danej Posted May 18, 2023 Share Posted May 18, 2023 If you want to succeed in the game I think it is essential to have a sensible long term strategy regarding your economy and wage budget. A critical factor here is this question: What should be the maximum wage for a given player? This is a complex question. Lately I have been thinking - perhaps the best way to learn about this is to collect data. So I have started collecting relevant data. Feel free to give me similar input. In any case I might update this thread/data collection if and when I gather more data and know more than I do know. The idea is that any player can be overpaid. It goes for a player where the scout report says that his current ability is at Vanarama North/South level. And it goes for a world class player. Even PSG has a limited budget, and overpaying for a player will harm your club in the long run. Both because it ties up too much of the wage budget. And not least because overpaying can make it more difficult than it should be to offload the player on attractive terms. Wage OK too high wage Level £ p/w £ p/w Club Player World class Leading PL 300.000 Man Utd Casemiro Good PL 170.000 Man Utd Eriksen Unspecified PL Decent PL 100.000 Man Utd Telles Leading Championshp 45.000 Man Utd Tuanzebe Good Championship 50.000 Man Utd Brandon Williams Unspecified Championship Decent Championship 14.750 Man Utd Benjamin Dominguez Decent Championship 25.000 Man Utd Pellistri Leading League One Good League One Unspecified League One Decent League One 13.750 Man Utd Daniel Gore Leading League Two 5.000 Man Utd Nathan Bishop Good League Two Unspecified League Two Decent League Two Leading Vanarama Good Vanarama 2.500 Man Utd Charlie McNeill + Will Fish Unspecified Vanarama Decent Vanarama 2.300 Man Utd Ethan Ennis Leading Vanarama North/South Good Vanarama North/South Unspecified Vanarama North/South 1.100 Man Utd Elyh Harrison Decent Vanarama North/South Examples that hopefully help understand this spreadsheet: - Paying a leading Premier League level player 300k p/w or more could be problematic. It is probably difficult to offload him. - Paying a Decent Championship level player 14.75k p/w or more could be problematic. It is probably difficult to offload him. - Paying a decent Championship level player 25k p/w or less is fine. You should be able to offload him when needed. - Paying a good Vanarama level player 2.5k p/w or less is fine. You should be able to offload him when needed. Note that I have deliberately emphasized two contradicting cases, those at Championship level. Of course both of those statements can't be true. It can't both be fine to pay a decent Championship level player up to 25k p/w, and at the same time be too much to pay such a player 14.75k p/w. This illustrates that my data collection is in its infancy. The system is far from perfect. I need to collect more data and to improve the system in order for it to be more useful. But this is a starting point. In any case I think I am onto something important here. It feels critically important to make wise decisions as to when to extend contracts and when not to. And it feels important to gather a great deal of knowledge about what is a reasonable level of wages at various leagues. Also, I of course wonder about how to improve this early version of the system. What creates the contradicting cases mentioned above? At the moment I suspect that age/potential ability is a huge factor. It might be reasonable to give a higher wage to a young player vs. and old player where both have similar current ability. My impression so far is that it is easier to offload the young player when you would wish to do so. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cloud9 Posted May 18, 2023 Share Posted May 18, 2023 (edited) 6 hours ago, danej said: If you want to succeed in the game I think it is essential to have a sensible long term strategy regarding your economy and wage budget. A critical factor here is this question: What should be the maximum wage for a given player? This is a complex question. Lately I have been thinking - perhaps the best way to learn about this is to collect data. So I have started collecting relevant data. Feel free to give me similar input. In any case I might update this thread/data collection if and when I gather more data and know more than I do know. The idea is that any player can be overpaid. It goes for a player where the scout report says that his current ability is at Vanarama North/South level. And it goes for a world class player. Even PSG has a limited budget, and overpaying for a player will harm your club in the long run. Both because it ties up too much of the wage budget. And not least because overpaying can make it more difficult than it should be to offload the player on attractive terms. Wage OK too high wage Level £ p/w £ p/w Club Player World class Leading PL 300.000 Man Utd Casemiro Good PL 170.000 Man Utd Eriksen Unspecified PL Decent PL 100.000 Man Utd Telles Leading Championshp 45.000 Man Utd Tuanzebe Good Championship 50.000 Man Utd Brandon Williams Unspecified Championship Decent Championship 14.750 Man Utd Benjamin Dominguez Decent Championship 25.000 Man Utd Pellistri Leading League One Good League One Unspecified League One Decent League One 13.750 Man Utd Daniel Gore Leading League Two 5.000 Man Utd Nathan Bishop Good League Two Unspecified League Two Decent League Two Leading Vanarama Good Vanarama 2.500 Man Utd Charlie McNeill + Will Fish Unspecified Vanarama Decent Vanarama 2.300 Man Utd Ethan Ennis Leading Vanarama North/South Good Vanarama North/South Unspecified Vanarama North/South 1.100 Man Utd Elyh Harrison Decent Vanarama North/South Examples that hopefully help understand this spreadsheet: - Paying a leading Premier League level player 300k p/w or more could be problematic. It is probably difficult to offload him. - Paying a Decent Championship level player 14.75k p/w or more could be problematic. It is probably difficult to offload him. - Paying a decent Championship level player 25k p/w or less is fine. You should be able to offload him when needed. - Paying a good Vanarama level player 2.5k p/w or less is fine. You should be able to offload him when needed. Note that I have deliberately emphasized two contradicting cases, those at Championship level. Of course both of those statements can't be true. It can't both be fine to pay a decent Championship level player up to 25k p/w, and at the same time be too much to pay such a player 14.75k p/w. This illustrates that my data collection is in its infancy. The system is far from perfect. I need to collect more data and to improve the system in order for it to be more useful. But this is a starting point. In any case I think I am onto something important here. It feels critically important to make wise decisions as to when to extend contracts and when not to. And it feels important to gather a great deal of knowledge about what is a reasonable level of wages at various leagues. Also, I of course wonder about how to improve this early version of the system. What creates the contradicting cases mentioned above? At the moment I suspect that age/potential ability is a huge factor. It might be reasonable to give a higher wage to a young player vs. and old player where both have similar current ability. My impression so far is that it is easier to offload the young player when you would wish to do so. When giving out contracts, what's a good wage for your club is dependent on the financial situation of your club (sponsors, debt, stadium size etc). You have a wage structure, and breaking that a means new/existing contracts will ask for a higher wage. In terms of selling a player, it's not just the wage that impacts if you can sell them. It's also: Players age Team performance Players performance Database loaded Players interest But establishing your wage structure is super important to your specific club. Keep the wages as low as possible and only break the wage structure when it's absolutely necessary. In my current save I'm in the championship, my previous max wage was 9k, but I broke the ceiling to sign an Uruguayan 20 year old for 15k a week who was leaps and bounds better than everyone else in the squad. My wage structure will remain at 15k until it's forced to go up by an exceptional player. As a general rule of thumb, I like to keep my wage ceiling below 100k in my saves, but that's just personal preference. Your club, Man United, is trying to do this IRL with a 200k wage cap at the moment. You might try to implement that in your Man U save then? It sounds like you've inherited their mismanaged wage structure, average players wanting too much money and forcing you to sell them instead of giving them crazy contracts. It's totally up to how you want to manage/how much you value the long term finances of your save. Edited May 18, 2023 by Cloud9 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
danej Posted May 19, 2023 Author Share Posted May 19, 2023 Yes I agree that a sensible wage structure is probably a key aspect in the game. For a long time I have been doing pretty much what is described in the bottom half of this piece, being very aware of what max % of my total wage budget that I want to give to a given player. Depending on wither I consider him a star player, regular starter, backup or youth player (or somewhere in between two of the categories). https://www.guidetofm.com/squad/wages/ 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lfds89 Posted May 19, 2023 Share Posted May 19, 2023 Another link you can check 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
danej Posted May 19, 2023 Author Share Posted May 19, 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, lfds89 said: Another link you can check This looks great, thanks. Edit: Very similar to my link it seems (have only read the first parts as I am writing this). Although this might be slightly off topic. For me, stuff like wage budget discipline is basic by now, I have been doing this for a long time, it is automated. What mostly interests me at this point in time is what can be generally said about a sensible maximum wage relative to relevant paramaters such as current ability, age etc. I would very much like to overpay on a player's wage to the extent that he could be difficult to offload when the time comes. For a club with a good wage budget, excactly this seems to be the biggest pitfall. Edited May 19, 2023 by danej Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cloud9 Posted May 19, 2023 Share Posted May 19, 2023 9 hours ago, danej said: This looks great, thanks. Edit: Very similar to my link it seems (have only read the first parts as I am writing this). Although this might be slightly off topic. For me, stuff like wage budget discipline is basic by now, I have been doing this for a long time, it is automated. What mostly interests me at this point in time is what can be generally said about a sensible maximum wage relative to relevant paramaters such as current ability, age etc. I would very much like to overpay on a player's wage to the extent that he could be difficult to offload when the time comes. For a club with a good wage budget, excactly this seems to be the biggest pitfall. I would emphasize giving contacts based on the performance you can get out of them, not the level your coaches tell you you're at. If your player plays well and you win things, even pretty mediocre players will have a market. Look at the clubs you'd want to sell to. If the wage is higher than their wages, you're pricing yourself out of a move. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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