In transition vs approach play

[Jack722]

If you want to create a defensive team that mostly plays on the counter, do you have to go direct and high tempo, or does ticking the ‘counter’ button in transition suffice?

[Cloud9]

1 hour ago, Jack722 said:

If you want to create a defensive team that mostly plays on the counter, do you have to go direct and high tempo, or does ticking the ‘counter’ button in transition suffice?

I generally utilize a combination of both.

The team will naturally launch counter attacks without counter ticked, but you will see your players do so more frequently with it on. The same goes for Pass into Space. Factoring in the mentality of your counter is another important factor as you start to play around with things. 

On passing directness and tempo, that depends on how quickly you'd like to transition the ball in your counter attacks. Leaving the sliders in the middle is another option, although an up tempo counter attack I would recommend for most approaches  

Edited September 15 by Cloud9

[bosque]

I read a lot of times in the forum that when the counter is on (AI generated), everything is maxed out as if the mentality was in Very Attacking. So I have this doubt: If I tick the Counter instruction, every attacking transition will be maxed out?

[Jack722]

1 hour ago, bosque said:

I read a lot of times in the forum that when the counter is on (AI generated), everything is maxed out as if the mentality was in Very Attacking. So I have this doubt: If I tick the Counter instruction, every attacking transition will be maxed out?

I've heard this too, In FM23 I used to assume this and therefore left a lot of the in possession sliders blank if I was trying to play purely on the counter as a weaker team. But in FM24 I have experiented with playing high tempo and direct in possession instructions and I get some lovely counter attacks as well as counter-pressing (gegenpressing) goals. I'm wondering now if it's to do with the instructions or more to do with the different Match engine.

[caco4003]

hace 20 horas, Cloud9 dijo:

I generally utilize a combination of both.

The team will naturally launch counter attacks without counter ticked, but you will see your players do so more frequently with it on. The same goes for Pass into Space. Factoring in the mentality of your counter is another important factor as you start to play around with things. 

On passing directness and tempo, that depends on how quickly you'd like to transition the ball in your counter attacks. Leaving the sliders in the middle is another option, although an up tempo counter attack I would recommend for most approaches  

Do you think direct passes with a slow tempo would work? the slow tempo basically is to give enoigh time for the team to get enough players forward to execute the counter

[Jakey8]

I did try “slightly mired direct” and down a notch on tempo but had inconsistent results. It mainly let teams settle into the block meaning it was less effective as a countering tactic. I’ve tried making my team more “structured” and that has worked well as the players on attack duty seem to have more urgency. 

[Cloud9]

8 hours ago, Jakey8 said:

I did try “slightly mired direct” and down a notch on tempo but had inconsistent results. It mainly let teams settle into the block meaning it was less effective as a countering tactic. I’ve tried making my team more “structured” and that has worked well as the players on attack duty seem to have more urgency. 

I wouldn't play counter attack against teams who are playing a block against you! If they're sitting back as well you may look to make some tactical tweaks to influence the game more. 

9 hours ago, caco4003 said:

Do you think direct passes with a slow tempo would work? the slow tempo basically is to give enoigh time for the team to get enough players forward to execute the counter

Counter attacking with low tempo sounds unfortunate. I would just leave the tempo on slightly higher and put the passing bar in the middle. Running a mentality like balanced can see more measured attacks (compared to a Positive/Attacking counter). 

One of the first things I look at when setting up a tactic is: How do I score goals? With a counter attack that tends to be an athletic frontline who can threaten the opposition when they have the ball. I would feel very comfortable playing a possession tactic against a side looking to counter attack slowly against us. 

Edited Monday at 21:32 by Cloud9

[Jakey8]

10 hours ago, Cloud9 said:

I wouldn't play counter attack against teams who are playing a block against you! If they're sitting back as well you may look to make some tactical tweaks to influence the game more. 

i get what you’re saying completely but I like to set my team up with a low line so it brings the opposition out of there block and forces them too build up. I tweak game to game but the principles are the same. 
 

i could definitely be more effective and put the pressure on lesser teams like you imply though. I’m just trying to keep the identity the same is all. 

[Robson 07]

On 16/09/2024 at 13:27, caco4003 said:

Do you think direct passes with a slow tempo would work? the slow tempo basically is to give enoigh time for the team to get enough players forward to execute the counter

Direct passes are more vertical by nature.  This would be useful for counter attacks.

Tempo is about speed of decision & action.  Low tempo equates to meaning more touches i.e. dwelling on the ball.  High tempo is the opposite and it helps make you press-resistant.  Although a low tempo invites in the press (something you may want but it is dangerous), it will slow transitions. 

[toshimitzou1]

Look mate. I'm averaging 38% possession and top of the league with Stoke City. Identify when and where you can win the ball back and situate LOE and DL accordingly.

Eg: I play three big lumps up top who cannot run for toffee. However, my midfield two can run - I tell the front three to mark tighter, set a mid- block and tell my to cm's to close down more.

In effect, I let them move into the middle of the pitch then harry them whilst blocking their defenders.

They run out of ideas.

All Balanced and standard tempo. I regroup and never use counter (useless instruction for measured defending).

I'm writing up a thread atm. Check it out when it's done.