Jean0987654321 Posted April 16, 2015 Share Posted April 16, 2015 First things first. I would change that TM to a DLF because your players will be just hoofing the ball to him and not counterattacking Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pedromanuelpinto Posted April 16, 2015 Share Posted April 16, 2015 With a Poacher or an AF as partner? Should I had already something to the TI, or keep with the basic? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
macca72 Posted April 16, 2015 Share Posted April 16, 2015 Like this thread but it just (in my mind) reinforces my view that team mentality should be done away with. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaunwwfc Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 Has anyone eventually who posted in this thread put together a successful counter attacking system? It is something I have probably longed for for years really. At the moment I would like something in esque to what Mourinho has created. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leoforos Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 The way I see it, counter attacking is a very situational style of play that needs to be adapted and tweaked during matches ( unless you play as a bottom table team and know that 90% of your opponents are going to constantly attack you). I don't have a counter attacking system per se, I have a formation ( 433 or 4123 IG) and different sets of TI and roles/duties in order to alternate between a fast transition style ( attacking) and counter ( defensive). However some principles always apply IMO : - 1) the need for space. Playing with a counter mentality will see your team drop deep and so you'll naturally have more space available to you. However with an attacking mentality you need to drop the D-line. It also greatly depends on your opponent's defensive shape. - 2) roles to attack said space ( winger on one side and an IF on the other has worked well for me, as well as an attacking minded forward - no DLF/F9 etc). - 3) someone able to quickly and accurately distribute the ball. DLP/Reg could also work I guess. I avoid any of the more advanced playmaker roles as they 1) keep the ball way too much 2) act as the focal point for your team. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jean0987654321 Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 Has anyone eventually who posted in this thread put together a successful counter attacking system? It is something I have probably longed for for years really. At the moment I would like something in esque to what Mourinho has created. Yep, see above my post. It has worked but it isn't really Jose tactics. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnyyakuza78 Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 Yep, see above my post. It has worked but it isn't really Jose tactics. Could that realistically be described as a counter attacking tactic though? Or is it just an attacking fast paced direct tactic? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jean0987654321 Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 Could that realistically be described as a counter attacking tactic though? Or is it just an attacking fast paced direct tactic? It IS a counter-attacking tactic. While the Counter is not ticked under the hood, it has counter-attacking-esque runs. Of course, because this game have nerfed defending anything other than the Attacking Mentality will make counter attacking moot Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnyyakuza78 Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 It IS a counter-attacking tactic. While the Counter is not ticked under the hood, it has counter-attacking-esque runs. Of course, because this game have nerfed defending anything other than the Attacking Mentality will make counter attacking moot But surely with this definition, any tactic that involves attacking quickly is a counter attacking tactic.. basically anything thats not tiki taka. I understand there are many different styles of counter attack, but surely the main definition is the ability to soak up pressure to create space for your players to run into. I can't quite believe that its impossible. Surely Cleon's threads illustrate a number of defensive tactics. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jean0987654321 Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 But surely with this definition, any tactic that involves attacking quickly is a counter attacking tactic.. basically anything thats not tiki taka. I understand there are many different styles of counter attack, but surely the main definition is the ability to soak up pressure to create space for your players to run into. I can't quite believe that its impossible. Surely Cleon's threads illustrate a number of defensive tactics. Cleon has done such but he has not introduced a counter-attacking tactic. There is a difference between playing parked bus and hoof ball and playing counter-attacking soccer. For example, watch Unai Emery's Sevilla or Marcelino's Villarreal. Exhibit A: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4khZxl7_HVA and then Jurgen Klopp's counterattacking style is dubbed "counterpressing" Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnyyakuza78 Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 I don't really know enough about those sides to comment, but I'd class Chelsea as a classic countering side, at least against bigger teams. They don't sit too deep but tend to only press in their own half and rely on direct balls and running to get goals. (obviously second half of this season more than first half). Also they are quite risk averse and suck teams in. If your tactic is high line attacking, pressing then its really more of a gegenpressing or actually just a direct attacking tactic surely? EDIT: I tried looking up some Villareal tactical reviews. This one against Madrid, with a deep, disciplined back line and talk of frustrating the opposition, doesn't fit in with an attacking tactic. Having said that, I haven't really seen them play. http://www.managingmadrid.com/2015/3/3/8133723/real-madrid-vs-villarreal-tactical-review-2015 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jean0987654321 Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 I don't really know enough about those sides to comment, but I'd class Chelsea as a classic countering side, at least against bigger teams. They don't sit too deep but tend to only press in their own half and rely on direct balls and running to get goals. (obviously second half of this season more than first half). Also they are quite risk averse and suck teams in. If your tactic is high line attacking, pressing then its really more of a gegenpressing or actually just a direct attacking tactic surely? EDIT: I tried looking up some Villareal tactical reviews. This one against Madrid, with a deep, disciplined back line and talk of frustrating the opposition, doesn't fit in with an attacking tactic. Having said that, I haven't really seen them play. http://www.managingmadrid.com/2015/3/3/8133723/real-madrid-vs-villarreal-tactical-review-2015 My tactic is not gegenpressing. It is set to Drop Deeper. That is not the high-line that gegenpressing requires. I did set one of my pivots to close down but I want him to work like a machine to win back the ball. Remember RM's win over Valencia 5-0 years ago. The pivots were closing down the oppo and then when they won the ball, boom, counter attack is on. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnyyakuza78 Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 Yes but Drop deeper from an attacking mentality, which is basically the same D-Line as a Control. So still a high D-Line. So you are basically pressing in the opposition half... which is more of a Gegenpressing than a typical standard counter attack. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jean0987654321 Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 Yes but Drop deeper from an attacking mentality, which is basically the same D-Line as a Control. So still a high D-Line. So you are basically pressing in the opposition half... which is more of a Gegenpressing than a typical standard counter attack. Nope, I'm not pressing in the oppo's half, only one of my pivots is pressing in my OWN half It is a tradition to treat the game as real life soccer, but once again you have to play to the game's limitations and logistics and not real life's. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnyyakuza78 Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 Nope, I'm not pressing in the oppo's half, only one of my pivots is pressing in my OWN half It is a tradition to treat the game as real life soccer, but once again you have to play to the game's limitations and logistics and not real life's. What are your possession stats like? Any screenshots? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jean0987654321 Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 What are your possession stats like? Any screenshots? Don't really matter. Even the Joses and Klopps of the world have most possession with their tactics. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jean0987654321 Posted May 8, 2015 Share Posted May 8, 2015 Alright, there seems to be some confusion on counterattacking. I know the game already makes it difficult to define due it its unique tactical structure. But here I go, I have another masterpiece. This one is even good for the lower leages. Attacking - I don't want the boys to defend too deep. I also want the tempo that the mentality has which is high. Rigid - Its the lower leagues. I can't allow the boys to be creative. They don't make bright decisions 4-3-3 GK or SK (d) or (s) or (a) - Roll It Out, Distribute to FBs, Pass It Shorter, Less Risky, Distribute Quickly, Tackle Harder Very basic. You have to ball, get rid of it quickly to start the counterattack FB (a) x 2 - Pass It Shorter, Shoot Less Often, Tackle Harder, Stay Wider I want these guys to overlap the Wingers as the break begins and they are out wide and available as a passing option to them. CB (d) - Pass It Shorter I want this guy to not do anything stupid and stay back. CB © - Pass It Shorter I want the cover guy to cover the runs of my Regista and my attacking CM has they'll leave a lot of gaps behind them. RGA - More Direct, Shoot Less Often, Tackle Harder Nothing out of the ordinary. I want him to start deep but make killer balls to aid on our counterattacks. BBM (s) - More Direct, Get Further Forward, Tackle Harder, Shoot Less Often He is a runner. He'll defend and attack when we have the ball. A machine in his position CM (a) - More Direct, Tackle Harder, Shoot Less Often, Roam, Move Into Channels My Di Maria. Stretch the play wide by running the channels. W (s) -More Direct, Get Further Foward, Shoot Less Often, Tackle Harder I want this guy to be a little deeper than his teammate on the other side is so when he scoops up the ball, the fun can really begin. IF (a) - More Direct, Shoot Less Often, Tackle Harder, Roam The man. He will stay higher than most of the midfield and when a counterattack is on, he will be a viable option. AF (a) or P (a) - Hold Up Ball, Tackle Harder, Roam I'll use the former PI to allow more men to make their runs forward as the AF is the lone striker up front and theres a lot of space behind him TI Pass Into Space - Through balls are key in counterattacks Play Out Of Defense - No hoofballs here. When you win the ball, play it out. Whipped Crosses - Whippage...Whippage everywhere. I have the pacy players that can get on the end of them so why not? Exploit the Flanks - I want the players to spread the play when beginning a counterattack. Drop Deeper - Take some pressure of us and lets the team get behind the ball in order to counterattack Stay on Feet - Its the lower leagues. While I have Tackle Harder in all the players PI, I don't want them to be too aggressive. Much Higher Tempo - Fast, baby. Once you have the ball, don't hesitate. Lets go. Close Down Much Less - I want the players to sit deep and not try to hunt down players. Deep and compact Highlights of this masterpiece Lyden intercepts the ball and the fun really begins Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnyyakuza78 Posted May 8, 2015 Share Posted May 8, 2015 That was nice, I liked how you got 6 people in the box by the end of it. Any more details on that match though? The opposition team seem to have push up really high. Were you an underdog or were they losing? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jean0987654321 Posted May 8, 2015 Share Posted May 8, 2015 That was nice, I liked how you got 6 people in the box by the end of it. Any more details on that match though? The opposition team seem to have push up really high. Were you an underdog or were they losing? It was already 1-0 in favor of us in that highlight Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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