Player sent off, fined, wants to leave...

[scass]

I've had Milinkovic-Savic sent off in two successive appearances. The first time he was unhappy at a one week wages fine.  The second time he was unhappy, and when told he\'d let his team-mates down, he said he wanted to leave the club. I'm not going to vent about this, as there isn't any point. 

But I think player interactions needs looking at.  What's the point of this sort of nonsense?

[themadsheep2001]

Why did you fine him? I know its there as an option (not particularly one mind), but fining players a week or 2 weeks ages is actually a big deal (both in game and in real life)

The fining system feels pretty blunt, and needs more scope if its there. Player fines in real life don't get this high unless its serious misdemeanours, and getting sent off doesnt count as one

I'm not sure he should be talking about leaving, but I can totally understand him raging if you've fined him a total of a months wages

[HUNT3R]

There is also a big difference between sending off after two yellows or a more serious straight red. Which was it?

[scass]

32 minutes ago, themadsheep2001 said:

36 minutes ago, themadsheep2001 said:

Why did you fine him?

A more pertinent question might be why a player would want to leave a club where he's won three Cham[ions Leagues and four Premier Leagues. But obviously, I'm the one who has to explain myself here: I fined him for indiscipline. If you think a player with a poor disciplinary record should simply be allowed to behave recklessly in a Champions League knockout game, then we obviously have very different views on managing a club. I fine everyone for a red card. As for "player fines don't get this high in real life", maybe so. But then the game needs to be modified to reflect this. Beside - he earns 205k a week - he can afford it. 

[scass]

32 minutes ago, HUNT3R said:

There is also a big difference between sending off after two yellows or a more serious straight red. Which was it?

First time, straight red, second time, two yellows, the second after he'd been asked to watch his step. It's still persistent fouling, and it's a feature of his game. 

[HUNT3R]

The first time is open for debate. Fining wages for two yellows is not something players are likely to accept though. 

[scass]

2 minutes ago, HUNT3R said:

The first time is open for debate. Fining wages for two yellows is not something players are likely to accept though. 

Don't agree. IN FM 18, I rarely had a problem with it. And I've not had a problem with anyone else. But, hey, what do I know?

[themadsheep2001]

4 minutes ago, HUNT3R said:

The first time is open for debate. Fining wages for two yellows is not something players are likely to accept though. 

I'm not sure he should be asking to leave. I am very much seeing why he would be very unhappy. That Savic reacted well to the last red card warning I gave him, hasn't been red carded a two season now

[JeffDogg]

I fine quite often, I don't get that much issues usually

[themadsheep2001]

15 minutes ago, scass said:

 

What he's won isn't really relevant tbh. Trying to work out the scenario of how hes wanting to leave. Since it's your save, you're the only one with answers. Not sure why you're being so hostile anyone trying to get to the bottom of it. Some players will react better than others to warnings and fines, trying to see why he would kick off in this instance

[scass]

3 minutes ago, themadsheep2001 said:

I'm not sure he should be asking to leave.

Well, that's my point - why go nuclear? Unhappy I can deal with, but it seems contrived. Still, as I say, happy to sell him for a fat fee.

[scass]

1 minute ago, themadsheep2001 said:

What he's won isn't really relevant tbh. Trying to work out the scenario of how hes wanting to leave. Since it's your save, you're the only one with answers. Not sure why you're being so hostile anyone trying to get to the bottom of it. Some players will react better than others to warnings and fines, trying to see why he would kick off in this instance

I'm not being hostile. He's a key player. He appears in as many matches as he is fit for. He plays in his preferred position, he has a contract for the next three years and he got what he wanted when he negotiated. 

[HUNT3R]

8 minutes ago, themadsheep2001 said:

I'm not sure he should be asking to leave. I am very much seeing why he would be very unhappy. That Savic reacted well to the last red card warning I gave him, hasn't been red carded a two season now

That is why I have my doubts about the reaction to the first red, which was a straight red. Unless it is a question of Savic not respecting the manager. I can see the player getting upset for two yellows, but also, this is AFTER the first fine already upset him, so that's why he'd want to leave now. It's that first fine that kicked things off, imo.

[kidthekid]

To be fair, fining players for bookings doesn't happen much in real life except if it's a nasty foul. Players like Ramos come to mind, I don't know if his managers ever punished him for his red cards.

Not saying your concern isn't valid, wanting to leave a successful club because of a week's fine is excessive. Just saying that I think people use the fines more than in real life.

[JeffDogg]

Because the choices are poor to do something else. Especially in Touch. All I can do is fine when the game allows to do so. Even in full game, it's very limited to do something else.

People need to stop comparing reality and the game on matters like that. You can talk to players IRL and they have a thought process and answers based on that. It's a computer game with reactions coded. We can't talk to players in the game like we could in real life.

[themadsheep2001]

4 minutes ago, JeffDogg said:

Because the choices are poor to do something else. Especially in Touch. All I can do is fine when the game allows to do so. Even in full game, it's very limited to do something else.

People need to stop comparing reality and the game on matters like that. You can talk to players IRL and they have a thought process and answers based on that. It's a computer game with reactions coded. We can't talk to players in the game like we could in real life.

The choice would have been to hand him a warning first. That's the lowest point of escalation. Fining a player who is already unhappy after the first fine is a big escalation, and then when your talk doesn't go well, you've not got much room left.

Regardless of real life, fining players in game isn't a low level sanction

[JordanMilly]

29 minutes ago, themadsheep2001 said:

The choice would have been to hand him a warning first. That's the lowest point of escalation. Fining a player who is already unhappy after the first fine is a big escalation, and then when your talk doesn't go well, you've not got much room left.

Regardless of real life, fining players in game isn't a low level sanction

There's also the option of giving a warning, and then going into player interactions and warning him again about his conduct (or, if it caused his performance rating to be low, warning for that instead).

[CityAndColour]

9 hours ago, HUNT3R said:

That is why I have my doubts about the reaction to the first red, which was a straight red. Unless it is a question of Savic not respecting the manager. I can see the player getting upset for two yellows, but also, this is AFTER the first fine already upset him, so that's why he'd want to leave now. It's that first fine that kicked things off, imo.

I think if you'd already had a red card earlier in the season and were sitting on a yellow, getting another yellow would easily be discipline-worthy. Perhaps the game lacks this sort of context though?

Sometimes a second yellow is worse as you already have had the warning and know you need to watch your conduct.

[IbrahimAliMaher]

I operate a 'three strikes policy' for sendings off as they're part and parcel of football. First card of the season, no comment. Second card, verbal warning. Third card is where fines kick in, and usually only if it's a straight red for violent conduct.

For the OP's scenario, I'm assuming these were his first cards of the season? Going straight for the fine option feels a bit OTT. I understand the complaint about would it be enough for a player to request a transfer, but yeah it probably would. Players are highly paid prima donnas and it wouldn't take much to upset them in today's game.

Also think about your own job IRL. If your manager immediately went for the nuclear option after a minor indiscretion, wouldn't you be upset?

[Hovis Dexter]

I’ve found that a warning for two yellows and a fine a straight red works. In, I think FM16 or 17 I tried being more strict after repeated cards but I’m not sure if the players have memories because that didn’t seem to work.

[Smurf]

14 hours ago, scass said:

I've had Milinkovic-Savic sent off in two successive appearances. The first time he was unhappy at a one week wages fine.  The second time he was unhappy, and when told he\'d let his team-mates down, he said he wanted to leave the club. I'm not going to vent about this, as there isn't any point. 

But I think player interactions needs looking at.  What's the point of this sort of nonsense?

Unless it has changed for FM19.

2 yellows = warning

1 Red Professional foul = 1 weeks fine

1 Red Violent Behaviour = 2 weeks fine

 

Anything other than that upsets players.

And they are not cummlative. 

 

Squad behaviour improves when you stick to this.  

[scass]

Thanks - I shall try that out. I've never seen a violent behaviour, mind you. 

[scass]

3 hours ago, IbrahimAliMaher said:

If your manager immediately went for the nuclear option after a minor indiscretion, wouldn't you be upset?

Yes, perhaps, though I don't think the situations are comparable. And a red card - two yellows or not - is not a minor indiscretion. 

[themadsheep2001]

1 hour ago, scass said:

Thanks - I shall try that out. I've never seen a violent behaviour, mind you. 

This is purely anecdotal based on my save, but they seem incredibly rare now. 

As an aside did you end up choosing to sell Savic or did you ever repair the relationship?

[scass]

10 minutes ago, themadsheep2001 said:

As an aside did you end up choosing to sell Savic or did you ever repair the relationship?

It's only  few games ago. And it's mid-season, so I'm going to give him games, see if he gets over it. Real Madrid are watching him, so we shall see. He was a replacement for Pogba, who wanted to go, unprovoked by anything I did, and who hasn't been missed. So I am open to a lucrative offer :-)

[themadsheep2001]

8 minutes ago, scass said:

It's only  few games ago. And it's mid-season, so I'm going to give him games, see if he gets over it. Real Madrid are watching him, so we shall see. He was a replacement for Pogba, who wanted to go, unprovoked by anything I did, and who hasn't been missed. So I am open to a lucrative offer :-)

PSG? That's where I sold him, got Savic and Fernandes in return and haven't looked back.

Be interested to see if you can repair the relationship. Like I say, I get him being annoyed, not convinced it should escalate to asking to leave. If it end ups being irreparable despite your best efforts to de-escalate thats off. Outcome is right (unhappy) impact (leaving) feels wrong imo

[RBKalle]

I for once really love how blunt the fining system and the players' reactions to it are.

They're a great sure-fire indicator of a player's personality, so whoever moans about a fine for a red card (the more unnecessary and careless the sending-off was, the better) ends up on the transfer list.

Fining two weeks wage may be "a lot", but there's also a difference between a second yellow on the 85th minute of pointless cup/league match (or of one you're winning decisively) and a stupid straight red 20 minutes into a CL knockout round...
If it's the former and the player is important enough, I can go for a warning. If it's the latter, it's 2 weeks fine and he'd better STFU about it too.

[Smurf]

None of what anyone is doing is doing anything, except pissing off your entire team.

Your own policies in your own head mean nothing.

The game is programmed.

Refer to my earlier post.

[Snorks]

My method is similar to @Smurf's.

A yellow card offence isn't a big deal, particularly for 'Persistent Fouling' as none of the fouls may warrant a YC in itself. A second yellow card is as big a deal as the first - remember though, a 2nd YC is not a red-card.

The consequence is the same, the player is removed from the field of play, but it could be a relatively minor discretion that leads to the 2nd YC. You often hear "How can he be sent of for that?" but if 'That' was a YC card offence (Removing shirt in celebration, not retreating 10yds, delaying the re-start or whatever 'minor' infringement that is a compulsory YC). Fining a player for something like this seems a little overboard.

Shout at them in the dressing room, talk to them outside the dressing room.

 

2 yellows and I give 'em a talking to.

Straight red, possibly a week's fine depending on the offence.

[RBKalle]

10 ore fa, Snorks ha scritto:

You often hear "How can he be sent of for that?" but if 'That' was a YC card offence (Removing shirt in celebration, not retreating 10yds, delaying the re-start or whatever 'minor' infringement that is a compulsory YC). Fining a player for something like this seems a little overboard.

Yeah, but are ANY of those instances present in FM?

So far, I've ALWAYS seen my players getting the second yellow card for bad and/or unnecessary tackles. Even after having been instructed NOT to dive into challenges because of a previous booking.

And even in the case of "trivial" yellow cards being a thing in FM, getting a second yellow for one of those silly infringments would warrant a hairdryer treatment AND a fine anyway... FFS, you've been booked already, don't be stupid and keep your shirt on/don't delay the play etc...

[Halofon]

Well, I usually go with three stirke rule. 1st red (direct red, or two yellows does not matter) - warning.

Second red 1 week fine.

Third red 2 week fine

Every another red 2 weeks fine.

Anybody does not like that? The door is open, I don't like players who lose their temper. No matter how important the match is.

[yolixeya]

I have pissed some of the players for fining week wages after a red card. They usually think that I'm being shortsighted about the matter. But he gets over it over time but I stopped doing it because official warning is accapted by the player most of the time. I will fine for wages only if it is unprofessional foul.

[Smurf]

 

2 hours ago, RBKalle said:

Yeah, but are ANY of those instances present in FM?

So far, I've ALWAYS seen my players getting the second yellow card for bad and/or unnecessary tackles. Even after having been instructed NOT to dive into challenges because of a previous booking.

And even in the case of "trivial" yellow cards being a thing in FM, getting a second yellow for one of those silly infringments would warrant a hairdryer treatment AND a fine anyway... FFS, you've been booked already, don't be stupid and keep your shirt on/don't delay the play etc...

Your own policies in your own head mean nothing.

The game is programmed.

 

2 yellows = warning

1 Red Professional foul = 1 weeks fine

1 Red Violent Behaviour = 2 weeks fine

 

Anything other than that upsets players and the team.

And they are not cummlative. 

Squad behaviour improves when you stick to this.  

 

47 minutes ago, Halofon said:

Well, I usually go with three stirke rule. 1st red (direct red, or two yellows does not matter) - warning.

Second red 1 week fine.

Third red 2 week fine

Every another red 2 weeks fine.

Anybody does not like that? The door is open, I don't like players who lose their temper. No matter how important the match is.

Your own policies in your own head mean nothing.

The game is programmed.

 

2 yellows = warning

1 Red Professional foul = 1 weeks fine

1 Red Violent Behaviour = 2 weeks fine

 

Anything other than that upsets players and the team.

And they are not cummlative. 

Squad behaviour improves when you stick to this.  

37 minutes ago, yolixeya said:

I have pissed some of the players for fining week wages after a red card. They usually think that I'm being shortsighted about the matter. But he gets over it over time but I stopped doing it because official warning is accapted by the player most of the time. I will fine for wages only if it is unprofessional foul.

Your own policies in your own head mean nothing.

The game is programmed.

 

2 yellows = warning

1 Red Professional foul = 1 weeks fine

1 Red Violent Behaviour = 2 weeks fine

 

Anything other than that upsets players and the team.

And they are not cummlative. 

Squad behaviour improves when you stick to this.  

[yolixeya]

8 minutes ago, Smurf said:

Your own policies in your own head mean nothing.

The game is programmed.

 

2 yellows = warning

1 Red Professional foul = 1 weeks fine

1 Red Violent Behaviour = 2 weeks fine

I will try to pay attention to it and see if it works that way, but I think I made player upset before for 1 week fine after a stright red. Also that doesn't account for player personalities and how they come into play.

[Smurf]

14 minutes ago, yolixeya said:

I will try to pay attention to it and see if it works that way, but I think I made player upset before for 1 week fine after a stright red. Also that doesn't account for player personalities and how they come into play.

As I said originally - I'm not sure if FM19 is different. 

But in general - it's that formula. 

You might get an odd one giving out - but I've not seen it. 

 

[RBKalle]

1 ora fa, Smurf ha scritto:

Your own policies in your own head mean nothing.

The game is programmed.

It's not as cut-and-dried as you say it is.

"My own policies in my head" may mean nothing, but I've fined 2 weeks wage to plenty of players who got a stupid red card (yes, even when it was two yellows) with NO negative reaction. Or, at worst, with a chat where I explained my reasons for the fine, which the player than accepted.

So it's not even close to the rigid scenario you described. No matter how many times you repeat it.

It's like saying that the "not good enough" team talk after a win is gonna upset players by default. Those with low mental attributes will likely get mad at anything vaguely negative (sometimes even at  praises they don't see as deserved...), while plenty of other more balanced players will just accept it. Or take it as a motivational tool.

[Smurf]

19 minutes ago, RBKalle said:

It's not as cut-and-dried as you say it is.

"My own policies in my head" may mean nothing, but I've fined 2 weeks wage to plenty of players who got a stupid red card (yes, even when it was two yellows) with NO negative reaction. Or, at worst, with a chat where I explained my reasons for the fine, which the player than accepted.

So it's not even close to the rigid scenario you described. No matter how many times you repeat it.

It's like saying that the "not good enough" team talk after a win is gonna upset players by default. Those with low mental attributes will likely get mad at anything vaguely negative (sometimes even at  praises they don't see as deserved...), while plenty of other more balanced players will just accept it. Or take it as a motivational tool.

In terms of discipline within the game - it's literally that cut and dry. 

As you say you may have fined 2 weeks to players for red cards or even two yellows - yes their mental attributes might accept it and they move on, and yes you can say "I think you deserved it" and they accept it. 

But over-disciplining players based on your own policies, like fining them for 2 yellow cards for their 3rd offence - does nothing. (edit) and may cause that player to continue getting more red cards throughout the season.

Over-discipline players have a negative impact on the rest of the team - regardless of how the player accepts it.  (edit) and this can lead to different players in the squad having discipline problems. 

(edit) - and by not doing the "cut and dry method" not disciplining players appropriately, will also have a negative effect (not fining warning them for 2 yellow cards because it's the first time they have done it, or fining them for their 2nd red card because they get a free pass on the 1st one - has a negative effect on the discipline in your team).(edit ends)

Using the "cut and dry" method - it fixes squad discipline after a while of doing it and cuts down on the red cards, or even yellow cads your team is picking up.

If you go about fining players 2 weeks wages for a professional foul - because that's their 3rd sending off, it will just irritate the team - and your squad discipline will never straighten out. 

Use it or don't - I don't care what you do in your game - I'm just explaining it the way I know it works. 

 

 

[CFuller]

It's not often I agree with you, @RBKalle, though I do agree with you here.

@Smurf may try to argue otherwise, but I believe FM's disciplinary system is not programmed in such a way that only one policy always works with all players in all teams. If it was, then what would be the point in having different player personalities? (Also, I don't know how others feel about this, but quoting three users in a post and giving them exactly the same response three times doesn't strike me as good forum etiquette.)

When it comes to red cards, I give out warnings for second yellows, and fines for straight reds (2 weeks for violent conduct, 1 week otherwise). I may increase the punishment if it's a player's second red of the season (which very rarely happens with my teams). I've had a few grumbles about unfair treatment, but nobody's ever become so unhappy over a fine that they've wanted to leave my club - certainly not since FM13.

I also tend to warn players for poor performances (i.e. match ratings of 6.2 or below; anything lower than 5.2 may incur a fine). I do this for reserve and youth games as well as first-team matches. It doesn't always work, as some players just grumble, in which case I drop them from the next game unless I absolutely must use them. The policy is worth it, though, for those players who take the warnings on board and become slightly more determined, hard-working, professional, etc.

[Smurf]

21 minutes ago, CFuller said:

(Also, I don't know how others feel about this, but quoting three users in a post and giving them exactly the same response three times doesn't strike me as good forum etiquette.)

That was in error. I meant to post it once. 

You are welcome to do whatever you like when playing the game.  But I know this one and how it works - I think I got the info on this years ago and it's always stuck with me. If you are blindly fining players for inadequate reasons - then it has effect on the rest of the team and that player. That player might accept the fine - but the team and other players won't. 

If you don't follow the structure - and you don't warn/fine your players, then they get worried about team discipline. 

 

I guarantee you will have less sending offs and squad discipline will evolve to be better once you follow the simple rules of:

2 yellows = warning

1 red professional foul = 1 week fine

1 red violent conduct = 2 week fine. 

The fines are not cumlative, so fining players more than they deserve, e.g., 2 yellows in 3 matches does not = a fine.

It would be a warning for the 1st offence, and still a warning on the 2nd offence.

Your squad discipline and players will fall into line.

 

If you don't want to follow it then go ahead and do what you want. 

Unless this has changed for FM19/FM 20 - that's my understanding of how it has worked as far as FM18.

 

[CFuller]

For someone who says he doesn't care about how other FMers discipline their players... you seem to care an awful lot about telling them what 'works' and what 'doesn't'.

[Smurf]

3 minutes ago, CFuller said:

For someone who says he doesn't care about how other FMers discipline their players... you seem to care an awful lot about telling them what 'works' and what 'doesn't'.

I care about letting people know. I don't care if you follow it or not. 

Give it a go. And if it's not working, let me know and I'll happily eat humble pie.

 

[Tom8983]

On 27/07/2019 at 20:01, scass said:

Don't agree. IN FM 18, I rarely had a problem with it. And I've not had a problem with anyone else. But, hey, what do I know?

 

On 27/07/2019 at 19:02, scass said:

But I think player interactions needs looking at.  What's the point of this sort of nonsense?

So you've only had one issue with one player over at least two iterations of the game, but because of that the entire thing is broken and needs looking at? Hmm...

4 hours ago, Halofon said:

Well, I usually go with three stirke rule. 1st red (direct red, or two yellows does not matter) - warning.

Second red 1 week fine.

Third red 2 week fine

Every another red 2 weeks fine.

Anybody does not like that? The door is open, I don't like players who lose their temper. No matter how important the match is.

Exactly the same as me. Though I don't usually have anybody get more than one red per season, I think Keita on FM18 was the last time it happened.

[enigmatic]

16 hours ago, Snorks said:

My method is similar to @Smurf's.

A yellow card offence isn't a big deal, particularly for 'Persistent Fouling' as none of the fouls may warrant a YC in itself. A second yellow card is as big a deal as the first - remember though, a 2nd YC is not a red-card.

The consequence is the same, the player is removed from the field of play, but it could be a relatively minor discretion that leads to the 2nd YC. You often hear "How can he be sent of for that?" but if 'That' was a YC card offence (Removing shirt in celebration, not retreating 10yds, delaying the re-start or whatever 'minor' infringement that is a compulsory YC). Fining a player for something like this seems a little overboard.

Shout at them in the dressing room, talk to them outside the dressing room.

 

2 yellows and I give 'em a talking to.

Straight red, possibly a week's fine depending on the offence.

tbf, if I was a real life manager I'd be more likely to fine my players for getting removed from the pitch for petulance and stupidity whilst knowing they're already on a yellow than getting removed from the pitch more mistiming their tackle or committing a professional foul I'm secretly pleased about...

(I generally just warn in FM. From what I can see a zero-risk option that sometimes produces a behaviour improvement)

[Halofon]

Well, I find this approach right, even tho the game mechanisms can be different and it is not the optimal mechanism for the game sake. I just imagine that ok, this is the way I do it, players know it, or should know it and whoever breaks the rules should know what is going to happen. This is the way I would do it IRL if I would be a manager. Maybe there would be an exception if any player really pisses me of by stupid red card - sometimes I apply the 2 weeks fine on the first strike if the player causes a lost match in important stage of the season. Despotic? Probably...

[scass]

1 hour ago, Tom8983 said:

 

So you've only had one issue with one player over at least two iterations of the game, but because of that the entire thing is broken and needs looking at? Hmm...

Exactly the same as me. Though I don't usually have anybody get more than one red per season, I think Keita on FM18 was the last time it happened.

Not what I said. My issue is with the over-reaction.

 And as for one red card a season - Milinkovic-Savic alone has had three. Herrera also fulfilled his reputation for being a s**thouse, and reliably patronised the bath before his team-mates. I don't mind the reds - it's a function of players getting stuck in. After all Arsenal and Man Utd had their most successful periods with Vieira and Roy Keane regularly getting sent off.

[scass]

On 28/07/2019 at 13:57, themadsheep2001 said:

Be interested to see if you can repair the relationship.

So, halfway through the next season, an update. He dropped his concern after another month or so. Then, it surfaced again, without any disagreements - that's to say, apparently for no reason. I thought it might have been gone at the end of the season. Following season, it's still there. He signed a new, improved contract, is listed as holding me in the highest regard, but now it's turned up in an Assistant Manager's report.

It doesn't seem to be having any effect otherwise, and is really just an irritant.

[themadsheep2001]

1 minute ago, scass said:

So, halfway through the next season, an update. He dropped his concern after another month or so. Then, it surfaced again, without any disagreements - that's to say, apparently for no reason. I thought it might have been gone at the end of the season. Following season, it's still there. He signed a new, improved contract, is listed as holding me in the highest regard, but now it's turned up in an Assistant Manager's report.

It doesn't seem to be having any effect otherwise, and is really just an irritant.

Sounds like a bug, a minor one by all accounts, but still a bug. If he's over it, there is no reason for it to resurface based on nothing

[roykela]

On 29/07/2019 at 14:37, Smurf said:

I guarantee you will have less sending offs and squad discipline will evolve to be better once you follow the simple rules of:

2 yellows = warning

1 red professional foul = 1 week fine

1 red violent conduct = 2 week fine. 

The fines are not cumlative, so fining players more than they deserve, e.g., 2 yellows in 3 matches does not = a fine.

It would be a warning for the 1st offence, and still a warning on the 2nd offence.

Your squad discipline and players will fall into line.

Normally i give a warning for 2 yellows, but there are exceptions i make. It depends on the context, game importance and/or when in the match. 2 yellows after 20 minutes is a 2 week fine from me. Especially if it's an important match and i've told the player to ease off.
Player normally isn't happy about it but gets over it after a little while.

Direct red card is always a fine, unless it's a bs one or a harsh one. But context etc, applies here as well.
Player normally accepts it, regardless whether it's 1 or 2 weeks.

I don't really have a problem with the way i'm doing it. Players kicking up a fuss, sure. But they get over it very quickly.
So i'd say that your "simple rules" can be a very good guideline but it's not the be-all, end-all.

The part that annoys me is that it isn't cumulative. 3 reds in 5 games (example taken out of my rear end), and unnecessarily so as well, and the player has no idea why you're not happy with him.
I end up dropping/selling him and there's more risk that all hell breaks loose within the team.
I find it kind of weird that the game has a promise system where player remember all kinds of stuff (even stuff that haven't been talked about, let alone promised) but it hasn't been programmed to remember that kind of behaviour, regarding conduct - fines and warnings. Yeah, i would love to see an improvement there in future versions.

[Hovis Dexter]

8 minutes ago, roykela said:

The part that annoys me is that it isn't cumulative. 3 reds in 5 games (example taken out of my rear end), and unnecessarily so as well, and the player has no idea why you're not happy with him.
I end up dropping/selling him and there's more risk that all hell breaks loose within the team.
I find it kind of weird that the game has a promise system where player remember all kinds of stuff (even stuff that haven't been talked about, let alone promised) but it hasn't been programmed to remember that kind of behaviour, regarding conduct - fines and warnings. Yeah, i would love to see an improvement there in future versions.

Totally agree with this. The players have no memory with regard to any disciplinary matters but remember everything that could possibly be considered as a promise in their favour. I don’t really have much of a problem with the promises (probably because I’ve worked out how to handle them) but the players should remember disciplinary action taken against them and it should be possible for them to accept accumulated actions.

[RBKalle]

10 ore fa, roykela ha scritto:

I find it kind of weird that the game has a promise system where player remember all kinds of stuff (even stuff that haven't been talked about, let alone promised) but it hasn't been programmed to remember that kind of behaviour, regarding conduct - fines and warnings. Yeah, i would love to see an improvement there in future versions.

Agreed.

TBF though, football players do tend to have selective memory and bring up only stuff that benefits them and their career, while conveniently ignoring anything that can make them look bad.

I'm convinced the likes of Pepe or Sergio Ramos reassured their managers they'd have been more careful with their overly aggressive and downright dangerous tackles, reactions etc?

So on one hand I'd like to see players, at least those with decent Professionalism, Temperament and Controversy, apologize AND accept their warning/fine without throwing a hissy fit. On the other hand, if they tend to get sent off often enough or in unnecessary and stupid ways, odds are they haven't the best attributes, so expecting them to "behave" later is a bit of a contradiction.