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Any chance to learn the tactic of Arsenal?

Sirjason

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Tom R.

Tom R.

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Posted

Yes, It's Default AI Arsenal Tactic!!

I'm grab her from save match's Arsenal(AI)-Chelsea(AI) and Arsenal(AI)-Liverpool(AI).

Then I'm use this tactic with MU.

====================================================================================================

2Nitewalk

Save anyone match (filename.pkm) on PC, then Start TacGrab and Load this match, then push on "=>" button and Save on PC tactic (filename.tac), then Load this tactic in game.

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Maz

Maz

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Posted
Yes, It's Default AI Arsenal Tactic!!

I'm grab her from save match's Arsenal(AI)-Chelsea(AI) and Arsenal(AI)-Liverpool(AI).

Then I'm use this tactic with MU.

====================================================================================================

2Nitewalk

Save anyone match (filename.pkm) on PC, then Start TacGrab and Load this match, then push on "=>" button and Save on PC tactic (filename.tac), then Load this tactic in game.

after loading the tactic in FM plz note it should take about 5 - 9 games before it works properly.

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pjtopor

pjtopor

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I tried this just for grins with a long-term save I have going and I'll tell you, its remarkable that it works. It does not follow any established tactical routines as touted on these boards, but its quite effective. I now use this in rotation with a few of my other 4-4-2 tactics. Its particularly strong against big teams.

I don't vouch for it beyond that, as I have quite a strong squad, but from a bit of empirical evidence, it looks like the default Arsenal tactic is a winner.

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leedsforever

leedsforever

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I've got some results with my Arsenal team:

Overall:

Played: 23

Won: 13

Drew: 9

Lost: 1

Goals For: 39

Goals Against: 39

Individual Games:

(With 'A' and 'H' representing 'Away' and 'Home' games)

Olympiakos A - 2-0

Chelsea H - 0-1

Fulham H - 2-1

West Brom A - 3-2

Everton A - 1-1

Juventus H - 1-1

Man City H - 3-1

Everton A - 2-1

Sporting CP A - 2-2

Bolton A - 1-0

Wigan A - 0-0

Newcastle H - 3-0

Tottenham H - 2-1

Middlesbrough A - 1-1

Cheltenham A - 2-1 (Used reserves)

Newcastle H - 2-0

Fulham H - 1-0

Aston Villa A - 2-2

Stoke H - 3-0

Newcastle A - 2-2 (Used reserves)

Millwall H - 2-0 (Used reserves)

Liverpool H - 1-1

Man Utd A - 1-1

My general assessment of this tactic is that it produces quite good results against good/mid-table sides. However, it seems to struggle against weaker opponents as highlighted in the 'West Brom A - 3-2' and 'Wigan A - 0-0' games. I usually struggle against the 'top 4' but going attacking seems to pin them back and surprise them to a certain extent. Overall, I would say that the results produced are 'realistic' as Arsenal do struggle with consistency problems in real life and they aren't the best in the Premiership (which is also proven in my game as I am 4th, but only 9 points from top with 25 games played).

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moj

moj

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Posted
I tried this just for grins with a long-term save I have going and I'll tell you, its remarkable that it works. It does not follow any established tactical routines as touted on these boards, but its quite effective. I now use this in rotation with a few of my other 4-4-2 tactics. Its particularly strong against big teams.

I don't vouch for it beyond that, as I have quite a strong squad, but from a bit of empirical evidence, it looks like the default Arsenal tactic is a winner.

it certainly does follow the some of the frameworks

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Sirjason

Sirjason

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I rather surprised that that WENGER is using an attacking formation in all away matches.

In meantime @Tom R., do you know if this tacgrabber only gets the tactic the teams starts to the match ?

cause WENGER is making changes rapidly during the game.

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moj

moj

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I rather surprised that that WENGER is using an attacking formation in all away matches.

In meantime @Tom R., do you know if this tacgrabber only gets the tactic the teams starts to the match ?

cause WENGER is making changes rapidly during the game.

i doubt he uses an attacking formation all the time, but ive never seen him use a tactic different than the 4-4-2.. must change the forward runs, etc..

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Mitja

Mitja

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Can anybody tell me, is this the ai arsenal tactic?

if that is true it's how AI plays than it's a major disapointmemt for me...all team instructions, no free roles, no TT&F roles - all players on mixed, except DCs...very disapointing!!!

what's the point tweaking, setting individual instructions and having mentality framework. just put everything on team...i hope it's not true!!

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moj

moj

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if that is true it's how AI plays than it's a major disapointmemt for me...all team instructions, no free roles, no TT&F roles - all players on mixed, except DCs...very disapointing!!!

what's the point tweaking, setting individual instructions and having mentality framework. just put everything on team...i hope it's not true!!

it's actually very intelligent and it follows some of the frameworks, just a case of Wenger's AI being better at all of us in making a successful tactic, logically the tactic should be the best in the game, there is no disappointment

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Mitja

Mitja

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doesn't look it follows anything except what's written in editor. the only framework i noticed is having centre backs on rarely froward runs and other on mixed. wow i'm really impressed..at least creative freedom could be lowered for centre backs.

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moj

moj

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what editor? which editor?

you dont seem to understand, the tactic doesnt have marking or lower creative freedom set for the DC's because you can take advantage, try any other AI tactic and you will see the same - no man marking, no special instructions, etc

wenger's tactic follows role theory attacking, quick tempo, high width, high creative freedom, the only slice of genius that the AI has that we did not have before (and now we do) is that there is team passing, not individual passing, this makes the team connect much better, so much better than setting the defenders to short passing, midfielders to mixed and attacking to direct..

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Mitja

Mitja

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what editor? which editor?

you dont seem to understand, the tactic doesnt have marking or lower creative freedom set for the DC's because you can take advantage, try any other AI tactic and you will see the same - no man marking, no special instructions, etc

wenger's tactic follows role theory attacking, quick tempo, high width, high creative freedom, the only slice of genius that the AI has that we did not have before (and now we do) is that there is team passing, not individual passing, this makes the team connect much better, so much better than setting the defenders to short passing, midfielders to mixed and attacking to direct..

yes it's absolutly briliant. it's so...so briliant and sophisticated that even the greatest tactical masters forgoten it's all about being nice and simple. why bother to upset those poor Arsenal players with detailed tactics, they wouldn't understand it, just put everything on mixed and team :thup:

i still doubt that's the way AI plays

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Ljuba82

Ljuba82

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yes it's absolutly briliant. it's so...so briliant and sophisticated that even the greatest tactical masters forgoten it's all about being nice and simple. why bother to upset those poor Arsenal players with detailed tactics, they wouldn't understand it, just put everything on mixed and team :thup:

i still doubt that's the way AI plays

Great topic!!!

I think that it's ok....you only have to keep tactic stupid simple and that's ok for me.

But thing that is unlogic to me is QUICK tempo, SHORT passing (notch 1). That shouldn't work.

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Mitja

Mitja

Posted
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stupid

that's the key word.

maybe that why human users' tactics seem useless comared to AI's. we're complicating things.

i'd just like to know if that's only wenger's style ('to have everything on team') or it is just general AI behaviour? if the latest, someone is fooling us around big time...

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Ljuba82

Ljuba82

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that's the key word.

maybe that why human users' tactics seem useless comared to AI's. we're complicating things.

i'd just like to know if that's only wenger's style ('to have everything on team') or it is just general AI behaviour? if the latest, someone is fooling us around big time...

No....all teams have simple tactics, at least Chelsea, Liverpool, Arsenal. I grabed only their tactics.

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Sirjason

Sirjason

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actually on WENGER tactics, have also grabbed his tactic on WET surface/AWAY matched and so on, basically what he does is "FORWARD RUNS" to midfielders and remaining same, which surprisingly completely against my understanding of FM. I personally thing that at least in the away matched need to consider defense also.

Really strange that this team - ARSENAL - is winning %95 of the matches. Suppose it depends on the Player's abilities as I have tried this tactic in a lower league and believe me it sucked.

Total disappointment for me...

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Mitja

Mitja

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Suppose it depends on the Player's abilities as I have tried this tactic in a lower league and believe me it sucked.

Total disappointment for me...

yep, i guess it all comes to players ability. this thing quite easily confirms for me that many features in FM are purely cosmetical. what a waste of money and time..

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moj

moj

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that's the key word.

maybe that why human users' tactics seem useless comared to AI's. we're complicating things.

i'd just like to know if that's only wenger's style ('to have everything on team') or it is just general AI behaviour? if the latest, someone is fooling us around big time...

this is 2 things

1. this is how wenger plays IRL, the whole team produces short passes often

2. general AI behaviour, no team has individual instructions except for through balls, run with ball, etc, adjusted..

yep, i guess it all comes to players ability. this thing quite easily confirms for me that many features in FM are purely cosmetical. what a waste of money and time..

what features are cosmetical?

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moj

moj

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actually on WENGER tactics, have also grabbed his tactic on WET surface/AWAY matched and so on, basically what he does is "FORWARD RUNS" to midfielders and remaining same, which surprisingly completely against my understanding of FM. I personally thing that at least in the away matched need to consider defense also.

Really strange that this team - ARSENAL - is winning %95 of the matches. Suppose it depends on the Player's abilities as I have tried this tactic in a lower league and believe me it sucked.

Total disappointment for me...

why is this against your understanding of FM? arsenal often attack away from home IRL, except in the CL or places like Porto or Dynamo Kiev, where Wengers plays with 4-5-1, look at the recent 2-1 win over Chelsea away from home, 2 strikers and all 4 midfielders attacked.

i think a main reason why this tactic is so successful for arsenal, is because the tempo is really quick and arsenal have a very fit team, while a lower league team do not have players with high stamina and they cannot play quick tempo very effective - this is one of those "logical" rules that people dont follow with a tactic designed for arsenal - why did you take the tactic and apply it to a small team? unless your players have the talent of fabregas or the fitness of clichy, they will get tired, make sloppy passes, bad movement off the ball, etc..

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Code

Code

Posted
Posted
Does anyone think we could make a pretty good tactic set from this ?

Attacking tactic would be Arsenal

Standard tactic Chelsea / Liverpool ??

Counter attack man u

Thoughts ?

Hmm, thinking nearly the same way as you, but my thinking was, have as much leagues running a season and in the end, look the best home / away form. So we have one for home, one away. Pretty much easier to use.

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macca72

macca72

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True, however to complete the picture would you look at who had the most success (home and away) against...

Big 4

Bottom 6/7 teams

Unconventional formations (including the 3-5-2, Chelsea 4-3-3)

What you would have here is then 5-6 tactics that should limit in game tweaking

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bigwills88

bigwills88

Posted
Posted
if that is true it's how AI plays than it's a major disapointmemt for me...all team instructions, no free roles, no TT&F roles - all players on mixed, except DCs...very disapointing!!!

what's the point tweaking, setting individual instructions and having mentality framework. just put everything on team...i hope it's not true!!

I'm not sure but when loading FM06 tactics into new versions the individual instructions are lost. Since this Tacgrabber thing is for 06, I'm assuming it saves it in the old format so we probably lose all the individuakl data.
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macca72

macca72

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Interestingly i can't seem to import any of the tactics back into the game.

This does have some merit though, i've just played man u at home (I'm Leeds, first season) and i lost 3-2, was 2-1 up until i had a man sent off. That was using the Arsenal tactic from above.

I've save a few PKM's of what i consider to be good results.

1. A comfortable away win from Chelsea at Spurs (4-0)

2. Arsenal tactic from above

3. Liverpool giving man u a hiding at old trafford (3-1)

Has anyone got this working properly ? If so, how and what can be done to make it work ?

Could be a nice little experiment this...

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Jesseh

Jesseh

Posted
Posted

go to any match that u have the possibility to save it to a .pkm

save it on folder "matches", then, go to tacgraber and press load, then search for the .pkm u just saved, after loaded it it should apear, which team (home/away) do u want to save the .tac press the respective arrow, then save it in folder "tactics", it should work

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spookgf

spookgf

Posted
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Thanks a mil.

I also wanna ask if in the grab tactics you change the player instructions for every individual ( mentality to tackling )or you left all of them to teams default.

I have playing fm from cm4 and it dosnt look normal for me all players to have the same individual instructions

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The Duke

The Duke

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Posted

Can someone please re-upload TacGrabber? I get this error when loading the link....

Error

This file is neither allocated to a Premium Account, or a Collector's Account, and can therefore only be downloaded 10 times.

This limit is reached.

To download this file, the uploader either needs to transfer this file into his/her Collector's Account, or upload the file again. The file can later be moved to a Collector's Account. The uploader just needs to click the delete link of the file to get further information.

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