Team qualifies for more than one continental comp

[Ominous77]

Hi everyone.

I'm having a bit of an issue here.

I'm recreating a lot of comps from scratch, and for the most part everything works pretty fine. The problem comes when setting up the qualifying process for each of the continental cups.

-For the tier 1 cup, only the league champions qualify.
-For the tier 2 cup, only the fa cup champions qualify.
-For the tier 3 cup, the top 3 teams from each league that didn't win the fa cup qualify.

What ends up happening is that, when the league champion wins the fa cup, its place being taken up by the league runner-up, not the fa cup runner-up, for the tier 2 cup. And for the tier 3 cup, if one of those teams won the fa cup it ends up participating in more than one continental cup (tier 2 and tier 3 cups), instead of its place being taken up by the next team in the league table.

I'm using "Get qualified teams for comp" with the appropiate seeding, with the "league fate action" for the tier 3 cup.

This is my setup for the continental part:


This is for the tier 3 cup:


Any ideas?

Thanks!

Edited December 13, 2022 by Ominous77
duplicated images

[rusty217]

I don't understand your league fate action. Is it in the league, or the continental cup? Set Continental Cup is used to show that a team is participating in that cup for the current season, that's all. The default competitions Set Continental Cup to the tournament the teams are playing in once they enter it, and Set Continental Cup to blank once they're eliminated from it. There shouldn't be any need to Top Position/Bottom Position unless it's to clear the continental cup from teams that are being knocked out, or change it for teams dropping down (eg. the teams that come 3rd in UCL groups and drop down to UEL). It also shouldn't be set in any domestic leagues.

If that's in the domestic league, that may be the issue.

As for using the cup runner up, I'm not sure there's anything you can do about that. The continental place going to the league next if the cup winner already has a higher continental cup place is how it works in Europe so I imagine is the default for the editor too.

Edited December 14, 2022 by rusty217

[Ominous77]

The league fate action is in the league page, and it's to set up the qualifying for the best 3 teams that are not champions or haven't won the fa cup for the tier 3 cup.

As for the runner-up thing, I thought it would be automatic but it's apparently not the case.

[rusty217]

10 hours ago, Ominous77 said:

The league fate action is in the league page, and it's to set up the qualifying for the best 3 teams that are not champions or haven't won the fa cup for the tier 3 cup.

As for the runner-up thing, I thought it would be automatic but it's apparently not the case.

Ah, definitely remove that then. It's not needed since your qualification system would qualify those teams anyway. It's set to qualify 3 teams for the tier 3 cup and it will skip all teams that have qualified via one of the rules above it, so that would be the champion and cup winner, or 2nd placed team if the champion won the cup. So it'd be 2nd - 4th, or 3rd - 5th anyway. Plus Set Continental Cup isn't how you qualify teams for a competition anyway.

[Ominous77]

Thank you very much, I managed to solve the issues (although I'd like to the cup runner-up to qualify instead of the next in the league, but it is what it is).

I found another issue, though. How can you make it so, if the league winner also wins the fa cup, the supercup does take place anyways with the league winner and another team (maybe the next in the league or the cup runner-up)? This also happens with the continental supercup.

Regarding visual qualification (showing different colors in the league table showing continental spots), is this set up via the "qualification rules" box?

Lastly, should I use ranking levels plus ranking level info in my league and cup, or just ranking levels (in this case, is it necessary to add highest and lowest rankings)?

Thanks!

Edited December 15, 2022 by Ominous77
added info

[themodelcitizen]

If you were to rebuild the continental rules themselves, you can "get last winner" of the cup with "use runner-up as backup" checked. If "get last winner" of the league was a previous entry, and someone won the double, the game will then follow that instruction to use the runner-up as backup. Not sure there's any other way to get into the nitty-gritty of South American continental qualifying, assume a lot of it is hardcoded like Europe (as Rusty hinted at)

[rusty217]

7 hours ago, Ominous77 said:

Thank you very much, I managed to solve the issues (although I'd like to the cup runner-up to qualify instead of the next in the league, but it is what it is).

I found another issue, though. How can you make it so, if the league winner also wins the fa cup, the supercup does take place anyways with the league winner and another team (maybe the next in the league or the cup runner-up)? This also happens with the continental supercup.

Regarding visual qualification (showing different colors in the league table showing continental spots), is this set up via the "qualification rules" box?

Lastly, should I use ranking levels plus ranking level info in my league and cup, or just ranking levels (in this case, is it necessary to add highest and lowest rankings)?

Thanks!

When getting teams for a super cup there's two options to do that. Firstly there's a Use Runner-Up As Backup" box that you can tick, not sure if that's available in older versions though? Then the runner-up of which ever tournament you listed second would be used, eg. you list league first and cup second, the league winner also won the cup so it uses the cup runner-up instead. Or you can just put a 3rd entry at the bottom for Get Runner-Up for one of the competitions, the competition should only draw 2 teams still and it will start at the top, so it should only use that instruction if it can't get 2 different teams from the first 2 rules.

Visual qualification should be automatic since you're setting things up using the continental qualifying system. If it doesn't work try fiddling with the season start/end dates. Sometimes even the default continental competitions won't colour the league table if the season dates are slightly off. I've only ever seen that for russia (pre-ban) though, probably due to their season starting too early or something.

Ranking levels for leagues are generally optional. If you have a playoff to determine the winner you may need them, but otherwise it should sort things out by itself. Cups may need them a little more, you might be able to get away with not using them, I believe some of the default cups don't and let the game just figure it out instead. If you have a 3rd place playoff or something though you'll definitely need to add them yourself. Highest/lowest rankings are only for teams that progress to the next round/stage. If they're done in the competition (eg. eliminated, or it was just a league stage and there's nothing after it) then they're not needed.

[rusty217]

5 hours ago, themodelcitizen said:

If you were to rebuild the continental rules themselves, you can "get last winner" of the cup with "use runner-up as backup" checked. If "get last winner" of the league was a previous entry, and someone won the double, the game will then follow that instruction to use the runner-up as backup. Not sure there's any other way to get into the nitty-gritty of South American continental qualifying, assume a lot of it is hardcoded like Europe (as Rusty hinted at)

That would work, yes. Although it would also be separate from the continental qualification system and you'd need to add instructions to ignore teams that qualified for the other continental competitions too. Would be nigh impossible to do it with a tier 2 competition in a 3 tier setup too since you wouldn't be able to skip over whichever team qualified for the 2nd tier competition when assigning 3rd tier qualification places, so you'd still end up with teams in multiple competitions. Wouldn't really work if you have any more than 1 team in the tier 1 competition too, since then there would be a possibility both the cup winner and runner-up qualified for the tier 1 competition, which if you're ignoring teams from would mean you'd have no teams for the tier 2 one.

[Ominous77]

13 hours ago, themodelcitizen said:

If you were to rebuild the continental rules themselves, you can "get last winner" of the cup with "use runner-up as backup" checked. If "get last winner" of the league was a previous entry, and someone won the double, the game will then follow that instruction to use the runner-up as backup. Not sure there's any other way to get into the nitty-gritty of South American continental qualifying, assume a lot of it is hardcoded like Europe (as Rusty hinted at)

I tried with the option of using the runner-up as backup but didn't work.

The fix that rusty mentioned, adding a 3rd entry with "get last runner-up of comp" did the trick.

Thanks!

[Ominous77]

8 hours ago, rusty217 said:

When getting teams for a super cup there's two options to do that. Firstly there's a Use Runner-Up As Backup" box that you can tick, not sure if that's available in older versions though? Then the runner-up of which ever tournament you listed second would be used, eg. you list league first and cup second, the league winner also won the cup so it uses the cup runner-up instead. Or you can just put a 3rd entry at the bottom for Get Runner-Up for one of the competitions, the competition should only draw 2 teams still and it will start at the top, so it should only use that instruction if it can't get 2 different teams from the first 2 rules.

Visual qualification should be automatic since you're setting things up using the continental qualifying system. If it doesn't work try fiddling with the season start/end dates. Sometimes even the default continental competitions won't colour the league table if the season dates are slightly off. I've only ever seen that for russia (pre-ban) though, probably due to their season starting too early or something.

Ranking levels for leagues are generally optional. If you have a playoff to determine the winner you may need them, but otherwise it should sort things out by itself. Cups may need them a little more, you might be able to get away with not using them, I believe some of the default cups don't and let the game just figure it out instead. If you have a 3rd place playoff or something though you'll definitely need to add them yourself. Highest/lowest rankings are only for teams that progress to the next round/stage. If they're done in the competition (eg. eliminated, or it was just a league stage and there's nothing after it) then they're not needed.

My comps are running from Feb to Nov, I don't know if that means something. I deleted everything in the game so the dates shouldn't cause issues.

I do have ranking levels for the fa cup (I'll have to add them to the continental comps too I suppose, since there will be rounds in some).

What I don't get is the use of "Ranking levels info". Should I add them to drive the board's objectives and confidence or I leave it empty? I'm asking for the leagues, although I don't know if the same could apply to cups (basically the board telling you they expect you to win a continental cup or reaching the fa cup final or the domestic supercup.

Thanks!

[themodelcitizen]

9 hours ago, rusty217 said:

That would work, yes. Although it would also be separate from the continental qualification system and you'd need to add instructions to ignore teams that qualified for the other continental competitions too. Would be nigh impossible to do it with a tier 2 competition in a 3 tier setup too since you wouldn't be able to skip over whichever team qualified for the 2nd tier competition when assigning 3rd tier qualification places, so you'd still end up with teams in multiple competitions. Wouldn't really work if you have any more than 1 team in the tier 1 competition too, since then there would be a possibility both the cup winner and runner-up qualified for the tier 1 competition, which if you're ignoring teams from would mean you'd have no teams for the tier 2 one.

If you're rebuilding it anyway you'd just have the tier 3 comp have a setup date slightly later than the tier 2 comp and use "ignore teams". Certain combinations of "runner up as backup" and using the team pool where it just goes down the list of teams until it doesn't need anymore would allow for appropriate backups to fill in as well.

But yeah, the hard-coded continental qualifying where the game/the Board "knows" what competition you've qualified for at the end of the season is far better than having to use "get last winner" etc the following season.

Edited December 15, 2022 by themodelcitizen

[rusty217]

5 hours ago, Ominous77 said:

My comps are running from Feb to Nov, I don't know if that means something. I deleted everything in the game so the dates shouldn't cause issues.

I do have ranking levels for the fa cup (I'll have to add them to the continental comps too I suppose, since there will be rounds in some).

What I don't get is the use of "Ranking levels info". Should I add them to drive the board's objectives and confidence or I leave it empty? I'm asking for the leagues, although I don't know if the same could apply to cups (basically the board telling you they expect you to win a continental cup or reaching the fa cup final or the domestic supercup.

Thanks!

I don't know the specifics, I just know slightly altering the russian league dates got the colour coding to show for me.

No need to set up ranking level info unless you've also set ranking levels. I'm pretty sure the editor would show an error if you had ranking levels without the info too, so in that case you'd definitely need to do it.