ProZone
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Posts posted by ProZone
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21 hours ago, snowofman said:
You would have to download the base skin from the 1st post here in the forum
then take the default file i've attached and change the ID as shown above and copy the file to the match folder in the base skin
clear the cache and reload the skin
Appreciate the help but haven't quite got it to work just yet...
I successfully loaded the base21 skin into the game.
The base21 download didn't contain a 'match' folder so I created it and copied the fixture details.xml into it.
Is this correct?
I'm suspecting not - the game doesn't appear to be reading the fixture details.xml file as I can delete some of the other bits of code (non Odds) with no effect on the Schedule screen in the game.
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Is there a way to correct this for the default skin? Could someone step me through how to do it on a Mac?
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So therefore do you simply think that you say I want A, B and C to improve in player X so il make them high and then think I dont need D &E so i will drop them down much lower? And then adjust from there depending on what you think needs improving etc. Obviously this is a rather general example!
I'd say that is spot on. The problem has always been that for the attributes you are happy to accept no increase, or simply wish to maintain, there has never been a way to ensure that this happens. It has always been guess work on where to set the relevant training slider.
The great thing with FM11 is that we have the attributes graph which allows us to see the progress of attribute development/decline which essentially allows us to control the pace of development/decline or ensure maintenance. If development is happening too slow or decline is happening too fast then we can now detect this (within a 1 month timescale, which is a massive improvement!) and increase the training level. As attributes change the chances of further changes are altered/recalculated and thus modification to the training schedule may be required to continue the progress you wish to see. By monitoring the graph you can detect increases, decreases, plateaus etc. in attribute development and 'manage' the training of you players as you decide.
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No sir. The inventor is SI Games it self, it's own system which explain by the Marc Vaughan Hints and Tips Guide 2007
Sincere apologies Teutomatos for not giving you due credit if it was you. I genuinely couldn't remember who first described the linear approach.
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Out of curiosity, do you actually think the mantralux approach is right? Iv done some basic and early stage testing and tbh I have still been able to use Sfrasers principles to shape certain players in certain attributes relative to their position where as using the linear theory simply more creates all round players, especially in the upper echelons of football where hidden stats are high. Thats fine if I want my striker to be able to fill in at the back but I dont, I want specialist players who are best in their position at what they do. It would be a real shame if the training aspect of this game reduced the impact we as coaches can have on moulding our future stars.
Just to be clear, there is no mantralux approach. I think you are referring to the 'linear' approach (I forget the inventor/author EDIT: Was it you Naks?) which I personally have no time for and it is something that mantralux asked to be removed from her thread. To my mind, the 'linear' approach takes 3-4 months to ascertain information that is of no practical use, and furthermore, like you I prefer to train specialist players on the whole, not all-rounders.
The principle of SFraser's approach is still valid, absolutely. Giving less focus to the categories which contain attributes that are less important to a player's position is the basis of 'position-general' schedule design. My belief is that the best results are achieved by tailoring individual schedules (i know this is time consuming!) and the addition of the attributes graph this time around makes this much more intuitive. We didn't have the graph last year and I thought that my training design tool was useful, now I don't - simple as that.
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I just thought I'd post again in this thread as I feel it's my responsibility to say that I will no longer be using the Training Schedule Design Tool, posted earlier in this thread, for FM11.
I believe that the addition of the Attributes Development Graph to the training module provides all the information needed to modify training schedules for individual players and the default positional schedules which have been added are a good point to start from.
In the absence of SFraser for a while, I recommend mantralux's training thread as being particularly helpful for understanding the changes made to this year's training module.
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for some reason I cannot download it...it navigates me to another site without link.
Try again Gents: http://www.mediafire.com/?v1pd9kckhpd58ic
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Here you go:
http://www.mediafire.com/?v1pd9kckhpd58ic
Apologies for the delay from the earlier requests for this!
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SFraser, have you had any input into the new training module announced for FM2011?
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If you look in the 'Reports' tab of the player then you can see whether your coaches are telling you something like 'Tafer is unlikely to improve in the future'. This means that his PA has been reached and therefore there are no ability points left to improve his attributes and would confirm SFraser's explanation.
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Scenario: Say I choose to over train a player on technical aspects of the game while ignoring the physical/mental parts, say in the ratio of 1:1:0:1:5:4:8:5:1 for STR:AER:GK:TAC:BC:DEF:ATT:SHT:SET. Here the numbers are based on your unit notation. So 1 of strength = 4 notches and 4 of BC = 20 notches and 8 of attacking = 16 notches on the corresponding slider. Intensity level wise, this schedule is about 60% (medium) on the workload indicator at the bottom. Keep in mind that this is a young CM with good amount of free CA left.
1. How does overall training intensity relate to the picture? Does having a higher workload matter at all?
2. Training progress and training level indicators. How do they work? If I'm not seeing good training progress on these graphs despite the high training, say, on Ball control, does it mean that this schedule isn't working?
3. Sculpting a young player - How much of it can we control? I've just edited Obertan to have a 200PA. His CA is around 130 and I cloned him. So I have two Obertans and I would like to make one of them into a Ronaldo type winger / striker / finisher. The other into an AM RLC with good creativity, passing and team work. Is this achievable through the game? (In-game position, training, retraining position)?
1. Player improvement, specifically the distribution of gained CA, is determined by two things. First, a natural distribution which has been imagined to be some sort of 'development curve' which is hard-coded in the game. Second, the manager defined distribution as defined by the training slider positions. The current understanding is that a higher overall training intensity gives a greater bias towards the manager defined training distribution. That is to say a player's development will match more closely the way you arrange the training sliders. A lower overall training intensity does the opposite and effectively gives more control to FM10 to develop your player. The price to pay for more manager control however is an increased injury risk.
2. No-one knows for sure and I for one would love to see this sorted out. What is known is that the graphs are produced from multiple pieces of data such as training slider positions, player characteristics, club facilities and probably a lot more. It is therefore impossible to ascertain precisely what they are displaying. As a result, I now don't use them at all. I prefer to track my player's progress through careful monitoring of their attribute progression (output) and relate this back to their training schedule (input). That's all that is required in my opinion and I think the graphs in their current state are pointless and misleading, the evidence for which is the much previously lauded Training Line Theory which has since died a death. I would definitely not advise using them as a measure of whether your training schedule is 'working' or not!
3. Perhaps an initial assessment for this is in my response to question 1 although it's difficult to quantify exactly. My personal opinion based on limited observation is that retraining to a new position can have a considerable effect on particular attributes. An example which springs to mind is the difference in physical attributes between AMCs and MCs. My guess is that re-training an AMC to MC would assist the development of his physical attributes over-and-above whatever is assigned in terms of Strength and Aerobic training focus. This will be true of other positionally key attributes and understanding them all will obviously aid your efforts to develop players in your desired manner.
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This GK schedule is not the same then as in the spreadsheet?
Correct, it is not.
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I'm wondering why it's only explained with full numbers when explaining focus, but perhaps I just have misunderstood everything ot it's just for the sake of ease of explanation?
Yes the focus has so far been described using whole numbers for ease of use but also because the testing carried out has been with whole numbers so we can be confident in what they produce.
Focus fractions are absolutely possible, but are only sensible so long as they correspond to a whole click in the relevent training category. However, schedules including Focus fractions have not been extensively tested as yet. Feel free to try yourself and share your findings.
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Another great write up. Is this not a much easier way of designing schedules and explaining them to others?
I promise to post something similar for a few of my developing players once I have got through 6 months of the season and can show some results. Needless to say I follow exactly the same approach as you have described, boosting areas of weakness through added Focus.
One further consideration is that you may want to retrain him as MR. I think, but I could be wrong, that PA is distributed differently according to position. For example, MR probably has a higher tendency for Strength category attribute improvements than AMR. It's maybe worth a try if you are not seeing the desired results.
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A very nice post indeed
This is exactly the sort of detail I like to see. If you get a moment, could you add the details of your coaches.
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Here's what is considered for outfield players:
STR (3) - Work Rate, Stamina, Strength
AER (5) - Acceleration, Agility, Balance, Jumping, Pace
GK (0)
TAC (5) - Anticipation, Decisions, Off The Ball, Positioning, Teamwork
BAL (4) - Dribbling, First Touch, Heading, Technique
DEF (3) - Marking, Tackling, Concentration
ATT (2) - Passing, Creativity
SHO (3) - Finishing, Long Shots, Composure
SET (5) - Corners, Crossing, Free Kick Taking, Long Throws, Penalty Taking
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Thanks DocSander, ProZone, and SFraser. I've downloaded the spreadsheet and I had a quick question about the baseline numbers. I came up with different numbers independently so I was wondering what you were using for your baseline numbers?
The GK baseline is a bit of a grey area but we're not far off each other. Here's what I have accounted for in the Tool however, please feel free to further question these assumptions:
STR (3) - Work Rate, Stamina, Strength
AER (6) - Acceleration, Agility, Balance, Jumping, Pace, Reflexes
GK (7) - Aerial Ability, Handling, Kicking, Throwing, One On Ones, Concentration, Composure
TAC (6) - Anticipation, Decisions, Positioning, Command Of Area, Communication, Teamwork
BAL (2) - First Touch, Technique
DEF (0)
ATT (1) - Creativity
SHO (0)
SET (0)
Including Creativity is perhaps a bit controversial but as the ATT Focus for GKs is always zero in SFraser's schedules it never gets included.
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One question re. roles. Say for example I want to train my keeper to be a sweeper keeper - I just work out the 'user defined focus' for myself and adjust accordingly, right?
Maybe posters here can contribute suggestions for all roles (especially the various striker roles) here.
Correct
All suggestions are welcome, especially if they are supported by detailed info. on the progress/decline over say a ~6 month period minimum.
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Excellent work. I have a question though. I don't really understand what the User Defined Focus exactly does. If it is turned off, then I'm assuming that the output will simply be based on SFraser's Focus, correct?
Correct
The User Defined Focus is where you can type in your own Focus values to create your own schedule. If SFraser's Focus is included ('yes') the two Focus numbers will be added together. If SFraser's Focus is not included then it's 100% your own schedule.
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I've just downloaded your spreadsheet but when i try to open with ms excel it's says it's not a proper document but i open it anyway and i only see the gk youth schedule. Please help
It most definitely is a proper document and if you click on the cell where it says GK you will see a drop-down list for all the other positions available.
EDIT - Apologies ron.e, I think there may have been a problem with the download for some users. It's now fixed so try downloading again.
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Thankyou. I think i'll listen to your advice. I totally understand about focus but i'm still not getting the age factor when it comes to constructing schedule the sfraser way. Is it best to look at it like this - Technical attributes run a steady course throughout a players career, mental attributes really kick off from 24-32 (depending on tutoring) and physical attributes start early (from 15yrs old) improve rapidly from 17-24 and then gradually decline from then till the 30's. Am i on the right track? Thanks.
That sounds sensible to me but I'll let SFraser give you the definitive answer on that if that's okay
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For those who would benefit from a helping hand in constructing training schedules based on SFraser's principles in this thread then here is an offering from DocSander and I:
http://www.mediafire.com/?v1pd9kckhpd58ic
This basic MS Excel Tool will allow you to check that the schedules you have modified from SFraser's original set are correct and, more importantly, start to create your own.
The Tool takes the Baseline and multiplies it by the Focus given to each category to output the slider positions.
The only points to explain are:
- Users only need to edit the blue boxes, nothing else.
- If you choose to select both SFraser's Focus and the User Defined Focus then these Focus values will be added together
- Please use whole numbers for the User Defined Focus for now
- SFraser's WF schedule is AMR/L in the Tool
- SFraser's FB schedule is DR/L in the Tool
- SFraser's AM schedule is AMC in the Tool
- The SW, WBR/L, DM and MR/L Focus values are missing (a good place to start your own testing)
DocSander and I will support this Tool as best we can here in this thread if there are any further questions.
Please, please, please make sure you give feedback on your training schedules here so that it can be used in the continuing development of training schedules and further the understanding of training players in FM.
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So let me get this straight - If i want to improve a player in a certain area and i make a base schedule with the right focus, as i move the slider to the right and i stop at, for example 'heavy' then it should maintain the same focus? Am i right?
No this is not correct. It is not straightforard to convert the Overall Workload slider movement into Focus. I wouldn't recommend constructing schedules in the way you describe because there is huge potential for error. I strongly suggest you stick to the method SFraser has described.
My post which you quoted was an observation on the mechanics of the Overall Workload slider. Please don't make it into anything more, it certainly wasn't meant as an alternative method for schedule design.
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I guess it means it's important to get the Baselines right to begin with but that was always the case.
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Match Odds on Schedule/Fixtures Screen - "fixture details" panel
in Skinning Hideout
Posted
That's it, done! Thanks mate