teej9
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Posts posted by teej9
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Excellent thread. I do have a question. Early in the thread, you mention that you don't have to play a high line and press like crazy, but then every system has a high line and presses like crazy. I mean sure, labelling it as defensive is fine, but it's just a high line press like mad without counter-pressing. Or am I missing something?
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I am pretty bad at making a new tactic and often get bogged down tweaking every single match. This never lets anything settle and I get frustrated. This I am going to just run pre-sets with minor tweaking here and there. How are the pre-sets performing this year? Anyone used them?
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7 hours ago, Jonthedon26 said:
It's interesting how different people's thought processes work! I am by no means saying that what you said is not true or incorrect, as it is obviously what you deem the most important thing, however for me the whole point of the game is almost everything but the matches (how I view them anyway). The last few years due to time constraints I have played commentary only and I think I have a lot more fun than most people on the forums. I enjoy all the other side of things, tactics, stats, transfers, squad building etc. I try to judge how my tactics are working by the stats I see rather than the on field representation. Obviously everyone is different and someone, like yourself, sees it completely the opposite, which is absolutely fine, I just find it interesting how different people can have completely different views. Maybe it is because I grew up playing manager games with terrible or no match engines/graphics, and to this day I still enjoy a lot of manager games with rubbish or no engines/graphics such as Out of the Park baseball, Draft Day Sports basketball/football and World of Mixed Martial Arts.
Oh for sure, different strokes for different folks. To be clear, I am not asking for better graphics, I am asking for a better representation of the match engine, so I can react as a manager. A good example is the bad defending that has plagued the series for a while now, its explained that the reason your top class Centerback runs to a ball, stops and looks at it while the opposing ST runs up, takes it and scores, is that there is something happening in the match engine, that the graphics engine cannot show. That is ridiculous to me.
I don't need it to be pretty, just need it to be connected to the match engine.
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Until legitimate match engine improvement happens, I honestly do not care about a single thing here. Got burned by the tire fire that is 23, sticking with 22.
The whole point of the game is matches, if they suck, I really can't be bothered to get excited about being able to slightly alter meeting agendas.
The big question for me is are we still going to fall back on the "well the 3D engine can't show what's really happening in the match engine" excuse? If so, count me out. Remove the 3D if it cannot represent the match engine or redo the match engine in a manner that allows the 3d engine to show it. I still cannot fathom that there was a meeting somewhere that went "hey the graphics engine cannot show anything correctly" "eh, release it anyway"...it amazes me.
Apologies for the ranting, I just love the game and to see it fall so hard so fast is painful.
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2 hours ago, Cloud9 said:
Just seconding this for those sounding frustrated by the engine in 23.
My understanding is that fatigue is one of the huge changes between 22->23. Just gegenpressing and leaving counter-press on all game will have diminishing returns now which wasn't true on previous versions. Rotating the squad and managing fatigue is a huge element in fm23, especially if you're creating a pressing focused system.
Holy hell. That is literally what I was missing. I wasn't pressing all the time, but had other high energy things on. Dribble more, get stuck in etc, all the time. I have removed those and used them situationally and it has made a massive difference to performances.
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Just an awful game engine. To fix this, head to FM 22.
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18 hours ago, kevhamster said:
If you read the future of FM blog, Miles is quite honest that FM23 fell short of their own expectations. I'm hoping FM24 addresses the major issues that many have pointed out, and then onto FM25 which will be, no pun intended, a whole new ball game.
Yeah, I have read the blogs, but this is so bad I have zero faith they can execute a new version of the game.
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I am a long time player, been around since FM08. I have finally found the time to sit down with FM23. There are some things that are solid, the agent interactions are cool, and the new data has made for some awesome skinning work for attributeless play.
Other than that...oof. It is just...awful. More than that, it is arbitrary. Other than having good dynamics, very little of what you do matters. I know the game is not scripted, but this is the first version that has felt like it is, and that is a problem. It's almost like the ME was upgraded, but the tools we have to play were not. Football is a game of space and you simply don't have the tools to accurately exploit and protect it. Instructions are counterintuitive, usually doing the opposite of what they say they do. Instructions also have little bearing on what the players do, so eventually I just kind of stopped doing them. Click gegenpress and then click continue. You know the matches you will lose a few weeks before they happen, you know you will be awful in January, you know which highlight is a goal 2 seconds in, it is just kind of bad.
Any who, apologies for the rant, super excited for 25 and who am I kidding, I'll buy and play the heck out of 24 too.
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Game changing skin for me. It is outstanding, thank you so much @_Ben_ so fun.
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I send my entire first team squad on holiday during it. Sim the matches. Cannot be bothered.
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23 hours ago, dcayton9 said:
I think I might've acknowledged at the start but I definitely acknowledge now that this isn't going to always provide the best possible results. I think that setting your team to positive or attack, gegenpressing, and flooding the box with 4-5 attack roles all looking to penetrate will always be the best way to win unless there are drastic changes to the match engine. The point of this guide is for the roleplaying or realistic approach to the game, of analyzing your squad and building a tactic to match that, which as a tactics aficionado myself, is the main reason I play.
@ta11zx I also don't think that tactics that don't take the overpowered approach are unsuccessful, we just are conditioned to think that a successful tactic means extreme over-performance, like finishing in the champions league places with our freshly promoted side, rather than consistently above expectation while the level of our squad grows as well. I do admit you and @teej9 are right about the limitations this approach has, but as @Delial said, sometimes the challenge is building a well thought through system that would work in real life, as well as the game
It is for sure a me problem! I think I just don't have the patience or time to play like this. Want to move through a bit too much. Thanks!
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I love the idea of this thread, but it just does not work. At the end of the day, I always have better results playing a high press attacking tactic. I score more, concede less and win more. No matter what team, no matter what the squad strength. I like fiddling like this, but never got good results, it was consistently boring awful football. I do love the attacking role breakdown, that is awesome. Thanks for the detailed write up!
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My thought on this one is a bit odd, but I actually think after the last patches, FM22 is OK. The big issue is there is no change in style over time. For instance, high pressure Gegen Press is the IRL rage right now, but will it be in 15 years? On FM, it damn sure is. I am not a game designer, but having some variety in the en vogue tactics of the game world would be amazing. I have used the exact same tactic for three years now and that is just boring. Whack a 433 Gegen Press and win has to change.
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9 hours ago, FrazT said:
Regular starter to fringe player is a 2 step drop, so it is perhaps understandable that he needs a lot of work to accept it. Try dropping only 1 step to squad player
That makes sense. Plus I don't recall actually talking about what the new status will be so maybe that is it. It wasn't a huge deal he ended calming down about it after 2 months.
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59 minutes ago, Mars_Blackmon said:
Maybe it’s a bug but it could also be miscommunication and the interaction was meant for the next 5 games.
There is expected playing time which is next 5 games
and career playing time path. He most likely got upset because you changed his playing time pathway instead of giving him lesser playing time without him complaining about it
The interaction to persuade him to accept the reduced playing came from the menu to reduce his squad status, so I assume it would not be about the next 5 matches. Unless they are using confusing UX to replicate miscommunication in IRL which would admittedly be hilarious.
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So I changed one of my wingers playing time from Regular Starter to Fringe Player, he was playing really really poorly, 1 goal contribution in 20 matches, etc. I was given the option of persuading him to accept, he did, saying he understood. After the interaction he was still listed as a regular starter, so I went in and changed it again and now he super pissed. How could you do this!? ITS MY CAREER!!!! he says. We literally just talked about it. On the same day. Surely this is a bug right?
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On 20/01/2022 at 07:46, zindrinho said:
Aha, I think I see the confusion here. I'm not talking about computer controlled players, the AI cant play FM if their future depended on it
I'm talking about your own team, if you had a decently paced IF on attack, coupled with a lone DLF(S) or similar striker role YOUR IF will be your top scorer every season, scoring 40-50 goals every year. It has been like this at least since FM15, and is probably one of the reasons why the game has been waaay too easy.
Not completely related, but I'd think Messi was more of a IW than IF back in his prime, he didn't just hang on the shoulder of a fullback or run into the space he had left behind, Messi went straight into 2 DMs and a CB no problem at all
I will eat my shoe if anyone can show this player performance with any non meme tactic.
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Anyone else finding this verson to just be a pass it around the back sim? In my game, in the Superliga there were 20 players all over 96% pass completion. They were all defenders and 17 of the 20 also appear on the most passes attempted list. For a reference IRL there are 10 players in the EPL with a pass accuracy over 90% this season. It makes every match so boring watching teams just tap it between CDs. No amount of pressing or telling my CDs to take risks, pass it long, do anything but that, can change it.
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7 hours ago, kepz said:
Honestly, I wouldn’t care if the percentages weren’t figured correctly or something but the fact that any team, let alone a B team, can manage 1000 pass attempts is really brutal to see. Thankfully, I will say, 1K pass attempts has been an anomaly but the problems still persist with woeful representation of possession overall.
I just had a match in the Dansih top tier where both teams hit 1k passes. It was just the defenders passing amongst themselves for 15-20 touches then hoof to the other back line who does the same. Rinse and repeat and BAM you've got an ME boys.
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- Popular Post
9 minutes ago, Baodan said:Naturally you cant get the same wage at Troyes as you can at PSG. He looks at what you're paying and ask for something comparative, just like he will do when he later signs for Troyes for much less when he's out of options.
lol. Yes. That is how the real world works. I am sure of it. When a player has 2 contracts sitting in front of them, we'll even use your example in this one, one from PSG at 55k p/w and one from Troyes at 10k p/w, he will accept the 10k p/w and reject the 55k p/w because PSG pays higher wages. You realize that is the opposite of how the real world works yes?
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- Popular Post
On 12/01/2022 at 08:38, Jonthedon26 said:Ye the wages are wild in this version. I got promoted with Birmingham City, got a modest transfer and wage budget and I put a personal cap on wages but I am struggling so badly to sign players as they all want crazy money. One player i tried to sign who had 2 years left on £3.3k per week contract at an average Dutch club wanted £55k per week despite being very interested in joining me. I offered £35k (my personal cap) and he rejected the contract...no other clubs were interested in him. That is just one example of about 15 I have experienced since getting promoted. I understand that joining a premier league team players would expect a wage hike, but some of the requests are totally crazy.
The best is when they then sign with another team for 10k.
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Surely summer transfers should apply to the upcoming season right? It makes it super awkward to look at past transfer windows. I am operating off of next seasons budget, why is the transfer back dated to the already completed season?
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3 hours ago, KingCanary said:
This sort of situation is where I struggle with this game.
I've come into this match in good form. We're unbeaten in the League so far, have one of the best defensive records going (7 conceded in 10 games) yet at half time this has happened...
We're getting absolutely battered. 3-0 down, defence torn to shreds, Everton can't stop creating chances and we can't create anything. I'm not saying this can't happen but where is the useable feedback? All I've had is my assistant manager recommending we mark their striker. Outside of that there is absolutely nothing of any use to me until half time. Not a great experience.
I have similar problems. There is no feedback as to why form swings happen. Team will be rolling along playing nicely and then suddenly nothing works. Which is fine, if there was any feedback as to why. I am guessing watching full matches is the way, but not really what i want to do.
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3 hours ago, joemez1193 said:
Do you really believe SI would produce a game whereby a specific point in every season is deliberately designed for you not to win? Please see logic.
I didn't mean it like that. I meant some variety in form swings would be cool. Of course they wouldn't code users losing, the game does not distinguish between AI and users. Don't jump to conclusions.
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Defence-First Football Tactics (Also Home To Real Sociedad Fans)
in Tactics, Training & Strategies Discussion
Posted
Thanks for clarifying!