.

 

I know what you mean re: splitting even with no presence between them, but sadly that isnt an option in this 2016 Match Engine.

[hoppo1982]

55 minutes ago, Lordluap said:

how do you play out from the back?  generally as the team advances up the field the CB's drift back closer together.

 

If you play the ball out (roll out) to the HB then you will find the CBs almost on the touchlines.

 

I know what you mean re: splitting even with no presence between them, but sadly that isnt an option in this 2016 Match Engine.

Your last line pretty much confirms what i thought unfortunately.

 

When using a HB the CB's will spit further to accommodate him dropping in but they are never as far apart as the touchlines.

 

Yes when the team advances up field i would expect the CB's to pinch back in closer together.

[RTHerringbone]

This just cannot be achieved in FM16 (or before) because the in possession positioning of centre backs just doesn't replicate this width when the keeper has the ball. I (and others) have requested some development to enable a sort of "set piece" style interface to influence player positioning at goal kicks, so hopefully this will be on the SI radar, as it's essentially standard positioning for many sides these days.

[hoppo1982]

12 hours ago, RTHerringbone said:

This just cannot be achieved in FM16 (or before) because the in possession positioning of centre backs just doesn't replicate this width when the keeper has the ball. I (and others) have requested some development to enable a sort of "set piece" style interface to influence player positioning at goal kicks, so hopefully this will be on the SI radar, as it's essentially standard positioning for many sides these days.

I think there is a general issue of horizontal spacing and movement between players.

Something covered here in FM14 : https://cdeekyfm.wordpress.com/2014/10/19/creating-the-david-silva-role/

Getting a player to move horizontally and not vertically from his starting position is very difficult to achieve.