Raumdater and Inside Forward roles is not working.

[ObeLisk]

What is the problem with these roles? In no way do they run into the opponent's penalty area. Take a look at this photo, I'm going crazy as I look at the photo. There is a huge void in the area where Reus is, but he doesn't even try to run into that void.

There is no team instruction I haven't tried, there is no formation I haven't tried. I take a look at the tactics that publishers are making and see that these roles work for them, but why don't they work for my tactics?

I'm instructing my team to "play narrow" so I'm aiming for my IF and Raumdaters playing on the wing to run more from the centre, but it doesn't work.
On the contrary, I instruct my team to "play wide" so I try to stretch the opponent's defenders and create space, but that doesn't work either.

[Drikcey75]

Hi @ObeLisk, if i understand well, you want to Reus to run from the right side to the box? Right?
but as i can see on the picture, he's close to the offside line so he won't move up  more to stay in the area.. Then if he has "stay wider" he will keep wide when he hasn't the ball and cut inside with the ball in his feet.

I don't remember but are Raum roles not supposed to cut inside when the ball is in the box to finish as a Poacher?

[Cloud9]

1 hour ago, ObeLisk said:

What is the problem with these roles? In no way do they run into the opponent's penalty area. Take a look at this photo, I'm going crazy as I look at the photo. There is a huge void in the area where Reus is, but he doesn't even try to run into that void.

There is no team instruction I haven't tried, there is no formation I haven't tried. I take a look at the tactics that publishers are making and see that these roles work for them, but why don't they work for my tactics?

I'm instructing my team to "play narrow" so I'm aiming for my IF and Raumdaters playing on the wing to run more from the centre, but it doesn't work.
On the contrary, I instruct my team to "play wide" so I try to stretch the opponent's defenders and create space, but that doesn't work either.

Reus gets to float around and do whatever he wants to as a RMD which I think is your frustration.

If you want him to run into the opposition area, try an IF. 

Edited March 30, 2023 by Cloud9

[Drikcey75]

also, what are Reuss Traits, and did you try be more "discipline" (don't know if it's like that in english)

in a Raum Positionn, the player use to try to get frogotten by the opponent to appear behind them in the box, i think this is what Reuss try to do

[Hilly1979]

The raumdeuter needs space to run into, your pressing forward on attack is occupying the space he needs to be operating in.

The Raumdeuter works best when the striker is creating space for him like a false 9 or DLF

 

[ObeLisk]

1 saat önce, Cloud9 said:

Reus gets to float around and do whatever he wants to as a RMD which I think is your frustration.

If you want him to run into the opposition area, try an IF. 

Is that Raumdater's mission?

I don't know if the link is shared on this page, but could you please take a look at this.

Reus did not go in until our attack was over and he always wanted to stay wide, but Müller, who plays the role of RMD in the video I shared this link, tries to enter the penalty area at every opportunity. Is the only reason he can do this because someone plays the F9 role of the forward? Reus has the ability to "Move into channels", while Müller does not.

Reus acted like a playmaker throughout the game.

I also tried it in the role of IF (S/A), the result does not change.

1 saat önce, Drikcey75 said:

also, what are Reuss Traits, and did you try be more "discipline" (don't know if it's like that in english)

in a Raum Positionn, the player use to try to get frogotten by the opponent to appear behind them in the box, i think this is what Reuss try to do

I've tried all the instructions you can think of play narrow, play wide, take more risks, roam from positions etc.

A few seconds before the first picture I shared. He's trying to play in a wide field too much.

39 dakika önce, Hilly1979 said:

The raumdeuter needs space to run into, your pressing forward on attack is occupying the space he needs to be operating in.

The Raumdeuter works best when the striker is creating space for him like a false 9 or DLF

 

Can't Reus run into this "HUGE" space? Can only one player playing the role of PF prevent this?

[Drikcey75]

il y a 21 minutes, ObeLisk a dit :

A few seconds before the first picture I shared. He's trying to play in a wide field too much.

he def thinks he is a winger ^^
does he have a trait which can explain this?

[ObeLisk]

5 dakika önce, Drikcey75 said:

he def thinks he is a winger ^^
does he have a trait which can explain this?

He only has move into channels, play one-twos and likes to round keeper traits.

[Poison]

You want him to be off-side? Sometimes attackers do it though, then someone else comes up from deep. I've only seen it in strikers in FM mainly I think. It makes more sense for the central forward to make this run anyway I think, but not sure.

[ObeLisk]

18 dakika önce, Poison said:

You want him to be off-side? Sometimes attackers do it though, then someone else comes up from deep. I've only seen it in strikers in FM mainly I think. It makes more sense for the central forward to make this run anyway I think, but not sure.

Of course I don't want it to go offside, I just find it unreasonable for someone playing RMD to be this wide. It needs to stay in a slightly narrower area, but it doesn't do that.

It is irrational for Reus to stay in such a large area when the opponent has created such a big space in the defense. Frankly, I don't think the striker, who only plays as a PF, will prevent Reus from running.

The thing that makes me think the most is that computer-controlled teams can attack many players in the same area with the tactics they use, so this is something that is possible, but I can't. There is probably a problem with the tactic but no matter what I do I can't figure it out.

Edited March 30, 2023 by ObeLisk

[Poison]

3 minutes ago, ObeLisk said:

Of course I don't want it to go offside, I just find it unreasonable for someone playing RMD to be this wide. It needs to stay in a slightly narrower area, but it doesn't do that.

It is irrational for Reus to stay in such a large area when the opponent has created such a big gap in the defense. Frankly, I don't think the striker, who only plays as a PF, will prevent Reus from running.

The thing that makes me think the most is that computer-controlled teams can attack many players in the same area with the tactics they use, so this is something that is possible, but I can't. There is probably a problem with the tactic but no matter what I do I can't figure it out.

That's probably width, set it to a  narrower option or you could try "focus passing on the left/right" to give the mentality there a slight boost. Btw he looks perfectly positioned to me

[Drikcey75]

seems like in thoses pictures your team tend to regroup on the right side of the pitch, do you use "focus play" ?
This TI set a pressure on one flank and at the same time create space on the other, which combinated with roam from position of the RMD could affect as stay wide aka where there is space

[Johnny Ace]

Only things I can say on the Raumdeuter:

1) Put in a bug report if you think the role's not working

2) Use another role instead 

I used the RMD loads in FM22, it was a fantastic role that did exactly what you expect from it, I cannot for the life of me get it to perform anything like I could last year. It stays way too wide for my liking and moves infield way too late on in an attacking move (as @ObeLiskhas discovered)

I'd advise giving the wide Advanced Playmaker on Attack a try instead 

For the Inside Forward, I'm not complaining

[davidbarros2]

Having using the ramdeuter to great effect since FM17, I definetely feel the same about this year.

He seems always too wide and only cuts inside really late in the moves...

[Andrew Marines]

And again, i gotta link this thread 

this extends to RMD too

[ObeLisk]

1 saat önce, Andrew Marines said:

And again, i gotta link this thread 

this extends to RMD too

Obviously, in this game, you can make players do whatever you want (at least many things in your mind), but you can't because you don't know the algorithm of the game.

As I said above, since all computer-managed teams know this algorithm, what instruction and role does what, and how it is used, opposing teams can do many things better.

I am looking at the summary of the matches played by Manchester City in the game, the players can stay in very large areas and suddenly run to the center (it doesn't matter whether the opponent's defense is crowded or not), so it is possible to do this in the game, but I don't know how.

If I had a league for tactical testing, I could try more easily, but unfortunately I couldn't find such a thing. How can I find such a league, does anyone know?

[Johnny Ace]

The AI has access to what we have so their selection or roles and duties will be affected the same as ours

Man City are Man City with top class players, they're better at finding space than an average player

6 minutes ago, ObeLisk said:

If I had a league for tactical testing, I could try more easily, but unfortunately I couldn't find such a thing. How can I find such a league, does anyone know?

Start a save with Man City to try it out, observe how their wide attackers move  

[Captain_T]

vor 16 Stunden schrieb Johnny Ace:

Only things I can say on the Raumdeuter:

1) Put in a bug report if you think the role's not working

2) Use another role instead 

I used the RMD loads in FM22, it was a fantastic role that did exactly what you expect from it, I cannot for the life of me get it to perform anything like I could last year. It stays way too wide for my liking and moves infield way too late on in an attacking move (as @ObeLiskhas discovered)

I'd advise giving the wide Advanced Playmaker on Attack a try instead 

For the Inside Forward, I'm not complaining

Hello Johnny,

so do you think Inside Forward is working quite well in FM23?

[Johnny Ace]

1 minute ago, Captain_T said:

Hello Johnny,

so do you think Inside Forward is working quite well in FM23?

I've had no problem with it to be honest 

[Captain_T]

vor 14 Minuten schrieb Johnny Ace:

I've had no problem with it to be honest 

So the conclusion could be to play Reus as IF. The only thing comes to my mind, that he could be too slow. I don't know his skills exactly, bit I think he is more a playmaker (but with good shooting skills).

[Johnny Ace]

4 minutes ago, Captain_T said:

So the conclusion could be to play Reus as IF. The only thing comes to my mind, that he could be too slow. I don't know his skills exactly, bit I think he is more a playmaker (but with good shooting skills).

In that case, I'd use him as wide Advanced Playmaker on Attack, if he's capable, I'm not familiar with his profile either 

You could also try him as a Trequartista or an Inverted Winger on Attack and note his movement within the team and stick with the one you prefer

[bielsadidnothingwrong]

Why are you expecting him to run into the penalty area when the ball isn't out of the progression phase? IIRC, raumdeuters are "wide poachers" who sit out wide and don't involve themselves much with anything until the final 3d. 

 

In your screenshot, it is way too early for him to be running and he's still holding width waiting for his opportunity. 

[Cloud9]

On 31/03/2023 at 05:17, Captain_T said:

So the conclusion could be to play Reus as IF. The only thing comes to my mind, that he could be too slow. I don't know his skills exactly, bit I think he is more a playmaker (but with good shooting skills).

Checked out his stats and surprised by what they've given him. Surprisingly low playmaking, dribbling, mobility/pace. 

Overall his mental and technical attributes are crazy good for end product (18 off the ball, 16 composure, 15 anticipation, 16 finishing, 16 first touch). 

I would seriously consider utilizing him as a Poacher. I'd keep the Winger on the right and move Reus to a striker partnership w Martinez who can do the heavy lifting (PFs, shorter passing) while Reus bangs the goals in. It will also unlock De Ketelaere who can swing out left into the open space as a Mezzala(a) for crazy good ratings.

Edited April 2, 2023 by Cloud9