Still too easy?

[zindrinho]

If the game management by the AI were to be as realistic as possible, wouldnt that just mean that every time you mark their players or switch positions of your strikers or wingers he would just instantly do the same? As to counter your switch, if you want your target man on their smallest CB. So at some point the AI just has to let the game play as is, but there's obviously room for a lot more of AI managers tinkering during games.

[Mars_Blackmon]

4 hours ago, zindrinho said:

If the game management by the AI were to be as realistic as possible, wouldnt that just mean that every time you mark their players or switch positions of your strikers or wingers he would just instantly do the same? As to counter your switch, if you want your target man on their smallest CB. So at some point the AI just has to let the game play as is, but there's obviously room for a lot more of AI managers tinkering during games.

Not if the manager’s tactical knowledge suck. Which is how it’s suppose to work. Attribute needs to matter in these types of games.
 

I wonder how many people actually use cautious mentality or even defensive and have regular success? Everyone goes with atleast a balance or positive because it gives the best results because the AI doesn’t adapt well enough.

 

[zindrinho]

Tact. knowledge 1 makes him never switch things up, 20 makes changes every 10-15minutes, something like that would be a great addition to the game!

[Robbie Hood]

The headline asks the question if FM21 is still too easy and my answer would absolutely be YES.

I will probably also post this in the bugs forums or feature requests because i really do think this edition of the game is way to easy.

Previously when playing FM i have always started out with my favourite team Nottingham Forest in the championship. I have always done some research to find a suitable tactic and have often ended up using a knap tactic with some tweaks to suit my squad. I usually had to spend 2 or 3 seasons in the championship before getting promoted, with a healty budget to do some transfer deals. What makes this game great is the struggle! The need to constantly improve - game by game - transfer window by transfer window.

In FM21 i wanted a new challenge and not start with Forest. I choose to start with Leyton Orient in League 2. Small club, but based in London with huge potential for future sucess. I looked forward to many seasons full of struggles but gradually improvement. I found a knap tactic - 4-2-3-1, can`t remember which one, and started up the game. Started up in march 2021 and ended up in the play-offs, which i lost.

Season 21/22: 1st place in League 2 - 113 points. Mid-table prediction.
Season 22/23: 1st place in League 1 - 112 points. Predicted to get relegated.
Season 23/24: 1st place in the championship - 101 points. Predicted to get relegated.

I hardly spent any money for permanent transfers and only signed free transfers and loans. I gradually improved the coaching team but nothing would indicate me storming the leagues season after season...

I just breezed through game after game and there was no excitement at all.

Some will probably say that i have no right to "complain" since i use a knap-tactic, but my point is that i have done that on every edition of FM and i have never once felt the game is too easy. So something has definately changed in this version of the game.

I guess the real proper challenge is coming up now that i`m in the Premier League. The odds for me winning the title are 900-1....

[Tyburn]

Knap’s FM21 tactic is the best ever??

[zindrinho]

What are these knap tactics that keeps being mentioned in the thread?

I bet you could get the same results just as easy with a clean slate tactic Robbie, as long as you manage games and just do minor tweaks to fit each opposition. Really takes away the long term enjoyment of a save, I remember so fondly how much fun it was to take Wolves from champ to EL/CL qualifiers over 4-5 seasons, takes 1-2 now.

[Mars_Blackmon]

13 minutes ago, zindrinho said:

What are these knap tactics that keeps being mentioned in the thread?

I bet you could get the same results just as easy with a clean slate tactic Robbie, as long as you manage games and just do minor tweaks to fit each opposition. Really takes away the long term enjoyment of a save, I remember so fondly how much fun it was to take Wolves from champ to EL/CL qualifiers over 4-5 seasons, takes 1-2 now.

You can if you know how to create an effective tactic that has atleast a balance mentality.

 

I would like to challenge the creator of the Knapp tactics to create a dominant tactic with caution mentality. 

[Abysmal]

I see some people mention the use of Knaps tactics. I think if you use one of his tactics as a base and then tweak it to your own team and adapt to how your opposition play, theres a big enough argument to say that you're not just plug and playing. 

Personally, I have downloaded a Knap tactic but changed roles and instructions enough to my own team that I would probably consider it some of my own now. I just like a base to start from

 

[Tyburn]

Why not just start with a “base” that the game provides you with? At least then you can be sure that there are no “exploits” ingrained in the tactic.

IMO anything downloaded is going to have certain tweaks that are designed to “beat” the system. You may edit those out I guess, but then why bother downloading it at all?

[zindrinho]

I still dont understand how a downloaded tactic with a bunch of preset roles and TIs/PIs can suit every team out there..

Would Peps tactics suit Burnley, and vice versa?

If you just start with a clean slate you can use your best players in their best positions, find roles that makes your players spread out, be available for passes all around the pitch, its really easy to see during pre season friendlies when there's big holes in your team and passes gets intercepted.

[bazhsw]

I don't think anyone should be seriously commenting on a game being 'too easy' when they have downloaded tactics that are specifically tested and designed to beat the match engine.  What did you expect to happen?

[Freakiie]

25 minutes ago, zindrinho said:

I still dont understand how a downloaded tactic with a bunch of preset roles and TIs/PIs can suit every team out there..

Would Peps tactics suit Burnley, and vice versa?

If you just start with a clean slate you can use your best players in their best positions, find roles that makes your players spread out, be available for passes all around the pitch, its really easy to see during pre season friendlies when there's big holes in your team and passes gets intercepted.

Because they're not tactics based on tactical solidity, but on finding gaps within the ME.

Generally they're all incredibly high intensity tactics that tick every box you can possibly tick. You could definitely argue it should be harder to pull these tactics of with weaker/unsuited teams (and considering their absurdly offensive nature you will probably get absolutely smashed a couple times a season trying to use them with a relegation team) and I'm not sure if a weaker team could actually maintain the intensity over a full season in FM21. They might not be quite as plug and play as some of the old exploit tactics way back, but they're still capable of massively over-performing in general.

At the same time, using them or having them as the base for your "own" tactic and then complaining the game is too easy is somewhat ridiculous. I've tried them myself in past editions and was winning pretty much every competition I could win, while switching teams every 2 seasons.

[Robbie Hood]

2 hours ago, bazhsw said:

I don't think anyone should be seriously commenting on a game being 'too easy' when they have downloaded tactics that are specifically tested and designed to beat the match engine.  What did you expect to happen?

This was not meant to be a post sulking about how easy fm21 is, but more like constructive criticism. I wrote that, yes, i have downloaded a knap tactic, but i have also done that on previous versions and never found the game to be this easy.
When downloading the tactic i expected to have a working tactic that i could build my team and playing style around. Not a tactic that would destroy the english leagues independent of player material.
and lets say that this tactic is a hybrid between Klopp and Guardiola. Every little thing that they do tactically has been studied and made into a theorethical framework. Is it realistic to think that such a tactic would work in level 4 of english football with players of a much lower standard?

I just find it unrealistic that a tactic can so easily override everything else in the game, and that`s the reason for my "complaint". 

I see that many people would like some form of difficulty level when starting up a new game, and i would definately support that if this is now the new difficulty level.

[Robbie Hood]

4 hours ago, zindrinho said:

What are these knap tactics that keeps being mentioned in the thread?

I bet you could get the same results just as easy with a clean slate tactic Robbie, as long as you manage games and just do minor tweaks to fit each opposition. Really takes away the long term enjoyment of a save, I remember so fondly how much fun it was to take Wolves from champ to EL/CL qualifiers over 4-5 seasons, takes 1-2 now.

I can`t remember the exact name, but something like Knap Parisienne Walkways 4-2-3-1. It`s basically just a normal tactic with a playing style that i like to watch - high pressing, playing out from the back, inverted wingers, overlapping full backs, positive/attacking play - nothing revolutonary.

I have the same experience as you. It was so much fun taking Forest up from the championship and then gradually improving in the PL season by season.

In my game with Leyton Orient now my first two games were against Man U and Liverpool......i won them both 2-1.

 

Edited March 22, 2021 by Robbie Hood

[zindrinho]

So Knap is simply a user who posts a lot of goods exploitive tactics then, is that correct? Thought maybe it was an abbrevation for some style of play.

I still find it hard to believe that a pre-made tactic used for whichever team you choose to start with can give better results than the ones you make yourself based on what your players do well, guess I just have to accept it then

 

[Freakiie]

To people that claim the game was never this easy using knap tactics in the past, you guys sure about that?

That was a random future "journeyman" I did with knap tactics on FM19. That's a first season title with a PSV side that finished 9th the season before. A clean sweep of all competitions I was in (Yes, a CL win with a mostly FM19 AI built squad) in the second season. Then Inter that failed to qualify for the CL when I took over, clean sweep again in both seasons.

Pretty sure I also played most of this with Instant Results, although I'm not entirely sure on that as this was a while ago. Lost interest in that save pretty quickly for some strange reason.

[Junkhead]

Downloading and using tactics which exist solely to exploit gaps in the match engine kill any argument about the game being too easy.

You must want it to be easy otherwise you wouldn't download a Knapp tactic. 

Even if massive improvements were made to the AI, or various features were introduced to add challenge or realism, one way or another someone would find a tactic - or some other way - to "game" the system.

It's meant to be a simulation. Real managers don't have lists of wonderkids or unbeatable tactics they can use whenever they fancy. Unrealistic input = unrealistic output.

 

Disclaimer: I know not everyone on this thread is using exploitative tactics or tools. However your probably legitimate arguments are being diluted and this is why.

[andu1]

I don't think it's that easy as it was in the BETA but i don't use and have never used downloaded tactics.

I am currently in the year 2032 managing Man Utd in my career save in and It's quite challenging to win the title. Liverpool beat me to the title 2 years in a row and now Leeds United have some fantastic players which took me by surprise ,they scored 73 goals in 24 matches managed by none other than Brendan Rodgers.

 

By the way Liverpool won one title by scoring 100 and conceding 60. So i think it's also a matter of AI managers ( some use defensive tactics others are offensive ).

[Mars_Blackmon]

44 minutes ago, andu1 said:

I don't think it's that easy as it was in the BETA but i don't use and have never used downloaded tactics.

I am currently in the year 2032 managing Man Utd in my career save in and It's quite challenging to win the title. Liverpool beat me to the title 2 years in a row and now Leeds United have some fantastic players which took me by surprise ,they scored 73 goals in 24 matches managed by none other than Brendan Rodgers.

 

By the way Liverpool won one title by scoring 100 and conceding 60. So i think it's also a matter of AI managers ( some use defensive tactics others are offensive ).

Defensive tactics are too passive. Me and many others who don’t use downloaded tactics have been saying this since release. That and the lack of adjustments made by the AI. It’s only a minority of people who have posted in these threads that have used downloaded tactics, some may have used exploits unintentionally like any functional high press attacking tactic. I winning a lot with Possession Football, granted I’m rarely scoring more than 2 goals a game but the lack of attacking from some  AI teams makes it very easy to win constantly.

 

[Preveza]

18 hours ago, Robbie Hood said:

The headline asks the question if FM21 is still too easy and my answer would absolutely be YES.

I will probably also post this in the bugs forums or feature requests because i really do think this edition of the game is way to easy.

Previously when playing FM i have always started out with my favourite team Nottingham Forest in the championship. I have always done some research to find a suitable tactic and have often ended up using a knap tactic with some tweaks to suit my squad. I usually had to spend 2 or 3 seasons in the championship before getting promoted, with a healty budget to do some transfer deals. What makes this game great is the struggle! The need to constantly improve - game by game - transfer window by transfer window.

In FM21 i wanted a new challenge and not start with Forest. I choose to start with Leyton Orient in League 2. Small club, but based in London with huge potential for future sucess. I looked forward to many seasons full of struggles but gradually improvement. I found a knap tactic - 4-2-3-1, can`t remember which one, and started up the game. Started up in march 2021 and ended up in the play-offs, which i lost.

Season 21/22: 1st place in League 2 - 113 points. Mid-table prediction.
Season 22/23: 1st place in League 1 - 112 points. Predicted to get relegated.
Season 23/24: 1st place in the championship - 101 points. Predicted to get relegated.

I hardly spent any money for permanent transfers and only signed free transfers and loans. I gradually improved the coaching team but nothing would indicate me storming the leagues season after season...

I just breezed through game after game and there was no excitement at all.

Some will probably say that i have no right to "complain" since i use a knap-tactic, but my point is that i have done that on every edition of FM and i have never once felt the game is too easy. So something has definately changed in this version of the game.

I guess the real proper challenge is coming up now that i`m in the Premier League. The odds for me winning the title are 900-1....

 

I mean, have you tried not using knap's tactics? Have you tried using your own and see how 'easy' it is then. Just saying. If you used your own tactic from scratch, and you're getting these results, different story. However I still do agree that using a plug and play tactic should not be this easy.

[laurentius82]

Using plug-and-play tactics of course makes it even easier, but let's be honest , it's way too easy to overachieve exactly in the same way with any decent tactic of your choice (in particular ones with higher mentality and pressing). For some reason consecutive promotions from the lower leagues to the PL are much easier though than winning the PL is. This is probably because as a newly promoted side with low rep, you are grossly underestimated by the AI managers, and it's really easy to punish them for it.  In the PL it's quite easy to achieve a top-half finish in your first season, but actually toppling the big 6 does usually take a few seasons because of the huge financial resources they have. 

[Robbie Hood]

Here is how the Premier League season has started for me after consecutive promotions from League Two.

And i totally understand those of you who say that i have no right to claim that the game is too easy while using a downloaded tactic. But at the same time i am far from using the most dominant tactic out there. On FM Base there are a lot of other tactics that are tried and tested with a much higher average points per game than my tactic. But these tactics often use two strikers which i don`t like. I wanted a 4-2-3-1 tactic which is one that i prefer in real life.

So just to be clear: i think the game is great. The match engine has never looked better. I just think the difficulty level could be somewhat higher.
 

[Robbie Hood]

Just another point that has absolutely nothing to do with tactics. 
I have managed to get some of the best staff in the Premier League! How is that possible with back to back promotions from League Two, constantly having the lowest wage budgets in every division?
I just seems too easy to compete with the top clubs even when it comes to staff....

[Pasonen]

6 minutes ago, Robbie Hood said:

Here is how the Premier League season has started for me after consecutive promotions from League Two.

And i totally understand those of you who say that i have no right to claim that the game is too easy while using a downloaded tactic. But at the same time i am far from using the most dominant tactic out there. On FM Base there are a lot of other tactics that are tried and tested with a much higher average points per game than my tactic. But these tactics often use two strikers which i don`t like. I wanted a 4-2-3-1 tactic which is one that i prefer in real life.

So just to be clear: i think the game is great. The match engine has never looked better. I just think the difficulty level could be somewhat higher.
 

Just being curious what was your match stats in against Liverpool which you won 1-2?

[Robbie Hood]

1 minute ago, Pasonen said:

Just being curious what was your match stats in against Liverpool which you won 1-2?

 

[Pasonen]

2 minutes ago, Robbie Hood said:

 

Another proof there's no point going too defensive no matter who you're. If you would have let AI play your game the shot would be 25 Vs 2 4-0 lost. Just because AI tries to play the game defensive like in real world and loses because that doesn't work.

[Robbie Hood]

Here is the tactic i`ve been using from the start in League Two.

[laurentius82]

8 minutes ago, Pasonen said:

Another proof there's no point going too defensive no matter who you're. If you would have let AI play your game the shot would be 25 Vs 2 4-0 lost. Just because AI tries to play the game defensive like in real world and loses because that doesn't work.

Looking at Jose Mourinho and Spurs, it doesn't work in the real world either. 

[thiagoanjo]

They need to fix some stuff on ME/AI, some tactics just exploits those issues and you can get unrealistic results.

[baris28]

Maybe they need to balance high intensity tactics*condition during match much more.  It was mentioned in FM'19,20, same problem. No team can press hard in all 90 minutes.

And AI needs more programming input  -random times- during match. Not specially to respond to player but to win.

 

 

[Mars_Blackmon]

I cringe every time I start a game and the AI goes defensive mentality. Automatic win.

 

mentalities definitely need to be more balanced. Or the AI need to be less likely to go so defensive to start a game and switch mentality more often during the game.

[BuryBlade]

I’ve been playing FM/CM since CM2 with moderate success. I’m nowhere near the levels of some people but I wouldn’t say I struggle either. However, this years game is providing quite an interesting challenge. 
 

** side note - I am playing FM Touch on the iPad. So my comments below relate to the iPad version. When my iPad broke at Christmas, I played the PC full fat version and doing the same as I would on iPad (tactics/training/signings wise) I took Pescara to the serie A title in the second season. That felt way to easy and unrealistic and actually made me lose interest**
 

Im playing as Dinamo Zagreb, I’m 7 seasons in and domestically it is very easy. There isn’t any real competition and I can hoover up any good players my domestic rivals produce. In Europe though, I really struggle against the big teams. The best I have done is the first knockout round of the CL, drawing 3-3 and losing 5-3 to Barcelona. That step up in quality is huge. 
 

Good quality players do not want to join because both league rep and club rep is much lower than the big leagues. I am therefore limited to younger players and youth intake. Any good players I develop, soon want to move to a bigger club. This combined with me not being a tactical genius (and unwilling to simply download someone else’s super tactic), has got me stuck in a loop where I don’t know how to progress! 
 

I am currently trying to improve my domestic rivals by chucking them money (loan a player with a high monthly fee) in the hope they improve their squads with my money and contribute more in Europe to the coefficient points. 
 

On FM20, I had already won the CL with Zagreb by season 7. I wouldn’t say the game is hard, but I also don’t believe this year’s version is easy. 

[Junkhead]

2 hours ago, Robbie Hood said:

Here is how the Premier League season has started for me after consecutive promotions from League Two.

And i totally understand those of you who say that i have no right to claim that the game is too easy while using a downloaded tactic. But at the same time i am far from using the most dominant tactic out there. On FM Base there are a lot of other tactics that are tried and tested with a much higher average points per game than my tactic. But these tactics often use two strikers which i don`t like. I wanted a 4-2-3-1 tactic which is one that i prefer in real life.

So just to be clear: i think the game is great. The match engine has never looked better. I just think the difficulty level could be somewhat higher.
 

Nobody said you had no right to claim the game is easy whilst using a downloaded tactic.

Just that using a tactic which exploits the match engine says nothing about the difficulty of the game.

100% agree with your point on standard of staff you can attract. This is an issue in any league and the only way around it is to use the job centre in my experience.

[Tyburn]

The point about fatigue is a good one. Somehow, even when my team is dead with tiny red hearts everywhere, we continue to move at the same pace as we did at the start of the game when we were fresh. To see a noticeable drop in performance, pace, positioning would really help with OP pressing tactics being so dominant.

[Abysmal]

I think downloaded tactics at times get harsh feedback, of course there are ones that purposely exploit the match engine and I personally think they are pointless and removes any fun from the game but the more traditional ones that dont yield as good results are ok IMO.

I remember last year how overpowered the default gengenpress preset was and you could essentially plug that into any team and it would yield great results pretty much instantly, I dont think there is much difference between using that a downloaded tactic, after all they're pre-built for you. 

Either way, I think tactics at times are overthought and such. Squad happiness and training can end up improving your team as much as any tactic if you do it right. 

[99]

6 horas atrás, Robbie Hood disse:

Just another point that has absolutely nothing to do with tactics. 
I have managed to get some of the best staff in the Premier League! How is that possible with back to back promotions from League Two, constantly having the lowest wage budgets in every division?
I just seems too easy to compete with the top clubs even when it comes to staff....

AI teams don't really care about staff. You check their staff page and they don't even fill all the default positions, while we do and even have the option to ask the board to hire more. You can easily have twice the number of staff employed compared to your opponents, no matter how big or small.

What I personally do, to not feel that I'm cheating, is hiring staff only with the same nationality of the club (p.ex. only portuguese staff in a portuguese team). And I still end up with the best staff of the league...

Edited March 23, 2021 by 99

[younkersegg]

too easy for me. Like putting money on Man City to win champions league at +200 Sportsbetting3.com If you scout your own players you just end up winning everything. no matter where you start.

 

Edited March 27, 2021 by younkersegg

[Platinum]

1 hour ago, 99 said:

AI teams don't really care about staff. You check their staff page and they don't even fill all the default positions, while we do and even have the option to ask the board to hire more. You can easily have twice the number of staff employed compared to your opponents, no matter how big or small.

What I personally do, to not feel that I'm cheating, is hiring staff only with the same nationality of the club (p.ex. only portuguese staff in a portuguese team). And I still end up with the best staff of the league...

Hiring staff in the game isnt realistic. The user changes staff much more frequently than real clubs and the AI do. On top of that we can see stats for staff which also isnt realistic. In real life it's more about word of mouth and good interview skills. On top of that the vast majority of real life managers dont hand pick all of the backroom staff. To stop this advantage put your Director of Football or Technical Director in charge of hiring staff as they will have more realistic hiring practices and they are the people who will actually hire staff in real life.

Edited March 23, 2021 by francis#17

[Icy]

I'd say it's easy to overachieve even with strict realistic house rules, that is somewhat fun, but tires me over time.

In my current save, I have reached the Premiership with Crewe after 2 years in League 1 and 3 reaching the playoffs in the Championship, winning them at the third attempt. I can't say I have stormed through the leagues, took me 5 years that could be fine but... the problem is that I had little struggle any year other than the playoffs roulette. I was not scared of any team. Even now in the premier, with team mainly of young players discarded by top teams and some cheap signings and a 23M total salary (that would be in the average for the championship) I know I won't go down. I'll probably will end mid table, but I have no fear to play vs City or United etc, I just attack to them like if I play any small team, and I might lose or win, but I'm not destroyed for trying as they play too conservative and are ok with a 0-0 until the last 10 minutes of the game when they attack a little bit more.

I'd like to struggle more with small teams as that is how I like to play. I'd love to fight every year against relegation and feel great for doing it, I'd like to feel fear of other teams, of top players etc as right now I barely care of who i'm playing against. Also if you do well a few games and do not screw up in the press conferences to not to have an overconfident team, you just keep winning, morale has much of an effect and it's easy to keep high enough.

[thiagoanjo]

2 horas atrás, francis#17 disse:

Hiring staff in the game isnt realistic. The user changes staff much more frequently than real clubs and the AI do. On top of that we can see stats for staff which also isnt realistic. In real life it's more about word of mouth and good interview skills. On top of that the vast majority of real life managers dont hand pick all of the backroom staff. To stop this advantage put your Director of Football or Technical Director in charge of hiring staff as they will have more realistic hiring practices and they are the people who will actually hire staff in real life.

How do you make a interview to a staff in-game? Yes, you cant. So the game fill those gaps with some stuff that doesnt exist in real life, thats why we have attributes for staff, think it is like you did the interview and you found that qualities.

But yes, I think the game could improve somethings to a more realistic way.

[thiagoanjo]

3 minutos atrás, Tyburn disse:

The point about fatigue is a good one. Somehow, even when my team is dead with tiny red hearts everywhere, we continue to move at the same pace as we did at the start of the game when we were fresh. To see a noticeable drop in performance, pace, positioning would really help with OP pressing tactics being so dominant.

Thats the main issue, teams can pressure 90min and even so play like fresh all the time, so you cant counter-attack never, cause they players will pressure high and return real quick 90min.

[majesticeternity]

On 23/03/2021 at 07:40, Mars_Blackmon said:

I cringe every time I start a game and the AI goes defensive mentality. Automatic win.

 

mentalities definitely need to be more balanced. Or the AI need to be less likely to go so defensive to start a game and switch mentality more often during the game.

Yes, definitely. 
 

there is not enough attacking mentality, and as mentioned already in this thread, most players are on balanced or higher. 
 

I think this is partly why increasing manager abilities is helpful, but not enough. It can’t change to a great degree the managers attacking. But, why I am finding my save very difficult, that there are legends in the game, so then player skill overcomes the poor manager tactics. An AI manager can be defensive, yet a legend can shoot from distance, create something from nothing, or take on a defensive line on their own, without needing a full attacking team behind them for support.
 

I think also too that individual player abilities are not strong enough, that players play too much as a team, they don’t have enough individuality on the pitch. 

[Outrospective]

I don't know about you guys, how do you even find this game easy.

For example, I've started a new save today, with no rep and licenses, and was hired by Wealdstone (VNL) just a couple of weeks in the game.

Our goal is to survive relegation battle. So far I had 2 draws, 2 losses and 1 lucky win. I play Direct Counter preset 4-4-2 with a couple of tweaks (e.g., I have a strong feeling, that deep defensive line is useless in the game so I use higher DL + low engagement line with more urgent pressing). I mostly start matches with cautious mentality and switch between it, positive and balanced.

I've played 2 full matches on cautious and had twice more shots (yeah, I know, it's not the sign of quality). My team regularly misses the chances like 3 meters far from the goal after a diagonal cross, where usually teams in FM score easily. I have no idea what to improve given that Wealdstone is semi-pro and therefore training is close to non-existent.

So, one loss was with me conceding, going defensive as the opposition was stronger, conceding another. I switched to positive and managed to get one goal but that's it. Second loss was me going attacking for the last 15 mins. Noted, don't do it.

While being cautious, I've managed to get the only win and had two draws. In both draw cases I switched between cautious and balanced.

The first win was after I got fed up of seeing my team having 20/7 shots and tried to counter it with turning "shoot on sight" on. You know, they shoot and miss regularly so probably they will have better probability to score if they shoot more, right?

I've got 600 hours of FM20/21 combined and I'm yet to win Champions League or something like that.

Back then I won 3 consecutive CLs with Leverkusen in FM2010 in a long-term save. That was easy.

FM21 is nowhere near to being easy, as I constantly get sacked when I start unemployed nobody journeyman saves as I end up in relegation candidates and have trouble with turning things around.

So, should I download someone's tactics? I play FM for storytelling and roleplay of myself in the football world. But I want to win Champions League too.

[zindrinho]

It's easier to be on the front foot, no doubt, start defending from the front and set 1 of your CBs to man mark their lone striker and cut off other possibilities for them to counter, use a player in the DM position to recycle possession and pick up clearances from their defence. Thats my main way of winning, then tweak it so you're always left with a CB to cover for the rest of the team, so dont use both CBs to man mark 2 strikers f.ex, use your DM to man mark their deeper lying one if they dont use a 1 striker formation.

Edited March 24, 2021 by zindrinho
clarity

[majesticeternity]

2 hours ago, Outrospective said:

So, one loss was with me conceding, going defensive as the opposition was stronger, conceding another. I switched to positive and managed to get one goal but that's it. Second loss was me going attacking for the last 15 mins. Noted, don't do it.

While being cautious, I've managed to get the only win and had two draws. In both draw cases I switched between cautious and balanced.

 

Yea, like @zindrinho says, attacking is better. being more cautious just means they have more ability to attack you. defensive mentalities will make you tend to concede more.

[rdbayly]

I’m not finding this year’s edition as easy as any that preceded it. My preference to operate with a small squad has been brutally exposed as a weakness this year. Fatigue has killed many a season for me.

I never start at an elite or rich club, so it’s hard to build a large squad with strength in depth.

Edited March 25, 2021 by rdbayly

[Junkhead]

12 hours ago, Outrospective said:

I don't know about you guys, how do you even find this game easy.

For example, I've started a new save today, with no rep and licenses, and was hired by Wealdstone (VNL) just a couple of weeks in the game.

Our goal is to survive relegation battle. So far I had 2 draws, 2 losses and 1 lucky win. I play Direct Counter preset 4-4-2 with a couple of tweaks (e.g., I have a strong feeling, that deep defensive line is useless in the game so I use higher DL + low engagement line with more urgent pressing). I mostly start matches with cautious mentality and switch between it, positive and balanced.

I've played 2 full matches on cautious and had twice more shots (yeah, I know, it's not the sign of quality). My team regularly misses the chances like 3 meters far from the goal after a diagonal cross, where usually teams in FM score easily. I have no idea what to improve given that Wealdstone is semi-pro and therefore training is close to non-existent.

So, one loss was with me conceding, going defensive as the opposition was stronger, conceding another. I switched to positive and managed to get one goal but that's it. Second loss was me going attacking for the last 15 mins. Noted, don't do it.

While being cautious, I've managed to get the only win and had two draws. In both draw cases I switched between cautious and balanced.

The first win was after I got fed up of seeing my team having 20/7 shots and tried to counter it with turning "shoot on sight" on. You know, they shoot and miss regularly so probably they will have better probability to score if they shoot more, right?

I've got 600 hours of FM20/21 combined and I'm yet to win Champions League or something like that.

Back then I won 3 consecutive CLs with Leverkusen in FM2010 in a long-term save. That was easy.

FM21 is nowhere near to being easy, as I constantly get sacked when I start unemployed nobody journeyman saves as I end up in relegation candidates and have trouble with turning things around.

So, should I download someone's tactics? I play FM for storytelling and roleplay of myself in the football world. But I want to win Champions League too.

See this is what I don't get. You are having a realistic experience using realistic tactics with a side that is 19th IRL. It looks to me like you are only 5 games in.

Their real manager is battling against relegation, as are you.

Wealdstone will not be playing a high press attacking tactic IRL.  

This is about the level of club I usually manage at and the results I tend to get. Winning the champions league with Wealdstone as a starting position should be ridiculously hard. Winning it with Wealdstone should be nigh on impossible.

This is why I am not convinced that the game is too easy.  Realistic input tends to mean realistic output.

It does appear that overly attacking tactics are overpowered Vs AI.  The issue is this is how most users naturally play. An overly attacking tactic with Wealdstone is unrealistic. I honestly think this is where the issue is here - people want it to be easier than it should be and are aware of overpowered tactics. They use them and then say that it shouldn't be that easy despite (purposely or not) them using overpowered tactics.

If things are overpowered, report it. If it's already been reported, hopefully it will be fixed.

Edited March 25, 2021 by Junkhead
Context

[Outrospective]

34 minutes ago, Junkhead said:

Winning the champions league with Wealdstone as a starting position should be ridiculously hard. Winning it with Wealdstone should be nigh on impossible.

Oh, I'm not going to win the CL with them, of course not. I just wonder if there's a real way to boost my reputation, as I intend to switch to any team which will offer higher wage to my manager. Given that I have adaptability of 5, I guess, offers from teams without me applying first actually CAN happen.

The problem is that I play for Wealdstone, they decline me a coaching license beacuse fear that bigger club can swap me (and I'm like, "well, that's the whole point"), I most likely relegate, I lose reputation and get sacked, no one wants to hire me anymore. Had several journeyman saves broken beacuse of that. I countered it with playing in Wales and boosting rep there, but I'm really tired of Welsh league and didn't even load it this time.

In the meantime, looks like the assumption of "more shots = theoretically more goals" works sometimes. Stockport is the 1st place btw. Cautious and balanced mentalities, didn't ever go higher.

Spoiler

 

[Junkhead]

2 minutes ago, Outrospective said:

Oh, I'm not going to win the CL with them, of course not. I just wonder if there's a real way to boost my reputation, as I intend to switch to any team which will offer higher wage to my manager. Given that I have adaptability of 5, I guess, offers from teams without me applying first actually CAN happen.

The problem is that I play for Wealdstone, they decline me a coaching license beacuse fear that bigger club can swap me (and I'm like, "well, that's the whole point"), I most likely relegate, I lose reputation and get sacked, no one wants to hire me anymore. Had several journeyman saves broken beacuse of that. I countered it with playing in Wales and boosting rep there, but I'm really tired of Welsh league and didn't even load it this time.

In the meantime, looks like the assumption of "more shots = theoretically more goals" works sometimes. Stockport is the 1st place btw. Cautious and balanced mentalities, didn't ever go higher.

  Reveal hidden contents

 

Yet at the same time there are users reporting that it is too easy to get better jobs which reputation shouldn't allow the user to get. Which has been logged and is being looked at.

If the manager of Wealdstone is relegated, reputation shouldn't take that much of a hit as relegation is expected.  So agree that is an issue. 

[Tyburn]

Reputation is a big issue for me personally.

Started at Albion in Scottish league 2. Predicted to finish bottom or 2nd bottom. Got them to the play off final 1st season where I lost.

Arbroath in the Scottish Championship came up. Two leagues above me. I went for it thinking I’d have no chance but they gave it to me! So I went. In 3 seasons I had won the Scottish cup (whilst still in the championship - instant Euro Cup place) and finished 3rd in the Scottish Prem 3rd season. Don’t really know how, something just clicked.

Aberdeen came up. I got it. Fairly realistic. Had a nightmare at Aberdeen and resigned before they booted me. Waited 6 months for a job I was interested in. I’m now continental in reputation btw, thanks to my European exploits in the Euro cup I suppose with Arbroath, and they couldn’t give me licenses quick enough! So have a continental pro license now. I wanted a good team in Holland but, although close to happening, it never materialised.

Arsenal came up, and I thought let’s test the water, for a laugh. To my shock and horror they offered me the job without batting an eyelid. Allegri had just been sacked for finishing 7th.

Arbroath seemed a stretch from Albion tbh but Arsenal from a disastrous 6 month spell at Aberdeen!?

For me, reputation is gained too easily. And it skews the realism. Of course, we are the masters of our own destiny. But it’s a shame so much weight should be put on our own will power.