Will the DRM on FM 09 stop you from buying the game?

[ZIRA - NK Jedinstvo Bihac]

All these posts about DRM make me sick.

WE ALL KNOW.. we will probably play FM09 1-2 max 3 years.

And dont tell me you need more than 5 activations...

And dont tell me your computer will blow up 5 times.

And dont tell me that you will be unable to contact SI / SEGA whatever and ask them for 1 more activation.

They all say in posts "What if i .. What if ... What if..."

After FM10 relase ill probably throw away my FM09 copy... or i will put it under sofa... or something.

[Tyler42]

And according to the site of the company it will take a hardware map of my PC. Also stated that I will be able to change various components in m PC without trouble, ie. graphics card, motherboard, RAM, CPU, just how sensitive is this character map. They say, various simultaneously without affecting the basic map?

If your HDD, Motherboard, Operating System(Doubt it) or any data that specifically identifies that this is the specific computer, is now possibly another one, it will most likely affect the "map"

[Dirky Diggler]

Hi Dirky Diggler - We don't actively monitor you, but record information at each point of activation.

But doesnt that kind of shoot yourselves in the foot, You may now have the greatest DRM in the world that is uncrackable, but people can just share it with their friends instead. Im not saying its right, but people will exploit this if they can.

Can you guarantee me that once this product is installed and authenticated, it WILL NEVER send ANYTHING out via any connection again?

Zeke beat me to it!!

However Zeke I dont think its 3rd party because I believe its actually embedded within the software itself rather than wrapped around it

[Pele_10]

Can someone tell me in plain english, what exact information will be getting sent from my computer to this 3rd party?

[Tyler42]

But then when they buy a new computer or upgrade something they wont be able to install FM09 cause they were so "clever" to share it with their mates.

[Tyler42]

Can someone tell me in plain english, what exact information will be getting sent from my computer to this 3rd party?

Most likely your computer IP address, your HDD serial or w/e they use to identify it, motherboard info.

No personal data, just computer specs. Only program I've seen reserve the right to get data from your Hard drive is Punkbuster. Hence why I dont buy games from EA anymore.

[Dirky Diggler]

But then when they buy a new computer or upgrade something they wont be able to install FM09 cause they were so "clever" to share it with their mates.

No, thats wrong, because you will uninstall and therefore get an authentication back with which to install again. Miles also said in a thread (I think) Thaat hardware changes shouldnt affect the game, obviously a new computer will, but as long as you uninstall first then you should have no problems

[Dirky Diggler]

Most likely your computer IP address, your HDD serial or w/e they use to identify it, motherboard info.

No personal data, just computer specs. Only program I've seen reserve the right to get data from your Hard drive is Punkbuster. Hence why I dont buy games from EA anymore.

No point in using IP address, a lot of peoples IPs Are dynamic, so it would make no difference, as they change all the time. Besides it doesnt matter if the computers are on two different continents, the end user who bought the game could own two different computers on opposite sides of the world. For instance home and office PC I know people who have an office in Germany, USA and one in UK

[Tyler42]

No point in using IP address, a lot of peoples IPs Are dynamic, so it would make no difference, as they change all the time. Besides it doesnt matter if the computers are on two different continents, the end user who bought the game could own two different computers on opposite sides of the world. For instance home and office PC I know people who have an office in Germany, USA and one in UK

Yea I just thought that since I myself have a dynamic one

[Tyler42]

No, thats wrong, because you will uninstall and therefore get an authentication back with which to install again. Miles also said in a thread (I think) Thaat hardware changes shouldnt affect the game, obviously a new computer will, but as long as you uninstall first then you should have no problems

The thing SI is preventing is for torrent users to download this game, with this method 50000+ ppl cant use the same copy like they have been able to in the past.

[Muzchap]

Hi! I played the demo. (Finally got it working after a long struggle)

Intresting debate.

Basically Muzchap is saying that you will install 3rd party program which will "call home" regularly. By definion this is 3rd party program itself which is "spying" on our computer using the normal internet traffic port 80.

When I buy a game which I do regularly I intend to install the game itself nothing more. EA is a bad example of business which went the wrong way. And now this. Doesn't sound like a good business plan.

If you can guarantee that the DRM protection only calls home once and does nothing else than I might buy this... might... but I doubt you can promise any such things.

As said I like the idea that you fight piracy etc as you should but the idea of 3rd party software on your computer is absurd.

Enough trash floating around internet already without this.

I never said it would 'dial home' - how would that work with phone then? Please READ carefully - it will only connect to the Internet if you choose Internet activation.

[Kriss]

Hi! I played the demo. (Finally got it working after a long struggle)

Intresting debate.

Basically Muzchap is saying that you will install 3rd party program which will "call home" regularly. By definion this is 3rd party program itself which is "spying" on our computer using the normal internet traffic port 80.

When I buy a game which I do regularly I intend to install the game itself nothing more. EA is a bad example of business which went the wrong way. And now this. Doesn't sound like a good business plan.

If you can guarantee that the DRM protection only calls home once and does nothing else than I might buy this... might... but I doubt you can promise any such things.

As said I like the idea that you fight piracy etc as you should but the idea of 3rd party software on your computer is absurd.

Enough trash floating around internet already without this.

I thought it was pretty clear, the act of authenticating triggers the info shot back to "HQ".

That's it, end of.

It will do it each time you authenticate, so in theory they will know every single machine type with every single hardware config, and, most importantly as we've seen, every single type of graphics card in use.

[Muzchap]

And according to the site of the company it will take a hardware map of my PC. Also stated that I will be able to change various components in m PC without trouble, ie. graphics card, motherboard, RAM, CPU, just how sensitive is this character map. They say, various simultaneously without affecting the basic map?

Hi Tony,

That's correct, you can change components around without breaking the Activation. We have also tested this in QA, a couple of gfx cards, hdd and a sound card and the game is still activated.

[philly_flyer10]

The thing SI is preventing is for torrent users to download this game, with this method 50000+ ppl cant use the same copy like they have been able to in the past.

Do naive, this will probably have zero effect on torrent users, in fact torrent users will probably end up with a superior, clean product.

[Äktsjon Männ]

The thing SI is preventing is for torrent users to download this game, with this method 50000+ ppl cant use the same copy like they have been able to in the past.

Well then they've already failed because it will be cracked anyway. That's just how these things work, sooner or later it will be available to download illegally. To think that the new system is somehow unbreakable is incredibly naive, as long as there's demand there will be enough of these people on it to figure it out. The best scenario is that it won't be cracked in the first two days after the release or even before it.

[zeke]

I never said it would 'dial home' - how would that work with phone then? Please READ carefully - it will only connect to the Internet if you choose Internet activation.

"Dialing" was not meant to be taken literally. But than again you did answer the question? I don't have any problems with internet activation by itself. However I do have a problem with the trend that software/product is gathering information from users without their knowledge.

That is a principle. So, basically you can guarantee that you can disable such "dialing" (matter of speech) after the product is activated? Quite conflicting statements on this issue.

It must gather a lot more than just IP addresses since most people are using DHCP servers. Thus meaning that these information is useless. I know some people do use static IP addresses but I think they are minority.

You are able to turn this off once activated? ....and if not could you specify in detail what data is the software collecting? Since it seems that you are more than aware of how this protection works.

I have been working on the IT business for several years and this is one of thing I really don't like.

It got nothing to do with 5 installation limits etc. That is more than enough. EHM2007 has 2 installs and it has been enough for me up to date. To me it is matter of principle nothing else.

But if you can give detailed information on the questions above than I might make an exception.

Since people are praising SI and naming it is the "only" producer that cares about the people than I might suggest you take a look at Matrix Games. Quality service, No DRM crap or such and nice forums. Allthough their games are for "niche" gamers compared to this. I have already bought several titles from them in this ongoing year.

Oh... and I did NOT meant that SI isn't providing solid customer service before someone makes that assumption. No!

[Muzchap]

Can someone tell me in plain english, what exact information will be getting sent from my computer to this 3rd party?

Hi Pele,

Here's a dump of the stats we collected during a testing session (sorry about the formatting)

Basically covers the following:

AUDIO_DEVICE

DESKTOP_BIT_DEPTH

DIRECTX_VERSION

INTEL_CPU_SPEEDS

MONITOR_REFRESH_RATE

MULTI_MONITOR_DESKTOP_RESOLUTION

NETWORK_SPEED

PHYSICAL_CPUS

PRIMARY_DISPLAY_RESOLUTION

PROCESSOR_VENDOR

SYSTEM_LANGUAGE

SYSTEM_RAM

VIDEO_CARD_DESCRIPTION

VIDEO_CARD_DRIVER_NAME

WINDOWS_VERSION

As you can see - it doesn't actually identify who the user is - all information is completely anonymous.

############################################################

Measures

Hardware Sampled Device Count % Users

Football Manager 2009 37 100.00%

Football Manager 2009 37 100.00%

AUDIO_DEVICE 37 100.00%

ASUSTeK Tiger Capture Device 1 2.70%

ATI Function Driver for High Definition Audio - ATI AA01 1 2.70%

Bluetooth Audio 1 2.70%

Bluetooth Hands-free Audio 1 2.70%

Bluetooth High Quality Audio 1 2.70%

Bluetooth Stereo Audio 1 2.70%

Bluetooth-lyd 1 2.70%

C-Media AC97 Audio Device 1 2.70%

Conexant AC-Link Audio 1 2.70%

Creative EMU10K1 Audio Processor (WDM) 1 2.70%

Creative SB Live! Series (WDM) 1 2.70%

Creative SB Live! Value (WDM) 1 2.70%

High Definition Audio Device 1 2.70%

Logitech Mic (Pro 9000) 1 2.70%

Realtek AC'97 Audio 4 10.81%

Realtek AC'97 Audio for VIA ® Audio Controller 1 2.70%

Realtek High Definition Audio 13 35.14%

SigmaTel C-Major Audio 2 5.41%

SigmaTel High Definition Audio CODEC 4 10.81%

SoundMAX Integrated Digital Audio 2 5.41%

SoundMAX Integrated Digital HD Audio 6 16.22%

Unimodem Half-Duplex Audio Device 3 8.11%

DESKTOP_BIT_DEPTH 36 97.30%

16 2 5.56%

32 34 94.44%

DIRECTX_VERSION 37 100.00%

4.09.00.0904 37 100.00%

INTEL_CPU_SPEEDS 37 100.00%

1595 1 2.70%

1596 1 2.70%

1600 1 2.70%

1608 1 2.70%

1664 1 2.70%

1667 1 2.70%

1695 1 2.70%

1729 1 2.70%

1799 1 2.70%

1862 1 2.70%

1995 2 5.41%

1997 1 2.70%

2161 1 2.70%

2200 1 2.70%

2211 1 2.70%

2394 1 2.70%

2400 4 10.81%

2403 1 2.70%

2404 1 2.70%

2411 1 2.70%

2624 1 2.70%

2663 1 2.70%

2664 1 2.70%

2666 2 5.41%

2671 2 5.41%

2793 1 2.70%

2997 2 5.41%

2999 1 2.70%

3013 1 2.70%

797 1 2.70%

798 1 2.70%

MONITOR_REFRESH_RATE 36 97.30%

50 1 2.78%

59 2 5.56%

60 29 80.56%

69 1 2.78%

72 1 2.78%

75 2 5.56%

MULTI_MONITOR_DESKTOP_RESOLUTION 37 100.00%

1 34 91.89%

2 3 8.11%

NETWORK_SPEED 35 94.59%

1000000 21 60.00%

110000 2 5.71%

360000 1 2.86%

4000000 4 11.43%

480000 2 5.71%

540000 6 17.14%

PHYSICAL_CPUS 37 100.00%

1 33 89.19%

2 4 10.81%

PRIMARY_DISPLAY_RESOLUTION 36 97.30%

1024 x 768 x 4294967296 colors 3 8.33%

1024 x 768 x 4294967296 kleuren 1 2.78%

1024 x 768 x 4294967296 kolorw 1 2.78%

1024 x 768 x 4294967296 1 2.78%

1024 x 768 x 65536 colors 1 2.78%

1024 x 768 x 65536 Farben 1 2.78%

1152 x 864 x 4294967296 colors 1 2.78%

1280 x 1024 x 4294967296 colori 1 2.78%

1280 x 1024 x 4294967296 colors 7 19.44%

1280 x 1024 x 4294967296 farger 1 2.78%

1280 x 1024 x 4294967296 frger 1 2.78%

1280 x 800 x 4294967296 colores 1 2.78%

1280 x 800 x 4294967296 colors 2 5.56%

1280 x 800 x 4294967296 couleurs 1 2.78%

1280 x 800 x 4294967296 renkler 1 2.78%

1440 x 900 x 4294967296 colores 1 2.78%

1440 x 900 x 4294967296 colors 3 8.33%

1680 x 1050 x 4294967296 colors 3 8.33%

1680 x 1050 x 4294967296 Farben 1 2.78%

1680 x 1050 x 4294967296 kolorw 1 2.78%

1680 x 1050 x 4294967296 1 2.78%

1920 x 1200 x 4294967296 colors 1 2.78%

1920 x 1200 x 4294967296 1 2.78%

PROCESSOR_VENDOR 37 100.00%

AuthenticAMD 8 21.62%

GenuineIntel 29 78.38%

SYSTEM_LANGUAGE 37 100.00%

1028 1 2.70%

1031 2 5.41%

1033 23 62.16%

1036 1 2.70%

1040 1 2.70%

1042 2 5.41%

1043 1 2.70%

1044 1 2.70%

1045 2 5.41%

1053 1 2.70%

1055 1 2.70%

3082 1 2.70%

SYSTEM_RAM 37 100.00%

1004974080 1 2.70%

1006092288 1 2.70%

1056423936 1 2.70%

1063698432 1 2.70%

1064693760 1 2.70%

1071067136 1 2.70%

1071693824 1 2.70%

1072087040 1 2.70%

1072390144 1 2.70%

1073131520 1 2.70%

1073201152 1 2.70%

1601564672 1 2.70%

1610067968 1 2.70%

1610072064 1 2.70%

2145255424 1 2.70%

2145398784 1 2.70%

2145460224 1 2.70%

2145796096 1 2.70%

2145824768 2 5.41%

2145828864 1 2.70%

2145890304 2 5.41%

2145984512 1 2.70%

2146480128 1 2.70%

2146545664 1 2.70%

2146611200 1 2.70%

2673848320 1 2.70%

2683613184 1 2.70%

3152547840 1 2.70%

3219566592 1 2.70%

3220221952 1 2.70%

3220680704 1 2.70%

535543808 1 2.70%

536326144 1 2.70%

6440550400 1 2.70%

936853504 1 2.70%

TOTAL_HD_SPACE 37 100.00%

1.00028E+11 1 2.70%

1020444672 1 2.70%

1031503872 1 2.70%

1.04856E+11 1 2.70%

1.04858E+11 1 2.70%

1.12546E+11 1 2.70%

1.1656E+11 1 2.70%

1.18436E+11 1 2.70%

1.20023E+11 1 2.70%

12584677376 1 2.70%

14485504 1 2.70%

1.47084E+11 1 2.70%

1.50864E+11 1 2.70%

1.57284E+11 1 2.70%

1.59381E+11 1 2.70%

1.60681E+11 1 2.70%

1.62787E+11 1 2.70%

1.66159E+11 1 2.70%

1.67771E+11 1 2.70%

17848856576 1 2.70%

2035974144 1 2.70%

2.03913E+11 1 2.70%

2.03921E+11 1 2.70%

2042232832 1 2.70%

2.09712E+11 1 2.70%

20974428160 1 2.70%

22060199936 1 2.70%

2263128064 1 2.70%

2.43271E+11 1 2.70%

2.43271E+11 1 2.70%

2.49978E+11 1 2.70%

2.50048E+11 4 10.81%

2.50986E+11 1 2.70%

2.7039E+11 1 2.70%

27332571136 1 2.70%

2845829120 1 2.70%

2.90385E+11 1 2.70%

3.00066E+11 1 2.70%

300318720 1 2.70%

309647360 1 2.70%

31453437952 1 2.70%

3.2007E+11 1 2.70%

3.2007E+11 1 2.70%

32810635264 1 2.70%

35467374592 1 2.70%

38074785792 1 2.70%

38181748736 1 2.70%

38346252288 1 2.70%

38527176704 1 2.70%

38699941888 1 2.70%

396208128 1 2.70%

39983050752 1 2.70%

4.00086E+11 1 2.70%

40336740352 1 2.70%

41940668416 1 2.70%

420005888 1 2.70%

44070912 1 2.70%

4.47669E+11 1 2.70%

4867547136 1 2.70%

4.99983E+11 1 2.70%

5.00097E+11 1 2.70%

5.00105E+11 2 5.41%

52427898880 1 2.70%

52427931648 1 2.70%

52436123648 1 2.70%

526907392 1 2.70%

52998930432 1 2.70%

55183400960 1 2.70%

552402944 3 8.11%

570216448 1 2.70%

5724160 1 2.70%

5812639744 1 2.70%

60003381248 1 2.70%

60019834880 1 2.70%

600950784 1 2.70%

603979776 1 2.70%

609286144 1 2.70%

609595392 1 2.70%

62843322368 1 2.70%

62915133440 1 2.70%

656369664 1 2.70%

71434326016 1 2.70%

73501069312 1 2.70%

736428032 1 2.70%

75138412544 1 2.70%

75982200832 1 2.70%

76149641216 1 2.70%

7975118848 1 2.70%

79844851712 1 2.70%

80015491072 2 5.41%

80037052416 1 2.70%

80048390144 2 5.41%

80848896 1 2.70%

81950851072 1 2.70%

8248295424 1 2.70%

83889594368 1 2.70%

8589930496 1 2.70%

91374600192 1 2.70%

95732887552 1 2.70%

99961827328 1 2.70%

VIDEO_CARD_DESCRIPTION 37 100.00%

ATI Mobility Radeon X1600 1 2.70%

ATI MOBILITY RADEON X300 1 2.70%

ATI MOBILITY RADEON X700 2 5.41%

ATI Radeon 9600 / X1050 Series 2 5.41%

ATI Radeon 9600 / X1050 Series Secondary 2 5.41%

ATI Radeon HD 4800 Series 1 2.70%

ATI Radeon X300/X550/X1050 Series 1 2.70%

ATI Radeon X300/X550/X1050 Series Secondary 1 2.70%

ATI RADEON XPRESS 200M Series 1 2.70%

Intel® 82865G Graphics Controller 1 2.70%

LogMeIn Mirror Driver 2 5.41%

Mobile Intel® 915GM/GMS 3 8.11%

Mobile Intel® 945 Express Chipset Family 1 2.70%

NVIDIA GeForce 6200 TurboCache 1 2.70%

NVIDIA GeForce 7600 GT 1 2.70%

NVIDIA GeForce 7950 GT 1 2.70%

NVIDIA GeForce 8500 GT 1 2.70%

NVIDIA GeForce 8600 GT 1 2.70%

NVIDIA GeForce 8800 GT 1 2.70%

NVIDIA GeForce 8800 GTS 1 2.70%

NVIDIA GeForce 8800 GTX 2 5.41%

NVIDIA GeForce 9800 GTX/9800 GTX+ 1 2.70%

NVIDIA GeForce FX 5600 1 2.70%

NVIDIA GeForce Go 7400 1 2.70%

NVIDIA GeForce Go 7900 GTX 1 2.70%

NVIDIA Quadro FX 1500M 1 2.70%

NVIDIA Quadro FX 560 1 2.70%

PCI GDIHOOK5 1 2.70%

RADEON 9200 SERIES 1 2.70%

RADEON 9200 SERIES - Secondary 1 2.70%

RADEON 9800 PRO (Microsoft Corporation - WDDM) 1 2.70%

RADEON 9800 PRO - Secondary (Microsoft Corporation - WDDM) 1 2.70%

Radeon X1300/X1550 Series 1 2.70%

Radeon X1300/X1550 Series Secondary 1 2.70%

Radeon X1600 Series 1 2.70%

Radeon X1600 Series Secondary 1 2.70%

Radeon X1800 Series 1 2.70%

Radeon X1800 Series Secondary 1 2.70%

Radeon X1950 Pro 1 2.70%

Radeon X1950 Pro Secondary 1 2.70%

VIA Chrome9 HC IGP 1 2.70%

VIA/S3G UniChrome Pro IGP 1 2.70%

Winvnc video hook driver 2 5.41%

VIDEO_CARD_DRIVER_NAME 36 97.30%

ati2dvag.dll 13 36.11%

atiumdag.dll 2 5.56%

ialmrnt5.dll 3 8.33%

igxprd32.dll 2 5.56%

nv4_disp.dll 9 25.00%

nvd3dum.dll 3 8.33%

nvd3dumx.dll 2 5.56%

S3gIGP.dll 1 2.78%

vtdisp.dll 1 2.78%

VRAM 35 94.59%

100663296 2 5.71%

1073741824 1 2.86%

134217728 9 25.71%

268435456 9 25.71%

536870912 7 20.00%

67108864 4 11.43%

671088640 1 2.86%

805306368 2 5.71%

WINDOWS_VERSION 37 100.00%

5.1.2600 30 81.08%

6.0.6000 1 2.70%

6.0.6001 6 16.22%

[Muzchap]

"Dialing" was not meant to be taken literally. But than again you did answer the question? I don't have any problems with internet activation by itself. However I do have a problem with the trend that software/product is gathering information from users without their knowledge.

That is a principle. So, basically you can guarantee that you can disable such "dialing" (matter of speech) after the product is activated? Quite conflicting statements on this issue.

It must gather a lot more than just IP addresses since most people are using DHCP servers. Thus meaning that these information is useless. I know some people do use static IP addresses but I think they are minority.

You are able to turn this off once activated? ....and if not could you specify in detail what data is the software collecting? Since it seems that you are more than aware of how this protection works.

I have been working on the IT business for several years and this is one of thing I really don't like.

It got nothing to do with 5 installation limits etc. That is more than enough. EHM2007 has 2 installs and it has been enough for me up to date. To me it is matter of principle nothing else.

But if you can give detailed information on the questions above than I might make an exception.

Since people are praising SI and naming it is the "only" producer that cares about the people than I might suggest you take a look at Matrix Games. Quality service, No DRM crap or such and nice forums. Allthough their games are for "niche" gamers compared to this. I have already bought several titles from them in this ongoing year.

Oh... and I did NOT meant that SI isn't providing solid customer service before someone makes that assumption. No!

Please see post 560 - that contains everything you need to know about this protection system.

It will only connect to the Internet when 'you' ask it to.

There is no 5 installation limit - please read post 560

The software as a once only exercise will send 'hardware' info (INSIGHT), this is to help us develop the game.

Hope this helps to clear up your concerns.

[Kriss]

I'd guess collation is automated then:D

[VexingVixen]

The thing SI is preventing is for torrent users to download this game, with this method 50000+ ppl cant use the same copy like they have been able to in the past.

Umm, sorry to break it to you, but by tomorrow the web will be loaded with FM09 torrents and they will all be playable. There is nothing ANY company can do to stop people from downloading a game, If anything, this DRM will encourage more piracy as I'm sure has been said many times.

I'm not condoning that, it just amazes me how naive some people are with regards to piracy.

[feedthegoat]

Umm, sorry to break it to you, but by tomorrow the web will be loaded with FM09 torrents and they will all be playable. There is nothing ANY company can do to stop people from downloading a game, If anything, this DRM will encourage more piracy as I'm sure has been said many times.

I'm not condoning that, it just amazes me how naive some people are with regards to piracy.

tbh it was inevitable that that was going to happen.

Also, why is it that there is only DRM on the PC version and not the MAC as well out of curiosity?

[stevie_G_32201]

you know most of those people who voted "yes" are going to buy the game anyway lol

[Muzchap]

Umm, sorry to break it to you, but by tomorrow the web will be loaded with FM09 torrents and they will all be playable. There is nothing ANY company can do to stop people from downloading a game, If anything, this DRM will encourage more piracy as I'm sure has been said many times.

I'm not condoning that, it just amazes me how naive some people are with regards to piracy.

Hi, so are you aware of a cracked version making the rounds? We're not naive about copy protection, we are trying to preserve our revenue.

[Dirky Diggler]

tbh it was inevitable that that was going to happen.

Also, why is it that there is only DRM on the PC version and not the MAC as well out of curiosity?

Coz fm piracy on the mac is so little a problem it doesnt make sense to invest loads of money into a DRM type copy protection for it

[tony1]

Hi, so are you aware of a cracked version making the rounds? We're not naive about copy protection, we are trying to preserve our revenue.

Just had a look about, found 3 sites offering full version of FM2009 PLUS crack. files uploaded 9th Nov.

No I haven't downloaded it and no i wont.

As for Mac, a guy I work with has one and never buys games, he downloads them all, about time this was looked into or are mac users considered too good to do this sort of thing

[Dirky Diggler]

Just had a look about, found 3 sites offering full version of FM2009 PLUS crack. files uploaded 9th Nov.

No I haven't downloaded it and no i wont.

As for Mac, a guy I work with has one and never buys games, he downloads them all, about time this was looked into or are mac users considered too good to do this sort of thing

Tony, They are all fakes, probably gay pron. Its not that mac users are deemed too good its the fact that there are too few mac users to impact on piracy numbers and overall sales of the game

[pelicanstuff]

Just had a look about, found 3 sites offering full version of FM2009 PLUS crack. files uploaded 9th Nov.

No I haven't downloaded it and no i wont.

As for Mac, a guy I work with has one and never buys games, he downloads them all, about time this was looked into or are mac users considered too good to do this sort of thing

They look to be attempts to crack from the demo, just about guaranteed to be rubbish. Cld also be fakes but I'm not going to check.

[JumbledSausage]

Coz fm piracy on the mac is so little a problem it doesnt make sense to invest loads of money into a DRM type copy protection for it

I thought it was because Steam authentication is not compatible with Macs presently, so they just stuck with the old CD-authentication systems?

[tony1]

Tony, They are all fakes, probably gay pron. Its not that mac users are deemed too good its the fact that there are too few mac users to impact on piracy numbers and overall sales of the game

875Mb files with a bright green+ so someone has downloaded it and approved or authenticated it to be what it is.

[Dirky Diggler]

I thought it was because Steam authentication is not compatible with Macs presently, so they just stuck with the old CD-authentication systems?

Might be, I was just looking at the bigger picture, They could still use online and phone authentication, but I dont think they sell enough copies to care

[Muzchap]

Coz fm piracy on the mac is so little a problem it doesnt make sense to invest loads of money into a DRM type copy protection for it

They look to be attempts to crack from the demo, just about guaranteed to be rubbish. Cld also be fakes but I'm not going to check.

I'd advise nobody to download the purported cracks - otherwise a reinstall will likely be required.

The only reason MAC DRM was not in this year, was due to the development effort it would have required before deadline day, there is no special preference to MAC users. We are fully aware of the piracy rates on the MAC and are committed to bringing these down in the future.

[Chris Ritchie]

piracy@sigames.com is the address to report anything you come across to.

[Dirky Diggler]

875Mb files with a bright green+ so someone has downloaded it and approved or authenticated it to be what it is.

Download it and watch some homo erotic tossfest.

Not been pre'd in any reputable channel yet. So 98% chance its fake or.... uncracked ISO a copy of FM09

Cracked copy of FM08 renamed, or FIFA manager 09, I hope its the latter, they deserve everything they get!

[pelicanstuff]

I'd advise nobody to download the purported cracks - otherwise a reinstall will likely be required.

I'm not going to. I was just reading up a bit. This interests me as I sometimes do QA in this sort of area at work.

[Hamselv]

1) We did not want restrictive DVD checks, this is problematic on most PC's and both SecuROM and SafeDISC install low level drivers, along with blacklisting which can cause system instability. Also with the rise of EE-PC's we did not want to restrict the game to be authenticated on DVD media.

All the previous years where FM used a disc-check, have you ever been this many threads from people complaining and refusing to buy the game? Maybe the people inside SI towers have a different definition of "restrictive" than many consumers.

2) We have listened to your requirements and have tried to make this protection as unobtrusive as possible - please let me dispel some of the myths already circulating:

Maybe you should have visited the boards for some of the other DRM restricted games as well. Then you would have seen that it's the restrictions rather than the choice of DRM that makes many people refuse to buy the game. Fallout 3 uses SecuROM to just perform the good old disc-check and no one seems to have any problems with that. Actually I've seen many people who refused to buy Far Cry 2 because of its restrictive DRM, choose to spend their money on Fallout 3 instead.

• There is a hardware feature called 'Insight' turned on - this will collect basic info about your machine - Hardware only (clockspeed, gfx card, memory, hdd size) - this will assist in future developments of the game - BUT can be turned off if it proves unpopular.
  
• There is no 'profiling' or 'monitoring' of how you play the game? Where this came from is beyond me?
  

The "insight" program supplied for the DRM solution contains 3 insight features: License insight, Feature insight and Hardware insight.

You admit to using the hardware insight, since Miles claims to be able to see if more than one person uses the game, then I would guess that you are also using the license insight, so is it really that far fetched that you would also be using the feature insight?

The feature insight is described as this:

Feature Insight tells you exactly how and when your customers use each of the features in your product. No more guessing — know exactly which features to invest in and which features to market and build your customer base around.

How is that not "monitoring", and shouldn't the user be able to turn off these insight features, rather than hoping that the software developer chooses to at some point?

• The game will be DRM free after around 18 months - this will ensure that you can always play the game, as we have listened to your concerns about servers being unavailable in the future.
  

Exactly what does "DRM free" mean? Does it mean unlimited activations, or does it mean that you install the game, apply the patch, and then every single trace of the DRM is completely removed from the system? If it's the second option, then maybe I will consider buying the game 18 months from now.

1) You can install the game on ALL 35 of your computers You can only play 5 at a time though.

Well you can buy a Windows cd and install it on 1000 computers if you like, but like FM you won't be able to activate it on more than a few of those computers, so what's the point?

[tony1]

I'd advise nobody to download the purported cracks - otherwise a reinstall will likely be required.

I am not and will not download it I was just saying a few places offering a 800+ Mb file reportedly to be the real thing is already out there

[VexingVixen]

piracy@sigames.com is the address to report anything you come across to.

And what exactly will they do?

[Matt ex SEGA]

We've had some success removing pirate versions in the past.

[Dirky Diggler]

We've had some success removing pirate versions in the past.

How? you may get it taken down from a site or someones server, but once its out in the wild what can you do?

[Chris Ritchie]

Removing a single link obviously won't stop the game being pirated, but it will make it slightly more difficult for those that are looking to download it for free.

[Matt ex SEGA]

Yep. Appreciate your point tho, Diggler.

[VexingVixen]

Removing a single link obviously won't stop the game being pirated, but it will make it slightly more difficult for those that are looking to download it for free.

Fact is, they're going to get it anyway. Especially if they know what they're doing. =/

[Chris Ritchie]

Fact is, they're going to get it anyway. Especially if they know what they're doing. =/

Yes, an experienced pirate will get it. There's no way around that once a cracked version is out there. But people who are less committed to not paying for it may well give in after their usual resources are blocked.

Anyway, removing links isn't exactly the full extent of SEGA's anti-piracy operation, is it? It's just a part of the overall effort.

[zeke]

Appreciate your time of being here Muzchap. Read latest few pages on this thread.

Allthough, it doesn't seem half as bad as EA has done it is still basically the same DRM system. The software does not ask anything and as Hamselv pointed it potentially can gather more information.

I have no trouble giving my system specs but there is an big diffrence whether the program ask for those or goes and does without your "approval".

I really do hope this is not the way game publishers will go in the future. Only way to influence on this is your wallet. That how it goes.

At lest this news gives me more time to play with other products and also time to continue with EHM2007 database project I have been working on.

[Dirky Diggler]

Yes, an experienced pirate will get it. There's no way around that once a cracked version is out there. But people who are less committed to not paying for it may well give in after their usual resources are blocked.

Anyway, removing links isn't exactly the full extent of SEGA's anti-piracy operation, is it? It's just a part of the overall effort.

Yes, but unfortunately there is no longer so called less commited pirates out there because its so easy to get, they no longer have to jump through hoops or do anything technical, its all done for them all they have to do is downlaod follow instructions in NFO and play. Maybe I misunderstand you and you mean if you can delay the inevitable by a week or better a month, people who want the game but would normally only pirate it, would get frustrated and go out and buy it, now that I understand and think is actually quite a good idea

[Chris Ritchie]

Yes, that's the point I'm making. Or at least close to it.

[Dirky Diggler]

Yes, that's the point I'm making. Or at least close to it.

Hi 5, sexy time

[marcoavgousti]

by the time u computer has broken 5 times im pretty sure ull have enough cash to buy another game, if ur pc breaks once a year, u got 5 years to save up, whats that?? 50p a month or somehting????

[Dirky Diggler]

by the time u computer has broken 5 times im pretty sure ull have enough cash to buy another game, if ur pc breaks once a year, u got 5 years to save up, whats that?? 50p a month or somehting????

2 things, thats not the point you shouldnt have to

other thing is, if you read up a page or two you would see you can get all your authentications back online anyway. so even if you dont uninstall the game 5 times you can still get them back so its not an issue

[Chris Waddle]

I personally can't stand DRM and refuse point blank to buy any game with it on.

I am forever re-building my pc and generally re-install windows every month or two.

Now whilst I apprecaite that an uninstall will give me a licence back, I know for a fact, that at some point, I will need to re-install windows and totally forget to uninstall FM09 first. My fault I know, but I legally own the game. I should be able to install and re-install this 100 times a day on my machine, should I choose to do so (without the need for internet or phone calls).

DRM has upset myself and many of my friends. Whilst I choose not to buy a copy of a game with DRM, I would never download a pirated version either. Yes, it may be 'cutting my nose off to spite my face' but I would rather go without a game than support DRM.

They say that it's to prevent piracy. Take Spore for example. This has become the most downloaded pirated game ever. Why? Because of DRM. I do not condone it, but I know people who would have happily bought it without DRM, because of DRM, they downloaded it for free.

The more DRM is incorporated into games, the lower the sales of games will be. If this poll is an accurate representation of the buying public (which I doubt, but it could be), FM09 has just reduced its sales by 27%.