[FM22.4] Pan-American Copa America + South American Nations League and re-worked Gold Cup

[rusty217]

FM22.4.1 version
Copa America.fmf

Copa America + Gold Cup.fmf

FM22.4 version

Copa America.fmf

FM22.3 version

Copa America.fmf

Expanded the Copa America to 16 teams, from both North and South America (every 4 years)
1 host nation
4 North American teams
6 South American teams
5 Playoff winners
The host (always group A) and 3 highest ranked teams are seeded and drawn in separate groups

Expanded the North American Nations League Division A to 4 teams per group (double round robin) (every 2 years)
Altered Division C to 2 groups of 5-6 teams (single round robin) with Saint Barthelemy and St Pierre & Miquelon included
The 1st team in each Division A group qualifies for the Copa America (every 4 years)
The 2nd and 3rd teams in each Division A group and the 1st team in each Division B group qualifies for the Copa America Playoff (every 4 years)

Added a South American Nations League (every 2 years)
Two groups of 5 teams (single round robin). The top 2 from each group proceed to semis/final.
The top 3 from each group qualify for the Copa America (every 4 years)
4th qualifies for the Copa America Playoff (every 4 years)

Added a Copa America Playoff (every 4 years)
The 3rd team from each NA Div A group, and 1st team from each NA Div B group play a 1 off semi-final
The 4 winners of the semi + the 2nd team from each NA Div A group and 4th from each SA Nations League group play a 2 legged playoff final. The 5 winners qualify for the Copa America

The Gold Cup has been made extinct

The + Gold Cup version of the file brings the Gold Cup back.
1 host nation
8 losing Copa America playoff teams
7 Gold Cup Qualifying playoff winners (14 teams enter the playoff, the 3 best semi-finalists from the Nations League and the 11 best North American teams that didn't qualify for the Copa America
Any teams that qualified for the Copa America will use their B team in the Gold Cup instead (only possible for the host and Nations League semi-finalists)
South American teams can qualify, but only by losing the Copa America playoff, so there will be at most 2 of them, often none.
The tournament starts a few weeks after the Copa America. They do overlap (anybody choosing to manage both the A and B teams of a major North American country will be busy!) but individual stages are at different dates.
Hosting has been freed up. The USA, Mexico and Canada are favoured for hosting rights, but a bunch of smaller countries are eligible to host too.

Known Issues:
The Copa America Quarter Final draw rules page shows incorrect information (visual error only, it correctly shows 1st in Group A vs 2nd in Group B etc. elsewhere and the competition is drawn correctly)
(posssible) fixture congestion for South American nations. An extra competition may cause congestion considering their long WC qualifying campaign

Edited April 17, 2022 by rusty217
Updated version

[rusty217]

Updated version released.

The host nation now automatically qualifies for the Copa America and is seeded for the group draw. Only 2 teams (down from 4) from South America qualify for the playoff and only the 5 playoff winners (down from 6) qualify for the Copa America now.

All awards now work correctly too!

Probably the last update since the remaining issues are purely cosmetic.

Edited March 6, 2022 by rusty217

[oche balboa]

Love this. 

[rusty217]

3 hours ago, oche balboa said:

Love this. 

Thanks, always good to hear people are enjoying it

[omarsorto6]

@rusty217Is it possible to merge the nations league of south and north ?

[rusty217]

10 hours ago, omarsorto6 said:

@rusty217Is it possible to merge the nations league of south and north ?

It's definitely possible. It'd probably be easiest if you want something similar to the current North American or even European one. Probably easier to copy/paste that and expand the teams in it or add an extra division than it would be to create one from scratch.

It's not something I'm looking to add though.

[vassilispyrgos]

Your file is a very welcome addition to the FM. It gives a chance to some small North American nations for success in the Copa America

However I have a small objection. You have extinct the Gold Cup which i think is a bit unfair because some nations from Caribbean like Honduras , Cuba , Jamaica and Costa Rica have a chance to break USA and Mexico winning strike.

My question is : Can you enable again the Gold Cup and make it a fully functional competition?

[rusty217]

17 hours ago, vassilispyrgos said:

Your file is a very welcome addition to the FM. It gives a chance to some small North American nations for success in the Copa America

However I have a small objection. You have extinct the Gold Cup which i think is a bit unfair because some nations from Caribbean like Honduras , Cuba , Jamaica and Costa Rica have a chance to break USA and Mexico winning strike.

My question is : Can you enable again the Gold Cup and make it a fully functional competition?

I removed it because I consider the Nations League to have taken its place as the de facto North American championship.

It would certainly be possible to add it back, a few things to consider though. Should it still be every 2 years, or change to every 4 years like the Copa America (in which case, should it be in the same year?). If it's every 4 years should it exclude the teams that qualify for the Copa America (not really possible if it's every 2 years). If it does exclude Copa America teams, how about including South American teams, I was thinking perhaps the losers of the Copa America playoff could qualify for the Gold Cup instead, that could include at most 2 South American nations.

Also, how should host selection be done? Should it still just be the USA every time? Or should other countries be a possibility. Also, should the hosts automatically qualify (only really relevant if excluding Copa America teams though, since then they could still qualify for both if selected as host)?

[vassilispyrgos]

6 hours ago, rusty217 said:

I removed it because I consider the Nations League to have taken its place as the de facto North American championship.

It would certainly be possible to add it back, a few things to consider though. Should it still be every 2 years, or change to every 4 years like the Copa America (in which case, should it be in the same year?). If it's every 4 years should it exclude the teams that qualify for the Copa America (not really possible if it's every 2 years). If it does exclude Copa America teams, how about including South American teams, I was thinking perhaps the losers of the Copa America playoff could qualify for the Gold Cup instead, that could include at most 2 South American nations.

Also, how should host selection be done? Should it still just be the USA every time? Or should other countries be a possibility. Also, should the hosts automatically qualify (only really relevant if excluding Copa America teams though, since then they could still qualify for both if selected as host)?

I will tell you mate

You should change it to every 4 years AND exclude teams that already have qualified for the Copa America . Your idea to include South American teams is very good especially since you said that Copa America playoff losers could qualify for the Gold Cup instead . 

As for the host countries , its a bit strange. USA HAS the stadiums for Gold Cup , but i think the addition of other countries such as Canada , Mexico and Costa Rica would be very important or cohosting will be a very good idea . Finally if they qualify automatically could they use B Teams like what it happens in Africa???

I will wait for your response

Edited April 15, 2022 by vassilispyrgos
Adding

[vassilispyrgos]

Moreover if you create again Gold Cup could you create a 3rd position playoff??

[rusty217]

Updated for 22.4.1, also added a version that includes a re-worked Gold Cup which mostly ignores teams that qualified for the Copa America but does use the B team for at most 4 of the best North American teams in the Copa. Hosting has been freed up too, the USA, Mexico and Canada are more likely to host but smaller nations are possibilities too.

Here are the results of my testing so far, pretty happy with it. Definitely more variety in winners, although Mexico and USA (or their B teams at least) are still certainly capable of winning it.

2064 was an odd one. Chile won the 2056, 2060 & 2068 Copa Americas, so were surely the best team in the Americas at the time. I can only assume they messed up their Copa America qualification on purpose that year just so they could win the Gold Cup and add a different trophy to their cabinet.

Edited April 17, 2022 by rusty217

[vassilispyrgos]

oh men thats perfect!!!!

you are the best!!!

[Capitao]

loooks amazing i will use for sure, but what i find wierd is that world champion brazil never won lol 

[LeoFreire98]

is it possible to do it with clubs?

[rusty217]

4 hours ago, LeoFreire98 said:

is it possible to do it with clubs?

Yes, but not to a degree I consider satisfactory. Believe me I tried! The best case scenario would be dynamic league reputations breaking (so rep, prize money etc. stays the same forever), even that isn't really good enough for it to be worth doing for me. Worst case scenario? Dynamic reps are still broken, but you also need to move every country from one of the Americas into the other one and have either North or South America with no countries in it. That would definitely require some international file changes as well to avoid breaking other stuff too.

Maybe it'll be easier in FM23, but it's pretty rare to get improvements for the editor.

[themodelcitizen]

Have you played around with trying an invited team? They didn't do it at the 2016 joint Copa, but that was only 16 teams. Plus, they've invited teams in the past. You could get 1 or 2 "random team from team pool" from, say, Australia, Japan, China, Qatar etc (all invited in the past). Maybe their U-23 team if the seniors are already booked that month. It would be cool if you could get any upcoming Asian-based World Cup host like they did with Qatar

It's a bit odd, but is a nice touch and helps prevent bloodbaths like Brazil vs. Saint Kitts.

[legendof88]

This is amazing idea. 

Just wondered if you have or even considered a global Nations League tournament or even super cup (Winners Nations League Tournaments)?

Also can you play this with your 40 World Cup Team file?

In terms of non-international files, could you play the two aforementioned files with say a European Club Cup competitions also?

[rusty217]

On 04/11/2022 at 06:33, themodelcitizen said:

Have you played around with trying an invited team? They didn't do it at the 2016 joint Copa, but that was only 16 teams. Plus, they've invited teams in the past. You could get 1 or 2 "random team from team pool" from, say, Australia, Japan, China, Qatar etc (all invited in the past). Maybe their U-23 team if the seniors are already booked that month. It would be cool if you could get any upcoming Asian-based World Cup host like they did with Qatar

It's a bit odd, but is a nice touch and helps prevent bloodbaths like Brazil vs. Saint Kitts.

Personally I've never been a fan of the invited teams. It could definitely be added, but it's not something I'm really interested in. I think it would be possible prioritise Asian World Cup hosts for the invite spot too actually. You could add your 2nd last team instruction to be Get Host Nation World Cup Continent = Asia and tick the Don't Use Later Rules If Number Of Teams Found Is At Least 1. Then have your final team instruction as the team pool for other invitees. It would take Asian WC hosts first, but if there aren't any move on to the other options instead.

Plus, Brazil vs Saint Kitts should be unlikely as Saint Kitts would need to get into Nations League Division A (or win Division B so they'd be A next time) in order to qualify.

[rusty217]

13 hours ago, legendof88 said:

This is amazing idea. 

Just wondered if you have or even considered a global Nations League tournament or even super cup (Winners Nations League Tournaments)?

Also can you play this with your 40 World Cup Team file?

In terms of non-international files, could you play the two aforementioned files with say a European Club Cup competitions also?

No plans for any other tournaments, sorry.

Yes, it can be used with my WC file. They were actually intended to go together from the beginning. I worked out the scheduling for them together so there shouldn't be any clashes and having both will make up for the loss in South American fixtures due to the different WC qualifying format.

You should be able to use them both with any files that don't change international competitions without issue. I'm personally using them both alongside 100+ other nation files.

[themodelcitizen]

3 hours ago, rusty217 said:

Personally I've never been a fan of the invited teams. It could definitely be added, but it's not something I'm really interested in. I think it would be possible prioritise Asian World Cup hosts for the invite spot too actually. You could add your 2nd last team instruction to be Get Host Nation World Cup Continent = Asia and tick the Don't Use Later Rules If Number Of Teams Found Is At Least 1. Then have your final team instruction as the team pool for other invitees. It would take Asian WC hosts first, but if there aren't any move on to the other options instead.

Plus, Brazil vs Saint Kitts should be unlikely as Saint Kitts would need to get into Nations League Division A (or win Division B so they'd be A next time) in order to qualify.

Makes sense. At one point I was telling it to invite whichever of Spain, England, Portugal, Holland, France etc hadn't qualified for the Euros that year, just to spice it up and reflect their historical and current possessions in América. In practice, they all almost always qualified for the Euros and didn't come