[Suggestion] Rethinking both the attribute system and training

[tezcatlipoca665]

This is reformatted from a post I made in the Football Manager 2024 Official Feedback Thread (along with some mixed ideas others had in the same thread). It might be a little bit messy to read, but the ideas tie into one another:

I think the idea of player attributes, as they exist now, should be reconsidered altogether. The number system is messy and kind of outdated imo. In general I feel like the 'attributes' should be more like observations by coaching staff/scouts (this is could also be a way to move the confusing star rating system along, since a lot of people seem to take that as gospel and not the opinion of staff). One big problem I've always had with the attributes in general is how they're kind of useless in terms of representation. If a player has 17 Finishing but isn't taking their chances, and is a poor goal scorer overall because of other factors such as Composure, Decisions, Technique etc. not being at adequate levels, then what good is it telling me they're a good finisher? They're clearly not since the other factors hinder it, so what is finishing really telling anybody, considering the bottlenecks? It might be a better idea to consolidate/remove some of the attribute listings and try to simplify things where possible, so we don't just have a mass of numbers.

I think it'd be a great idea to use training to help show how the players are performing, since this is really how a lot of managers assess who makes it into the first team squad and how good players are at certain things (as well as the actual matches, obviously). I don't mean with training reports like 'so and so performed well in training' along a number, as it works now - I mean maybe seeing the actual training itself in the new match engine on a training field so we can see who's passing well, tackling well, taking set pieces well, shooting training, etc. during drills. For people that think it sounds tedious to watch the players train, you could probably just delegate this and get a basic report from the assistant manager or something, like 'Striker A's shot accuracy: ___%' and whatever else. I mean, some managers irl don't like being involved with training at all, so it's not unrealistic to just have your coaching staff do all the work and be labelled more as a man-manager or something. It'd be much more immersive to look at your players up close that way.

Anyway, I'm sure it'd require *a lot* of work to make such an overhaul of the database and how the game functions, but I do genuinely feel like this series could benefit from redoing a lot of core things and keeping things as simple as possible from there.

[Enzu225]

3 hours ago, tezcatlipoca665 said:

If a player has 17 Finishing but isn't taking their chances, and is a poor goal scorer overall because of other factors such as Composure, Decisions, Technique etc. not being at adequate levels, then what good is it telling me they're a good finisher

Finishing only means shooting accuracy, nothing more. It is a technical ability. If the player has low composure then he panics and makes mistakes, while technique is important for finishing if the player has not yet 'killed the ball', such as in situations where the player is running or hits a volley.

[tezcatlipoca665]

2 minutes ago, Enzu225 said:

Finishing only means shooting accuracy, nothing more. It is a technical ability. If the player has low composure then he panics and makes mistakes, while technique is important for finishing if the player has not yet 'killed the ball', such as in situations where the player is running or hits a volley.

I'd argue you can't really tell if somebody has good shooting accuracy if they don't ever prove that they do, which is why I think it shouldn't even be shown in the game. That's what I'm getting at when I'm talking about the attributes and the numbers not being very helpful. I've personally started ignoring attributes more and more and looking mostly at player statistics and performance ratings, but it's very difficult and long-winded to play that way in the game with how stats are currently presented. It definitely makes a difference though.

[boey]

On 05/01/2024 at 21:09, tezcatlipoca665 said:

I'd argue you can't really tell if somebody has good shooting accuracy if they don't ever prove that they do, which is why I think it shouldn't even be shown in the game.

You can see how well a player finishes in training, where there is little pressure to perform. Shooting drills can easily isolate a player's ability down to a few skills, like Finishing, Technique.

In a match, a player's goal scoring ability does not only rely on such skills, as composure, anticipation, off-the-ball etc. are needed to perform under pressure and get into the necessary attacking positions. That's the idea behind the attribute system.

Quote

I've personally started ignoring attributes more and more and looking mostly at player statistics and performance ratings, but it's very difficult and long-winded to play that way in the game with how stats are currently presented. It definitely makes a difference though.

You can download attribute-less skins, and play in that manner. It's a completely valid way to play, although the stats could be more in-depth.

I kind of agree that the numbers don't really mean much, but it's a video game. You can't expect the majority of your player base to launch the game and work as professional data analysts and scouts to sign some virtual footballers.

[Zachary Whyte]

Thank you for the detailed suggestion and feedback, we will put this under consideration.