Turnover of possession in dangerous areas, weak up front

[KlaaZ]

Hi. I'm currently in 2028 with Nancy and have been overperforming in the Ligue 1, playing in Europe for the last two years. However, this year I'm running into serious issues that I just can't seem to fix. I used to be really stable defensively (conceded 35/25/22 in my three seasons in the Ligue 1), but now we're five games in and I've already conceded nine. My problem seems to be two fold.

1) My press isn't working. My players are always too far away from their opponent, which means they can easily play from underneath the press as they have plenty of time to assess their option. I've tried both aggressive pressing and standing off more, but to no avail. My opponents on the other side do manage that kind of press, giving my players very little time on the ball which makes it that we often misplace passes and don't really create much chances.

2) On the other end, my players often lose possession due to sloppy passing in our own half (usually center back to full back or center back to midfielder), leading to quick turnovers, balls behind the defense and goals conceded. I've tried not playing out of defense, a deeper line and standing off more, but that doesn't fix the issue.

The idea is a fairly simple one. Through buildup from the back, try to either get the AP on the ball or have the WB overlap on the right. The striker will mostly drop deeper to link play, which whould then open up space for the runners (mainly the MEZ and the IF, but also the BBM).

[Andrew Marines]

Could you add a few screenshots of those issues?

[KlaaZ]

24 minutes ago, Andrew Marines said:

Could you add a few screenshots of those issues?

One example of my game against PSG. Best team in the league, I know, but it's similar as to what I see happening on a regular basis.

My left central defender is on the ball. My DM is not available because closely marked. The two other midfielders are (too) high up field, might need to get rid of the BBM. I would expect that one to come deep, then run, but apparently no.

Either way, Mukiele plays the only ball he can, left to Montoia. Completely unmarked, in acres of space.

Montoia drives up, plays a 1-2 with the man in front of him, but then gets pressed into trouble. The logical step would be to clear it down the line, as there is a lot of space for the MEZ. 

Instead however, he turns back and play a ball to Mukiele. However, it's too short and the 15 of PSG intercepts.

He drives up the ball, plays in striker Tissier. 

My DM Kaba is back to press Tissier, but he just plays a short pass back to Sambi Lokonga, who now has a gazillion options. Send Tissier into space would be the best best bet, but..

He picks out Mbappé instead, who luckily for us shoots instead of just playing the short cross to Tissier. Goalkeeper saves.

[KlaaZ]

Here's another one that I run into regularly. Two crosses from deep, no pressure on the ball, nobody tracking their marker, easy tap in.

FC Metz v Nancy.pkm

[Andrew Marines]

1 ora fa, KlaaZ ha scritto:

Montoia drives up, plays a 1-2 with the man in front of him, but then gets pressed into trouble. The logical step would be to clear it down the line, as there is a lot of space for the MEZ. 

You can see the issue here.

Your DM is not helping in any way your possession. Okay it's marked but he should still move a bit to open up lanes.
Second Thing second, Love the fact you're using an AP but in that case, you don't need a fullback. You can let him go forward from the beginning. Your AP will help with the possession when the team needs it and the defense will have issues holding that attacker too.

If you change to a wingback for example watch out for the third problem: Left midfielder could occupy the same space of the AP. Watch out for that

[Andrew Marines]

There are a lot of ways you can try to manage this. I'd try with.

DM-D->DM-S or DLP-D

FB-S to Wb-S

AP-s->Tre(stay narrower)

Mez-A->Car.

 

If you wanna keep the FB on support and the mezzala

 

Fb-S stay narrower

Ap-s -> Ap-A with stay wider

Mez-A

Edited June 15, 2023 by Andrew Marines

[Cloud9]

7 hours ago, KlaaZ said:

Hi. I'm currently in 2028 with Nancy and have been overperforming in the Ligue 1, playing in Europe for the last two years. However, this year I'm running into serious issues that I just can't seem to fix. I used to be really stable defensively (conceded 35/25/22 in my three seasons in the Ligue 1), but now we're five games in and I've already conceded nine. My problem seems to be two fold.

1) My press isn't working. My players are always too far away from their opponent, which means they can easily play from underneath the press as they have plenty of time to assess their option. I've tried both aggressive pressing and standing off more, but to no avail. My opponents on the other side do manage that kind of press, giving my players very little time on the ball which makes it that we often misplace passes and don't really create much chances.

2) On the other end, my players often lose possession due to sloppy passing in our own half (usually center back to full back or center back to midfielder), leading to quick turnovers, balls behind the defense and goals conceded. I've tried not playing out of defense, a deeper line and standing off more, but that doesn't fix the issue.

The idea is a fairly simple one. Through buildup from the back, try to either get the AP on the ball or have the WB overlap on the right. The striker will mostly drop deeper to link play, which whould then open up space for the runners (mainly the MEZ and the IF, but also the BBM).

You need to put pressure back on the opposition, via runs/passing options and the starting positions of your players. 

• Defensively you're sitting deep and inviting too much pressure. I wouldn't go back behind a mid defensive line. This will also help your press by making your players more compact, and reduce errors leading to goals.
• If the pressing isn't working, go more narrow  to make the players more compact (again). You'll need to combine this with more structured roles.
  • The front three will do very little/no defensive effort w/their roles and you've got a a double roamer midfield combo that provides very little foundation for a structured press. Your CF is also roaming, so he may not be applying appropriate pressure on their backline like an AF would.  

5 hours ago, KlaaZ said:

My DM Kaba is back to press Tissier, but he just plays a short pass back to Sambi Lokonga, who now has a gazillion options. Send Tissier into space would be the best best bet, but..

 

• Are you asking individual players to take more risks in their PIs? You don't have pass into space as a team instruction, so you're asking the players to keep possession with Shorter + Play Out From the Back. If you want better passing options, go into the PIs and tell your players to "Play it short" vs "More direct" via the passing meters. 

7 hours ago, KlaaZ said:

2) On the other end, my players often lose possession due to sloppy passing in our own half (usually center back to full back or center back to midfielder), leading to quick turnovers, balls behind the defense and goals conceded. I've tried not playing out of defense, a deeper line and standing off more, but that doesn't fix the issue.

 

• Changing the low defensive line, the passing instructions, and a striker capable of putting pressure on the backline will help with turnovers, and also help you score yourself. Getting rid of Play Out from the Back will also help and make you more dangerous in possession.

Edited June 15, 2023 by Cloud9

[Johnny Ace]

I think your tactic is screaming out for a Defensive Midfielder on Support @KlaaZ

A FB and Wingback on Support is nothing crazy, bumping him from Defend to Support will help things out. He'll push closer to your centre midfielders to help you keep possession and keep them more as a unit when trying to win the ball back. The bump in mentality will have him make more positive passes for the team, on Defend he'll be thinking safety first with his pass choice, on Support he'll be more forward thinking

He's still a DM, he'll still drop back and defend infront of the back 4 and defend like a DM 

[KlaaZ]

Thanks for all the input already! Had two easier games to implement some changes with very satisfying results before running into a freak result against Reims but even there, I'm very happy with the way we played. We just didn't finish our chances and they scored from a headed away corner volley.