[DISCUSSION] Fluid Attributes

[Sporter]

Hi, I'm relatively new to the forum!

I was wondering if it would be possible to change attribute development as we know it, if it doesn't already exist. 

As it stands, if a player from the start of the game has a good spell of recent form in a top league, say a central midfielder with passing of 15, achieving 90+% passing success, several assists from passing and, during these games, plays several 'exceptional' long range passes, then his passing attribute will most likely still remain 15, if he is in his prime.

Whereas in real life, had an FM scout seen him play (as he's in a top league, this is more than likely), then he might have decided that for the player update, he would award a 1, maybe 2, increase of this player's passing attribute.

You only have to look at Leicester on FM 16 Vanilla vs Leicester on FM 16.3.0 to see how this happens in real life.

Obviously technology plays a part, but what I'm hoping to discuss is this; is it possible to change the game so match performance determines attributes rather than attributes determining match performance, and also would it improve the game significantly, in your view, if this were to happen?

EDIT-

I'm sorry if I'm confusing to some, I am more than happy to try and explain my idea further.

[Cougar2010]

You have it backwards I'm afraid.

Attributes should always determine performance not the other way round as that would give you the following situations:

A) Player does well > Improve attributes > Player does better due to increased attributes > Attributes increase further etc etc

B) Player does badly > Attributes decrease > Player does worse due to decreased attributes > Attributes decrease further etc etc.

 

Bascially your idea would create a cycle of neverending improvement or failure.

[Sporter]

3 minutes ago, Cougar2010 said:

You have it backwards I'm afraid.

Attributes should always determine performance not the other way round as that would give you the following situations:

A) Player does well > Improve attributes > Player does better due to increased attributes > Attributes increase further etc etc

B) Player does badly > Attributes decrease > Player does worse due to decreased attributes > Attributes decrease further etc etc.

 

Bascially your idea would create a cycle of neverending improvement or failure.

What if attributes were merely a guide to a player's abilities rather than what makes them perform well?

Also players with good attributes go through bad patches on FM, while players with bad attributes hit patches of good form.

It just seemed odd to me that a player scoring 40 league goals in National League couldn't get his finishing up. This meant that when I got promoted he couldn't finish for toffee.

It would also help reflect real life players such as Leon Britton and Garry Monk, who managed to turn from Division 3 players into Premier League standard players due to how they performed at a higher level. 

FM certainly wouldn't have given them a chance years ago.

I'm not saying that potential shouldn't play it's part, but it would nice if this was included alongside it.

[Cougar2010]

3 minutes ago, Sporter said:

What if attributes were merely a guide to a player's abilities rather than what makes them perform well?

There is another thread discussing how attributes are presented to the user which might touch on your idea a little.

However in terms of the ME it needs fixed numbers to make calculations so numbers would always be required for the ME to function.

 

3 minutes ago, Sporter said:

Also players with good attributes go through bad patches on FM, while players with bad attributes hit patches of good form.

All to do with hidden attributes such as consistency and hidden numbers such as complacency.

I don't know for sure but I suspect these modify the actual attributes you see to give you good/bad performances.

 

3 minutes ago, Sporter said:

It just seemed odd to me that a player scoring 40 league goals in National League couldn't get his finishing up. This meant that when I got promoted he couldn't finish for toffee.

It would also help reflect real life players such as Leon Britton and Garry Monk, who managed to turn from Division 3 players into Premier League standard players due to how they performed at a higher level. 

FM certainly wouldn't have given them a chance years ago.

I'm not saying that potential shouldn't play it's part, but it would nice if this was included alongside it.

Finishing is nothing more than the ability to hit the target, actually scoring a goal requires a good mix of attributes.

There will always be limitations due to the constraints of coding and these are generally more obvious with RL players as opposed to newgens.

In your 40 goal player I'm fairly sure he would have been successful in a higher league with the right role/duty/tactics, maybe not 40 goals but he still be able to contribute a fair number up until maybe the Championship.

I have a 2* MC who is currently averaging 7.64 this season just playing as a CM(a).  Totally unexpected when I took over the team (especially as his last two seasons were very average) as I just thought he would make a decent backup but he has become an important member of my first team.  He still can't finish chances but he does everything else right.  My point is some players in FM can do better than expected and don't require their attributes to be increased to do so.

[Neil Brock]

Reviewed so locked.