suggestions on how to play a geriatric Messi in a counter attacking side?

[fraudiola]

managed to snag a 38 yr old messi on a free transfer for probably his last season. problem is we're a 442 counter attacking side...

 

side note: this signing has also messed up our wage structure with messi eating up 100k of our wage budget, now everyone wants a raise lol

[Jack722]

defo wouldn't play messi on the right of a 442, i reckon he'd have to be one of the strikers purely just to not have to defend. Maybe a treq

Edited May 1, 2023 by Jack722

[Cloud9]

4 hours ago, fraudiola said:

managed to snag a 38 yr old messi on a free transfer for probably his last season. problem is we're a 442 counter attacking side...

 

side note: this signing has also messed up our wage structure with messi eating up 100k of our wage budget, now everyone wants a raise lol

You'll struggle with him in a counter attacking setup since he can't hold up the ball, win it back or run forward at all. Definitely tick "play for set pieces" if you're going to use him. If you want to keep a 4-4-2,  stick him up front as a T or as a WP and ask him to spray balls from there.  

There's not enough players making attacking runs forward to benefit from his ability to pass. I would suggest moving the W(s) to W(a). Lose the PF(a). An AF is far more effective in a low lines system. I would also get rid of the IWB.

I would also switch to a mid block as it will lessen your distance to goal. 

 

Edited May 1, 2023 by Cloud9

[Justified]

He's not going to last very long on the pitch with that Stamina. Impact player I'd say. If your TM isn't having a good game it could be good to throw Messi on with 20-30 mins remaining up front.

[Cloud9]

12 hours ago, fraudiola said:

we're very reliant on the TM winning headers from goalkicks etc. and scoring from set pieces and my PF scores a lot....

it'll have to be somewhere in midfield, doesn't have to be 442. i think 433 would be ideal with messi as one of the midfield 3 but i have no idea on how to set up considering we're generally considered underdogs and my underdog tactics are all 442 based. 

my key midfielders: 

From a tactical point of view, the AF is just much stronger than a PF in a low block counter system. 

They do similar things when the PF is on attack, so he will still get goals, however it means you are less of a threat on the counter attack against a proper team. 

Edited May 2, 2023 by Cloud9

[Johnny Ace]

I'd just sell him tbh, he doesn't fit the team and he's screwed up your wage budget  

He'd make a great Enganche but it just wouldn't fit all 

[Andros]

The thing that really stands out to me is that this is a counter attacking tactic with a target man.  so that suggests to me that every time you get the ball it will be lumped up to that target man completely bypassing Messi as the wide midfielder.  With messi's work rate and stamina, he would rarely see the ball. 

 

My thoughts would be to redesign this tactic but start with messi and how you would want him to play.  I would suggest you might want him to be the focal point, like get the ball forward as quickly as possible to him and just tell him to do something with it.

 

These days, based on the amazing article here, I try to get my players in the attacking phase to look like this: 

So essentially 1 player attacking the goal, 2 out wide, 2 in the centre with 2 providing support and 3 defending. 

The first thing I would do with your tactic is think about where messi would fit in.  I would suggest playing him centrally with a role that is a ball magnet (the playmaker roles).  Perhaps a Trequartista or an enganche:

 

Next I would build around him.  You need someone for messi to feed, I would get rid of the Pressing forward in a counter attack as he would likely be pressing on his own (the others would be sitting back, and messi doing nothing) so I would change Djuka to an advanced forward.  I do not know who you have in the team beyond the starters, so I will also keep Nuno in but remove the target forward role as I want messi to be the focal point.  

Next I like to focus on my width.  You seem to have a few Left midfielders so I would keep that, and an attacking RB.  So I will use those for the width. (ignore the other positions, there is nowhere else i can put them on that website!).  I am not sure of either of the duties, but that would be my start point.

 

 

So now we have the 5 advanced roles taken care of (roughly) and now i am looking to the support roles.  I see you are using an IWB for LB.  I am not sure why so this may break down a bit.  If this player is like a CM playing at LB, then I would keep that role and duty as it can act as one of the support roles.  The other support role can be the other CM as you have one young player you like.  I am not sure what to do with that role, so I will keep it as a CMS as I worry that a BWM might not be ideal in a counter attacking style, but i could be wrong there.  I would also consider a carrilero as it can give support to the right side.  

 

You have a DLP so maybe keep that as the most defensive midfielder, you can use this person to get the ball forward quickly.  This will leave me something like this: (again I am not 100% on the roles and duties, just showing you my thought process)

 

With the roles and duties doing these functions:

 

Having done all that, I do wonder if it would be better to remove one of the strikers and move them back, as you are working on a counter attacking tactic so it might be better to have more behind the ball.  That could change my aim to something like this:

 

You could have an extra in DM, or reduce the attacking capabilities of the RFB and add a Rmid, or another CM, or an extra CB and use players in the WB strata.  Just brainstorming.

 

Anyway, TLDR: I don't think your current tactic will get anything out of messi as the team will just bypass him.  Try to think about building the team around him and see what you can come up with.