Brexit in FM21

[dybing91]

26 minutes ago, bringbacklilnux said:

It is a good way for the top prem teams to maintain their superiority of course. (After their failed attempt to be allowed to decide who can own other club, how money is distributed etc etc etc  failed.   )

Fully agree with this. In a weird way SI's made up work permit rules will keep the big six in control. It turns the championship and the rest of premier league into a breeding group for British players, that big six can pick up - to compliment the very few foreign talents, that have earned enough "points" to get a work permit. I saw in another post that even talent like Sandro Tonali from Milan couldn't get a work permit. Guessing that only Timo Werner and Kai Havertz-level players will be able to get one, which only teams like Chelsea, Man City, etc. can afford. 

I'd imagine this sort of points system would also drive up prices for mediocre British players to a point where championship clubs have to bankrupt themselves to buy a decent championship level player. Atleast if the in-game economy works like real life. 

And what about the whole talent problem? We won't see player stories like Fabregas in British FM saves with the current work permit points system. 

Edited November 15, 2020 by dybing91

[Dagenham_Dave]

21 minutes ago, bringbacklilnux said:

Give me a button to over-ride the permit rules please - others can chose not to do so.

(Do not want to use the ingame the editor.  Too much temptation for mere mortals.),

It can't be changed using the in-game editor. You need to remove it from the pre-game editor. Two different programs. 

[Siven]

As far as i know, there arent any official rules for football related work permits and brexit.

So instead of the game guessing, im just going to use a steam workshop file (there will prolly be one early) to remove it.

I could use the editor, but i think it removes achievements?

[Viking]

Do the Brexit rules ever change over the years in the game, or do they stay the same forever?

[Guest]

11 minutes ago, Dagenham_Dave said:

It can't be changed using the in-game editor. You need to remove it from the pre-game editor. Two different programs. 

I had in mind you could give them a second nationality - of English.

[Pantelas]

51 minutes ago, benhoward12 said:

Seems to of worked with me aswell. 

Surely a script error in this screenshot? "with a wage of N/A or above" ? And in general the wording of the reason is a bit odd. Did you have to readjust the wage?

[HowzatFM]

12 minutes ago, Pantelas said:

Surely a script error in this screenshot? "with a wage of N/A or above" ? And in general the wording of the reason is a bit odd. Did you have to readjust the wage?

I didn’t do anything. Just clicked ‘re apply for work permit’ 

[Oswaldo]

1 hour ago, benhoward12 said:

Seems to of worked with me aswell. 

He was one of the 4 players I mentioned, the others were Ali Akman, Matchoi Djalo and Ervin Omic.

Heading into the summer it seems not too bad for work permits atm. Guess it will be those early 20's players from Spain/Italy/France who will be the problematic ones as they won't have senior caps. Hopefully meet the points criteria by playing in strong leagues regularly

[RyanXO]

6 hours ago, Icy said:

I’m using the no brexit file from FM20 and I think it works as well for FM21, no brexit so far in my game.

I’ll want to use brexit in my game once it’s finished and it’s clear how it will affect football, not before.

Can i get some more information about this? The FM21 brexit restrictions are killing the fun for me too.

Edited November 15, 2020 by RyanXO

[Ragin Cajun]

The work permits also affect coaches as they must have a Continental Pro License.  Those guys would not normally be assistants or staff coaches they are running their own clubs. 

[sporadicsmiles]

Are people really complaining about Brexit restrictions? I mean perhaps more people should have voted against it, and then not elected the blond muppet to make a crappy deal. 

Unfortunately this is reality for people now. It is crap. I just had to sort out my work permit to stay on the continent. May I suggest lobbying and doing proactive things in real life to get rid of this travesty? Or if you like the internet warrior thing we could twitter bomb BJ to tell him he messed up our FM21 saves.

Or wait for the release of the game where someone will undoubtedly release a no Brexit file. 

[Showerman]

From what I have read and seen a lot of people will be disappointed after brexit because the FA is pushing hard to have a strict points based system especially in the football league and they will most likely get it. 
 

So SI is probably really close to calling it correctly, as for the Premier League I think last round of negotiations they got a huge exemption list of clubs world wide to be able to sign youth players from provided they played a certain percentage of games at u21/19/17 level depending on their age, but yh a lot less foreign players for sure.

Edited November 15, 2020 by Showerman

[chucklehead]

Folks, I play FMT, so I'm not 100% that this is possible in full fat:

Is a roundabout way to get past these super strict work permit rules simply to apply the 'no work permits' unlockable? I know it isn't completely the same as pre-brexit rules, but is this an imperfect solution? 

[Pantelas]

25 minutes ago, sporadicsmiles said:

Are people really complaining about Brexit restrictions? I mean perhaps more people should have voted against it, and then not elected the blond muppet to make a crappy deal. 

Unfortunately this is reality for people now. It is crap. I just had to sort out my work permit to stay on the continent. May I suggest lobbying and doing proactive things in real life to get rid of this travesty? Or if you like the internet warrior thing we could twitter bomb BJ to tell him he messed up our FM21 saves.

Or wait for the release of the game where someon will undoubtedly release a no Brexit file. 

I'd never complain about the politics that affect the game, I do complain about the casual implementation of politics in the game though. E.g. Having to guess what "club reputation" or reputable league" means, so that you can know which market you could go for to sign someone, that's so unnecessary. I'm just hoping that in the finished product the brexit rules, whatever SI choose, are explained in-detail.

 

We're talking about realism all the time here, would it be realistic for an English club manager after 1st of January to ask his scouts to scout a nation, that he can buy no players from because of it's top league not being reputable enough? Of course not!

So in short, that work permit rules screen needs to be enriched with at least some more info.

[iownyou]

So here’s part of the real life new work permit system which is really good, though remains to be seen if it’s included in fm. 

“ At senior level, an 'autopass' system means those with regular appearances for clubs ranked by FIFA in the top 50 will qualify automatically.”

 I had a look at the top 50 clubs ranked by FIFA and it includes the likes of Gremio, River Plate and Al Ahli. What this incoming rule means is that you should be able to sign players from these clubs who make a decent amount of appearances for their club regardless of international appearances. 

 

[f.zaarour]

Hope they dont make it that strict in game or change it abit in the full version. I mean yeah realism is nice but to an extend. Its a game at the end and shouldnt bring that much frustration. So ye get it in but dont make it to hard. Like how SI handled with the corona problems.

Edited November 15, 2020 by f.zaarour

[Icy]

hace 4 horas, RyanXO dijo:

Can i get some more information about this? The FM21 brexit restrictions are killing the fun for me too.

I was wrong, the FM20 file doesn't work in FM21, we need to wait for the pregame editor on release day to disable it.

[greenz81]

can people list the brexit they got here? mine is.....

 

Edited November 15, 2020 by greenz81

[allezdae]

Amusing me greatly that some people will wake up to the stupidity of Brexit when they realise they can't sign foreign wonderkids on Football Manager. 

[samdiatmh]

5 minutes ago, allezdae said:

Amusing me greatly that some people will wake up to the stupidity of Brexit when they realise they can't sign foreign wonderkids on Football Manager. 

you mean I can't go back to 2016 and vote "remain"? like this is the direct action of that "leave" being successful

[allezdae]

2 minutes ago, samdiatmh said:

you mean I can't go back to 2016 and vote "remain"? like this is the direct action of that "leave" being successful

Not sure what you mean - the new work permit rules and massive uncertainty wouldn't exist if the UK weren't leaving. So how could it be anything but a direct action?

 And no, none of us can go back, but that also wasn't the point.

[SeaCarrot]

People need to stop calling this implementation as “realistic”. It’s completely fabricated, as it has been in the last 3 versions of the game. It’s SI making it up as they go along. The real life football rules for brexit do not exist yet and aren’t decided. 
 

there is nothing realistic about SI’s brexit and never has been. 

[samdiatmh]

39 minutes ago, SeaCarrot said:

People need to stop calling this implementation as “realistic”. It’s completely fabricated, as it has been in the last 3 versions of the game. It’s SI making it up as they go along. The real life football rules for brexit do not exist yet and aren’t decided. 
 

there is nothing realistic about SI’s brexit and never has been. 

other than the fact that the scenario in the 2nd post is likely to be implemented IRL?

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2020/10/24/exclusive-premier-league-clubs-accept-limits-non-homegrown-players/

 

and a direct quote from it:

Quote

The new work permit rules are set to see the points-based eligibility system used for foreign players revamped and based predominantly around a player's club rather than their international record. The current system makes it hard to sign players who are not regulars for international teams in the top 50 of the world rankings, leading Crystal Palace to be unable to sign Canadian Alphonso Davies, who recently lifted the Champions League with Bayern Munich, in 2016. Arsenal were also famously unable to sign a young Yaya Toure. 

The new work permit rules - if they can be agreed - will make it more difficult for Premier League teams to sign players from Europe, which will be a significant blow to clubs. 

But it is hoped that the new rules will include provisions that allow teams to sign leading young players who may not have yet played a significant amount of first team football. The Premier League is proposing that the work permit eligibility criteria allows young players who aren’t first team regulars to accrue points - for instance, based on the quality of their club, their number of recent appearances for youth teams, or whether they have made the first team squad. It is hoped that such rules can ensure teams are still able to sign the best talent in Europe and maintain the quality of the league. 

 

and the first post is how the system currently is (so effectively no change, just gone from EU)

 

you can argue about how it isn't "realistic", but both of those scenarios are being debated about which one is actually being implemented
you might not like it, but that's arguably about as "realistic" as it gets, without an actual time machine to January 2021 - Brexit's happening regardless of the nuances (which are still being decided), and these nuances is precisely why SI have at least 2 separate options coded into their game (and I dare say it will see an update to the actual restrictions for the 'February patch', but that won't be removing Brexit)

Edited November 16, 2020 by samdiatmh

[decapitated]

I agree with how FM has implemented Brexit in general as the whole point is its as real to life as can be. Some of the decisions whilst I'm not saying they are wrong, might need explaining better. 

For example:

I don't see how this player would qualify? wage salary perhaps?

[Spedding]

1 hour ago, decapitated said:

I agree with how FM has implemented Brexit in general as the whole point is its as real to life as can be. Some of the decisions whilst I'm not saying they are wrong, might need explaining better. 

For example:

I don't see how this player would qualify? wage salary perhaps?

that transfers agreed in real life

[FistOfTheFirstMan]

Hey everyone

 I've played fm for years, but never used an editor before - always thought of it as unholy! However, the whole brexit scenario is making me reconsider. Going to be enough of a ********* in Britain over the next few years anyway, without my favourite escape from reality being bombed by it too. I'm only a couple of months into my save, but by the sound of some of the messages on here, come 2021 it's incredibly hard to sign foreign players. Was wondering how I would go about removing brexit/wp? Do I have to start a new save or is there an editor which will allow me to introduce this into my existing save? Feels like it should have at least been an option at start of game. They haven't imposed Covid because it was unclear how this wouldn't spoil the game, and yet they have introduced something which is in no way settled as part of the exit agreements? 

Sorry if this is a noob question, but I've never tinkered with the game before

Peace

[Icy]

hace 11 minutos, FistOfTheFirstMan dijo:

Hey everyone

 I've played fm for years, but never used an editor before - always thought of it as unholy! However, the whole brexit scenario is making me reconsider. Going to be enough of a ********* in Britain over the next few years anyway, without my favourite escape from reality being bombed by it too. I'm only a couple of months into my save, but by the sound of some of the messages on here, come 2021 it's incredibly hard to sign foreign players. Was wondering how I would go about removing brexit/wp? Do I have to start a new save or is there an editor which will allow me to introduce this into my existing save? Feels like it should have at least been an option at start of game. They haven't imposed Covid because it was unclear how this wouldn't spoil the game, and yet they have introduced something which is in no way settled as part of the exit agreements? 

Sorry if this is a noob question, but I've never tinkered with the game before

Peace

Once the game have started you can't remove Brexit, the editor edit is for new saves only.

I'm going to stop my Crewe save and start a new one outside UK and will leave the UK one for the full game once the Brexit can be removed from new saves.

[JordanMilly]

15 hours ago, f.zaarour said:

Hope they dont make it that strict in game or change it abit in the full version. I mean yeah realism is nice but to an extend. Its a game at the end and shouldnt bring that much frustration. So ye get it in but dont make it to hard. Like how SI handled with the corona problems.

SI always strive to make the game as accurate to real life as possible. The Work Permit system they have at present is pretty accurate to real life - there's a reason why, in reality, English clubs aren't buying hundreds of South American wonderkids every year. It's called "the work permit system".

15 hours ago, greenz81 said:

can people list the brexit they got here? mine is.....

 

There is only one Brexit in FM21, they're all the same.

[Mcfc1894]

Even European wonderkids apart from the Really expensive ones are Impossible to sign now would be interesting how that affects the English leagues if at all down the line

[Guest]

1 hour ago, FistOfTheFirstMan said:

Hey everyone

 I've played fm for years, but never used an editor before - always thought of it as unholy! However, the whole brexit scenario is making me reconsider. Going to be enough of a ********* in Britain over the next few years anyway, without my favourite escape from reality being bombed by it too. I'm only a couple of months into my save, but by the sound of some of the messages on here, come 2021 it's incredibly hard to sign foreign players. Was wondering how I would go about removing brexit/wp? Do I have to start a new save or is there an editor which will allow me to introduce this into my existing save? Feels like it should have at least been an option at start of game. They haven't imposed Covid because it was unclear how this wouldn't spoil the game, and yet they have introduced something which is in no way settled as part of the exit agreements? 

Sorry if this is a noob question, but I've never tinkered with the game before

Peace

When available, you could use the in-game editor to add English as a nationality to the player you are trying to sign.

But unless you are close to saintly it is very hard not to use the editor for 'other' advantages as well - which depending on what you want to do could completely spoil your save.

Like you, I will stop my home-town club save now and wait until I can use the pre-game editor before starting it again.

 

[dybing91]

16 hours ago, allezdae said:

Amusing me greatly that some people will wake up to the stupidity of Brexit when they realise they can't sign foreign wonderkids on Football Manager. 

Not a brit. Can't vote in Britain. Not everybody here are brits. Don't assume we are please. Proud Dane here. Don't care about Britains real life politics, I just want to play a football game thats fun, these brexit fantasy restrictions ruin the game experience for me. 

[JordanMilly]

52 minutes ago, dybing91 said:

Not a brit. Can't vote in Britain. Not everybody here are brits. Don't assume we are please. Proud Dane here. Don't care about Britains real life politics, I just want to play a football game thats fun, these brexit fantasy restrictions ruin the game experience for me. 

It's a shame they won't be "fantasy" after 1st January, when the EU citizen transfer restrictions kick in IRL, and given the FA's sign-off is needed for work permits, they have a lot more influence in this area than the EPL does.

As said previously, if you want a realistic post-2020 EPL season, you're going to have to get used to things not being as flexible as they were before.

[Mattias333]

On 12/11/2020 at 13:09, SeaCarrot said:

Yeah I got the 17 foreign player limit one too. Looks like thats most common this year.

Strangely in FM20 on all 3 saves I did the UK didn't leave the EU.

 

Typically every same I did on fm19 and 20 we DID leave the eu an got similar rules to the work per net an 17 foreigners ones mentioned on fm21. 
 

bit of a grind in some respects as I love building a top squad, not just team, youth academy etc but made it a bit more difficult. However equally I found 99% of the time a work permit NEVER got rejected after the Brexit rules come in, even on nations an players of low experience an rep that always would get rejected pre Brexit rules etc. Swings and roundabouts I guess 

[HowzatFM]

1 hour ago, JordanMillward_1 said:

It's a shame they won't be "fantasy" after 1st January, when the EU citizen transfer restrictions kick in IRL, and given the FA's sign-off is needed for work permits, they have a lot more influence in this area than the EPL does.

As said previously, if you want a realistic post-2020 EPL season, you're going to have to get used to things not being as flexible as they were before.

Not as flexible is fair enough, but no rules are currently final and could change, especially with pressures from clubs with long term visions! so this level of limit on signing players will be very difficult to get used to, and it isn't a case of signing hundreds of South American regens, players from top EU nations don't get permits. 

Edited November 16, 2020 by benhoward12

[corn_onthecurb]

What happens in FM when a player signs without a WP? Can he train? Can he play friendlies or for the u23/u18's?

[LolloViola]

so, basically, apart from that screen that talks about points and reputation... what a player has to do/have done to be eligible for a work permit in UK? Definitely impossible to buy cheap youngsters from lower non-EU leagues?

[Showerman]

4 hours ago, dybing91 said:

Not a brit. Can't vote in Britain. Not everybody here are brits. Don't assume we are please. Proud Dane here. Don't care about Britains real life politics, I just want to play a football game thats fun, these brexit fantasy restrictions ruin the game experience for me. 

They are not fantasy though, I would suggest Ligue 1 or Bundesliga as they have minimal restrictions.

These current rules haven’t always been like this, some of us can remember a time when it was a lot worse/more difficult.

[FistOfTheFirstMan]

5 hours ago, bringbacklilnux said:

When available, you could use the in-game editor to add English as a nationality to the player you are trying to sign.

But unless you are close to saintly it is very hard not to use the editor for 'other' advantages as well - which depending on what you want to do could completely spoil your save.

Like you, I will stop my home-town club save now and wait until I can use the pre-game editor before starting it again.

 

Thanks for the answer mate. Is this something that can be done in an existing save? And is the in game editor available immediately upon full release?

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, FistOfTheFirstMan said:

Thanks for the answer mate. Is this something that can be done in an existing save? And is the in game editor available immediately upon full release?

Yes, it allows you to edit many in-game variables.

Usually available to purchase about the same time as the full release, for about £5.

Only problem is, it can make you godlike - you can edit player attributes, moves players to your club, increase budgets, remove injuries etc etc etc - which, as said, can spoil your save.  Or be fun depending on what you want to do.

Edited November 16, 2020 by Guest

[LolloViola]

1 minuto fa, bringbacklilnux ha scritto:

Yes, it allows you to edit many in-game variables.

Usually available to purchase about the same time, for about £5.

Only problem is, it can make you godlike - you can edit player attributes, moves players to your club, increase budgets etc etc etc - which, as said, can spoil your save.  Or be fun depending on what you want to do.

Would be nice to know if more scenarios are planned for the game release or we will stick with this one for this year and, if the latter, I really hope there'll be a way to avoid it with some add-on like for the past versions. Buying the ingame editor just for this reason is awful...

[FistOfTheFirstMan]

1 minute ago, bringbacklilnux said:

Yes, it allows you to edit many in-game variables.

Usually available to purchase about the same time as the full release, for about £5.

Only problem is, it can make you godlike - you can edit player attributes, moves players to your club, increase budgets, remove injuries etc etc etc - which, as said, can spoil your save.  Or be fun depending on what you want to do.

Thanks that's good to know! I won't use it to change anything else, because I like the challenge. Just don't want to rely on sub-standard English players. Mind you, Messi would look pretty good in a Villa shirt...

Last question; where do I purchase the editor from?

[LolloViola]

2 minuti fa, FistOfTheFirstMan ha scritto:

Thanks that's good to know! I won't use it to change anything else, because I like the challenge. Just don't want to rely on sub-standard English players. Mind you, Messi would look pretty good in a Villa shirt...

Last question; where do I purchase the editor from?

You'll find it on steam just like any other normal app when the game is released and once downloaded and installed you'll have the option in-game under FM menu.

[Guest]

10 minutes ago, FistOfTheFirstMan said:

Thanks that's good to know! I won't use it to change anything else, because I like the challenge. Just don't want to rely on sub-standard English players. Mind you, Messi would look pretty good in a Villa shirt...

Last question; where do I purchase the editor from?

It is a SI product and should appear on steam, once available.

See link below for FM20 version for reference:

https://store.steampowered.com/app/1100750/Football_Manager_2020_Ingame_Editor/

There are also similar unofficial third party products.  Try duckduckgo/google search.

In fact, some youtube streamers will have videos showing how to install and use it - for earlier fm versions.  (Golden FM is one, but seems now to not stream.).

Edited November 16, 2020 by Guest
clarification

[Icy]

En 15/11/2020 a las 15:20, City1904 dijo:

I have finished the first season with Burnley and thought I would give my experience so far on the Work Permit's "issue" rather than rely on hearsay. 

 

Work Permits Approved

Esteban Andrada - 4.2m - Argentinian with 5 Caps

Caicara - Brazilian - Free Agent - 0  Caps previously playing in Turkey

Mike Maignan - 0 Caps - Lille - 5.2m

Jerome Onguene - 9 Caps - Salzburg 3.7m 

Antony - Ajax - 14.1m - 0 Caps 

 

Rejected

Matias Arezo - Wonderkid from Argentina

Boubakary Soumare - 3.2m - Lille - 0 caps

 

So as you can, see this is hardly making the game unplayable. Arezo is a prime example of a wonderkid who I can't bring in, but realistically Burnley haven't signed any wonderkids in a long time and tbh, I knew before I was going to sign him it would be impossible.

Both Arezo and Soumare I knew before making any bids I couldn't sign them, and I was told when I then offered them contracts, but I wanted to see what the process was like so I carried on.

Personally I have found it very realistic and it has not had any detrimental impact on my game. I appreciate if you play in a different manner (Less realistic one potentially) it may impact your games, but as I am managing Burnley, a middling English team I am still able to sign a lot of players.

Just to understand it, why did these get a work permit without international caps? Was it because the points system? because they came from top clubs (not the case of Caicara)? because high salary? or why?

Caicara - Brazilian - Free Agent - 0  Caps previously playing in Turkey

Mike Maignan - 0 Caps - Lille - 5.2m

Antony - Ajax - 14.1m - 0 Caps

Also why not to make the points visible so at least we know why it was approved or denied? like this player has 14 points, from which 3 come from X reason, 5 from Y reason, etc.

Edited November 16, 2020 by Icy

[allezdae]

5 hours ago, dybing91 said:

Not a brit. Can't vote in Britain. Not everybody here are brits. Don't assume we are please. Proud Dane here. Don't care about Britains real life politics, I just want to play a football game thats fun, these brexit fantasy restrictions ruin the game experience for me. 

Yeah, you're right, they should make a button to stop Brexit in the game for you. 

[Domathon]

1 hour ago, Icy said:

Just to understand it, why did these get a work permit without international caps? Was it because the points system? because they came from top clubs (not the case of Caicara)? because high salary? or why?

Caicara - Brazilian - Free Agent - 0  Caps previously playing in Turkey

Mike Maignan - 0 Caps - Lille - 5.2m

Antony - Ajax - 14.1m - 0 Caps

Also why not to make the points visible so at least we know why it was approved or denied? like this player has 14 points, from which 3 come from X reason, 5 from Y reason, etc.

I got a harder brexit than his can’t sign players young foreign players at all really

[M.D]

On 15/11/2020 at 13:16, Oswaldo said:

I have almost reached the end of the first season in the PL. I signed 4 young players in Jan with the new Brexit/Work Permit rules, none of them had work permits.

After 120 days I reapplied for all of them (none had been out on loan, or had got any more u20 caps etc) all of them got a work permit. So seems like its worth just signing them anyway (if they will join without a work permit) and waiting the 3 months. It's annoying but not too bad with young players who wouldn't be in the first team anyway

Im second season and got promoted with Bristol City, after reading this post I thought I would give this a try.

I signed Oliver Batista Meier after his permit was turned down so just trained him

After 120 days I applied for a permit even though in a press conference they told me he wouldn't get one and to my surprise, granted for the duration of his contract.

Did he get a permit now as he is an English premier league player as of course not played a single match at any level?

[Pantelas]

4 minutes ago, M.D said:

Im second season and got promoted with Bristol City, after reading this post I thought I would give this a try.

I signed Oliver Batista Meier after his permit was turned down so just trained him

After 120 days I applied for a permit even though in a press conference they told me he wouldn't get one and to my surprise, granted for the duration of his contract.

Did he get a permit now as he is an English premier league player as of course not played a single match at any level?

If that's the case, doesn't this sound like a bug?

[samdiatmh]

he'd probably qualify as his points now register him as a premier league player, rather than a dutch league

 

I'd like to see this implemented as a controversy, in that regen/human managers can "be investigated for transfer irregularities" for exploiting such a loophole (obviously legal rights would prevent this from actual managers, but Human/Regen managers are exempt from this)

Edited November 16, 2020 by samdiatmh

[M.D]

19 minutes ago, samdiatmh said:

he'd probably qualify as his points now register him as a premier league player, rather than a dutch league

 

I'd like to see this implemented as a controversy, in that regen/human managers can "be investigated for transfer irregularities" for exploiting such a loophole (obviously legal rights would prevent this from actual managers, but Human/Regen managers are exempt from this)

I got him from FC Bayern so you would have thought the Bundesliga would be a strong enough league to qualify..