RPM_01
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Posts posted by RPM_01
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Long time FM player here looking for a bit of help.
My idea of fun on FM is fairly simple. I want to dominate possession and maintain a 3 in the midfield with the remaining attackers dropping whilst others make runs in behind, a fairly fluid system, however I can't seem to get it to the point where I'm completely happy with it.
Current system is below -
My thought process for each position is this;
FB - Attack; this player looks to move forward to provide width on the left hand side, crossing from the byline to avoid any unnecessary crosses early whilst providing decent defensive cover. Typically this role works well.
IWB - Support; the right back inverts creating part of the three, taking less risks, stopping counters and retaining possession in the midfield. I find this works for the majority of the time.
BWM - Support; this was a tricky role to get right and I'm still not sure it is. I want him to hold position and dribble less. Essentially if he doesn't hold position the middle of the pitch becomes wide open and dribbling more creates a lot more mistakes. I've tried a DM-Su however he doesn't get involved in the game and simply makes a lot less tackles. DLP-Su moves too much from the middle and again leaves us open to counters.
CM - Support; This player dribbles less, passes shorter (if not, lots of cross field passes that again lead to counters) and stays wide. Stays wide allows the 2-3 shape. This player essentially is a CAR/BBM who recycles and maintains a solid shape. He isn't a playmaker and more of another ball winner in that midfield, allowing players ahead to attack more.
CM - Attack; Only PI is to roam, find space and be creative in that final third. AP-At seems to lose possession too much with silly passes. I tend to find a player like Wirtz who likes to run with the ball more to allow him to run up the pitch and open spaces for others.
IF - Support; he roams and creates that dropping deep whilst also to look to run in behind.
W - Attack; another player roaming but my worst position. Output can be good but I tend to find this role tries to run with the ball too much and becomes isolated, losing it a lot of the time. I put on takes less risks but I'm not sure that is the solution. I tried a WM - Attack for this, which does more of the job (dribble more often not hardcoded) but in the press is too deep and allows teams to play more freely along the back line. Any input here would be great.
DLF - Attack; another role I question. Drops deep but also breaks the line, find it hard with AF or other similar roles to maintain enough possession.
Positive mentality; now again not one I want to choose however balanced doesn't press enough. It allows teams to maintain possession in their back line and they control the game from there. I just can't then get my passing right. Quite a few cross field passes which just land on opposition players allowing a counter too easily.
TI's -
Narrow means they're more compact however it still gives a lot of space. Seems to work quite well.
Directness and tempo is a tricky one. Shorter passes does the cross field passes more and the same with tempo even though this can be my downfall at times too with being too slow on the ball. I don't want the meta highest tempo.
I've also tried dribble less but this just holds the team too rigid and doesn't create enough chances.
OOP seems to work ok, it can leave us high but I accept that for the most part. I wonder if dropping the line allows a bit more space to play in at times but it also creates too much space when not in possession.
Here's a typical position on the field of this. I'm trialling with Man United and these players but it does change.
Any tips would be great!
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Not sure if this has been posted but the amount of mistakes top players are making in this beta is incredible.
The majority of highlights on extended seem to stem from a mistake, whether that's my team or theirs.
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Interesting, thank you for your take, will give those combinations a try.
Think I might combine that with play through the middle and take overlap off just to see if I get any better play.
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11 hours ago, khodder said:
What shape are you wanting to create in possession - currently you'll form a sort of 2-2-2-4 in possession with nobody really actively attacking the central defenders. It looks a little bit like when you're attacking the AP will not have any good options to create for and is ending up becoming a pivot point to feed the wingbacks to then cycle back to the AP. Kind of how the Arsenal of last season looked. Big passing circles, no penetration.
Essentially the below, where the AP is the focal point of either distributing to the overlapping winger for a cross, or playing it into the F9 as a give and go or to play a through ball to the IF-A for the assist. The theory behind it is the IF's provide the penetration, acting as strikers, with narrow mentality and stay narrower, which for the most extent works, however it doesn't provide the AP with what I want.
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So I have the below tactic, which in general works well. The aim is to move the ball relatively quickly within a compact unit, with the WB's keeping wider to give us the width. In defence it means we are pushed up but also close together to counter press in the transition.
I also have the AP on stay wider too to help with this but have tried many different variations to make their rating stronger. Whoever seems to play there though has really poor ratings vs the rest of the team. Is it the width of the team hindering him?
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Really interesting thread. Like others I thought I had to give this a try to see the combinations and style of play. When it worked, it worked really well but consistency seemed to be a fairly big issue.
Few questions from me -
- I had to drop the back line as there were so many balls over the top, did you experience that at all? How did you combat it?
- The pressing - did it work the way you wanted? Again on more often it meant they, at times, could play around me very easily but on much more often it felt like they were headless chickens at times, especially the CB's running out leaving lots of space.
- Did you find at times games drifting by? How did you try force the issue at times?
- I found, especially away from home, the width in attack left the pitch very open for counters. I tried adjusting by forcing them outside, which didn't really have the effect I wanted. I also tried narrowing width in attack, which helped with that transition but then felt really hindered in a fluid system. Did you experience that at all?
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Second one especially is prone to being wide open. Counter + extremely high tempo + pass into space just means instability. Maybe look at knocking the tempo down one and taking off counter and pass into space.
I'd also look at your pairings. So IF-At and BBM may, being narrow, try occupy the same space at times, so try and look to a CAR-Su to provide options between that and your WB with a little more defensive cover.
Let me know if that helps!
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Short answer, like Mitja said, is no. I've tried so many different ways, they don't overlap enough or keep the width if the wingers come in narrow. It's a shame really...
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Does an IWB with the overlap instruction mean they will look to overlap when the width narrows? Or does it have no effect?
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Few points to note from me -
Lower tempo doesn't seem to be overly effective this year and passing around the CB's just seem to increase. Move it to standard and you should see a few more chances created for very little positive possession lost.
I personally would change your striker to a supporting role, just so the mez & if-a have more room to move into.
Your higher line with much higher engagement really requires elite CB's from what I've found, are Saliba & Kamara good enough to play that way?
I like your midfield three but they are prone to a counter too. If a mistake is made the BBM and mez (along with be more expressive TI) won't usually be in a position to stop the counter and your DLP will go find the ball, which, at times, can cause issues. I'd suggest changing Rice to maybe DM-D/Anchor/HB.
Your counter doesn't seem to fit the play either. It will, no doubt, cause you to score a few more goals but when you've won the ball back their thought it to support the counter and leave the defensive shape a little more vulnerable.
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This is really good!
I use pretty much this formation and system but have the LB as an IWB too, like you say the FB really doesn’t do what I want it to.
How do you find the IW on the left plays? I run identical roles on both sides yet no matter which player the left IW always has a low average rating!
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I provided concerns pre patch on this game and stated if they were to be fixed it had the potential to be a great version of FM.
After playing a good amount of time now on the patched version I feel the majority of the issues have been addressed -
- Possession is now what it should be, I had to have a look at CB's as mine were still passing around 100 times a game but looking at real stats this isn't too far off at times.
- Playing shape feels more natural again, without the compactness of the previous version.
- Crossing and corners seem to have been nerfed which is great and playing through the middle is more viable again - with through balls being the highest assist type in my team.
- VAR is now much less predictable and can't be seen by the linesman which adds more immersion, I'm sure people will spot a tell but it's harder to see at this point!
- Pressing seems to be slightly better, even though my data hub suggests otherwise and the final element of the pitch is still at 0% despite highest press intensity and line!
I haven't really tried out the IF's since the patch so can't comment on that but my IW is playing exactly how I'd like them too.
Overall I am really enjoying the game again, well done SI for addressing the changes that were needed!
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- Popular Post
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So I've played a few seasons now.
Few points I've noticed (some are spoken about in here and I know are being looked at) -
- Pressing of the defence is a known issue but the ME needs to fix the ambition of the defenders. Very rarely in football do we see the passing between defenders so much as it makes no logical sense and isn't within the spirit of the game. Interestingly the press also ask about this, e.g. you managed to win comfortably 4-0 with only 37% possession?! My question will be how much does this affect the ME when this changes? Do teams become more aggressive and open up more? Or do they create more chances then they do currently?
- The Data Hub is a good addition but with the bugs how usable is it? Winning back possession makes no sense, pass maps are more irrelevant from the point above and other stats are masked with the current issues. It can be used still but not to the extent SI want it to be.
- Team shape feels a little strange and took me a minute to get used to. In possession I'm seeing a more compact shape and without the use of a poacher or advanced forward everything feels too squashed, even if you put an IF-A or RMD on the wing it just doesn't open up the play enough. The trouble I'm finding too is that my CB's are more adventurous too going forward and the team shape just compresses even more. I don't really have much of a choice but to go for a poacher up top to spread the field to what I like, which gives more space for everyone else.
- Crosses are almost to the level of FM20 but there is a small amount of central play in there. I feel like only a small tweak is needed for this to find its balance again.
- Corners have been an issue for a while and if you want to abuse this your defender will score 20+ goals a season, however it can be avoided if you feel like you lose the immersion with this.
- VAR decisions need to have less tells. Linesman running back = goal, standing still means no goal. Can we have it so we won't know?
- NewGen faces, say no more.
- I like the new animations, even though I mainly use 2D, it's nice to see when I do flick over to it.
I struggled to get into FM22 but now have found my groove and am enjoying it more despite the bugs. I think there is potential, with bug fixes, to be the best yet.
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HB is the closest you'll get to this
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4 hours ago, Jack722 said:
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Cons
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Super high possession for teams parking the bus
- I can live with this, since I watch most games on extended, and doesn't seem to affect any results (eg. a defensive team can't just draw every game 0-0 by playing keep ball). But it's obviously not very realistic and ruins a bit of the immersion, while also damaging the credibility of the otherwise brilliant data hub, as you can draw false conclusions.
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Super high possession for teams parking the bus
My question here is, how much will this affect the ME once patched though as well as the results? Will we see sides win more emphatically or will be it be a case of the teams parking the bus have a greater chance as the counter then becomes a bit more of an option?
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Cons
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Depends, if you're on FM22 it is bugged so really can't use possession stats at the moment.
If it is FM21, only things I'd suggest is changing your DM to a DM-D, they tend to recycle possession more instead of trying risky passes. Change the Mez to either a CM-Su or a DLP and open up your left side a little more, maybe change the IWB to a FB-Su or change the IF to a winger to allow passing options. Currently they seem a little bunched together.
Maybe change be more expressive and just up the tempo up a little too!
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ME feels like another step back.
FM21 seemed a huge step up from the previous version, with the inclusion of central play and other tweaks. Sure, it wasn't without fault but was the most enjoyable ME for a while.
FM22 in beta form feels off. If you aren't pressing full on, the pressing feels off and doesn't match what you're asking them to do with lines of engagement. The balanced tactics from previous versions don't really seem to work and putting everyone attack seems to automatically work, which again shouldn't be the case. I'm not sure if anyone else has seen this but I find without everyone on attack players aren't stretching the pitch and it just becomes a tight cluster in the middle, with the CB's even running past midfielders with the ball often, just leaving such an odd shape in possession.
I appreciate this is the beta so hopefully the changes will be made for the full release!
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I've preordered so
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2 minutes ago, Justified said:
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This maybe a very niche suggestion, however I would like it within the tactics so that players always maintain some form of width, with the ability to spread an opposition team.
Take a look at Man City for example, when the IWB cuts inside the winger maintains the width and when the winger is inside the IWB spreads the play by sitting wider. If both of them are sitting narrow you sometimes find the central midfielder providing that width.
Too often I find all players occupying a narrow space, where in a real life situation their logical may tell them to pull wide to create more space.
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I'd look at changing the AF-A if you want more possession. You'll find that players tend to play long more to the AF who's constantly trying to break the line. You'll sacrifice a few chances but not loads if you try the CF-A just make sure it's the right player.
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Can someone tell me what the issues are if you set up like the below -
DLF-Su
IF-At AM-At IF-At
CM-De DLP-Su
WB-Su CD-De CD-De WB-su
SK/GK
I would use with a top team and would accept that the counter is obviously an issue.
My goal is to provide width with the WB's, hold the ball and retain possession through the 2 midfielders and have attacking runs behind the line with the 'attacking 3' along with having the DLF interchanging.
TI's would just be shorter passing and a higher line with the front 4 pressing more.
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2-3-5 possession tactical help
in Tactics, Training & Strategies Discussion
Posted
It's a great point with the DM. The BWM on support is more of a positive mentality and with defend he is now cautious which helps the back line a lot more than I would have thought. I've been trying the AP on support on that left with dribble less, seems to be missing a player between their defence and midfield which may help there and he will drop into the 3 when needed too.