Andrew_ Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 Sterling any better going backwards? Also, that won't be as important in the other two games. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Adam Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 Not agreeing with the calls for Wilshere to replace Henderson either. All I can remember Wilshere doing when he came on was dribble straight into Italian players and misplace a pass 20 yards back towards our goal to give away possession. He's too gung-ho to start in what needs to be a very disciplined position. God knows why people want an attacking aggressive player BEHIND our 4 strikers up front. Need the cover Henderson provided last night. He was very good (in my biased opinion) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Adam Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 Sterling any better going backwards?Also, that won't be as important in the other two games. That's why I'd do it. If we had Italy all over again I'd have played Milner against Darmian. But seeing I'd never heard of Darmian I am using a hell of a lot of hindsight. Ironic that all our pundits were going on about how Italy wouldn't have heard of Sterling (of course they have) and were then all like "Who's Darmian?" who then proceeded to tear us a new one. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TalkSport Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 Quite enjoyed that game from what I can remember of it 1st half is how we should play all tournament and all the time from now on, exciting quick football. If we took our chances like Italy did we would have got at least something so that's a major positive going into the other games. Think that was Baines worse performance in an England shirt, yes at times he didn't have cover but even in one on one situations he was being beaten Rooney bar the assist was painfully average again during a game at the World Cup, like how did he miss the target when he cut in? The corner at the end just summed it all up. Welbeck impressed me a lot, contributed to the attacking play by laying down the benchmark for the work-rate/pressure. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Adam Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 The doom and gloom from a lot of people does seem quite overdramatic. That was easily in the top 2 or 3 games I've seen England play. We came up against a good and well organised opposition. Got to love the moron fans on SSN saying we definitely won't qualify now as there is no way we can beat both Uruguay and Costa Rica and needed to beat Italy . So Italy was an easier game than both of those was it? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TalkSport Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 Got to love the moron fans on SSN saying we definitely won't qualify now as there is no way we can beat both Uruguay and Costa Rica and needed to beat Italy . So Italy was an easier game than both of those was it? Think thanks to Costa Rica winning, team finishing 2nd could get through on 4 points now, so even if we draw against Uruguay next game it'll still be in our hands near enough if Costa Rica don't end up beating Italy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anti Spiral Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 Actually, the second team could get through on 3 points. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
georginho_juventusygr Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 You should never aim low enough to go through. You should win every match. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Razzler Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 Such a shame to not get at least a draw. I think we deserved it. We played pretty well and that's all I am usually concerned about. At least it's not the usual abject, terrified performances at a tournament Italy just took advantage of some slack defending. That right side caused problems. Rooney wasn't happy there. We still have this Rooney issue, he's a very good player but Sturridge is where he needs to be. Rooney had two touches in the Italian box I think we tired a bit in the last 10-15 mins. Just really disappointing an tough game with Uruguay now even though they looked ropey against Costa Rica. If we approach that game with the same positivity there's no reason we can't get a result though Pirlo free kick was crazy, was moving all over the place Odd feeling in that we lost but we weren't awful so it's hard to be angry but just frustrated that we didn't do this or that and annoyed we made some small errors that cost us Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew_ Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 You should never aim low enough to go through. You should win every match. Unless you lose your opening match and then have to think of other scenarios... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainPlanet Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 Still mad about the Rooney chance. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TalkSport Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 Another positive, when we go through it'll most likely will be as runners up now which means our Last 16 game will be on a Saturday instead of a Sunday Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redshift Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 difference, to me, is that italy dictates without necessarily having to press. they could control the ball, take a breath, and decide what to do. every time england takes possession they run off to the races to try to take advantage of sterling and sturridge's talents. no chance to recover. gunning for a constant break in attack and pressing in defense works in a temperate climate like england but is madness in manaus. I agree with this. Italy could afford to park the bus when they got the lead again and in those conditions could conserve more energy than England. I don't think it is fair to judge Rooney when he was placed in a role he wasn't comfortable in and Gerrard should perform better when he's not knackered out playing in rainforest conditions. Yes, England really need to win both of the next games but as long as they are not too tired, (and at least we have a bit of depth now for rotation), they have the skill to do it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
georginho_juventusygr Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 Andrew_: Yes, you can be realistic. But why think about how many points you can minimally get to qualify when you still have two matches to get six points? There should be PASSION, DETERMINATION, AND WILLINGNESS TO WIN. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andyh21 Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 England lost, lets move on, hardly expected a win but its kind of strange that we did play a lot better than what we did v Italy 2 years ago yet result was worse. Just have to win both games now but if we don't then at least we know there are some players who look promising for euro 16 and beyond. This is a tournament that I've had least expectations and even being there feels good enough. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brett.spurs Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 ^ Hopefully Glenbo, Gerrard and Rooney won't be there. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ringwoodrob Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 If Italy win all their games could a team go through with just 3pts,i think,goal diff being the important factor? I think Rooney should be benched now,start Milner or Lallana if Roys brave Berkley(spelling),according to Sky Sports Gerrard had the best passing stats Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
james95 Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 Draw would probably have been the right result. Ah well. Italy deserved their win. Hit the woodwork twice and had a shot cleared off of the line. England mainly shot from long range and other than the Rooney chance never created anything clear cut. To be fair England were better than I expected them to be but at that level a midfield two of Gerrard and Henderson isn't going to cut it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
skybluedave Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 Shouldn't we have had a pen on Gerrard 2nd half? Seen them given. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bracken Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 FFS Pukey, tell me how it could have been worse, don't tell me how England can beat Uruguay, stay focused.How could the results have been worse? Unless your answer is Italy could have won 6-1. This is England's worst nightmare, regardless of what happens from here, this was the worst England could have hoped for. It's really not. You always want the two teams that won the first game to play each other in the second, as it means that only one can guarantee qualification, leaving an open qualifying spot no matter what the result. Had the two teams that won been playing the two teams that lost (so if Uruguay won or we won), both could guarantee qualifying in the second game, leaving nothing to play for in the final game. Put it like this, had Uruguay won, we'd be out of the competition with 2 draws in the other games. As they haven't, if both games are draws we can still qualify through goal difference. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
james95 Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 Johnson was very rarely exposed. Everything came down Baines side really. Which shocked me a lot The only reason he never got exposed was because Italy had a centre back at left back. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainPlanet Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 Johnson wasn't that bad, just has a lot of haters. Gerrard and Rooney were the only two who had poor games really. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TalkSport Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 Shouldn't we have had a pen on Gerrard 2nd half? Seen them given. Didn't leave a brown bag in the FIFA congress like Brazil etc In fact probably did but the contents containing something else. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason the Yank Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 If Italy win all their games could a team go through with just 3pts,i think,goal diff being the important factor? Yes. Matchday 2 Italy over Costa Rica, Uruguay over England leaves the group: Italy 6, Costa Rica 3, Uruguay 3, England 0 Matchday 3 England over Costa Rica, Italy over Uruguay Group would finish: Italy 9, Costa Rica 3, England 3, Uruguay 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cubiscus Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 Shouldn't we have had a pen on Gerrard 2nd half? Seen them given.Yeah possibly, he didn't get near the ball. Sort of thing that would be given outside the box. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob1981 Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 I think there have been a couple of WC groups that panned out that way. One team wins all three, others all beat each other, somebody goes through with only 3 points. Equally you can have 6-6-6-0 where one team loses all games and the others each beat one another. So then somebody can win 2 out of 3 and still go out. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmr Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 I don't see how anyone can see that England team and not see the improvements and how dangerous the forwards can be, they can cause problems for every team. We need Rooney and Gerrard to step it up though, those were the two worst players last night. The biggest mistake we've made is not taking Cole. Baines is a completely different player for England than he is for Everton, he isn't half as good as Cole and in this weather isn't going to get forward enough either. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lermon Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 Watching Uruguay again- can see why they came 5th in their league, they were quite exposed defensively. So England could be able to beat them but obviously Uruguay have lethal forwards. If Suarez comes back, he'll relish scoring vs England. Costa Rica are tame, but they still contain a threat. Costa Rica will be desperately after a point from either Italy or England so they can get through. Italy should, however, beat Costa Rica and they will see themselves through. If they do that- it's uncertain how Italy will field against Uruguay in the last game. But should England beat Uruguay then that result won't matter anyway. But anyway the shortest and easiest way England can qualify- two wins. It was always expected to be a miracle if England got out the group. So it's no different a mission now. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brett.spurs Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 It was always expected to be a miracle if England got out the group. So it's no different a mission now. Walob Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
georginho_juventusygr Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 Prandelli didn't like it that FIFA decided not to allow timeouts for drinks. Marchisio said that he was hallucinating from the heat. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew_ Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 Andrew_: Yes, you can be realistic. But why think about how many points you can minimally get to qualify when you still have two matches to get six points? There should be PASSION, DETERMINATION, AND WILLINGNESS TO WIN. Who the **** cares if people run through all the scenarios. Jesus christ. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
georginho_juventusygr Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 Who the **** cares if people run through all the scenarios. Jesus christ. Pathetic mentality. There is no need to run through all scenarios. England have two games remaining. They can get six points and will certainly qualify. And it's not that they can't do that. Uruguay are old, Costa Rica are of lower quality than England are. Two wins, six points, qualify. Simple as that. England are good enough to do so. Running through the scenarios makes sense if England screw up in the next game. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew_ Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 I'm out . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
arenaross Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 Didn't expect this thread to descend into madness so quickly. That was a good performance and we lost to a team that are a bit better and more experienced than we are in these situations. A few tweaks here and there and do people really think that we're not at least going to give Uruguay a good game. After watching that last night I'm more than confident that we can pick up 6 points now. Much better than the dross we've had to watch at recent tournaments. Just remember how bad we were in South Africa. All this stuff about the results being the worst possible is utter madness. Would anyone not want to be in a situation where qualification is still entirely in your own hands?! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bootador Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 I think we'll qualify now, and we'll make it through to the quarters. As someone has already said, it's more annoying when our failure is hamstrung by one or two players and you know the problem won't be fixed this tournament. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
themadsheep2001 Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 I think we'll qualify now, and we'll make it through to the quarters. As someone has already said, it's more annoying when our failure is hamstrung by one or two players and you know the problem won't be fixed this tournament. For what its worth I don't think Rooney or Gerrard will hamstring us in the next two games, but if we do make it through, a decision needs to be made for the second round, especially about that left flank. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainPlanet Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 I think there's already a decent case for Rooney getting dropped, less so for Gerrard given the other options we have available. If Rooney doesn't turn up next week there'll be massive pressure on Roy to have the balls to drop him. And if he doesn't drop him and he also doesn't turn up in the third game and we go out, that's definitely Roy's job gone and Rooney's international career will take a hammering. Scholes was so right when he said that Rooney's only chance is to play as an out and out centre forward, don't track back, don't worry about getting the ball back, just get ready to shoot when the chance comes his way. And even that is only a chance, as I don't know if he has the mentality to keep calm after not having the ball for so long and to not snactch and chances to shoot when he gets them (like last night) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob1981 Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 No way Roy is getting sacked. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brett.spurs Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 I think there's already a decent case for Rooney getting dropped, less so for Gerrard given the other options we have available. If Rooney doesn't turn up next week there'll be massive pressure on Roy to have the balls to drop him. And if he doesn't drop him and he also doesn't turn up in the third game and we go out, that's definitely Roy's job gone and Rooney's international career will take a hammering.Scholes was so right when he said that Rooney's only chance is to play as an out and out centre forward, don't track back, don't worry about getting the ball back, just get ready to shoot when the chance comes his way. And even that is only a chance, as I don't know if he has the mentality to keep calm after not having the ball for so long and to not snactch and chances to shoot when he gets them (like last night) DM Gerrard CM Henderson CM Wilshere AM Sterling ST Welbeck ST Sturridge Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
darren1983 Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 Sacking Roy for not dropping Rooney? Heard it all now. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
themadsheep2001 Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 I think there's already a decent case for Rooney getting dropped, less so for Gerrard given the other options we have available. If Rooney doesn't turn up next week there'll be massive pressure on Roy to have the balls to drop him. And if he doesn't drop him and he also doesn't turn up in the third game and we go out, that's definitely Roy's job gone and Rooney's international career will take a hammering.Scholes was so right when he said that Rooney's only chance is to play as an out and out centre forward, don't track back, don't worry about getting the ball back, just get ready to shoot when the chance comes his way. And even that is only a chance, as I don't know if he has the mentality to keep calm after not having the ball for so long and to not snactch and chances to shoot when he gets them (like last night) I don't think there is a case yet for him being dropped, unless the next two teams start ripping on our flank, in which case, definitely. Gerrard we've actually shot ourselves in the foot by not bringing an alternative option (Barkley et al are not defensive enough, though again might get away with that in next two games). Agree if he doesn't turn up in a game where he is less like to have to track back (if at all) then the pressure mounts. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmr Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 Gerrard is 100% not getting dropped this tournament and I don't think it would be right to anyway, mainly due to lack of other options, rather go 3 in midfield if we must. Rooney might but there's no way Roy gets sacked if he doesn't. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RubenJ Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 This was probably the most exciting England I have seen in a long time. Hopefully Chamberlain can take Rooney's spot in the next game, fancy them winning against Uruguay and Costa Rica. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anti Spiral Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 Doubt Ox will be fit enough to start. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cedrik Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 Nice game last night. England again pretty poor imo. Why keep a player like Lallana on the bench? I really don't understand that, but okay. Pirlo ownend the whole midfield, Darmian also had a good game. As long as they don't sort out that Premier League, I don't see it happening with the England national team, the whole league supports on foreign players and truckloads of money, qualitywise it isn't even the best league, and if you take away all that money and the foreign lads you are stuck with a pretty poor bunch of English players who are mediocre. If they play like this, with this players I hope England will go home as soon as possible, even freakin' Costa Rica interests me more. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
darren1983 Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 Nice game last night. England again pretty poor imo. Why keep a player like Lallana on the bench? I really don't understand that, but okay. Pirlo ownend the whole midfield, Darmian also had a good game. As long as they don't sort out that Premier League, I don't see it happening with the England national team, the whole league supports on foreign players and truckloads of money, qualitywise it isn't even the best league, and if you take away all that money and the foreign lads you are stuck with a pretty poor bunch of English players who are mediocre. If they play like this, with this players I hope England will go home as soon as possible, even freakin' Costa Rica interests me more. I think you maybe should learn to follow the advice in your own location mate. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RubenJ Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 Cedrik is notoriously wrong on everything, so I wouldn't pay too much attention to him. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barnzy Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 Personally I think the worst thing about yesterday was the realisation that Costa Rica are a hell of a lot bettrer than anyone gave them credit for. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SJ234 Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 Nonsensical post. England were good I thought. Rooney and Baines were our worst players. If Chamberlain is fit I would pick him over Rooney for the next game and just try it again. Rooney should be dropped for two reasons 1) he was awful 2) he doesn't fit the style of play we seem to be going for which is based on pace and energy as he constantly slowed the play down. However I doubt he'll be dropped as intrinsically he is our best player he just needs to get it all together as the style of play should suit him if he is at his best. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhino Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 It's quite alright that your common garden football fan underestimates a team like Costa Rica, but it's pretty embarrassing that the media in Britain still does it, despite having the incentive, opportunity and means to better educate themselves. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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