Football Manager 2014 - Full Game Feedback/Tilbakemelding 14.1.3

[aduh]

Well if you don't score your Celnes and Niecelnes that's bound to happen.

you think ?

15 minutes later:

This gime is just stupid now. Waiting for a patch.

[Guest]

It doesn't count for every player though and possible your transfer/wage budget must be not sufficient enough (not entirely sure). But when it's the case you'll see a right windows "interact with the board" (or something similar, I translated it freely)

yeah just checked it seems to only show for quality players

[Kriss]

During FM Live SI once announced an ME update was commenced which never actually materialized, which didn't keep people posting Feedback on the apparent update regardless.

I still belly laugh when I recall that one

[Ste-25]

you think ?

15 minutes later:

This gime is just stupid now. Waiting for a patch.

Visit the tactics forum.....Tactics is the obvious problem here

[GarrySmutts]

I've heard that on this forum all the time but I am not having that his tactics are in question there he has annihilated them on every aspect of play and yet the other guy scored 3 goals from 4 shots with a hugely inferior team.

[CityAndColour]

I don't think some here understand fully what a hotfix is too. It often relates to small changes that don't need extended testing as it doesn't touch core mechanics of the game.

It still needs to be tested, which takes away time and resources from testing a major update which fixes multiple issues. They're not a massively staffed company in that regard.

I get your point, and agree that it's yet another year that has major ME issues upon full release, but I think focusing on multiple smaller hotfixes would be one step forward, two steps back in terms of the bigger picture.

[Blueflash]

Visit the tactics forum.....Tactics is the obvious problem here

You cannot be serious.

[mBrace1985]

Always the tactics, nothing to do with the game being bugged as hell

[Ste-25]

You cannot be serious.

Well spotted

[kutason]

The game is not to play, we all look forward to the patch:confused:

[RTHerringbone]

Always the tactics, nothing to do with the game being bugged as hell

It's a bit of both (though "bugged as Hell" is somewhat excessive), and as and when the ME issues get corrected, there will be a requirement for more posters to consider that maybe they are having tactical issues.

[daylight]

as and when the ME issues get corrected, there will be a requirement for more posters to consider that maybe they are having tactical issues.

I think that is fair and something most people would agree with.

[GezDixon]

The problem I have with this patch is every team I play against play like brazil even lower league teams. They get the ball and make multiple perfect passes & break very fast ghosting past everyone.

My players make 1-2 passes before been dispossessed (nearly all players have passing ranging from 15-17) or just get the ball and either just run & kick it out or get tackled and loose possession.

Too many red cards, I watch most games but if I key highlights 9 times out of 10 a player will get sent off or go off injured.

My strikers don't score but opponent teams do, I only seem to score with my defenders, unless I key highlights then my strikers can score.

Concede from corners as my defenders don't defend properly.

Marking is non existent

Cup games are stupidly hard even playing against lower league teams.

Goalkeepers don't distribute properly so I lose possession often.

Sorry for the rant, im sure its all been said before.

[aduh]

Stop this ******** about tactics issue here. I have post 2 match stats screenies from current season:

http://i.imgur.com/uYyhye2.jpg

As you can see there is no really tactic issue when you look at my results.

When Im playing a match and I see my team mass bombing on opponent target and all I see are shots on crossbar or post

then Im start to asking is it really possible that RvP or Rooney really cant score from 5m distance ?

Then camera goes to my side - 2,3 quick pass BOOM and Goal - obviously opponent team always score, no matter what.

One action boom and goal. Then camera goes back to their side - 20 shots on goal, all missed, end of game.

Its not a tactic issue its ME issue and it needs to be fixed immediatelly. Not ready when ready - we need it NOW.

[daylight]

aduh you never read RTHerringbone post properly, he clearly said after the update and hopefully after the ME issues have been fixed, then if people are still having problems then it could very well be their tactics.

First we need the update and then we can start from there, we just have to be patient now and wait for the update.

[kutason]

Stop this ******** about tactics issue here. I have post 2 match stats screenies from current season:

http://i.imgur.com/uYyhye2.jpg

As you can see there is no really tactic issue when you look at my results.

When Im playing a match and I see my team mass bombing on opponent target and all I see are shots on crossbar or post

then Im start to asking is it really possible that RvP or Rooney really cant score from 5m distance ?

Then camera goes to my side - 2,3 quick pass BOOM and Goal - obviously opponent team always score, no matter what.

One action boom and goal. Then camera goes back to their side - 20 shots on goal, all missed, end of game.

Its not a tactic issue its ME issue and it needs to be fixed immediatelly. Not ready when ready - we need it NOW.

True....

[Burhan]

Stop this ******** about tactics issue here. I have post 2 match stats screenies from current season:

http://i.imgur.com/uYyhye2.jpg

As you can see there is no really tactic issue when you look at my results.

When Im playing a match and I see my team mass bombing on opponent target and all I see are shots on crossbar or post

then Im start to asking is it really possible that RvP or Rooney really cant score from 5m distance ?

Then camera goes to my side - 2,3 quick pass BOOM and Goal - obviously opponent team always score, no matter what.

One action boom and goal. Then camera goes back to their side - 20 shots on goal, all missed, end of game.

Its not a tactic issue its ME issue and it needs to be fixed immediatelly. Not ready when ready - we need it NOW.

A bit harsh but true...

[aduh]

aduh you never read RTHerringbone post properly, he clearly said after the update and hopefully after the ME issues have been fixed, then if people are still having problems then it could very well be their tactics.

First we need the update and then we can start from there, we just have to be patient now and wait for the update.

daylight IM sure that peoples that playing this game many years can see the difference between loosing the game with better opponent or bad tactic

when your team just loose or draw the game because of bad tactic, low team morale or just bad luck ...

BUT when my team is just dominating in all match aspect and I mean DOMINATING and Im loosing because we have shoot 10 times on crossbar, 7 times on post we couldnt score few times from 5m distance and Rooney didnt score 2 penalties then Im sorry but its not FM I know. Its something like FIFA causal game nothing more.

EOT for me - waiting for a patch and going back to FM13 for now ...

[iMan]

Same here. It's long been obvious that only the last patch makes the game even remotely enjoyable, so I've stopped being a Day 1 purchaser since '11, and skipped '13 altogether (the feedback here was still too poor). From what I can read here it looks like a 50-50 proposition I will buy '14 next spring.

Yeah it's always been like this. The game is released full of bugs and imbalances and doesn't really end up as entended till the New Year when the final patch arrives.

It will be the same thing for next years version aswell. If people don't want to put up with loads of annoying bugs then don't buy it until the final patch comes out.

[daylight]

aduh if you had read the thread you would have seen I agree that the ME is not so good right now, I also agree that teams dominating the match but being on the losing side is not right, certainly not as often as is being shown in the game.

I also agreed that it is wrong to blame the players tactics every time.

There is not much we can do, we just need to wait on the update and start from there.

[aduh]

I know I know Im sorry I just have to spell my frustrations here and Im better now

[Moose-Stuff-For-Money]

It's a bit of both (though "bugged as Hell" is somewhat excessive), and as and when the ME issues get corrected, there will be a requirement for more posters to consider that maybe they are having tactical issues.

I think this is a fair point to make. It is also a little bit of a catche 22 in some respects, certain 'issues' in the ME are making some peoples tactics appear amazing, but at the same time those users are being undone tactically by things the ME isn't showing very well. For example I have conceded 3 goals in as many games from short corners, the only way to solve this is wait for an update in which defending said set piece is looked at.

For me it's not the results of 30+ shots on target 5CCC and only 9 long shots which I find detract from my complete enjoyment many of these are explainable, in some cases (not all) shot stats can't really be trusted, for instance one probelm in the ME means players shoot to readily without looking for other options, so some shots which are either weak or from silly angles are registering making it appear you more hard done by then perhaps you are. For me its the little quirks, I have watched my last 4 games on full match mode and some things do damage the realism, people passing corners short and getting it back in an offside position, the short passes which bounce of players who stand and watch. Too many cases of trying to win corners. Shooting too soon. Defensive wing play. Clearing the ball under little pressure when options are available to keep possession, which are things you see more of the more of a match you view.

But I have every confidence these issues will be ironed out to make the ME better. Its easy to get frustrated, and if you are someone who has played FM for a long time and find yourself struggling like never before, being told to go check out the tactics forum may seem a bit of a cop out, saying that it can help, some stuff is really good to read no matter the level of depth you go into tactically, and some is really good at making you think differently.

The only argument I see which I 100% understand is that the game should be more welcoming in terms of tactics with a better way of showing you why your having problems, and what the decisions you make really mean. Not everyone has the time or inclination to watch comprehensive or full match detail, or to pour over threads on forums and these people have contributed to the games economic success as much as anyone and if they feel they are being left behind then thats something that needs to be looked into.

[sriracha]

and as and when the ME issues get corrected, there will be a requirement for more posters to consider that maybe they are having tactical issues.

While you're spot on with this I think you'll also find that fewer and fewer people are willing to listen to the ones who currently (not pointing at you) , without considering the state of the ME, immediately sneer everyone off with "it's your tactics, stupid". I see a of goodwill getting lost there. Wouldn't be the worst thing if a few know-it-alls were more like "Look, the ME is fairly buggy atm, so it's a bit tricky to a) figure out what's whose fault and b) give advice that works. Patch is coming." then "LOL, your obviously just not smart enough'

Just 2c.

[macca72]

I think this is a fair point to make. It is also a little bit of a catche 22 in some respects, certain 'issues' in the ME are making some peoples tactics appear amazing, but at the same time those users are being undone tactically by things the ME isn't showing very well. For example I have conceded 3 goals in as many games from short corners, the only way to solve this is wait for an update in which defending said set piece is looked at.

For me it's not the results of 30+ shots on target 5CCC and only 9 long shots which I find detract from my complete enjoyment many of these are explainable, in some cases (not all) shot stats can't really be trusted, for instance one probelm in the ME means players shoot to readily without looking for other options, so some shots which are either weak or from silly angles are registering making it appear you more hard done by then perhaps you are. For me its the little quirks, I have watched my last 4 games on full match mode and some things do damage the realism, people passing corners short and getting it back in an offside position, the short passes which bounce of players who stand and watch. Too many cases of trying to win corners. Shooting too soon. Defensive wing play. Clearing the ball under little pressure when options are available to keep possession, which are things you see more of the more of a match you view.

But I have every confidence these issues will be ironed out to make the ME better. Its easy to get frustrated, and if you are someone who has played FM for a long time and find yourself struggling like never before, being told to go check out the tactics forum may seem a bit of a cop out, saying that it can help, some stuff is really good to read no matter the level of depth you go into tactically, and some is really good at making you think differently.

The only argument I see which I 100% understand is that the game should be more welcoming in terms of tactics with a better way of showing you why your having problems, and what the decisions you make really mean. Not everyone has the time or inclination to watch comprehensive or full match detail, or to pour over threads on forums and these people have contributed to the games economic success as much as anyone and if they feel they are being left behind then thats something that needs to be looked into.

Good post my man.

I'm generally not one to complain, but I'll be honest, this is the least I've enjoyed an FM from release day for a long while. The goals I concede are like watching the same replays over and over again, it's all just set pieces & crosses. When you couple this with the fact that the stats say I'm doing well in most games (played Arsenal @ Emirates, I had more possession, more CCC, more shots, less from long range, more passes completed and lost 4-0), you do struggle to see what more you could do from a tactical perspective.

I'm 100% certain SI will fix it, no doubt.

[GezDixon]

Just seen this stat

Goals:100 from 896 attempts

Shots on target:431 from 896 attempted

[Dennis_Ajax]

After playing this game for 2/3 weeks now I find it to easy.. First season champion with Newcastle, runner up in the LAC. Won the Community shield against Chelsea and 6 games in season 2 I haven't lost at all.

Haven't done any transfer in season 1 and the only transfers in the second season are : Yarmalenko, Depay, Vargas and Holtby. Not going to finish this season, waiting for an job offer in an other league.

It's just about the tactics. More important then in FM13 etc.

[SurferJames]

well the ME does have bugs but what herrington is trying to say that even with the bugs, your tactics can still be wrong, I know many people get tired of hearing its your tactics but they say it with good reason, he and many people are not trying to hide the fact there are improvements made its just that they have studied the game and have found solutions to those problems you keep posting.Me myself I have struggled sometimes and question the ME but regardless of this I still know I don't always get the right tactics and teams can catch me out on the counter.

[wwfan]

I also agree that teams dominating the match but being on the losing side is not right, certainly not as often as is being shown in the game.

I also agreed that it is wrong to blame the players tactics every time.

There is not much we can do, we just need to wait on the update and start from there.

That's not exactly a problem in his save. Played 26, won 21. That's an 81% win record, which is 10% better than real life stats would suggest a team always outshooting the opposition would achieve. Given he's got a goal difference of +53 as well, you understand why we take some ranting about the unfair AI and horribly bugged ME with a pinch of salt.

Just seen this stat

Goals:100 from 896 attempts

Shots on target:431 from 896 attempted

Given that teams score from roughly 1 in 9 shots and 1 in 4 shots on target in reality, your point is? Too many shots?

[wwfan]

While you're spot on with this I think you'll also find that fewer and fewer people are willing to listen to the ones who currently (not pointing at you) , without considering the state of the ME, immediately sneer everyone off with "it's your tactics, stupid". I see a of goodwill getting lost there. Wouldn't be the worst thing if a few know-it-alls were more like "Look, the ME is fairly buggy atm, so it's a bit tricky to a) figure out what's whose fault and b) give advice that works. Patch is coming." then "LOL, your obviously just not smart enough'

Just 2c.

I don't think you'll find a single mod behaving like that. We accept that the ME is by no means perfect. We've also put ourselves out to provide advice that works. What we find frustrating is when people refuse to read that advice, insist they are right, rant that the ME is an unplayable mess, claim their tactics are perfect and call us sneering know-it-alls. How can we help if nobody even begins to follow the advice we give?

[difran8]

Watching the games doesn't seem as smooth as previous FMs. Players sometimes just stop, run into each other and perform a bizarre number of back-heels on my game.

Example- From Kick Off my players ran into each other, stopped in a group and let the opposition take the ball from the centre circle within three seconds. A general lack of intelligence

This is my biggest complaint as well. Up to FM12 the game looked more like pinball, but it was a well adjusted pinball. It was consistent. FM13-14 give me a feeling there's something off with the game physics and player intelligence: the ball travels too fast, the pitch has no friction, defensive challenges seem light . The overall experience is like a WIP that isn't ticking well yet, although steps are made forward

I understand that last year's big ME change was written on top of pre-existing code, so might this be the problem? :confused:

[jim82]

After playing this game for 2/3 weeks now I find it to easy.. First season champion with Newcastle, runner up in the LAC. Won the Community shield against Chelsea and 6 games in season 2 I haven't lost at all.

Haven't done any transfer in season 1 and the only transfers in the second season are : Yarmalenko, Depay, Vargas and Holtby. Not going to finish this season, waiting for an job offer in an other league.

It's just about the tactics. More important then in FM13 etc.

Completely the opposite for me. Can count on one hand the amount of times I've been sacked in FM games since Champ Man days..... until this one. Started three games on this one and been sacked three times by February! Not much fun.

[timbamania]

That's not exactly a problem in his save. Played 26, won 21. That's an 81% win record, which is 10% better than real life stats would suggest a team always outshooting the opposition would achieve. Given he's got a goal difference of +53 as well, you understand why we take some ranting about the unfair AI and horribly bugged ME with a pinch of salt.

I'm pretty sure the 81% is winning when outshooting your opponent, regardless of by how much more shots your team produces. What people here are talking about is something completely different: failing to win too often when they outshoot their opponent by like 8-1 or 10-1 margins. So unless you actually know the stats for those situations, it makes sense to take your pinch of salt with a pinch of salt.

[wwfan]

I'm pretty sure the 81% is winning when outshooting your opponent, regardless of by how much more shots your team produces. What people here are talking about is something completely different: failing to win too often when they outshoot their opponent by like 8-1 or 10-1 margins. So unless you actually know the stats for those situations, it makes sense to take your pinch of salt with a pinch of salt.

He's lost twice in 26 matches. Given his goal difference, he's going to be scoring circa 3 a game at least. I don't see any issue in that he's failed to win five times, even if he outshot the opposition in all of them by 10 shots to 1.

[Mr U Rosler]

After playing this game for 2/3 weeks now I find it to easy.. First season champion with Newcastle, runner up in the LAC. Won the Community shield against Chelsea and 6 games in season 2 I haven't lost at all.

Haven't done any transfer in season 1 and the only transfers in the second season are : Yarmalenko, Depay, Vargas and Holtby. Not going to finish this season, waiting for an job offer in an other league.

It's just about the tactics. More important then in FM13 etc.

Can you show us how many goals you scored from corners? (although it looks like your success was built on great defence)

[ArneH]

I don't think you'll find a single mod behaving like that. We accept that the ME is by no means perfect. We've also put ourselves out to provide advice that works. What we find frustrating is when people refuse to read that advice, insist they are right, rant that the ME is an unplayable mess, claim their tactics are perfect and call us sneering know-it-alls. How can we help if nobody even begins to follow the advice we give?

This answer is a bit dubious if you ask me. And to be fair, it comes over a bit arrogant (but that might be interpretated wrong. Not always easy if English isn't your native language.)

We're customers after all, paying money for a product. We have right to mention aspects that aren't working right in order to fix it. Of coure that has to be done with respect, what sometimes is missing from the customers side aswell.

It's good that you realise the ME isn't perfect, but just providing advice won't cut it though. As some said here before actual advice will be able to be given after the bigger issues in the ME are resolved. Most of the advice given at this moment on the tactical is either to bypass a flow or other people somewhat saying "you need to play this way, it works". Personnaly I like that not so much. Finding and devoloping is fun, and for me one of the bigger aspects in this game. I've been playing FM for several years already and over that time I worked out a tactic that worked very good to me and I liked much. This edition it doesn't work, like for one example because you can't choose Inward Forward on the 'AM'- position. It is totally fine that the tactic I used in earlier versions don't work. Not a problem at all, just means I've to look for new ways which isn't a bad thing at all.

But after trying so many tactics several of us (not a small group) are encountering the same problem. Some of those are sure even more veteran in this game than me. So by all means they are far from clueless about tactics. Yet they experience problems like the well documented full back issue. Yet they're often being directed to the tactical forum as it 'has' to be their tactic, whilst it's known there are isssues. It only adds up to the frustration as some feel ignored or ridiculed. F.e. some of the advices I've seen: "play with 3 central defenders"; "play 4-4-2" (currently called overpowered some say, haven't tried it myself). That sort of advice sucks the fun out finding and devoloping a good tactic as having to play a certain system f.e. to neglate a issue that isn't working proper is going against the nature of the game.

At the end I think a lot of frustration will be gone (hopefully) when the new ME is here and we can make a real difference between 'it's your tactics that have some downsides' and 'your tactic is ok, but not working currently because of issue x". Because only then people will be able to help each other truly.

[timbamania]

He's lost twice in 26 matches. Given his goal difference, he's going to be scoring circa 3 a game at least. I don't see any issue in that he's failed to win five times, even if he outshot the opposition in all of them by 10 shots to 1.

Actually 81% would be pretty low if he outshot every opponent by 10-1.

[ArneH]

Given that teams score from roughly 1 in 9 shots and 1 in 4 shots on target in reality, your point is? Too many shots?

Actually, it's closer to 2 in 4 shorts on target. 431/8.96 = 48,1% (oh nvm this, I understood you wrong, you weren't talking about his stats, sorry)

But for the opposite team it's much higher in match stats like this. Not sure if you can check that in ai vs ai games if it happens a lot a team had 4 shots, 3 on goal and won 2-0 f.e.

Would be interesting to know.

Of course it happens at times in real life an underlying team wins despite the opponent totally dominating, having more shots, possesion etc. But stats like that appeared several times on these forum, indicating it's not that rare

[aduh]

Of course it happens at times in real life an underlying team wins despite the opponent totally dominating, having more shots, possesion etc. But stats like that appeared several times on these forum, indicating it's not that rare

On FM13 when I was dominating then i was DOMINATING ... like that:

Now when we are dominating then I pray that 1 shot on 30 will find a goal ...

[A_Sober_Paddy]

Is there an issue with full backs in the game? I've played a season and all my full backs very awful...like ratings between 3.7 and 5.4 was the average...Very annoying when considering my full backs are costing me a fortune in wages

[ArneH]

Is there an issue with full backs in the game? I've played a season and all my full backs very awful...like ratings between 3.7 and 5.4 was the average...Very annoying when considering my full backs are costing me a fortune in wages

Yes, it's well documented and is being reviewed in the upcoming patch.

[Dagenham_Dave]

On FM13 when I was dominating then i was DOMINATING ... like that:

Now when we are dominating then I pray that 1 shot on 30 will find a goal ...

You're posting that from FM 13 to make a point that the current game isn't realistic enough?

Didn't your team only lose two games all season with something like a +53 goal difference? What more do you want?

[aduh]

Yes Im pointing here on FM13 as with final patch FM13 was a great and realistic enough football manager game.

If you would try to read and understand my previous posts then you will understand that Im not complain that about winning or loosing on FM14.

Im winning now 2 season in a row but its not about that. Its about shots on goal stats and their effectiveness comparing to opposed team.

Just look at my match stats screenies on my previous posts.

[A_Sober_Paddy]

Yes, it's well documented and is being reviewed in the upcoming patch.

Any date on potential patch release?

[Dennis_Ajax]

Can you show us how many goals you scored from corners? (although it looks like your success was built on great defence)

I've moved the FB's to WB position and that helped a lot. Good pressing and good (zonal) marking right now.

I don't use any corner tactics. Just standard on mixed.

Can't find the exact stats because I played 7 matches in the PL, 2nd season but maybe this is ok

[Dagenham_Dave]

Yes Im pointing here on FM13 as with final patch FM13 was a great and realistic enough football manager game.

You think beating Barcelona 10-1 is realistic? I'm out.

[funnylittlefrog]

Yes Im pointing here on FM13 as with final patch FM13 was a great and realistic enough football manager game.

.

In what world is that scoreline realistic? I'll be amazed if I ever see a top European side put ten past another in my lifetime. As much as I've moaned about the realism we can't have it both ways. 'Realism' doesn't mean 'I can win really easily'.

[ArneH]

Any date on potential patch release?

No, not sure why you are asking me. I'm not a developer.

There are some indications on this forums that it will be this week, but as long it's not released we won't know.

[SurferJames]

I don't know how can describe that image as anything but realism to be fair, it wouldn't happen at all

[Sarin1]

I am 11 points clear at the top of the Premier League and do not want to play until the patch is finally released.

Match Engine is broken.

[WizbaII]

Any score is realistic when you have millions of people playing the same match.