Playing out with a half-back (4-3-3). Any success?

[whatsupdoc]

Whenever I use a half-back it messes up playing out. Just wondering if anyone has had success using one and what passing length and roles were used.

[whatsupdoc]

I'll take that as a no

 

I think it's pretty buggy. Using a half back makes the CMs in front of him drop very deep as well in my experience. 

[crusadertsar]

No it's not buggy. It works how it's supposed to. You just need to set up the tactic to suit the role. I like to create 3-2-5 shape in attack. Meaning I have two IWBs coming into DM space while HB drops back to join CBs. At same time I ask my two CMs to be more aggressive and act like Free 8s. Usually AP(a) and Mez(s). Two IW(s) on flanks with instruction to stay wider. DLF(a) in middle. Works well just as expected.

Edited December 19, 2023 by crusadertsar

[whatsupdoc]

50 minutes ago, crusadertsar said:

No it's not buggy. It works how it's supposed to. You just need to set up the tactic to suit the role. I like to create 3-2-5 shape in attack. Meaning I have two IWB coming into DM space while HB drops back to join CBs. At same time I ask my two CMs to be more aggressive and act like Free 8s. Usually AP(a) and Mez(s). Two IW(s) on flanks with instruction to stay wider. DLF(a) in middle. Works well just as expected.

 

😂

Dani Alves at barca? 

There's no reason a HB should need two IWBs. The purpose of it is to create numerical superiority and stability at the back and free the FBs to push on in whatever way suits them. 

The issue I find bugged with it is an AP(a) will often drop level with the HB early during the build up. Especially if you have shorter passing. 

Edited December 19, 2023 by whatsupdoc

[crusadertsar]

4 minutes ago, whatsupdoc said:

 

😂

Dani Alves at barca? 

There's no reason a HB should need two IWBs. The purpose of it is to create numerical superiority and stability at the back and free the FBs to push on in whatever way suits them. 

The issue I find bugged with it is an AP(a) will often drop level with the HB early during the build up. Especially if you have shorter passing. 

Dunno but you should definitely look closer at your player traits and team instructions. It's not what I'm seeing at all. And this type of 433 seems to work for many other people. If anything Positional Play like this is a bit overpowered right now. 

[whatsupdoc]

26 minutes ago, crusadertsar said:

Dunno but you should definitely look closer at your player traits and team instructions. It's not what I'm seeing at all. And this type of 433 seems to work for many other people. If anything Positional Play like this is a bit overpowered right now. 

Unfortunately the 10 ("advanced playmaker") is hard-coded to come short when he is on the near (ball) side. Regardless of attack or support duty or PPMs.

The mezzala replicates the normal positioning of a 10 better than an advanced playmaker.

Anyway, it's the opposite of what they should do according to positional principles.

Similar thing often happens with FBs. They often will come short into the CBs space, cramping everything instead of stretching the opponent.

I'm currently testing what impact having more direct passing has on the way they position themselves. 

Edited December 19, 2023 by whatsupdoc

[JIPI1]

Does he have any PPM?

Just by being a playmaker role he's already prone to try and come near to the ball.

[whatsupdoc]

12 minutes ago, JIPI1 said:

Does he have any PPM?

Just by being a playmaker role he's already prone to try and come near to the ball.

No relevant PPMs. As I said it's hard-coded. 

Personally I'd expect an ADVANCED playmaker to behave differently and I think it's probably mis-named if that's the intended behaviour. 

The correct behaviour would be for the 10 to stay high and allow the 3 players +GK to beat the 2 forwards with short passing or carrying the ball out. Unfortunately if you put short passing or advanced playmaker on it seems to suck players towards the ball in anti-positional ways. 

Edited December 19, 2023 by whatsupdoc

[Dr Naysay]

The HB is one of the most dynamic roles in the game. It all depends who you surround him with and the roles you give those players.

[jc577]

On 19/12/2023 at 14:09, whatsupdoc said:

The mezzala replicates the normal positioning of a 10 better than an advanced playmaker.

Agreed on this. I'd like to see different behaviour from an AP, staying a higher to take advantage of the deep build up, with the ability to drop in if necessary.