Does FM incorporate Economics? (Book "Money and Soccer")

[phd_angel]

I'm about finishing "Money and Soccer", a book written by an economics professor. In addition to many fascinating stories about the history of top European clubs and leagues (with a focus on England), he shows a bunch of statistical correlations between revenue, transfer fees, payroll and league performance (the more you spend, the higher you rank). He analyzes revenue structure development over time (from gate receipts and sponsorship, to global broadcasting, and the sugar daddy phenomenon), the role of stadiums, and he even measures the impact of head coaches on club performance! (yes, we make a difference). But his main overall point is that clubs are prone to lose money nearly always.

I'm curious as to whether SI has ever considered this type of economic correlations when developing the game, or if gamers who develop new mods (such as @Daveincid) are aware of this type of studies on football economics.

My impression is that FM has little correlation with real football economics. Other than most clubs operating in the red most of the time, it is unrealistic that a good FM head coach can turn a minion bottom-feeder into a continental powerhouse in just a few years. Or, that salaries in FM are so often off the mark...

Has anyone read this book, or see any relationship with FM?  Here's a recommendation for some Christmas reading...
 

Edited December 22, 2021 by phd_angel

[FootballHedgehog]

I can tell you that at least in my corner of the research world, Africa and the Middle East, we do discuss this sort of thing often. On the one hand, Middle Eastern clubs are primarily financed either by governments or super wealthy individuals, neither of which can be accurately quite simulated in the game at this point in comparison to the more traditional models of ownership seen in Europe, and tickets are usually quite cheap, relative to Europe or america. In Africa this applies pretty well across the board but in a more extreme way because even some first division clubs in some areas have rather poor facilities and financial power, so it is a challenge if you decide to manage them in game.

 

When it comes to revenues and sponsorships, I can tell you that it is something that I at least try to pay attention to and implement in my research, but it is often quite difficult to find the right numbers. Broadcast revenues for example are often quite hard to pin down in my region, while finances are basically impossible, and this holds very similar for much of the world due either to clubs and leagues not releasing detailed financial information, or it simply being impossible to find. Some areas are far easier than others.

 

So I can say that it is certainly something that i, and the researchers I talk to often, do consider, and I can assume that this holds true throughout the rest of the researcher population. I just wish data was easier to find, because it could make things a lot more interesting and realistic in that regard.

[kepz]

I have noticed clubs in Argentina and Turkey all seem to start with okay to poor finances, presumably because of the economic issues in those countries, so it does seem like FM researchers try to account for economics. But I don’t know the long-term implications of finances and the like in the game world, I tend not to look around too much when I play too far into the future because inevitably I get disappointed by something stupid (like Klopp resigning from Liverpool to take over City after they fired Pep, who in turn gets hired at Liverpool) that ruins the game world for me. 

[derekuu]

On 21/12/2021 at 04:45, FootballHedgehog said:

I can tell you that at least in my corner of the research world, Africa and the Middle East, we do discuss this sort of thing often. On the one hand, Middle Eastern clubs are primarily financed either by governments or super wealthy individuals, neither of which can be accurately quite simulated in the game at this point in comparison to the more traditional models of ownership seen in Europe, and tickets are usually quite cheap, relative to Europe or america. In Africa this applies pretty well across the board but in a more extreme way because even some first division clubs in some areas have rather poor facilities and financial power, so it is a challenge if you decide to manage them in game.

 

When it comes to revenues and sponsorships, I can tell you that it is something that I at least try to pay attention to and implement in my research, but it is often quite difficult to find the right numbers. Broadcast revenues for example are often quite hard to pin down in my region, while finances are basically impossible, and this holds very similar for much of the world due either to clubs and leagues not releasing detailed financial information, or it simply being impossible to find. Some areas are far easier than others.

 

So I can say that it is certainly something that i, and the researchers https://www.nursingpaper.com/ I talk to often, do consider, and I can assume that this holds true throughout the rest of the researcher population. I just wish data was easier to find, because it could make things a lot more interesting and realistic in that regard.

That’s an interesting question! It would be amazing if FM incorporated more real-world economics like in "Money and Soccer." The financial side of football is so complex and can really change the game dynamics. I love when games dive deep into that kind of detail, but it can be overwhelming, too.

[phnompenhandy]

I think  @Daveincid  puts a lot of thought on these issues into his additional files

[FM24] "Increase Realism"- Megapack SEPTEMBER UPDATE by Daveincid

Edited September 21 by phnompenhandy

[scythian12]

This is a good video essay on why video game economies are never like the real world, and why they are intrisically so, e. g. never can simulate a real world ecomony truly.

[jscjr]

If the game simulated the actual difficulty of raising a minnow to the Champions League (including the economics, but other factors as well), there would be many fewer people interested in spending so much time playing it. Always have to remember that, as interesting as the simulation parts of FM might be, it's a game in the end and it has to be interesting to potential customers. 

Edited September 23 by jscjr

[Costav]

On 23/09/2024 at 04:06, jscjr said:

If the game simulated the actual difficulty of raising a minnow to the Champions League (including the economics, but other factors as well), there would be many fewer people interested in spending so much time playing it. Always have to remember that, as interesting as the simulation parts of FM might be, it's a game in the end and it has to be interesting to potential customers. 

Ok, but it will make the game waaay more interesting.
Especially in Italy, clubs need to balance financial situation with transfer markets. They should allow a modality in which finances are very realistic and you need tofinance the club in the way you can (trading players).

Now it's too easy to build a very good team when you have no financial difficulties.