Will the DRM on FM 09 stop you from buying the game?

[Hamselv]

No game should ever monitor the gamers playing habits or anything else to do with a users pc , having it in the EULA is a cop out , if they want to install software on a persons PC that used or unused , has the potential to monitor user behaviour....... print it on the box and lets see how many copies of the game are sold.

If SI doesn't want this feature then most likely it isn't even installed. I don't know, and I don't want to accuse SI of something unless I know it for a fact. The feature does exist though and can be used as part of the DRM.

If you do a search on google for the name of the DRM (which is very easy to find if you have installed the demo and read a few of the posts in this thread, but that we are not allowed to mention) then you can read about the "insight" feature on their site and judge for yourself.

[Andy20]

Then you would just ring the number to authenticate. If you don't have a phone borrow one? Go next door!

You seem to be a big supporter of this method and you seem to really like FM 09 already, which is remarkable considering the demo has more bugs than a i'm a celebrity get me out of here bushtucker trial.

The fact of the matter is, why should we have to do all this faffing about just to play a game which we spent hard earned money on. Why can't it just be simple like buying the game, sticking it into the drive, installing it and playing it whenever you like, wherever you like with the disk. All this installing on 5 computers rule and having to authenticate it is just silly, ok so it might clamp down on people who play with CD cracks and stuff but that is just a kick in the nuts forthe people who actually always bought games genuinly and played them whenever they wanted as long as they had a disc and legal copy.

Don't get me wrong, I think Sigames and everyone involved have created the best football management series ever but I do have a lot of worries about 09 given the amount of bugs and glitches in the demo, it reminds me of Champ Man 4.

[treble_yell_:-)]

If SI doesn't want this feature then most likely it isn't even installed. I don't know, and I don't want to accuse SI of something unless I know it for a fact. The feature does exist though and can be used as part of the DRM.

If you do a search on google for the name of the DRM (which is very easy to find if you have installed the demo and read a few of the posts in this thread, but that we are not allowed to mention) then you can read about the "insight" feature on their site and judge for yourself.

I dunno why people keep saying we cant mention the name of the DRM, if you look on the steam page, in the game info its names the DRM, its not a secret when steam has it up in nice bold letters on the games info page.

[Hamselv]

I dunno why people keep saying we cant mention the name of the DRM, if you look on the steam page, in the game info its names the DRM, its not a secret when steam has it up in nice bold letters on the games info page.

I have never wanted to have anything to do with steam, so I didn't know that.

I asked Miles for the name of the DRM at some point and got the following answer:

There are very good reasons why we won't be revealing the name of the system that we are using in advance of release...

So, we're just trying to respect that decision.

[treble_yell_:-)]

I have never wanted to have anything to do with steam, so I didn't know that.

I asked Miles for the name of the DRM at some point and got the following answer:

So, we're just trying to respect that decision.

I think STEAM , unlike SEGA/SI like to let people know what they are putting on their pc's so they can make an informed choice.

[tony1]

If SI doesn't want this feature then most likely it isn't even installed. I don't know, and I don't want to accuse SI of something unless I know it for a fact. The feature does exist though and can be used as part of the DRM.

If you do a search on google for the name of the DRM (which is very easy to find if you have installed the demo and read a few of the posts in this thread, but that we are not allowed to mention) then you can read about the "insight" feature on their site and judge for yourself.

Wonder what he means by whatever

S*********r Insight is not a license protection, activation, or management product,” says Brian Deeley, U****c’s VP of product management. “It’s actually an online service designed to get all that data for you.”

desktop analytics, business intelligence, real-time reporting, or whatever, this new service offers powerful capabilities.

[Kriss]

Don't get me wrong, I think Sigames and everyone involved have created the best football management series ever but I do have a lot of worries about 09 given the amount of bugs and glitches in the demo, it reminds me of Champ Man 4.

Have you tried counselling? It's a bloody game, why would you be worried?

Don't like it don't buy it.

Do you have the same problems if you read that they've changed the boot for a shoe in the monopoly set you wanted for Christmas?

I can't believe all the adjectives people use to describe their emotions in relationship to a few mega bytes of software.

[GillsMan]

I will never buy anything with any form of DRM. I buy something, it is mine to do as I please and use in any manner I see fit. If i'm not able to do this then I wont buy it. Once again people who pirate the game will have a better experience than legitimate users... it's just ridiculous and plain stupidity. I refuse to buy any other kind of media now like DVDs just because of those frigging anti-piracy adverts at the start. (I rent stuff now before anyone starts)

The only saving grace this year is the game is being released on steam so it's not going to be a problem for me personally... although i'm not happy with these ad board things on FM09 either.

This is becoming more and more an antiquated take on property - particularly digital property such as music, videos, games, etc. If you were to purchase, say, a car, I'd be 100% with you, but I think that, just as technologies change, so too do our ownership parameters.

With that in mind - and much as I don't see why people are that bothered by DRM - I do think that after a reasonable period of time (which would differ for music or films or games), the product should obtain automatic immunity from DRM. In other words, the purchaser should not be asked to keep up with the protection. This is to stop people who buy music from obscure online stores finding, several years down the line, that they can no longer play that music (as has happened). Similarly if, god forbid, years down the line there was no SI, Sega, or companies that could provide authentication for FM09, it shouldn't be the player/owner who is penalised.

And, just so nobody is confused about my POV here, I've argued for several years that DRM is inefficient, promotes piracy (BioShock being a classic example where legitimate buyers couldn't play the game they'd paid for so ended up pirating it) and can, in some circumstances, unfairly penalise the genuine buyers (why should I have to sit through an Anti-Piracy commercial on my DVD which I can't fast forward through when, oh irony of ironies, those who have pirated the movie go straight to the movie). That said, DRM done in the correct manner (as in Microsoft - no they are not the evil of the planet the paranoid seem to think they are) isn't too much of a hinderence. I fully understand, for example, why Microsoft would want to limit the number of machines I can install Windows XP onto - it's basic business common sense!

[PetitSourice]

It [anti piracy bugs] was done on FM08 and appeared to be totally ineffective, caused a lot of vitriol on here too, mind you even changing the colour of the match ball would do that

WOW. This has good and bad implications. Well.. No. Just bad.

I have been playing the legal, non-no cd cracked version of 20008. (yes, this is bad). It's bad because it means that I can't blame my horrible, horrible experiences in the lower leagues on piracy.

I'm talking about going 10-20 games w/o a goal sometimes. I did find out about a supposedly never fixed bug relating to strikers missing opportunities too much making their moral go in the toilet. The fix in that case is to have them start getting less shots, but higher quality shots by building up play.

As far as the piracy bit, I guess it did not fix or deter anyone. This is exactly why i won't pirate the game though. In addition to the viruses that seem to come with any piracy habit, there's the games not working right.

[Ritari]

I won't buy the game. Mainly because of the DRM and ads system. Maybe this is a good thing as I haven't played FM08 for about five months because it's a crap game, so now I have a chance of ending my 16-year-long playing of CM/FM for good. It's still a shame, though.

[GillsMan]

This is exactly why i won't pirate the game though.

And not the fact it's illegal and ISPs are finally relenting to pressure and starting to crack down on it?

[PetitSourice]

And not the fact it's illegal and ISPs are finally relenting to pressure and starting to crack down on it?

I have never refused to do something solely based on it's legal status. Never. That's just too English / American for me.

If legality determined behavior, then there would have been no french revolution for example.

[GillsMan]

I have never refused to do something solely based on it's legal status. Never. That's just too English / American for me.

If legality determined behavior, then there would have been no french revolution for example.

Fair point - I suppose we all weigh up the consequences before blindly following the law (I don't drive - but how many drivers have gone over the speed limit, for example). For me, though, the risk of getting caught from piracy, plus the threat of getting defective products (intentional bugs - e.g. the European Championship qualification one that backfired in FM08) means I won't touch it. The biggest reason is, however, that I'd feel morally wrong stealing it. Oh, and the fact I have OCD and like to have all the DVD boxes lined up in alphabetical order!

[PetitSourice]

Fair point - I suppose we all weigh up the consequences before blindly following the law (I don't drive - but how many drivers have gone over the speed limit, for example). For me, though, the risk of getting caught from piracy, plus the threat of getting defective products (intentional bugs - e.g. the European Championship qualification one that backfired in FM08) means I won't touch it. The biggest reason is, however, that I'd feel morally wrong stealing it. Oh, and the fact I have OCD and like to have all the DVD boxes lined up in alphabetical order!

Umm... regarding ocd. Do you have every release of FM? On the shelf? Lol! You should uploada pic!

[saberhagen83]

For me, though, the risk of getting caught from piracy, plus the threat of getting defective products (intentional bugs - e.g. the European Championship qualification one that backfired in FM08) means I won't touch it.

That "bug" was not a problem for pirates wih a few braincells left. It all depended on what version they got, so it was pretty pointless in the end.

[GillsMan]

Umm... regarding ocd. Do you have every release of FM? On the shelf? Lol! You should uploada pic!

No, because my copies of CM96/97, and onwards (I only started at 96/97) are in the old style CD jewell cases. So they'd look out of place in my cabinet - they have to live in the drawer. Goddamn this OCD!

[Andy20]

Have you tried counselling? It's a bloody game, why would you be worried?

Don't like it don't buy it.

Do you have the same problems if you read that they've changed the boot for a shoe in the monopoly set you wanted for Christmas?

I can't believe all the adjectives people use to describe their emotions in relationship to a few mega bytes of software.

Lol maybe saying "Worries" Was overreacting shall we say but the point I was trying to make is that there seems to be a lot of bugs in the demo and the demo is the final versian. Yes patches will come and fix those but I remember when CM4 first came out, without patches it was probably unplayable for a long career game. Some might argue that it was unplayable long term even after the patch due to the agility and balance bug.

I mean come on lets be honest, you are bound to react angrily to my comments seeing as you seem to be one of the boys for FM on here. (FML moderator)

[T-Bag]

This is becoming more and more an antiquated take on property - particularly digital property such as music, videos, games, etc. If you were to purchase, say, a car, I'd be 100% with you, but I think that, just as technologies change, so too do our ownership parameters.

With that in mind - and much as I don't see why people are that bothered by DRM - I do think that after a reasonable period of time (which would differ for music or films or games), the product should obtain automatic immunity from DRM. In other words, the purchaser should not be asked to keep up with the protection. This is to stop people who buy music from obscure online stores finding, several years down the line, that they can no longer play that music (as has happened). Similarly if, god forbid, years down the line there was no SI, Sega, or companies that could provide authentication for FM09, it shouldn't be the player/owner who is penalised.

And, just so nobody is confused about my POV here, I've argued for several years that DRM is inefficient, promotes piracy (BioShock being a classic example where legitimate buyers couldn't play the game they'd paid for so ended up pirating it) and can, in some circumstances, unfairly penalise the genuine buyers (why should I have to sit through an Anti-Piracy commercial on my DVD which I can't fast forward through when, oh irony of ironies, those who have pirated the movie go straight to the movie). That said, DRM done in the correct manner (as in Microsoft - no they are not the evil of the planet the paranoid seem to think they are) isn't too much of a hinderence. I fully understand, for example, why Microsoft would want to limit the number of machines I can install Windows XP onto - it's basic business common sense!

If it does become an antiquated view then I just wont buy anything any more. I wouldn't have any moral issues whatsoever about just going off to pirate any game I wanted to play. I buy games to respect the developers, that's the single reason. I can quite easily download a game on SSL secured newsgroup connection in less time than it takes me to go to the shops and back but I don't, because I like to give people like SI my money. They introduce DRM crap like this and I suddenly no longer want to give them my money. Then I find I can get a better experience from illegally downloading the game compared to actually buying it.... so what are people going to do? I've stopped buying DVDs because of the annoying piracy adverts, i've stopped buying music because of what they did to places like oink, and I WILL stop buying games if companies like Sega/SI continue down this road... hell it will be cheaper for me.

In fact i'm so annoyed by this, although I was planning to buy this on steam so I would be unaffected by the activation crap, i'm actually not going to buy it out of my own personal protest.

[GillsMan]

If it does become an antiquated view then I just wont buy anything any more. I wouldn't have any moral issues whatsoever about just going off to pirate any game I wanted to play. I buy games to respect the developers, that's the single reason. I can quite easily download a game on SSL secured newsgroup connection in less time than it takes me to go to the shops and back but I don't, because I like to give people like SI my money. They introduce DRM crap like this and I suddenly no longer want to give them my money. Then I find I can get a better experience from illegally downloading the game compared to actually buying it.... so what are people going to do? I've stopped buying DVDs because of the annoying piracy adverts, i've stopped buying music because of what they did to places like oink, and I WILL stop buying games if companies like Sega/SI continue down this road... hell it will be cheaper for me.

In fact i'm so annoyed by this, although I was planning to buy this on steam so I would be unaffected by the activation crap, i'm actually not going to buy it out of my own personal protest.

Wow. The sooner ISPs pull their fingers out and clamp down on piracy the better, frankly.

[Illdisposed]

I Couldn't care less, what works for SI Works for Me.

[F77]

the only thing i have to say about this is that it will spare me some trouble...

i have 2 laptops... 1 for me and 1 for my father.

we both love this game, and to avoid having to move the cd around too many times, since fm07, what we do is instal the game on both laptops, leave the cd on one of the laptops, and for the other one i'd get the though job of finding a cracked .exe file to the other laptop(which is even harder considering i wouldnt get any without being 100% sure it was virus free...)...

now, since i dont need to have the cd on any of the laptops to play, t'l be easy to set things up!

just to think that the only thing i have to do after installing it twice is authenticate it online ONCE... it just makes me happy...

ps: what i did in the 2 previous FM games was NOT piracy... i did buy the game, but only 1 which was installed twice... the cracked .exe file had exactly the same effect as changing the cd between the 2 laptops... with one advantage: the cd was safer... less scratches... less chances of it becoming unreadable by the laptop...(as it happened to me in other games...)

[Kriss]

the only thing i have to say about this is that it will spare me some trouble...

i have 2 laptops... 1 for me and 1 for my father.

we both love this game, and to avoid having to move the cd around too many times, since fm07, what we do is instal the game on both laptops, leave the cd on one of the laptops, and for the other one i'd get the though job of finding a cracked .exe file to the other laptop(which is even harder considering i wouldnt get any without being 100% sure it was virus free...)...

now, since i dont need to have the cd on any of the laptops to play, t'l be easy to set things up!

just to think that the only thing i have to do after installing it twice is authenticate it online ONCE... it just makes me happy...

ps: what i did in the 2 previous FM games was NOT piracy... i did buy the game, but only 1 which was installed twice... the cracked .exe file had exactly the same effect as changing the cd between the 2 laptops... with one advantage: the cd was safer... less scratches... less chances of it becoming unreadable by the laptop...(as it happened to me in other games...)

Why tell people on this site that you did that?

Whatever your rationalisation it was technically illegal so why not just keep schtum?

[Kriss]

Lol maybe saying "Worries" Was overreacting shall we say but the point I was trying to make is that there seems to be a lot of bugs in the demo and the demo is the final versian. Yes patches will come and fix those but I remember when CM4 first came out, without patches it was probably unplayable for a long career game. Some might argue that it was unplayable long term even after the patch due to the agility and balance bug.

I mean come on lets be honest, you are bound to react angrily to my comments seeing as you seem to be one of the boys for FM on here. (FML moderator)

The people who are "boys for FM" are their most demanding critics, that's why we are doing what we do, yes men are no good to them.

We are privileged to know much more about the dev/production cycle than people like yourself, it follows then that we'll understand better why things happen the way they do.

So in fact instead of using our position to belittle us and calling us fanboys, you should rationalise that as we know more than you we might just know what we're talking about.

My only criticism of you and so many others is the hysterical terminology used, it actually defeats your object, people stop listening when they know you're going ott.

All the points you make are perfectly valid, making them using calm considered statements backed up with facts if it helps, gets people to listen, screaming about it using adjectives like disaster, disgraceful and implying it will affect your mental stability makes the people you want to listen roll their eyes in their heads.

[mattbuck]

Interesting thread and a good read. Some good and bad points made.

Will i still buy FM, yes i always do every year, and i will again this year.

Am i happy about the protection, not really however i will reserve judgement until i have the game and can see it in action, saying all that though, i don't like drm.

[MSCCG]

The people who are "boys for FM" are their most demanding critics, that's why we are doing what we do, yes men are no good to them.

We are privileged to know much more about the dev/production cycle than people like yourself, it follows then that we'll understand better why things happen the way they do.

So in fact instead of using our position to belittle us and calling us fanboys, you should rationalise that as we know more than you we might just know what we're talking about.

My only criticism of you and so many others is the hysterical terminology used, it actually defeats your object, people stop listening when they know you're going ott.

All the points you make are perfectly valid, making them using calm considered statements backed up with facts if it helps, gets people to listen, screaming about it using adjectives like disaster, disgraceful and implying it will affect your mental stability makes the people you want to listen roll their eyes in their heads.

I guess some people feel that those who follow the system must love and support the system whole-heartedly. You've gotta be mavericks and go against everything, blowing everything out of proportion and staging extravagant protests to seem like an individual with an opinion. In fact, most people aren't "fanboys" or whatever, it's just so obviously better to see things in an objective view than looking at it from either side and when these people don't make a big fuss, they are labeled as sheep as well.

[zeusbheld]

not a fan of DRM but it won't stop me from buying the game.

[Mike.83]

I have a DRM Question, sorry if its already been covered.

At the moment with FM08, its installed on the two PC's in my house. I move the disk between them, depending which one FM is running on. Every so often, its on both PC's at the same time, if my brother is playing for example.

Will I be able to install the game on two PC's, or along with the 5 install thing, can I only install on one PC configuration?

Hope someone can answer this, as it will effect if I buy the game or not.

cheers.

Anyone know?

[mertle]

NOT HAPPY and VERY ANGRY WITH SI & MILES.

Seems DRM was present in the demo and it has left residual rubbish and does NOT uninstall once you uninstall Fm2009.

I AM SO ANGRY with SI for not saying DRM was in the demo. NOW I have a piece of rubbish on my HDD which cannot be removed thanks a bunch for warning people who dont want DRM .

If the demo dont remove the certificates and DRM protection like miles already said what hope is there on the full version of removing said protection. This is why I now will never trust SI ever again while they stay in bed with Sega for causing this issue. It seems we just gone down hill since the eidos split. SI lost focus and now no better than companies like EA although they do at least still rectify bugs in the game but even patches have diminished what we used to get.

I cant believe I was suckered to installing and looking at the demo.

This WHY I HATE DRM it leaves residual rubbish. Sorry but if I get banned so be it there does seem to be a TAG on my system from the protection in a folder miles has not been very truthful and be wary if you buy the game best to uninstall before upgrading pc especially a device which you tend to upgrade. I had three down the years I will let you guess what but its rather easy to guess.

However what is strange miles dont want the protection system revealed incase these pirates get a head start but puts the DRM in the demo thats double dutch when we have in the past non hard protected demos apart from code omited for its security which was very good idea.

Now I understand they want to protect there work but gods sake not with this its evil dont care how it worms onto your pc DRM. STill cant get Why the DEMO has the evil deed. In the past SI said they made sure the demo cant go beyond the season end even if its hacked by removing certain code even to combat piracy of the demo. If this has been suficient in the past why change.

Mike.83 you wont be able to miles said somewhere that you would have to buy 2 versions.

[Viking]

Exactly what is left on the HDD after you uninstall the demo?

[JumbledSausage]

what happens if you have to install it more than 5 times?

What happens if you want to play it in a few years and the activation servers aren't there anymore?

Don't you feel annoyed that people who download the game illegally get a completely unrestricted version while you paid for it but have to abide by restrictions?

1. If you uninstall the game, you get one of your "lives" back - so, if you have to reinstall windows, make sure to uninstall fm first. If your computer breaks, keep the hard drive (if that bit isn't the bit that didn't break), then you could uninstall it later.

2. SI have said that the servers will be available in, I think, 11 years...so I highly doubt it will be an issue

3. Yes - but I try not to think about it whilst laughing like hell when watching those adverts on TV where people sing about the cheapskate thief who downloads movies!

[JumbledSausage]

Anyone know?

Um...technically the stock answer is that you need one copy per person playing the game. I'm not entirely certain if this means that you won't be able to run the same copy on two machines at the same time - if you wanna try you'll have to wait until the 14th (obviously).

[F77]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kriss

Quote:

Originally Posted by F77

the only thing i have to say about this is that it will spare me some trouble...

i have 2 laptops... 1 for me and 1 for my father.

we both love this game, and to avoid having to move the cd around too many times, since fm07, what we do is instal the game on both laptops, leave the cd on one of the laptops, and for the other one i'd get the though job of finding a cracked .exe file to the other laptop(which is even harder considering i wouldnt get any without being 100% sure it was virus free...)...

now, since i dont need to have the cd on any of the laptops to play, t'l be easy to set things up!

just to think that the only thing i have to do after installing it twice is authenticate it online ONCE... it just makes me happy...

ps: what i did in the 2 previous FM games was NOT piracy... i did buy the game, but only 1 which was installed twice... the cracked .exe file had exactly the same effect as changing the cd between the 2 laptops... with one advantage: the cd was safer... less scratches... less chances of it becoming unreadable by the laptop...(as it happened to me in other games...)

Why tell people on this site that you did that?

Whatever your rationalisation it was technically illegal so why not just keep schtum?

funny thing...

i dont remember coming to the site at this time... actually i believe that at that time i was drinking some wiskey with a friend of mine...

considering whats said there i believe i know who it was... i better change my pass... unfortunatedly the guy knows all my passwords, so i'll have to make a new one which i'll probably forget in a week or so...

anyway... that new system is probably be a real pain... specially since my laptop is kinda old... i had to repair it a few times already... well... i paid for some one to repair it for me... else it would probably exploded in my face if i tried to do it...

i sence i'll have to instal and uninstal FM09 a few times...

[vaz1111]

this may have been mentioned before i dont know because i havent read every post.

si are doing this to crack down on piracy, but it'll lose them sales. if you and 3 mates all play fm, no point you all buying the game, just go thirds on 1 copy and authenticate it on each persons pc

[Mike.83]

Mike.83 you wont be able to miles said somewhere that you would have to buy 2 versions.

That sucks first time thats been the case, maybe the first time I wont be buying it then

[Hamselv]

That sucks first time thats been the case, maybe the first time I wont be buying it then

You can have FM09 installed on up to 5 different computers at the same time. The problem is that when you buy FM you get a license to play it – your brother doesn't. If you install it on several computers for you to play then it's fine, but if you install it on several computers to make both you and your brother play, then it's against the license.

So, if you install it on two of your computers and sometimes let your brother play as well, then technically it's against the license, but I doubt you'll ever find Miles knocking at your door to hand you a court order.

[Richardav]

You can have FM09 installed on up to 5 different computers at the same time. The problem is that when you buy FM you get a license to play it – your brother doesn't. If you install it on several computers for you to play then it's fine, but if you install it on several computers to make both you and your brother play, then it's against the license.

So, if you install it on two of your computers and sometimes let your brother play as well, then technically it's against the license, but I doubt you'll ever find Miles knocking at your door to hand you a court order.

its the same with dvds where you cant rent it or let a friend borrow it

[Ranbir]

I'll probably delay my buy until it is cheaper.

Until publishers listen to Stardock and help support the principles in the Gamer's Bill of Rights (dramatic title but gets the attention) games can be worth their tag again.

[JonPaulWild]

its the same with dvds where you cant rent it or let a friend borrow it

I wonder if any employed members at Sports Interative have ever lent a DVD, video or music CD to a friend or family member?

[DJ]

My take on DRM

The program I do the helpdesk for (costs 350 Euros for the normal user version) has an activation policy as well (only TWO activations possible - SEGA are being generous) and it really helps us to catch out people who hand the program out to their pals or who think they can staff their entire office with only one license. Or who sell it on but keep using it.

There's also people who simply honestly didn't realize the EULA limitations - we can set them straight, no harm done to us or them.

As far as SEGA needing to keep activation servers alive - let that be their concern. By implementing this technology, they commit themselves to providing the possibility to activate the program for as long as the program doesn't reach end-of-life. When it does (many years from now), they'll probably hand out some 'non-expiring' or 'unlimited activation' licenses for the few hard-core fans who still play the game.

In the past, SI used to protect CM/FM by making it mandatory to have the disk in the drive - therefore committing themselves to being able to deliver the CDs if the customers would be in need of them (when CDs break or get lost) - no one ever doubted their willingness or ability to deliver those.

Of course you can think of scenarios in which the activation policy backfires somehow. No battleplan ever survives contact with the enemy. However, these cases will be few and far between and knowing SI, they will be dealt with in a spirit of leniency and fairness.

I can hear the cries of 'fanboi' already - consider this: I wouldn't be writing the above paragraph if I didn't believe it is true - SI have turned me into a loyal customer over the years, I have no reason to believe otherwise!

[Robioto]

Another annoyance to add to the many with FM. I pay for the game, so I should be able to install it, play it and uninstall it when I want. You won't stop piracy and I think rather than that, this is just a way to pointlessly annoy legitmate users while probably spending more money on the system in the process.

[DJ]

so I should be able to install it, play it and uninstall it when I want

You can. At least, the way I understand it is that you don't lose activations unless something like a hard disk crash happens.

[Ranbir]

An unnecessary inconvenience then.

Just 'authenticate' us when we download an update and other post-launch content you'll provide. Reward the buyers, don't assume foul-play.

[treble_yell_:-)]

stuff

So it cuts out license violations, great, but surely with games the main form of piracy is BT/p2p/usenet , of which drm has proven to have no effect.

[DJ]

So it cuts out license violations, great, but surely with games the main form of piracy is BT/p2p/usenet , of which drm has proven to have no effect.

It'll have some effect - it's up to SEGA to gauge if the inconvenience is worth the prevented theft. They must have thought it's worth it - they don't do this to pester us!

[CaptainPlanet]

If the DRM buys them an extra few days after release, that's a lot of extra money they'll get - impatient people who can't get their hands quickly on a dodgy copy will buy the full version.

[treble_yell_:-)]

If the DRM buys them an extra few days after release, that's a lot of extra money they'll get - impatient people who can't get their hands quickly on a dodgy copy will buy the full version.

Missed the locked thread earlier then ? the game got released in some countries early which in turn led to copies being available via nefarious means

[johnsoncarmichael]

absolutely not. if you have nothing to hide then you have nothing to fear. up with DRM!

[Andy20]

The people who are "boys for FM" are their most demanding critics, that's why we are doing what we do, yes men are no good to them.

We are privileged to know much more about the dev/production cycle than people like yourself, it follows then that we'll understand better why things happen the way they do.

So in fact instead of using our position to belittle us and calling us fanboys, you should rationalise that as we know more than you we might just know what we're talking about.

My only criticism of you and so many others is the hysterical terminology used, it actually defeats your object, people stop listening when they know you're going ott.

All the points you make are perfectly valid, making them using calm considered statements backed up with facts if it helps, gets people to listen, screaming about it using adjectives like disaster, disgraceful and implying it will affect your mental stability makes the people you want to listen roll their eyes in their heads.

I agree, I apologise for my remarks, they were a bit OTT. I guess I just don't like all this upto date activation stuff that some games have nowadays, I used to enjoy it more when you just bought a game and didn't have to think about how many installs you are allowed or what will happen if your computer breaks while FM is still installed etc...

I realise that this activation is going to benefit computer game makers because it will clamp down on piracy which I am all for. I would never criticise Si because they have made some unbelievably good football management games and I know they will continue to do so... I just feel a bit unsure of what FM 2009 will hold, people talking of strange things happening in the match engine, some bugs etc...

The game just froze when I was around 5 minutes into the demo and was clicking around and I hadn't even pressed continue yet! I knew it was unlikely because of my computer because it is a dual core 2.4ghz processor with 3gb ram with no background programs running at the time So I guess that was disapointing too.

I'm sure the final product with patches will be very good though.

[Interloper]

absolutely not. if you have nothing to hide then you have nothing to fear. up with DRM!

I wonder if people like you even read the threads.

1. The pirates arent affected by this anyway so what are we legal buyers supposed to be hiding ?

2. Some anti piracy software is known to install root kits and what not on your system

3. 5 installs isnt enough for people, i have many times installed my game more than 5 times when i format my computers and i do that atleast every 4 month (my laptop included), i dont go around uninstalling every damm software first that would take way too long time not to mention : hardware upgrades.

4. I dont want to call in and beg SI for a new install, not only cant i call when i want to but i also need to pay big ass phone bills for out of country calls.

5. People already got the game in the mail/ bought it in a shop for their kids or whatever, they come home and they cant install it before official release date they know nothing about.

6. SI's servers will probably go down and even if they wont it will be a pain in the ass for people with no internet having to be in line to call in for hours.

This "If you have nothing to hide" attitude is stupid and not a valid argument like many others in here, it could slow down the crackers yes but it will in no way affect downloaders anyway.

[DJ]

As said in my earlier post: DRM does have an effect on piracy. You won't catch out the hard-core crackers, but you will put off a lot of 'casual downloaders' and 'home copiers' and 'lend it of a mate'.

For the rest people are just being dramatic, inventing all sorts of very unlikely scenarios that would lead to this DRM being detrimental. Sure, there will be some cases like that. I'm sure SI will deal with them fairly. But how many of those cases will there be? Judging from experience (see my earlier post) there will be very, very few.