Any advice for my 433

[ReadingFan82]

Just had a few queries about the 433 DM I am using on my current save. I've played pretty much the same system bare a few small variations from time to time and just wanted to see what people thought about it and if anyone had any advice on how to maybe improve it.

  

 

These are a few observations I have on the system from the game's I've played this season and last -

1 - I have a horrific record and always lose against the sides as good or better than mine, such as the other traditional "top 6" sides as well as good European teams. On there you can see Arsenal and Atletico, who I both thumped at home to only get crushed away, and the last season was exactly the same

2 - In some games my team create absolutely nothing at all and I'm not quite sure what to do to remedy this. I've tried lowering tempo, adding work ball into box, etc..., all the things like that, but to very little effect

3 - I also struggle against the better top half sides, the equivalents in real life being Leicester, Villa, Wolves, Brighton, etc..., I always seem to struggle against them, particularly in creating chances

4 -  I concede a fair amount of goals/chances from the same type of passage of play, a cross pitch ball played from deep from the oppositions right sided players in behind my right back to a forward running across and into the space between my RB and RCB. Best example of this is what happens to Liverpool in real life with Trent at RB with the cross pitch balls played behind him if that makes sense (that's why the RCB is a ball player on cover duty in the hope he can sweep up those balls but I can't say that has done the trick)

5 -  the inverted winger on the right always gets quite low rating generally

I'm currently 3rd in the league and still topping my UCL group, but if I lost my next game and certain teams below me all won, which in fairness is unlikely, I could drop to 8th. I came 4th on the final day last season after winning and Newcastle and Chelsea both dropped points so I just nicked in, which was brilliant obviously but I pretty much lucked out with other teams dropping points in situations were they might not be expected to. I just want to see what people think, I don't know if I'm just expecting too much of my squad at the minute and my problems could well be magically be solved by adding a few better players into the squad or if there are problems with the system I'm trying to play with.

 

[Lasson]

2 hours ago, ReadingFan82 said:

4 -  I concede a fair amount of goals/chances from the same type of passage of play, a cross pitch ball played from deep from the oppositions right sided players in behind my right back to a forward running across and into the space between my RB and RCB.

Have you tried changing your RB from WBs to a FBs? When I have an attacking player at CM, I like to have a FB on that side to give some better defensive cover. 

[ReadingFan82]

9 hours ago, Lasson said:

Have you tried changing your RB from WBs to a FBs? When I have an attacking player at CM, I like to have a FB on that side to give some better defensive cover. 

That might be worth a go, I'll see how it goes. From your experience do you find that the RB still goes forward often or does this instruction neuter their attacking output somewhat?

[Novem9]

• Really don't like how MEZ works with IW, but it's more productive MEZ+W
• Don't feel you need pass into space, especially you after said this:

16 часов назад, ReadingFan82 сказал:

2 - In some games my team create absolutely nothing at all and I'm not quite sure what to do to remedy this. I've tried lowering tempo, adding work ball into box, etc..., all the things like that, but to very little effect

 

Do you know why exactly you added pass into space?

• What do you think about your CF? What if you try a more predictable role, AF for example? Just to check difference, mb it will give more understanding
• I also thought about rb is fb(s)
• Don't like BPD (especially two!) under DLP, but I’ll refrain here

[Vizzini]

Are you simply taking too much risk on and off the ball? Aggressive roles, aggresive instructions and aggressive mentality seems like overkill to me. Maybe try dropping the mentality to balanced so you don't try to force the issue as much.

[Lasson]

6 hours ago, ReadingFan82 said:

That might be worth a go, I'll see how it goes. From your experience do you find that the RB still goes forward often or does this instruction neuter their attacking output somewhat?

He still goes forward, but with less risk than a WBs. With FBs you can also customize his behaviour since the role doesn’t have any hardcoded PIs.

[ReadingFan82]

3 hours ago, Novem9 said:

• Really don't like how MEZ works with IW, but it's more productive MEZ+W
• Don't feel you need pass into space, especially you after said this:

Do you know why exactly you added pass into space?

• What do you think about your CF? What if you try a more predictable role, AF for example? Just to check difference, mb it will give more understanding
• I also thought about rb is fb(s)
• Don't like BPD (especially two!) under DLP, but I’ll refrain here

Are you saying that a combination of a MEZ with a winger would be more productive than the current set up I already have? Or would maybe a supporting MEZ with an IW on attack would be better than what I have currently? 

Yeah that point on pass into space is really good, I do turn it off when I'm chasing a game or a winner against a low block but never really thought about it in the way you have. Do you think that turning that off and adding work ball into box would work or just turning pass into space off would be sufficient?

To be honest the CF is because I imagined they'd drop a bit deeper and bridge the gap between attack and midfield, but to be honest I'm not 100% sure if that works how I'd imagine. I thought that an AF may end up being a bit isolating but have never tried it so it could be worth a go.

What's your thinking for not liking the 2 BPD's, especially when combined with a DLP?

[ReadingFan82]

3 hours ago, Vizzini said:

Are you simply taking too much risk on and off the ball? Aggressive roles, aggressive instructions and aggressive mentality seems like overkill to me. Maybe try dropping the mentality to balanced so you don't try to force the issue as much.

It might be a bit overkill as you say, but I think in terms of roles on my players its relatively balanced and instructions aren't too ridiculous either? Dropping the mentality as you say might be an idea. Just a question on that, is a high tempo on a balanced mentality the same as a high tempo on ana attacking mentality?

[Novem9]

13 минут назад, ReadingFan82 сказал:

Are you saying that a combination of a MEZ with a winger would be more productive than the current set up I already have? Or would maybe a supporting MEZ with an IW on attack would be better than what I have currently? 

 

It's difficult for me to explain this in English, so I show:

MEZ(1) can't passing for 2 (IW) because they crossed the same line, which covered by opposite player

 

But MEZ and W could to interact easier

I didn't use W before, it was not comfortable for me. But Winger is not stupid run-n-cross player, so don't worry. Check is free, in the end.

 

20 минут назад, ReadingFan82 сказал:

Do you think that turning that off and adding work ball into box would work or just turning pass into space off would be sufficient?

Better to disable firstly and add something only when you realize you need this. If you add anything at random, more difficult to investigate

 

21 минуту назад, ReadingFan82 сказал:

To be honest the CF is because I imagined they'd drop a bit deeper and bridge the gap between attack and midfield, but to be honest I'm not 100% sure if that works how I'd imagine. I thought that an AF may end up being a bit isolating but have never tried it so it could be worth a go.

 

DLF(a) or F9 could do the same. CF has many options, read his description. If it works good for you, don't change forsure. Just pay attention about how your wings work with CF. Do they complement each other?

 

24 минуты назад, ReadingFan82 сказал:

What's your thinking for not liking the 2 BPD's, especially when combined with a DLP?

I just prefer two CB or CB/BPD. A technical defender is the enemy of his team  

About DLP in DM slot. BPD runs attacks from deep positions and goes higher with a ball. It works without any traits now. I feel it like BPD does job of DLP and question why it needs both?
+ despite DLP has 'hold position' as playmaker he rolling as any playmaker role. Mb it works fine for you, I just drew your attention. I prefer CB+CB+DLP or BPD+CB+DM , but it depends on many factors - your players, opposite teams formation, etc.

[Bitner]

Gotta give my 2 cents, but i'm no professional at the game like some people over here, BUT.

Wing pairings aren't my favourites. IW is a Winger, and i don't like pairing them with a Wingback, even worse if your winger is more attacking. Second thing, both wingbacks support, so they behave the same when attacking, thus this creates less variations. Looking to the wingers and thinking you want them to be the same as they are, i'd go for a FB (A) on right side, and CWB (S) on left side, so both players on left can, but won't drift wide always. If you want the CWB to be powered, combine with a Winger, tho.

Speaking on midfield MEZ + IW sounds a bit of overkill, and has the problem that you got no penetration inside, so looking at that situation, i rather use a CM (A) to give some penetration through the middle. And BBM and CM (A) isn't a bad partnership, coz your DM is a sitter and a passer, the BBM being skipp, he'll be more industrious, and will left the penetration/attacking duties to CM (A).

I like the complete forward, but looking at how your team is set up, he'll be more isolated, as he's attacking, not supporting. You maybe want him to link up play a bit more, instead of being a finisher inside a desert of ideas.

About the defenders, i don't like the De + Co combination, if you want someone covering, then might be good trying to use a Stopper.

About team instructions: Your wingbacks aren't attacking enough to overlap your wingers, so it might be a good idea that you put a get further forward on the support one, and let another attack.

Passing into space demand runners upfront. Only LW is a runner, and in general he'll not be able to score due being out wide. Run at defence is ok, but you want everyone to try and take on people?

I can live with higher tempo, but demands observation.

Countering is good, but maybe you'll want a PF (A) who is more direct than the CF (A)?

Well, that's all my opinions, hope you consider them.

Cheers,
Bitner 

[Vizzini]

8 hours ago, ReadingFan82 said:

It might be a bit overkill as you say, but I think in terms of roles on my players its relatively balanced and instructions aren't too ridiculous either? Dropping the mentality as you say might be an idea. Just a question on that, is a high tempo on a balanced mentality the same as a high tempo on ana attacking mentality?

Attacking mentality comes with a high tempo and a high block, also, wbs naturally get forward,  using overlap just forces the wide men to wait for wbs, thus slowing down your attacks, which does not seem to be what you want based on your setup.