[FM20] Irchester Utd. Tier 10. England. Home. Youth Only.

[Jimbokav1971]

2 minutes ago, rodesire said:

only has 18 caps at 23, looks like i was wrong about him after all

28 Caps at 24 now. What was your prediction? He looks brilliant and his only issue is height. 

[Jimbokav1971]

2 minutes ago, Pompeyboyz said:

Is it worth trying out a new GK if Ward is still unhappy?

If he is going to be leaving at the season end, give first team time to a possible/probable replacement.

Update on the way shortly. 

[enterprise1]

6 minutes ago, Jimbokav1971 said:

Thanks very much. really glad you are enjoying it. 

The idea of the Goal scoring GK stuff and the discipline stuff is just something else to keep me interested when things get a little boring. really helps add depth to the save though. 

Must be quite exciting seeing your GK score a few. Wouldn't want to risk it myself as my defence would probably get caught out time and time again. It is interesting how little ideas like that do give a save more longevity.

[Jimbokav1971]

1 minute ago, enterprise1 said:

Must be quite exciting seeing your GK score a few. Wouldn't want to risk it myself as my defence would probably get caught out time and time again. It is interesting how little ideas like that do give a save more longevity.

If you are only going to do a relatively short save and then start another, (like many do), or if you are going to play really slowly and watch matches in great detail then you probably don't need anything else. Because I go really deep into saves though and don't watch matches at all, it just helps to have something else to focus on while we are wallowing in mid-table obscurity, (although to be fair we haven't had many mid-table finishes in this save). It's all about how the individual plays the game though I think. 

[rodesire]

10 minutes ago, Jimbokav1971 said:

28 Caps at 24 now. What was your prediction? He looks brilliant and his only issue is height. 

so right after intake I said

So, 4 more years, 22 caps. Seems just about right to me 

[enterprise1]

59 minutes ago, Jimbokav1971 said:

If you are only going to do a relatively short save and then start another, (like many do), or if you are going to play really slowly and watch matches in great detail then you probably don't need anything else. Because I go really deep into saves though and don't watch matches at all, it just helps to have something else to focus on while we are wallowing in mid-table obscurity, (although to be fair we haven't had many mid-table finishes in this save). It's all about how the individual plays the game though I think. 

I've recently got into using Instant Result with my Ipswich save. 21 years I've been in charge and am absolutely loving it. When a few seasons ago I was getting bored playing the matches myself. All it took was a slight change to the way I play the game and my interest soared.

[Jimbokav1971]

Jan 2047. 

The close of every Transfer Window now is bloomin hard work. 

League 1. What a month!  

The truth, (as @Pompeyboyzand someone else suggested earlier as well as myself), is that the unhappiness of our long-term GK meant that the performances of (33e) Lee Ward (NIR) (Bal) were suffering and our results suffering as a consequence of that. Replacing that has yielded instant rewards. We're up to 4th in the league again and although Blackpool have disappeared off into the distance, we are only 3 points off 2nd and auto-promotion. I will be completely honest with you and admit that I want auto-promotion. 

(43f) Fabian (JAM) (Pro) has come straight in and played the last 5 league games, keeping 4 clean sheets and scoring 1 direct free-kick.  

I think that this suggests that (33e) Lee Ward (NIR) (Bal) might be better right now than (43f) Fabian (JAM) (Pro), but for whatever reason it's not transferring to performances like hat and (43f) Fabian (JAM) (Pro) is absolutely smashing it. Good decision all round and my only regret is that I didn't make it sooner. The truth is that the decision wasn't made sooner because I wanted to get (33e) Lee Ward (NIR) (Bal) to 100 career goals. 

Transfers. 

In. 

(40d) Giertl (SVK) (F.Pro) has come back in from Preston for £100k and while he looks a little like a downgrade that we have had to pay more for than we received for (33e) Lee Ward (NIR) (Bal), he does at least have the potential to improve a little. The truth is he's actually competing with (43f) Fabian (JAM) (Pro) for the gloves , who kept a clean sheet on his debut at the weekend so maybe things are looking up. Happiness, (or lack thereof), is a powerful magic.  

(33b) Dean Cooke (Pro) * might be 30, but we are short of quality and numbers at centre-half and things are going to be worse at the back next season when we lose 2 centre-backs and our best left back. We've paid £350k for him and he's immediately worth £425k which suggests that it was decent business, but I had to pay him a £100k signing on fee to keep his wages at £10k per week so maybe not so good after all. We needed someone though. 

Out. 

(33e) Lee Ward (NIR) (Bal) has gone to Doncaster Rovers for £40k + 50% and a friendly. I didn't want him to go but he wouldn't sign a new contract, was unhappy and was leaving in the Summer on a free. While he's already worth in League 2 than he was with us, we had to make a change because he just wasn't performing. He's finished his time with us on 88 career goals which is more than a little frustrating because I really wanted to get him to 100 career goals, but he's only scored 2 goals in the league this season and that's just not good enough and is costing us in tight games. 

Edited August 28, 2020 by Jimbokav1971

[Jimbokav1971]

Feb 2047. 

League 1. It's amazing what a change of GK has done for us although we have finally lost after 11 games undefeated. There are 8 games left and 1 of them is against Sheff Wed, (we're at home), although they have a game in hand too. 

Goal-scoring keeper (43f) Fabian (JAM) (Pro) has scored 3 goals in 10 appearances, (2 penalties from 2 attempts and a free-kick), after (33e) Lee Ward (NIR) (Bal) scored 4 in 32. I wish I knew why some GK's score and others don't, (other than morale/happiness obviously), but whatever it is it's clear that (33e) Lee Ward (NIR) (Bal) didn't score prolifically and while the jury is stiill out on (43f) Fabian (JAM) (Pro), it's looking good so far. 

[Jimbokav1971]

13 hours ago, Jimbokav1971 said:

Youth Intake preview. Dec 2046. 

A GK and a SC in a Golden Generation. Sounds good to me. 

Youth Intake day. Mar 2047. 

Well they say it's another Golden Generation, and maybe it is, but I'm seriously underwhelmed. 

That being said, I have been surprised by a few players recently who seem to have come out of nowhere after developing in the U18 squad to suddenly be competing for a place in the Senior squad. Maybe I need to lower expectations a little and just give them time to develop. 

Squad by PPA. 

Nations represented by previous Youth Intakes. 

New Nations represented by this Youth Intake. None. 

(47a) Best (F.Det) looks reasonable for a 16 year old, but he's "only" 4.5 PA and we will have to see how he develops. 

(47c) Doyle (IRL) (Bal) is someone who has caught my eye and I like the look of him. he's very good for a 16 year old I think. 

(47d) Frecklington (L.Heart) looks to have decent mentals and I quite the look of him because he looks a little different to the usual Playmakers that I prefer.

[Jimbokav1971]

Poached. Mar 2047. 

There is another player who has been poached but whom I missed at the time. He has just come through the intake at Leicester and I know he has been poached because we have 10 clauses on him and because I have checked his Milestones page. 

He looks ok, but nothing special. 

Right, now this is getting interesting. We get £26k per 10 league appearances, (compared to £5k and £10k previously), so if he was to make 100 league appearances for Leicester City then we would receive £260,000.

He's the 4th of 6 players that have been poached and..... oh wow. He's good. He's really good. I mean he's really REALLY good. At least his PA is. 

I feel a little awkward checking this because I don't check the PA of my own players, and by doing so I give myself an advantage because I have been open that I want to be able to sign these players if it suits me, (because they are still a product of our Academy). On the other hand I will have gained an advantage by using the editor and that's not what this is about. 

I'm not really sure what to do here because I quite like the "Poached" section and I like checking the CA/PA when they come through. Leicester City are in the league above us and look to be heading back to the Premier League anyway, so there is little chance of us signing (HG47) Brendan Gillies, but the potential is still there to do so and it doesn't seem right that I can gain an advantage like this. Thoughts? 

[-Jef-]

I would definitely send a bid for Gillies.

Also, I think the money tied to apps when player is poached is based on the time he was last at your club. And it counts the Youth Level on that date. Maybe. Maybe check the two players poached and compare when they were at the club.

 

[Tajerio]

14 minutes ago, Jimbokav1971 said:

Poached. Mar 2047. 

There is another player who has been poached but whom I missed at the time. He has just come through the intake at Leicester and I know he has been poached because we have 10 clauses on him and because I have checked his Milestones page. 

He looks ok, but nothing special. 

Right, now this is getting interesting. We get £26k per 10 league appearances, (compared to £5k and £10k previously), so if he was to make 100 league appearances for Leicester City then we would receive £260,000.

He's the 4th of 6 players that have been poached and..... oh wow. He's good. He's really good. I mean he's really REALLY good. At least his PA is. 

I feel a little awkward checking this because I don't check the PA of my own players, and by doing so I give myself an advantage because I have been open that I want to be able to sign these players if it suits me, (because they are still a product of our Academy). On the other hand I will have gained an advantage by using the editor and that's not what this is about. 

I'm not really sure what to do here because I quite like the "Poached" section and I like checking the CA/PA when they come through. Leicester City are in the league above us and look to be heading back to the Premier League anyway, so there is little chance of us signing (HG47) Brendan Gillies, but the potential is still there to do so and it doesn't seem right that I can gain an advantage like this. Thoughts? 

Speaking just for myself, if I were doing this sort of save, I would feel fine re-signing him once I was pretty sure he was done developing (say 25 or 26). You're not really gaining an advantage by knowing his PA if he's already hit it.

[Jimbokav1971]

International recognition. Mar 2047. 

We've had 3 players who have received 100 International Caps. 

(30a) James (DMA) *.

(31a) Liam Watts (FIN) *.

(34a) Nieminen (FIN) (Driven)*.

The player who has been awarded the most U21 Caps is (35a) Liriano (NED)(DOM)Pro *.

[Jimbokav1971]

11 minutes ago, rosque said:

I would definitely send a bid for Gillies.

Also, I think the money tied to apps when player is poached is based on the time he was last at your club. And it counts the Youth Level on that date. Maybe. Maybe check the two players poached and compare when they were at the club.

 

11 minutes ago, Tajerio said:

Speaking just for myself, if I were doing this sort of save, I would feel fine re-signing him once I was pretty sure he was done developing (say 25 or 26). You're not really gaining an advantage by knowing his PA if he's already hit it.

Thanks for the responses. 

I've been thinking about it and I'm certainly not happy about looking to sign him now. He doesn't look all that and any attempt in me signing him at this stage would be directly as a result of knowing his PA. 

I will obviously keep an eye on him as I keep an eye on everyone, and will just have to make a decision as and when the situation arises. 

I'm not saying that I will never buy him. I am saying that I don't feel comfortable doing so as a result of me using the editor. 

I think that's the strategy that best suits the way I play. The other option would be to stop looking at the PA of poached players and I don't want to do that because I think it adds something to the thread. 

[Jimbokav1971]

International recognition updated. Mar 2047. 

I've realised that while the Senior International appearances/goals had been updated, I had missed some of the U21 info. 

The main thing to point out here is that just about everyone who comes through with a 2nd Nationality or a Foreign Nationality is now being recognised at some level, but the Big(ish) news is that (45b) Kendall (F.Amb) has been called up to England U20's and played twice. He's already been sold to Southampton, who are top of the Championship and look like they are heading back to the Premier League with Leicester, but the only player who was capped at any level by England is (30a) James (DMA) * and he turned out to be a bit special. I think any International recognition by England is a bit special by comparison to other Nations simply because it's the only Nation loaded. 

[Jimbokav1971]

Mar 2047. 

League 1. 0 wins, but only 1 loss. The big game was against Sheff Wed, where we really needed to win to have a chance of finishing 2nd, but we could only draw. With 5 games left and still trailing them by 3 points, (and they have a game in hand), it looks unlikely that we will reel them in and gain auto-promotion. 

The big thing now is to make sure that we finish the regular season in decent form so that we can take that into the Playoffs and get promoted.

If we don't get promoted this season, we're not going up either of the next couple of seasons. 

[Jimbokav1971]

Personalities. May 2047. 

If I rank my squad by CA, then these are the personalities at the top. 

I know this is nothing in comparison to threads like that of @_Ben_but it's huge progress for us. 

I only started looking at the staff about 5 seasons ago and had decided that we didn't have enough positive personalities in influential positions to bother with mentoring. (I may have to review that). 

M.Pro x1
Amb x1
F.Pro x7
F.Det x3
F.Amb x1

Bal x6
Realist x1
F.Sport x1

I've lost the count somewhere but that's decent and is just being done just by using the squads positive character. 
We could do with some of the F.Pro players popping to Pro, but it's actually significant progress considering I'm purring very little effort into it. 
Mot a single player in single figures for Det is also decent, but maybe that says more about low Det players not progressing, (which might also be the case with my original point). 

[Jimbokav1971]

Apr 2047. 

League 1. We never managed to close the gap on Sheff Wed and in the end I was just happy to qualify for the Playoffs. We lost 2 of our away games but kept clean sheets in both the home wins. That augers well for the Playoffs were I would hope that if we win to nil at home then we have a chance of at least winning on away goals over 2 legs. 

It's officially squeeky-bum time. 

[Jimbokav1971]

Playoffs. 2047. 

The 1st leg (home) of the Playoffs Semi was just 3 days after the last league game and I opted to rotate all 10 outfield players and prefer fit players over our "best" players. It worked a treat as we ran out convincing 5-1 winners against Hull, (who's goal was scored by (38c) McCormack (IRL) (Bal) * bringing him to 23 goals in all competitions this season). 

My plan is to revert to our "strongest" side for the away leg and hopefully the fresh legs will see us through. 

(43f) Fabian (JAM) (Pro) slotting late penalties in both games suggests he likes the pressure.  

There are 2 weeks between the 2nd leg of the Semi and the Final so I won't be able to use my fitness trick. We did however play a cheeky friendly against the U23's to make sure everyone was as fit as possible. 

We had to win the Final now. With 3 defenders leaving this season it was unlikely that we would be able to mount a promotion challenge for a few seasons at least.

We had our left back sent off in the 14th minute. 

Then our substitute left back, (who was subbed on in the 14th minute), was shown a yellow card in the 18th minute. 

Then our substitute left back, (who was subbed on in the 14th minute), was shown a 2nd yellow and then a red in the 41st minute. 

Then we scored to make it 1-0 in the 45th minute. 

It went downhill from then on. 

We would have destroyed them 11v11. 

Gutted. Absolutely gutted.. 

On the plus side......

Edited August 28, 2020 by Jimbokav1971

[rodesire]

well, that was a yike. 9v11 midway through first half..

[scousevasey]

On 26/08/2020 at 20:37, Jimbokav1971 said:

 

On 26/08/2020 at 21:46, Jimbokav1971 said:

Instead of protesting this deal I asked them to negotiate it and include a sell on clause and they agreed. I don't know what % we are getting yet if any. 

 

On 27/08/2020 at 00:13, Jimbokav1971 said:

I was able to protest and get it stopped eventually, but we have £29.5M in the banks so what's the problem and why the rush to sell? 

Is it something linked to the difference between the value to the club (shown on the player screen) and the bid.

While the value metric isn't perfect, as shown when a player has a value in the thousands and the club want the tens of millions, and it is linked to the contract length and wage, from the board side there may be something to note.

Kendall - £19,250 --> £7m

Grainger - £26,500 --> £8m

Doing some lazy sums, bid divided by value, the bid for Kendall is 363x value, and for Kendall it is 300x value.

 

I know that usually the money in the bank is worth a lot, but from the board perspective that is a massive bonus.  Scaled up it is the equivalent of selling a £1m player for £300m, or a £5m for £1.5B.  Not ideal when they are your best players, and you can't buy anyone, but then the game doesn't have a mechanism to judge a youth only save, so the board work on the assumption that the income will be reinvested in either a better player than what was sold, or someone else that can be sold.

 

What would be interesting in terms of game development, would be a board/chairman style that focuses on youth, and therefore provides a minimal transfer budget, but also doesn't intervene in selling players over the head of the manager, because they want the players to stay at the club and develop.

[Jimbokav1971]

14 minutes ago, scousevasey said:

What would be interesting in terms of game development, would be a board/chairman style that focuses on youth, and therefore provides a minimal transfer budget, but also doesn't intervene in selling players over the head of the manager, because they want the players to stay at the club and develop.

Lots of good points in there but I wanted to pick up on this one 1st. 

I don't think it's a matter of not selling players, but selling players with a clear direction of "selling player x will allow us to keep player x and player z". Everything seems to be on an individual basis with little "overall" strategy, although I appreciate that's not the easiest thing to implement. In an ideal situation they would sell the single most valuable asset each season, provided that is that they weren't all in similar positions. Selling 3x defenders and little else in 1 season is a killer, but at the same time money talks and they know the costs that will be incurred every year in terms of the Youth system, so maybe they need to make hay when the sin shines because there is no guarantee that the production line, (and linked income), will continue. We also know that they don't count for the value of add-on clauses anywhere. In a perfect World all these things would be factored in. The thing is, it's extremely hard to do that when there is no guarantee that any of these clauses will generate any cash at all. 

The next level AI is for the board to tell you that they expect you to generate xx income via player sales this season, and if you don't then they will. At least you will know where you stand then. And I'm not saying that you shouldn't accept a £200M bid for anyone, (and I also see your point about the fee being 300x the value), but there has to be a smarter way for the AI to make it's decisions. 

[Edit]

ps. @scousevasey If I could like your post multiple times then I would because it's really interesting and it has got me thinking, so if anyone else reads this and feels the same, please feel free to like the previous post.  

Edited August 28, 2020 by Jimbokav1971

[Jimbokav1971]

I've got to admit. It's hard to get going after a loss like that.

I just need to look at the long term picture I think and hope that we get some defenders through soon.

I also think I need to have a look at defenders who have left and see who can come back in. It's going to be a tough few seasons. 

[scousevasey]

5 minutes ago, Jimbokav1971 said:

Lots of good points in there but I wanted to pick up on this one 1st. 

I don't think it's a matter of not selling players, but selling players with a clear direction of "selling player x will allow us to keep player x and player z". Everything seems to be on an individual basis with little "overall" strategy, although I appreciate that's not the easiest thing to implement. In an ideal situation they would sell the single most valuable asset each season, provided that is that they weren't all in similar positions. Selling 3x defenders and little else in 1 season is a killer, but at the same time money talks and they know the costs that will be incurred every year in terms of the Youth system, so maybe they need to make hay when the sin shines because there is no guarantee that the production line, (and linked income), will continue. We also know that they don't count for the value of add-on clauses anywhere. In a perfect World all these things would be factored in. The thing is, it's extremely hard to do that when there is no guarantee that any of these clauses will generate any cash at all. 

The next level AI is for the board to tell you that they expect you to generate xx income via player sales this season, and if you don't then they will. At least you will know where you stand then. And I'm not saying that you shouldn't accept a £200M bid for anyone, (and I also see your point about the fee being 300x the value), but there has to be a smarter way for the AI to make it's decisions. 

[Edit]

ps. @scousevasey If I could like your post multiple times then I would because it's really interesting and it has got me thinking, so if anyone else reads this and feels the same, please feel free to like the previous post.  

I agree with that idea.

I was just musing that in the same way the tycoon/underwriter models are there, there should be a 'draft and develop' (for wont of a better phrase), where the aim is to be a selling club, maybe linked to club reputation, and then a youth-centric board, who want to model the club on the La Masia/Klopp's 11 scouser thought, and then there are metrics to fit in that.

Ideally it would be part of a development of the club vision - what annoys me about the current system is there is a 5-year plan, that changes every year - it would be better if there were club goals that were fixed after negotiation, like earning £x from sales (or even £y transfer net) by a certain date, and a tracker on this that means you can judge whether you need to shift a few minor bodies regularly, or if one big sale would cover it.  For a lower league club, there could be that one sale that makes the difference.  Or a clause that then comes into play similar to the massive influx from JFC.  For a mid-tier club, who have a decent academy (I am thinking about Southampton in real life) they could look to sell 4-6 players over 2-3 seasons, that if they go to the top-6 teams then it covers the budget.  Then for a bigger club in a smaller league, they look to buy from smaller clubs, then sell to bigger clubs to gain the net profit.

 

If it was part of the club vision, then it would be easier to be part of the dialogue with the board, saying 'Don't sell this player as it would leave us short, but I will look to profit from someone else soon'.

And knowing that in previous versions you get AI clubs that have only 1 CB but then 8-10 striking options, I wouldn't expect them to be too sensible in the balanced squad building too soon

[scousevasey]

15 minutes ago, Jimbokav1971 said:

Selling 3x defenders and little else in 1 season is a killer, but at the same time money talks and they know the costs that will be incurred every year in terms of the Youth system, so maybe they need to make hay when the sin shines because there is no guarantee that the production line, (and linked income), will continue.

 

12 minutes ago, Jimbokav1971 said:

I just need to look at the long term picture I think and hope that we get some defenders through soon.

I also think I need to have a look at defenders who have left and see who can come back in. It's going to be a tough few seasons. 

To be honest, I didn't look at the positions, more the huge swing from value to bid, so wasn't aware that the board were decimating one part of the squad.  The saving grace is that it isn't your Jahn Regensburg save, where selling players, and minimum age rule meant you didn't have any players at certain positions

[Jimbokav1971]

3 minutes ago, scousevasey said:

To be honest, I didn't look at the positions, more the huge swing from value to bid, so wasn't aware that the board were decimating one part of the squad.  The saving grace is that it isn't your Jahn Regensburg save, where selling players, and minimum age rule meant you didn't have any players at certain positions

You are of course correct.

However my therapist has asked that you kindly refrain from future mention of the J...Ja...Jah...Jahn.... that German save. 

[scousevasey]

1 minute ago, Jimbokav1971 said:

However my therapist has asked that you kindly refrain from future mention of the J...Ja...Jah...Jahn.... that German save. 

They pop up in the news items of my European save, currently in Switzerland, and trying to head north.   Each time I see them, I am reminded of the struggle you faced - and remember to avoid trying the same thing

[Jimbokav1971]

Transfer policy. May 2047. 

It's not all bad news though. We have some strength in depth in some places and I think the answer is that I need to be more proactive in selling players so that the board don't want to become involved. 

Strikers. 

(44c) Hamilton (F.Pro) * is still a teenager and this his 1st season playing senior football. I think he will be my 1st choice striker next season as we look to boost his development. 

(41l) Mike Burns (Merc) * is a player I don't actually like but I have extended his contract and I plan on playing him enough to generate some interest and then selling him. The problem is that he made 12(17) appearances last season and only scored 3 goals. 

(39a) Harri (Pro) * is a player that I have a soft spot for, quite simply because he has scored so many goals for us. While my love for him knows no bounds, his PA is extremely limited and I think he has probably reached his limit now looking at his stars. That's still makes him a better than decent squad player at this level. The fact that he has a Model Pro personality just makes it even better. His scoring record for us over the last 8 seasons is simply ridiculous. 

(34c) Guy Bacon (Driven) * has just signed a new 2 year contract. My thinking is that he wasn't valued at much and if clubs came in for other strikers, he would be a decent player to keep at the club for the next few years. 

So that's our best 4 strikers, (even if I don't like 1 of them), but we do have more depth. 

(43e) Mario (JAM) (L.Det) * is probably next in line to move into our rotating 4 if and when I manage to sell (41l) Mike Burns (Merc) *.

(45f) Tucker (Unamb) is someone who I really like, but I need to get him 1st team games somewhere. 

(47c) Doyle (IRL) (Bal) * is someone that I have high hopes of. 

That's 7 in the the production line and ideally I would sell 1 per season. I think we've got no chance of getting promoted this season so I don't mind starting (41l) Mike Burns (Merc) * to generate some interest.

Get him in. Get him scoring. Get him sold. Next! 

[Jimbokav1971]

End of Season Summary. May 2047. 

League 1. So close, but no cigar. 

FA Cup. All I cared about this season was the league. 

Carabao Cup. Who cares. 

Leasing.com Cup. Who cares. 

FA Youth Cup. 5th Round again is decent. The kids are doing better than the Seniors.

U18 Div3 South-West. (We've moved from South-East to South-West again). 

U18 Div 3 Cup. Lost in the Semi's.

Goal-scoring keepers. (33e) Lee Ward (NIR) (Bal) scrored 4 goals in 32 games before he left and then (43f) Fabian (JAM) (Pro) came in and scored 5 goals in 21 games. 

Overall Best XI. 

Awards.

League 1 Player of the Year. 

Team of the Year. 

Squad by Appearances. 

Discipline. A little subdued in this area this season. All a bit calm, (until we got to the Playoff Final!) 

Special mention should go to (40c) Paul Stovell (F.Amb) who was sent off twice this season.  Unfortunately he no longer plays for us. 

Finances. It's looking good, but it's amazing how quickly it dwindles away. I'm hoping that the DoF will do a deal for the 50% clause on at least 1 of the players we sold this season when they finish their loan spell with us. 

Income. We sold players to the value of £25.6M this season. Considering our bank balance is only £29.3M I think that explains the need to do so. 

Expenditure. Youth setup costs are £4.7M so as far as I'm concerned I need to bring in more than that in fees each season, whether by transfer fees or clauses. 

Facilities. Still developing nicely. 

Transfers. I had to work really hard at transfers and loans this season. I'm pretty sure I'm not going to put that much effort in each season. 

Tracker. Despite only having 2 disciplinary fines all season, we still did reasonably well on cards, despite a relatively low number of actual fouls. Our red card count was low though. 

We must be close to having a new record league goal-scorer. I think that's likely to go next season barring injury. 

Edited August 28, 2020 by Jimbokav1971

[Jimbokav1971]

Facilities. May 2047. 

[Jimbokav1971]

Squad depth. Jun 2047. 

I've never really looked at this page so let's have a look and see what it's like. 

3.0 CA stars would seem to be a minimum.

2 strikers is decent to start with, because we know there is more depth below that. 

3 central midfielders is ok, and I know there is more depth, but the wide positions are a problem. 

We have no left back, 1 centre-back and 1 right back. 

Yeah. No GK wasn't exactly a surprise. 

[Pompeyboyz]

4 minutes ago, Jimbokav1971 said:

Squad depth. Jun 2047. 

I've never really looked at this page so let's have a look and see what it's like. 

3.0 CA stars would seem to be a minimum.

2 strikers is decent to start with, because we know there is more depth below that. 

3 central midfielders is ok, and I know there is more depth, but the wide positions are a problem. 

We have no left back, 1 centre-back and 1 right back. 

Yeah. No GK wasn't exactly a surprise. 

Pretty sure when you look at that page, you can set the minimum level. 3* is default

[Jimbokav1971]

Squad depth continued. Jun 2047. 

We might not be very good in terms of CA, but let's have a look at PA. I would have set it to 4.0 PA but I don't seem to be able to set it higher than 3.0

5 strikers looks a bit more promising in terms of PA. 

ML is still a problem with just (44b) Big Don (JAM)(Bal)6'5" *.
MC is an area of strength with loads of options. (46a) Gérard (FRA) (F.Pro), (45d) Ndlovu (ZIM) (F.Pro) *, (47b) Pratley (Bal) *, (38b) Kuchar (CZE) (Bal) *, (40b) Gilchrist (SCO)(F.Amb) *, (47d) Frecklington (L.Heart) * and (38a) Usman (SWE) Bal *.
MR is still a problem with just (44a) Gray (SCO) (Real) *.

DL is still a problem. I had planned to sell (42g) Gillespie (SCO) (L.Det) but I don't think that's the best idea as he is our only option now. 
DC might still be an area of strength despite the fact that we have just lost our best 2 players in this area. 
DR is still a problem with just (43j) Richard Jenkins *.

GK is actually an area of strength, at least as far as PA is concerned. (43f) Fabian (JAM) (Pro) * is 1st choice, (47a) Best (F.Det) * his long-term successor and (40d) Giertl (SVK) (F.Pro) * the backup.

This system looking at the PA seems to be a far better fit for my style of play and management and I quite look at it. What it has told me straight away is that if I'm going to sell anyone, then it needs to be a striker and/or a central midfielder. I knew that, but it's good to see it there in front of me. 

I know that PA isn't always accurate, but there is 1 thing it being wrong on day 1 of a Youth Intake, and quite another it still being wrong after a few years. 

[Jimbokav1971]

24 minutes ago, Pompeyboyz said:

Pretty sure when you look at that page, you can set the minimum level. 3* is default

This is all I can see. 

I can set it to 3 options but 3.0 is the highest. 

[Jimbokav1971]

This is another page I haven't used before. 

It can be a little misleading because players can appear in multiple positions, but it's a decent snapshot. 

CA.

PA.

Edited August 28, 2020 by Jimbokav1971

[Sonic Youth]

6 hours ago, Jimbokav1971 said:

This is another page I haven't used before. 

It can be a little misleading because players can appear in multiple positions, but it's a decent snapshot. 

CA.

PA.

Post 1234!

Interesting developments for Irchester, and was a bit sad to see that this season you died by the sword that you’re living by for this save.

The other note of interest, and something you say all through this thread, and look like might be recognising, is how you judge your players. Some you hang on to even though you can see the damage they do because they’re so close to a marker (Gk Ward, sounds like the Neymar project of 100 goals!), others are not noticed/given a try because of the same reason. Loyalty to a player is good, but not to the point that the board start flexing their fingers to accept transfers because team form is affected. That’s what this season feels like to me, that you should have been promoted automatically. Reminds me of early in Ben’s save in Brazil when he had that awful season. And that’s why I feel optimistic about next season.

I am curious though how your backroom staff looks, and who looks after your games. 

I’m also quietly curious what’s going to happen with the mentoring, especially when you’ve got a MPro in your team as a star!

Bring it, next season 

[Jimbokav1971]

2 hours ago, Sonic Youth said:

Interesting developments for Irchester, and was a bit sad to see that this season you died by the sword that you’re living by for this save.

That wasn't lost on me at all. I have to just take it on the chin because that particular problem is very much one of my own design. 

[Jimbokav1971]

Meh! 

I lost the save I made last night so have basically lost the Playoffs and a close-season. 

I will play them again ensuring that I get to but lose the Final. 

[Jimbokav1971]

2 hours ago, Sonic Youth said:

The other note of interest, and something you say all through this thread, and look like might be recognising, is how you judge your players. Some you hang on to even though you can see the damage they do because they’re so close to a marker (Gk Ward, sounds like the Neymar project of 100 goals!), others are not noticed/given a try because of the same reason. Loyalty to a player is good, but not to the point that the board start flexing their fingers to accept transfers because team form is affected. That’s what this season feels like to me, that you should have been promoted automatically. Reminds me of early in Ben’s save in Brazil when he had that awful season. And that’s why I feel optimistic about next season.

You are both right and wrong at the same time here. 

The GK (33e) Ward was partly about achieving a milestone, but also circumstances seemed to just transpire to leave me with few other options. You have to remember that I dropped him back in 2042, but his replacement was (39c) Mendoza and he left, but I have known for a while now that he was a weak link in the side, but at the same time he was still the best GK available, (Remember I can't just go out and buy a new one). Of the 2 GK's that we have produced who are better than him, 1 is the Colombian GK (39c) Mendoza at Barnsley who they see as their long-term GK I think and want stupid money for, and the other is the guy I just resigned, (Gierti the Slovakian). I wasn't able to re-sign him until this season. Unfortunately though, he simply isn't as good as Ward, (it's not even that close), so basically that means that I had no GK's outside the club who I could sign who were better than Ward. That leaves me with the other GK's at the club. 

(47a) Best seems to be the star of the show, but he is very much PA rather than CA, and although I believe in blooding players early, he is way off the pace at the moment. 

(43f) Fabian is the guy who I have promoted to play in the 1st team and while he did well, there is little comparison between the 2 players. Ward is simply a better more rounded GK. 

(40d) Gierti might have been re-signed, but he really isn't good. If I have to play him there is a problem. 

The problem isn't that (33e) Ward wasn't good enough. The problem is that we didn't have anyone better so there didn't seem to be a reason to make the change while we were going for promotion. 

My original plan was for him to score about 8 goals a season and that would allow him to hit 100 league goals and I would get rid of him at the end of next season, but it became obvious early this season that he wasn't going to score 16 goals in 2 seasons so either he wasn't going to hit the 100 goal mark or I was going to have to give him longer, and I didn't want to give him longer. This season I effectively decided that I would use him to get us promoted and then next season I would start with someone else. Anyone else. Because of that I didn't offer him a new contract and then turned down a bid from Portsmouth I think, who are in the Championship. That seemed to be the final straw and his form fell off a cliff. Now the Summer window is closed and He's all I've got. You have to remember that (43f) Fabian has come on leaps and bounds over the last year. When I made this decision, (at the beginning of the 2046/47 season), (43f) Fabian was miles off what he is now. Now it's close and I'm sure he will soon surpass (33e) Ward, but back then there just wasn't a decision to be made in there here and now. It was all about something that needed resolving in the future. At the same time, the 1 GK that I really did want to re-sign, (ideally on loan), was (39c) Mendoza, but Barnsley would just not play ball. In any case, Portsmouth interest in (33e) Ward vanished after the window closed, (I'm guessing they signed someone else), and the only clubs interested in him now are league 2 clubs, (which is where he eventually ended up moving to), and let's be honest, I think that's his level. By way of a comparison, when I decided to sell (33e) Ward in the Jan window, (43f) Fabian was on loan at a struggling League 2 side himself, (and had to be recalled), and these were his 1st senior appearances. He played 23 games for them and only kept 2 clean sheets. 

There was no way he was ready to play for us back then. 

With regards to the board accepting transfer offers because team form is affected by..... morale... or something, that hasn't happened. The board have accepted offers because bids came in that were 300x the value of the player and we have high costs because of our facilities and low income because we play in League 1 and have a small stadium. There is no link between the GK situation and the board accepting offers this season. The 3 big deals were all done in August this season, (and in the end the deal we accepted for each was a deal of my making rather than one the board accepted). There was no problem with the GK situation back then. (33e) Ward was the bet GK for at least the next season. It was only once the window closed and Portsmouth had signed someone else that the problem arose. 

I've got an old save from Jun 2046 so let me show you the GK options I had back then and hopefully it will make more sense. 

This is from Jun 2046, (so the end of the previous season). On a really basic level, (33e) Ward is 2.5 CA and (43f) Fabian is 2.0 CA. I use the CA stars as a general tool, but I also look at individual players so let's have a look at what my options were like then, (and honestly feel free to tell me who the best GK is because I might have been blinded by milestones, which is why I used the comparison tool earlier and it seemed to back up my decision even half a season later).

So this was basically my choice back at the start of last season. I don't think there is any comparison. I think that (33e) Ward is better than (43f) Fabian by some distance, (although he's not great). Had we not been going for promotion & had he not been nearing 100 goals, I think I would have just binned off (33e) Ward back then, but primarily because we were going for promotion, I decided to stick with CA over PA. Even with the benefit of hindsight, I'm not sure now if (43f) Fabian would have been a better choice at the beginning of the season because he is so poor. I probably think I worked it as well as I could in that I played (33e) Ward for the 1st half of the season why (43f) Fabian went on loan, and then made the swap in January. If I had kept (43f) Fabian at the club but not played him then it would have limited his development so it's a bit of a double edged sword. 

I went over this last night myself when I was posting the comparison bits, because at the time I wondered if I had made the right decision. If most of you think that you would have chosen (43f) Fabian ahead of (33e) Ward, (even with hindsight), then perhaps I was wrong, but I don't see it.

I have mentioned a few times recently that I have been "surprised" by the progress of this player or that player, and that's because there are 3 very distinct groups within the squad. 

We have U18's who are left in the U18's because they are not good enough for the Senior squad. 
We have over 18's who are in the reserves because they are not good enough for the Senior squad. 
We have the Senior squad which might include U18's who are either good enough for the Senior squad or who appear to have significant potential so that I play them before they are really ready. 

The development of some players in the U18's squad has been so significant that when I occasionally have an injury or suspension in the senior squad that means I need to select someone in the match squad from outside, I see a youngster I don't really know high up the list when I rank them by CA. I don't only use the CA stars as a tool, but it is my 1st point of reference. In the above example, (33e) Ward was 2.5 CA and (43f) Fabian was 2.0 CA so that's an indication that one is better than the other. It has to be close for me to check. I'm unlikely for example to consider playing a 2.0 CA player instead of a 3.0 CA player unless the reason for playing them is high PA and I am forcing them in early. Does that make sense? 

[Jimbokav1971]

3 hours ago, Sonic Youth said:

I am curious though how your backroom staff looks, and who looks after your games. 

My games are managed by my Ass Man. 

I don't really want to go through posting all the staff profiles, but you get a fair amount of info from their nicknames. Hopefully that's enough. 

Some of them haven't got nicknames yet sorry. I've also got quite a few out of contract that I need to sort. 

[Pompeyboyz]

12 minutes ago, Jimbokav1971 said:

You are both right and wrong at the same time here. 

The GK (33e) Ward was partly about achieving a milestone, but also circumstances seemed to just transpire to leave me with few other options. You have to remember that I dropped him back in 2042, but his replacement was (39c) Mendoza and he left, but I have known for a while now that he was a weak link in the side, but at the same time he was still the best GK available, (Remember I can't just go out and buy a new one). Of the 2 GK's that we have produced who are better than him, 1 is the Colombian GK (39c) Mendoza at Barnsley who they see as their long-term GK I think and want stupid money for, and the other is the guy I just resigned, (Gierti the Slovakian). I wasn't able to re-sign him until this season. Unfortunately though, he simply isn't as good as Ward, (it's not even that close), so basically that means that I had no GK's outside the club who I could sign who were better than Ward. That leaves me with the other GK's at the club. 

(47a) Best seems to be the star of the show, but he is very much PA rather than CA, and although I believe in blooding players early, he is way off the pace at the moment. 

(43f) Fabian is the guy who I have promoted to play in the 1st team and while he did well, there is little comparison between the 2 players. Ward is simply a better more rounded GK. 

(40d) Gierti might have been re-signed, but he really isn't good. If I have to play him there is a problem. 

The problem isn't that (33e) Ward wasn't good enough. The problem is that we didn't have anyone better so there didn't seem to be a reason to make the change while we were going for promotion. 

My original plan was for him to score about 8 goals a season and that would allow him to hit 100 league goals and I would get rid of him at the end of next season, but it became obvious early this season that he wasn't going to score 16 goals in 2 seasons so either he wasn't going to hit the 100 goal mark or I was going to have to give him longer, and I didn't want to give him longer. This season I effectively decided that I would use him to get us promoted and then next season I would start with someone else. Anyone else. Because of that I didn't offer him a new contract and then turned down a bid from Portsmouth I think, who are in the Championship. That seemed to be the final straw and his form fell off a cliff. Now the Summer window is closed and He's all I've got. You have to remember that (43f) Fabian has come on leaps and bounds over the last year. When I made this decision, (at the beginning of the 2046/47 season), (43f) Fabian was miles off what he is now. Now it's close and I'm sure he will soon surpass (33e) Ward, but back then there just wasn't a decision to be made in there here and now. It was all about something that needed resolving in the future. At the same time, the 1 GK that I really did want to re-sign, (ideally on loan), was (39c) Mendoza, but Barnsley would just not play ball. In any case, Portsmouth interest in (33e) Ward vanished after the window closed, (I'm guessing they signed someone else), and the only clubs interested in him now are league 2 clubs, (which is where he eventually ended up moving to), and let's be honest, I think that's his level. By way of a comparison, when I decided to sell (33e) Ward in the Jan window, (43f) Fabian was on loan at a struggling League 2 side himself, (and had to be recalled), and these were his 1st senior appearances. He played 23 games for them and only kept 2 clean sheets. 

There was no way he was ready to play for us back then. 

With regards to the board accepting transfer offers because team form is affected by..... morale... or something, that hasn't happened. The board have accepted offers because bids came in that were 300x the value of the player and we have high costs because of our facilities and low income because we play in League 1 and have a small stadium. There is no link between the GK situation and the board accepting offers this season. The 3 big deals were all done in August this season, (and in the end the deal we accepted for each was a deal of my making rather than one the board accepted). There was no problem with the GK situation back then. (33e) Ward was the bet GK for at least the next season. It was only once the window closed and Portsmouth had signed someone else that the problem arose. 

I've got an old save from Jun 2046 so let me show you the GK options I had back then and hopefully it will make more sense. 

This is from Jun 2046, (so the end of the previous season). On a really basic level, (33e) Ward is 2.5 CA and (43f) Fabian is 2.0 CA. I use the CA stars as a general tool, but I also look at individual players so let's have a look at what my options were like then, (and honestly feel free to tell me who the best GK is because I might have been blinded by milestones, which is why I used the comparison tool earlier and it seemed to back up my decision even half a season later).

So this was basically my choice back at the start of last season. I don't think there is any comparison. I think that (33e) Ward is better than (43f) Fabian by some distance, (although he's not great). Had we not been going for promotion & had he not been nearing 100 goals, I think I would have just binned off (33e) Ward back then, but primarily because we were going for promotion, I decided to stick with CA over PA. Even with the benefit of hindsight, I'm not sure now if (43f) Fabian would have been a better choice at the beginning of the season because he is so poor. I probably think I worked it as well as I could in that I played (33e) Ward for the 1st half of the season why (43f) Fabian went on loan, and then made the swap in January. If I had kept (43f) Fabian at the club but not played him then it would have limited his development so it's a bit of a double edged sword. 

I went over this last night myself when I was posting the comparison bits, because at the time I wondered if I had made the right decision. If most of you think that you would have chosen (43f) Fabian ahead of (33e) Ward, (even with hindsight), then perhaps I was wrong, but I don't see it.

I have mentioned a few times recently that I have been "surprised" by the progress of this player or that player, and that's because there are 3 very distinct groups within the squad. 

We have U18's who are left in the U18's because they are not good enough for the Senior squad. 
We have over 18's who are in the reserves because they are not good enough for the Senior squad. 
We have the Senior squad which might include U18's who are either good enough for the Senior squad or who appear to have significant potential so that I play them before they are really ready. 

The development of some players in the U18's squad has been so significant that when I occasionally have an injury or suspension in the senior squad that means I need to select someone in the match squad from outside, I see a youngster I don't really know high up the list when I rank them by CA. I don't only use the CA stars as a tool, but it is my 1st point of reference. In the above example, (33e) Ward was 2.5 CA and (43f) Fabian was 2.0 CA so that's an indication that one is better than the other. It has to be close for me to check. I'm unlikely for example to consider playing a 2.0 CA player instead of a 3.0 CA player unless the reason for playing them is high PA and I am forcing them in early. Does that make sense? 

Doing a quick side by side, I would agree that (33e) Ward was the better option of the two at that time.

Question i have is how much first team experience did you give to (43f) Fabian though?  You never used him in any League matches up to swapping out (33e) Ward.  Was (43f) Fabian used in cup game at all?

[Jimbokav1971]

3 hours ago, Sonic Youth said:

I’m also quietly curious what’s going to happen with the mentoring, especially when you’ve got a MPro in your team as a star!

I mentioned in a post yesterday that I can't really be bothered with mentoring at the moment. Honestly, the transfer windows are proving such hard work that it's just too much. 

We do indeed have a Model Pro player, which reminds me I need to change his nickname. 

The big thing though is that we don't just have a Model pro player. We have a Model Pro player who is one of the top influencers at the club. 

I might be lazy, but I'm not so lazy that I can ignore a Model Pro player who is also a Team Leader. @_Ben_would have a fit. 

I will force myself to start experimenting with just 1 group, see if I can get some F.Pro's popped to Pro and then go from there. (Thanks for the nudge). 

[Jimbokav1971]

11 minutes ago, Pompeyboyz said:

Doing a quick side by side, I would agree that (33e) Ward was the better option of the two at that time.

Question i have is how much first team experience did you give to (43f) Fabian though?  You never used him in any League matches up to swapping out (33e) Ward.  Was (43f) Fabian used in cup game at all?

No. None at all. 

He's 20 years old now. 

He came through in 2043/44. 
2044/45 he played in the U18's. 
2045/46 he played in the U18's.
2046/47 I think he might have been too old for the U18's here so should have gone out on loan but didn't. (I've just checked and he was too old for U18's). n
2047/48 Went out on loan to League 2 and then recalled and played for us. 

The only Senior games he played in were on loan in the 1st pat of the 2047/48 season and then for us in the 2nd part of that season. 

I don't know if I couldn't get anyone to come in for him for the 2046/47 season or if I just dropped the ball. If I'm honest I think it's more likely that i just missed it. His birthday is in June and I bet I thought he had another year in the U18's. 

Edited August 29, 2020 by Jimbokav1971

[Pompeyboyz]

In my opinion I think you did drop the ball there with (43f) Fabian

Had I been in your shoes, I would be blooding him in at least the Leasing.com(Checkatrade/EFL Trophy) Cup if not Carabao Cup too to give him a taste of first team action.  

What I also do at seasons end, depending on if I'm already promoted/champions, is to rotate and bring in some younger players in matches where it won't matter about the result.

[Jimbokav1971]

9 minutes ago, Pompeyboyz said:

In my opinion I think you did drop the ball there with (43f) Fabian

Had I been in your shoes, I would be blooding him in at least the Leasing.com(Checkatrade/EFL Trophy) Cup if not Carabao Cup too to give him a taste of first team action.  

What I also do at seasons end, depending on if I'm already promoted/champions, is to rotate and bring in some younger players in matches where it won't matter about the result.

That's a fair point and definitely relates to chasing the 100 goal milestone. 

I think my biggest mistake was not loaning him out of that 3rd season. If I had loaned him out for the 3rd season then maybe he would have already have surpassed (33e) Ward. It's hard work getting them all out on loan though. 

If I leave it to the DoF who seems to agree to loans at levels/squad status that I don't like. Need to find a balance I think. 

[Jimbokav1971]

I've just played the Playoff Final again, (and saved right before just in case I had to re-load). You wouldn't believe how the game went. 

10 yellows and 3 reds.  

[rodesire]

beautiful throw

[_Ben_]

20 hours ago, Jimbokav1971 said:

If I rank my squad by CA, then these are the personalities at the top. 

I know this is nothing in comparison to threads like that of @_Ben_but it's huge progress for us. 

This is wonderful!

If you consider that I sourced both my first M.Pro (Jaja) and M.Citizen (Edersen) and I started in the third tier and not the tenth with far more quality players and facilities at a time where, realistically, my players generated and developed then could play at the top level - you've had it way harder than me.

You're right - it's not perfect, yet, but at least you're not going to be falling into that trap of 'losing' determination now to fit in with the rest of the squad.

 

6 hours ago, Sonic Youth said:

That’s what this season feels like to me, that you should have been promoted automatically. Reminds me of early in Ben’s save in Brazil when he had that awful season. And that’s why I feel optimistic about next season.

Ahh! I'd pushed that out of my head! But yeah, when you're in for the long run, as long as you learn something from it, you'll come out stronger the other side.

3 hours ago, Jimbokav1971 said:

I might be lazy, but I'm not so lazy that I can ignore a Model Pro player who is also a Team Leader. @_Ben_would have a fit. 

I will force myself to start experimenting with just 1 group, see if I can get some F.Pro's popped to Pro and then go from there. (Thanks for the nudge). 

Make use of him! Get him mentoring anyone who you think could be close and make sure to welcome those new signings (back) as every little helps. If you can convert just one F.Pro to Pro and then to M.Pro, you're going to be able to rinse and repeat until you're at a level whereby it maintains itself, which is where I am at now with 7xM.Cit and 7xM.Pro with a further 3 Pro who are yet to turn 23 and potentially pop to M.Pro.

[Jimbokav1971]

League 1 sponsorship. Jun 2047.

[Jimbokav1971]

Contract extensions. Jun 2047.

I've got a little strategy that I use for young players and their contracts, and it's just about to change so I though I would mention it.

Earlier in the save we had a player poached who was on a Youth contract, (can't remember who it was now but he went to Notts County). With that in mind it makes sense to offer pre-contracts to player on Youth contracts, that stop other clubs from nicking them and then automatically kick in on his 17th birthday. 

• If a player comes through the intake aged 16 or below and looks decent then I offer him a youth contract quickly. As mentioned above, the purpose of this "pre-contract" is to protect the player from being poached by other clubs. 
• If a player comes through the intake aged 17 or older, then although you can sign them to a youth contract, (and I do), you also want to go back to them a short while later and offer them a proper pro contract.
• When you go to offer a player a proper pro contract, (either on the players 17th birthday or shortly after they have come through the intake as a 17 year old), then if you think the player has potential, then it might be worth adding in clauses that keep him tied to the club for longer, but you might have to pay a higher wage as a result, or a higher signing on fee, (or both). 
• The 1st main clause is the Optional contract extension by club. This allows you to extend the existing contract by by the specified number of years, and all the other contract info remains for the extended period. Beware though. If you offer a pre-contract to a player aged 16 and under, and you include and optional contract extension by club clause, then although it will appear in the contract, YOU WILL NOT BE ABLE TO ACTIVATE IT. Effectively you have to pay for it to be added to the contract, but you will not be able to benefit from it. It's just a waste. This means that you can offer 3 year contracts to a player on their 17th birthday, and include a +3 year option meaning that you keep them at the club for a minimum of 6 years, taking them to their 23rd birthday. 
• 
• The way my strategy is changing relates to another clause and this was actually instigated at the players request. 
• As well as the +3 Optional Contract Extension by club, you can also offer an auto Contract Extension after Promotion. This effectively means that, (assuming of course that we get promoted during the period of the contract), you get to keep the player on this deal for the initial 3 years, then the 3 year that are triggered after promotion, and another 3 years that you can choose to trigger yourself. So effectively 9 seasons right from the off. 
• 

Of course a 9 year contract like this might have the player in uproar and extremely unhappy, but at the same time it's your choice and it's a hell of a weapon if you think there is a chance of you going up. 

This "contract extension after promotion" is usually requested by the player/agent, because it's likely that promotion might leave them surplus to requirements at a higher level, and this protects them. If you are like me though and you refuse to sign contracts with certain clauses, then it might just be a way to really tie a player down for a long period on a very small wage. 

Where possible I refuse to agree contracts with the following clauses. 

• Yearly wage rise. 
• Promotion wage rise. 
• Unused substitute fee. 
• Sell on fee percentage. 

In the whole of this save I haven't signed a single contract with any of the 4 above clauses. If and when I am forced to do so, (over my dead body), I will let you know. 

Does anyone do something different?