Quickfire Questions and Answers Thread (Tactic and Training Questions Only)

[davidnio_422]

Well what happens I think (it's been some time since I did it) is first you have to remove the PPM shoots from distance, then learn the new one to reduce long shots, but again I can't recall exactly. It would have been nice had I just done it and could tell you for sure . What happens if you select either one? Same effect?

No you were exactly right with your initial answer . My coach seemed pretty pessimistic about the success of both, but worded it differently. For the add a new PPm one he said 'player has enough about his game' but for the other he said 'i dont see him being capable of this' Ive tried it anyway so we'll see. What I'm not sure of is if you are successful with learning 'Takes Few Long shots' whether or not that automatically removes 'Shoots from Distance'. Nothing to suggest that it does, but that seems bizarre!

[Dr. Hook]

No you were exactly right with your initial answer . My coach seemed pretty pessimistic about the success of both, but worded it differently. For the add a new PPm one he said 'player has enough about his game' but for the other he said 'i dont see him being capable of this' Ive tried it anyway so we'll see. What I'm not sure of is if you are successful with learning 'Takes Few Long shots' whether or not that automatically removes 'Shoots from Distance'. Nothing to suggest that it does, but that seems bizarre!

You would think it does and I would be surprised if it didn't do that. It may be that not being capable of it is because he already has the PPM and would need to unlearn it first. Hmm. Let us know how you get on with it

[hamezmace]

Stupid question on suited player roles/star recommendation;

How important do you consider a players 'most suited' role to be? For example Dele Alli is shown with full bars for role suitability as a RPM, now I have never had any success with a RPM, even in previous versions when I signed Pogba who can play anywhere, so I don't want to have to force a tactic set up to accommodate this role, but will it prevent him achieving his full potential if I don't?

On star recommendations from scouting, in a previous save I was 5 years into the game and I became Chelsea manager, the best right back at the club was Di Scagglio, who had a star rating (CA) of 2, despite average season ratings just above 7 in the previous two seasons, I sent my scouts out to find a player with a minimum of 3.5 stars for CA and even after 6 months they came back with no suitable players, why would this be?

[herne79]

Stupid question on suited player roles/star recommendation;

How important do you consider a players 'most suited' role to be? For example Dele Alli is shown with full bars for role suitability as a RPM, now I have never had any success with a RPM, even in previous versions when I signed Pogba who can play anywhere, so I don't want to have to force a tactic set up to accommodate this role, but will it prevent him achieving his full potential if I don't?

I ignore it. A player's attributes are far more important for the role that you want him to perform. Case in point - I play Angel Di Maria in my ML position as a Wide Midfielder (attack). According to the game he is only "competent" at playing in that position and his bar isn't even half full for WM(A). However, he's won the Golden Boot award for the last 2 seasons and this season won the Balon D'Or after being runner up the previous season.

On star recommendations from scouting, in a previous save I was 5 years into the game and I became Chelsea manager, the best right back at the club was Di Scagglio, who had a star rating (CA) of 2, despite average season ratings just above 7 in the previous two seasons, I sent my scouts out to find a player with a minimum of 3.5 stars for CA and even after 6 months they came back with no suitable players, why would this be?

Star ratings are a) an opinion of your coaches or scouts and so are only as good as they are; and b) are only relative to the players at your club - somebody could have a 5 star rating at Plymouth Argyle, but out them into Arsenal's team and they'll be lucky to get half a star. Use them as an indication only - read the detailed scout or coach report to get a better indication of potential and ability. And their attributes of course.

[hamezmace]

I ignore it. A player's attributes are far more important for the role that you want him to perform. Case in point - I play Angel Di Maria in my ML position as a Wide Midfielder (attack). According to the game he is only "competent" at playing in that position and his bar isn't even half full for WM(A). However, he's won the Golden Boot award for the last 2 seasons and this season won the Balon D'Or after being runner up the previous season.

Then why do they put these things in the game if they are so inaccurate, and there are several examples (looking at this forum) and your example above that a player will do even better in a position the game is advising you he cannot perform in? It just looks confusing when you set a team up and you're being advised everyone is out of position.

Star ratings are a) an opinion of your coaches or scouts and so are only as good as they are; and b) are only relative to the players at your club - somebody could have a 5 star rating at Plymouth Argyle, but out them into Arsenal's team and they'll be lucky to get half a star. Use them as an indication only - read the detailed scout or coach report to get a better indication of potential and ability. And their attributes of course.

He was the only right back the club had, in the first team at least, and he was the first choice RB for the Italy national team also so couldn't have been that bad, but I'm also surprised my scouting team, who had ratings of 19/20 for JPA, and JPP couldn't find a higher rated player

[Dr. Hook]

Then why do they put these things in the game if they are so inaccurate, and there are several examples (looking at this forum) and your example above that a player will do even better in a position the game is advising you he cannot perform in? It just looks confusing when you set a team up and you're being advised everyone is out of position.

They are just guidelines and helps provided for players, and probably targeted at the casual player more than anything. If you are more interested in the tactical side and are imagining your system and how you want it to play, they are less helpful. If you are one that likes to pick a big team and buy the best players and get on with it, the attribute wheels are useful. What we point out here is for more detailed tactical approaches such simplistic ratings systems don't give the whole picture.

[hamezmace]

It seems strange to me that the game would include a feature which is essentially saying 'this players best position is....' if it doesn't really mean anything, or perhaps putting it another way is less important than the overall tactic/formation/strategy itself. It just creates further confusion when trying to create a tactic.

[herne79]

The game is just giving its' opinion based on the apparent ideal attributes for each role. What it can't do is match our own perceptions of attributes that we may want in roles. Sometimes those opinions coincide, sometimes they don't.

We can pick and choose, the game simply follows rules.

[sgevolker]

Hi,

first sorry for my english. I'm not a natural speaker and I hope everybody understands what I'm writing here

After reading al lot of stuff here I decide to develop a system witch suits my players well. The first thing I was doing is to look where are my key players. I've got strong wingers, two young talent central midfielders and a strong target man. The system I was making with that is a 4-1-2-3. I want to play a possession based game with a solid defense and an offense how has the possibility to create space and move into it.

So this is my formation:

I play on control with a fluid team shape.

I like to let my players play the roles they do best. If it's possible.

The back four got two limited defenders. This is the position with the highest role suitability for both. And for me it is fine, because I don't want to open to much space on the flanks for the opposition. If there is a need, I can change the roles later in the game.

In midfield I've got a defensiv midfielder who should be a kind of "quarterback" for me. I test this with a DLP too, but I don't like how he drops between the two defenders. Then I have a runner, a BBM. He should support the DM and although support the Inside Forward on the left. The other player is a AP who should be able to pass into channels which the IF and the Winger on the other side hopefully creates.

At least I've got an Target Man in front, he has an attack duty, because he should bind the opposite defenders deep to create space for my wingers and the BBM. I don't know if this works, we'll see.

As TI I've got:

Roam from position, because I wan't to create space in front.

Pass into space for the same reason.

Retain possession. I don't now, if this works with pass into space? But it should.

Run at defense and fairly wide, because I wan't to use my two wingers and they should stretch the opposition defense.

If I play against a much stronger team I will switch to counter, close down a little bit more and play with higher tempo, remove retain possession.

If I pay against a weaker team I can switch to attack, play with a little bit lower tempo and maybe change the two limited defenders to full backs.

So now I want to watch the games and see If the players act like I want.

Is there anything wrong what I'm doing?

Is there something where I should have a deeper look during the games?

[hamezmace]

The game is just giving its' opinion based on the apparent ideal attributes for each role. What it can't do is match our own perceptions of attributes that we may want in roles. Sometimes those opinions coincide, sometimes they don't.

We can pick and choose, the game simply follows rules.

Yeah, that's a fair point, as I said at the start I just wanted to confirm it wasn't going to derail a players development by playing them/training them outside of their 'best position'. You've answered the question, so thank you very much guys.

[Dr. Hook]

Hi,

After reading al lot of stuff here I decide to develop a system witch suits my players well. The first thing I was doing is to look where are my key players. I've got strong wingers, two young talent central midfielders and a strong target man. The system I was making with that is a 4-1-2-3. I want to play a possession based game

Is there anything wrong what I'm doing?

Is there something where I should have a deeper look during the games?

If you are looking for a possession system, then first off you need to ditch the limited defenders because they are very direct in passing and will squander possession. The limited defender has nothing to do with how the player defends, only how he handles the ball, so switch to standard fullbacks or central defenders for better possession. Second, the targetman role will frustrate a possession style because players will look to get he ball up to him, many times when there are better options. It is a ball magnet role, and so I would advise against it, even if that is what the player is best at, because you are looking for possession.

You can use retain and pass into space, but keep in mind that will hurt your possession game to an extent as well, because players are looking NOT to hold on to the ball here, but put it where they hope a teammate can run on to it. It does work, but be aware that it will mitigate your possession a bit. Run at defense instructs your attacking players to dribble more so if you have world class dribblers, great, if not they will lose the ball a good bit, whereas without that TI they will look to pass through or around the defense as you might expect in a possession style.

Okay, so in the spirit of what you posted, these are what I look at in terms of your tactic and what you are trying to achieve.

[Dr. Hook]

Yeah, that's a fair point, as I said at the start I just wanted to confirm it wasn't going to derail a players development by playing them/training them outside of their 'best position'. You've answered the question, so thank you very much guys.

Won't hurt them at all, in fact, use the position/role in the game that you want and train the position/role that best does what you want to develop in the player. I train players in roles they won't necessarily play sometimes because the attributes that get trained are what I want the player to develop.

[sgevolker]

If you are looking for a possession system, then first off you need to ditch the limited defenders because they are very direct in passing and will squander possession. The limited defender has nothing to do with how the player defends, only how he handles the ball, so switch to standard fullbacks or central defenders for better possession. Second, the targetman role will frustrate a possession style because players will look to get he ball up to him, many times when there are better options. It is a ball magnet role, and so I would advise against it, even if that is what the player is best at, because you are looking for possession.

You can use retain and pass into space, but keep in mind that will hurt your possession game to an extent as well, because players are looking NOT to hold on to the ball here, but put it where they hope a teammate can run on to it. It does work, but be aware that it will mitigate your possession a bit. Run at defense instructs your attacking players to dribble more so if you have world class dribblers, great, if not they will lose the ball a good bit, whereas without that TI they will look to pass through or around the defense as you might expect in a possession style.

Okay, so in the spirit of what you posted, these are what I look at in terms of your tactic and what you are trying to achieve.

Thank you, that makes sence. I will try this.

[Ross Ingersoll]

here is a really dumb question. the more you slide the team training slider to the right, the more training towards attributes they will do while doing less match training?. for example in this pic they are basiclly doi8ng all training towards attributes and no match day training, correct? Just wondering because someone just told me i was wrong and its the opposite

[Dr. Hook]

here is a really dumb question. the more you slide the team training slider to the right, the more training towards attributes they will do while doing less match training?. for example in this pic they are basiclly doi8ng all training towards attributes and no match day training, correct? Just wondering because someone just told me i was wrong and its the opposite

The way it is set is to have no match day training and all team training. Whoever told you it was the opposite is dead wrong on that.

[Ross Ingersoll]

ok, thank you. thats what i thought but wanted to be sure.

[AllRed]

I play FM touch/classic on 16, as all the extra nonsense is a pain in the backside. But I've noticed it misses players out, e.g. Liverpool save hasn't included a few youngsters like Jerome Sinclair, who isn't exactly an unknown.

Is there a way to increase the database at all as the setup button is shadowed out, also a separate question, I assume by adding other leagues this will naturally add more players anyway?

[Cleon]

This forum is for tactic or training questions only, it does state this in the thread title. Please use the correct forums and try the touch/classic forum http://community.sigames.com/forumdisplay.php/308-Football-Manager-Touch-General-Discussion

[Mr_Demus]

I have tinkered a lot with my tactics, and I have the ffeling that I am nearly there, but I am missing the last few pieces. I hope you can help me. I want to play possesion football.

TI: Play out of defence, lower tempo, retain possesion (sometimes: roam from positions). Only have PI's on GK - roll out, distribute to centre backs.

Mentatlity: Control

Shape: Flexible

GK - D

FB - S

FB - S

CD - D

CD - D

MC - D

MC - S

W - S

AP - S

W - S

CF - S/A

What I need: suggestions on player roles and instructions. Don't worry about players, as I am nearing the transfer window and will be able to bring in some players to accomodate any changes.

[RTHerringbone]

What Mentality and Team Shape are you using? In my opinion, Wingers on Support (who hit early crosses) don't really fit a possession style, and having two of those with a lone striker who receives no support from midfield is very wasteful.

[Mr_Demus]

What Mentality and Team Shape are you using? In my opinion, Wingers on Support (who hit early crosses) don't really fit a possession style, and having two of those with a lone striker who receives no support from midfield is very wasteful.

I forgot. Have edited it in now.

I originally had IF - S on one of the wings, but he seemly took my striker out of games. I wanted to involve my striker, as he is probably my best player, but so far I have failed to make him a threat

[Tyon_Games]

Well.

I play with Stoke - new Board.

I ask for a Stadium expansion - accepted.

We won the Title and the board ask me if we should buy the Britannia Stadium - i said yes.

Now both are running, expansion and buying stadium.

Im not from England but doesn´t own Stoke the Stadium allready? Or is it just rent?

[Cleon]

Well.

I play with Stoke - new Board.

I ask for a Stadium expansion - accepted.

We won the Title and the board ask me if we should buy the Britannia Stadium - i said yes.

Now both are running, expansion and buying stadium.

Im not from England but doesn´t own Stoke the Stadium allready? Or is it just rent?

This thread is for Tactic and Training questions only. Please use the appropriate forum.

[Tyon_Games]

This thread is for Tactic and Training questions only. Please use the appropriate forum.

Oh yea, im sry

[Bigpapa42]

Keep meaning to check this in the game and forgetting, and I can't at the moment. The GK PPM of "Long Throw to Start Counter".... can that be learned or does it have to come thru mentoring?

[Cleon]

Keep meaning to check this in the game and forgetting, and I can't at the moment. The GK PPM of "Long Throw to Start Counter".... can that be learned or does it have to come thru mentoring?

All PPM's except argues with officials can be learnt now. It's been like this since FM15

[Bigpapa42]

All PPM's except argues with officials can be learnt now. It's been like this since FM15

And I totally didn't realize! As always, appreciate it, Cleon.

[wdoorn]

the tactic wheel is gone, how do i get it back?

[kingjericho]

If I play a 4-1-4-1, using the Run At Defense TI will add more runs with ball to which players? I'd guess the WMs and the ST?

[wingwangwong]

Has anyone got specific marking to properly work?

I've tried getting my full backs/wingers to specifically mark opposition wingers, or a DM to specifically guard a dangerous M/AMC but they always ALWAYS end up getting goalside of my players. Extremely easily, I might add. Once I remove specific marking, the problem stops. However, other problems arise (e.g. players marking other "less desirable" targets).

[davidnio_422]

Has anyone got specific marking to properly work?

I've tried getting my full backs/wingers to specifically mark opposition wingers, or a DM to specifically guard a dangerous M/AMC but they always ALWAYS end up getting goalside of my players. Extremely easily, I might add. Once I remove specific marking, the problem stops. However, other problems arise (e.g. players marking other "less desirable" targets).

Short answer yes it can work but like many specialised OIs I find it can easily pull you out of shape, and if the defender is not a great marker or the attacker has good off the ball then you can find it backfiring.

Personally the only time I use it is when the opp have a deep lying playmaker that dictates the play I sometimes put a forward on to mark him just to make his life a bit harder.

I would also imagine if you had a back 3 and the opp had a lone forward you could mark him with the central CB with low risk

[RTHerringbone]

If I play a 4-1-4-1, using the Run At Defense TI will add more runs with ball to which players? I'd guess the WMs and the ST?

Just the striker AFAIK. Only affects players in the AMC line and beyond.

[ianscousemac]

quick question about training.

My team training is focus is on attacking.

So I understand the focus will be on the following attributes Crossing, Finishing, Long Shots, Passing, Creativity, Off the ball.

How does this affect my defenders that are set to training as a Central Defender as none of those attributes are included in his training?

[Cleon]

quick question about training.

My team training is focus is on attacking.

So I understand the focus will be on the following attributes Crossing, Finishing, Long Shots, Passing, Creativity, Off the ball.

How does this affect my defenders that are set to training as a Central Defender as none of those attributes are included in his training?

They still have a high chance of the attributes from general training increases too. This is why I have always advocated using specific general focus with generic role training instead. That way you aren't watering down both focuses and splitting the time between them. The focus and the general one are kind of split evenly so neither is getting full effect but both are still the emphasis if that makes sense.

[woland]

Hello everyone.

Tell me please, when I comparing roles, could i count on player instructions, to understand a difference between roles? Or there are another hidden diferences, which not showed in default player instruction?

And another one question. What could i do, when my opponents using high pressing? Will it usefull to change instructions from short passing on mixed? Maybe there are something else?

[Dr. Hook]

Hello everyone.

Tell me please, when I comparing roles, could i count on player instructions, to understand a difference between roles? Or there are another hidden diferences, which not showed in default player instruction?

And another one question. What could i do, when my opponents using high pressing? Will it usefull to change instructions from short passing on mixed? Maybe there are something else?

There are just a few roles with "hidden" effects that are essentially to do with ball attraction. Playmaker roles and Targetman roles will have more balls come their way. The rest of the roles you can see in mentality bar and PIs attached to them. For high pressing, one of the ways to defeat is to up you tempo to move the ball quickly away from the closing down, and if you have a midfielder with "like to switch flanks" PPM that is useful. Lastly, you might have some success using a "pass into space" team instruction as high pressing teams should leave space for you to exploit.

[woland]

Ok, thank you.

But. It would be great news (I mean regarding role comparison), but i have noticed, for example, that Full Back (D) and Wing Back (D) don't have any difference in instructions:) I guess, it doesn't mean, that this roles are the same. How to understand a difference in this case?

I had saw, that WB(D) has crosses as key atributes, but FB(D) - not. But both roles have no instruction regarding crossing frequency, and both roles are trying to cross from the deep. So, if the instructions the same, why one role use crosses attribute, but another - not?

Thanks in advance.

[Dr. Hook]

Ok, thank you.

But. It would be great news (I mean regarding role comparison), but i have noticed, for example, that Full Back (D) and Wing Back (D) don't have any difference in instructions:) I guess, it doesn't mean, that this roles are the same. How to understand a difference in this case?

I had saw, that WB(D) has crosses as key atributes, but FB(D) - not. But both roles have no instruction regarding crossing frequency, and both roles are trying to cross from the deep. So, if the instructions the same, why one role use crosses attribute, but another - not?

Thanks in advance.

The wingbacks start out a bit higher up on the pitch, so in a neutral shape they will be a little more advanced than their fullback counterpart. The reason for crossing as a key attribute (I think it is necessary for a fullback role too ) is that the wingback is expected to be more attacking and is expected to put more crosses in as part of a system that uses wide play. With a defensive role you will sill see the wingback a little further forward than the fullback.

[Bunkerossian]

How much influence would the lack of Opposition Instructions have on a tactic's effectiveness, overall? I don't have the patience to do multiple OI-s, unless the opposition is highly skilled. Yet, I find myself in trouble against weak opponents too.

[Dr. Hook]

How much influence would the lack of Opposition Instructions have on a tactic's effectiveness, overall? I don't have the patience to do multiple OI-s, unless the opposition is highly skilled. Yet, I find myself in trouble against weak opponents too.

I rarely use them at all- I'd prefer to set up my tactic to account for what I want to see happen. In fact, OIs can pretty dramatically mess with your team shape and defensive structure. I do use them in certain specific situations, usually to try to neutralize a playmaker, hard tackle a cowardly forward/tired player, or if a particular player is just killing me in a match. But, in my view, better to have a setup that does what you want from the start.

[woland]

The wingbacks start out a bit higher up on the pitch, so in a neutral shape they will be a little more advanced than their fullback counterpart. The reason for crossing as a key attribute (I think it is necessary for a fullback role too ) is that the wingback is expected to be more attacking and is expected to put more crosses in as part of a system that uses wide play. With a defensive role you will sill see the wingback a little further forward than the fullback.

Am i right, that there are no way to see it, except to watch ME?

[Dr. Hook]

Am i right, that there are no way to see it, except to watch ME?

Well, there is an indication on the right hand screen where your tactic is shown. If you set wingback, then fullback, or try the different roles, the player square will move up and down the pitch a bit.

[Fritz13]

Opposition instructions

I have asked for one of my staff to (within the Respnsibilities section) deal with OI as I though this took place during a match.

During the match though I will select OI then "Apply advice" and new OIs are selected.

I thought the staff member would automatically update the tactic as new player entered the game via substitution.

Am I misunderstanding what this responsibility actually does?

[phnompenhandy]

Opposition instructions

I have asked for one of my staff to (within the Respnsibilities section) deal with OI as I though this took place during a match.

During the match though I will select OI then "Apply advice" and new OIs are selected.

I thought the staff member would automatically update the tactic as new player entered the game via substitution.

Am I misunderstanding what this responsibility actually does?

I click that button again at half time to account for subs - the assman/coach doesn't make any changes if you don''t tell him to.

[Fritz13]

So what's the point of the setting in Responsibilities then?

[koimes]

How many new signings will affect my teams synergy?

[Dr. Hook]

How many new signings will affect my teams synergy?

Each one has a small negative effect on tactical familiarity and squad gelling, so bringing in several players will have a noticeable effect.

[davidnio_422]

I tend to play with my wide midfielders in the Ml/r stratum. A few games ago for one reason or another I moved them up to the AM level. My tactic familiarity dropped slightly as you would expect, to the lower range of 'fluid'.

After making this change I was noticing that the MCs were misplacing passes to the wide mids but particularly they would play it behind them as they ran forward. My question is is this literally because they are expecting them to be further back? Does tactic familiarity map exactly to specific problems based on the changes you've made or is it just coincidental? I could definitely imagine this in real life but not sure if it happens in game.

If it is the former, would it have been worth telling the MCs to pass into some space for the winger to run onto?

[Quasi]

There are some old players in my squad (32 & 33 years old). Their personnality is "professionnal". But every month, my assistant manager tells me both have been poor in training. Their personnal training is set to free kick (both).

I know that physical stats decrease when he player is getting old. Even when I warn them about their poor performance at training, the next month my assistant manager tells me they still have trained poorly. I don't know what to do. Any advice ?

[steveshaw1983]

When I create a tactic I tend to create 2 alternative versions using different team instructions and strategies etc. The purpose being to ensure that when I make changes mid game the team are comfortable with a slight change of style. I started doing this a few versions ago. Does this still work and would you say it's still necessary?