loisvale

Very helpful. Thank you.

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@Cloud9 Apologies for going back deep into the thread but I have just come across this excellent debate. I'm very interested in this counter-attacking set up as it is very similar to the system that I use myself. The system that I use currently is below. I have tended to struggle turning it into an effective counter-attacking system when required and what you have posted here is very helpful. I will certainly try some of the ideas you have posted here to make changes to this tactic to give me a Plan B. From what you are suggesting below as well as the changes to the team instructions I need to consider changing the shadow striker to an attacking midfielder, the Segundo V to a defensive midfielder on support, the wide Centre backs to Ball playing defenders with dribble more as a PI. The PIs you suggest are not clear through the team Adding mark tighter to both wingbacks (not sure what you mean by showing inside) Other points for clarity: When you say AMC support and DM support have pressing metres increased do you mean adding the PI closedown more? Also not sure what you mean by "passing metres changes w/no playmaker are key + take more risks" Are you also suggesting increasing passing to slightly more direct against better opponents? Can the setup be alternated between defensive, cautious and balanced? Sorry for the questions and hopefully I've made myself clear. Many thanks for sharing. Much appreciated.any advice greatly received?

Thanks for the detailed reply. look forward to more updates on the OP. The more info around how to tinker for certain situations the more I learn. Don’t quite understand the point you make about use of 4231. Understand when trying to force things but are you suggesting to use against a back 3 or back 4 that’s not clear? thanks again look forward to using. keep up with the info it’s an interesting set up.

Interesting read. Always interested in how tactic creators adapt in game as I don’t like just leaving tactics as plug and play. Don’t believe any real managers do that. if reading correctly in summary with either tactic changes include; - if you are being heavily pressed and other team is pushing up then remove play out of defence and add pass in to space. -if up against a 3 at the back system with single players on flank or a diamond type formation then consider increasing width, overlaps and focus on flanks. -no real changes to transition. Do you ever remove counter press? - against weaker teams push up. Increase loe and def line? -consider an AF when underdog and there are options of DLP and Regista if pressing higher. -play IFs with their strong foot on outside. Thats what I’m reading. other questions~ -do you ever change mentality? -what circumstances do you employ the 4321? -If you are really trying to push for a goal do you do anything different? -same question for really trying to soak up pressure and hit on the break? - is the CWB attack because of a player you have. I presume you could mirror the tactic to suit stronger right wb and add variety? -if down to ten men what changes do you make? sorry for all the questions but am genuinely interested especially with tactics that have been developed over a number of years. Thanks for sharing. Happy to try when have more info.

Tried cm defend last time. Will try this next time! Thanks.

Appreciate the reply. It works very well. Well done. Have been getting great results. The only game so far where I’ve had any trouble is when I had a man sent off. Should it happen again I will try something different than I tried the first time and work it out!

Important This tactic isn't plug and play, it'll outperform anything that is if you put some effort in though! Great (and quite amusing read as ever). If it isn’t plug and play what tweaks/ changes do you make? Is it just changing the mentality to attacking if not winning at 70mins and rotating the two 11s or are there any other thoughts you can share? What do you do if a team is all over you for instance? Do you do something different to avoid the press from stronger opposition? Your results are insane. I am almost glad I’m not that successful from the start - don’t know how you stay motivated to play it! brilliant stuff and thanks for sharing.

Brilliant. Thank you. Just the type of advice and content I was after. Appreciate it.

Been away for a few days but thanks for the reply. I have been trying your less complicated style which I do find interesting and effective. One question I would have is what is your thought process when you really need a goal towards the end of the game and you need to chase?

@Justified was looking through some old threads today and came across your “Rome wasn’t built in a day” thread. Wish I had read it at the time! Is that how you still play today in terms of roles, shape TIs etc? The content in there is exact what I was looking for and referring to above. I am always trying to build a base formation with simple TIs and PIs and then have a more positive attacking one and a more dialled down countering one in the two other slots. Any updates on your previous thread would be devoured by me.

@Johnny Ace @Justified Thanks both for the replies That is is the sort of stuff that I find to be so useful. I have always been fairly decent at putting balanced roles together but can struggle in adapting in game to certain scenarios. Appreciate these thoughts

Enjoyable read. Nice work. Love the 433. Often have a midfield of DM(D), CM (S) and AP (S). Otherwise similar. When I am trying to to be more attacking or defensive I change the duty on the CM. Will try some of the roles you have suggested and see how they work out. Particularly interesting to read how using DM(s) when using a Mez in the midfield 3 keep things together better. Some good learnings in here. I love threads like this but am always interested to see ideas expanded to see how people use roles or TIs to dial risk up and down depending on the opponent (ie how to approach better opponents, similar opponents or teams you expect to beat). A great example that I often come across with tactics I have done myself is when I am being overwhelmed by a great team like Man City- pressing high and constantly pinching the ball of me. Not always obvious to me what I should be doing to slightly alter my tactic without making large changes to soak it up and hit on break. Hope that makes sense.

Goodness me. There are a few tactics here. Do you have personal favourites? Any good home and away combinations? 3 tactics that gel well together and could be used in match strategies and used in all 3 slots? Good effort churning them all out.

Thank you very much for the response. Like you I am trying another homemade tactic and playing around with the different blocks and applying them sensibly. Working well. Enjoyed your tactic set though. Have always enjoyed you stuff. Keep posting!