Is Training the worst part of FM ?

[lemeuresnew]

@Svenc - player says in interview you are a hard b******. thats gota be a 2 week fine now a days lol

i personally miss these types of game, but dont know if i could go back to them again. spending 8 hours in your room because of storms was fine at the time, now i can still talk on forums or fb, no need for that much imagination

 

[lemeuresnew]

On 7/31/2017 at 15:38, ilkork said:

Likewise, I would like to be given the option to train in some things. It's ok if you don't use it, not the end of the world. But I will use it, and it means that I will have a slight advantage over the AI.

i think this is part of the problem. as things are, most features in game are designed to be useful without giving such a clear advantage. can you imagine how much a difference this could be over the AI? you know they aren't going to be able to make anywhere near the use of it a human could

what would be more balanced, and a lot more easier for SI to instigate would be more feed back to the training and set pieces created that are already in use. so instead of just telling us about the takers or if any one is marking a post (why this is important enough to have its own feed back i do not know) it could point out if one CB is better suited to zonal than man marking, or if a player challenging the keeper is regularly giving free kicks away and should be changed. 

 

[lemeuresnew]

as it is in game, training in certain areas is already supposed to give as boost for the next game, so why not have it explained better towards the players doing the training. some thing along the lines of player a + b have been working well at covering each other in midfield, or performing there off side trap from set pieces depending on the team selection.

this would also implement more effects of squad rotation - as it is putting 2 random players in to play defense together has no real side effects once all players are familiar with the tactics. so a central defense pairing could have a familiarity bar, same as the tactics one, that can be increased by the training and playing together. you could get reports on there training to see if they are suited to play together, and get an idea through that on how long it would take them to gel and know each others strengths and weaknesses. some thing along those lines?

[Smurf]

I think it's clear that some sort of training report in terms of stats is required. 

It could come from assistant manager as a news item - with a list of players who impressed in training and so on.

[Cougar2010]

2 minutes ago, Smurf said:

I think it's clear that some sort of training report in terms of stats is required. 

It could come from assistant manager as a news item - with a list of players who impressed in training and so on.

Personally I think thats the kind of thing that could work.

Those that train well say either get a small boost to attributes for the next match or potentially a chance of a small boost if you want to include random.  Those that don't train well either do or potentially maybe get a small drop.

You would have to be careful though that players don't end up in either a spiral downwards or spiral upwards.

[Tony Wright 747]

Some good ideas on this thread, I hope SI are listening

[Seb Wassell]

31 minutes ago, Tony Wright 747 said:

Some good ideas on this thread, I hope SI are listening

Always  

[Tony Wright 747]

5 hours ago, Seb Wassell said:

Always  

Thanks for that

[XaW]

For those of you who have played FM/CM for many years, you might remember when we had to set this up VERY specifically for groups of players:

This was CM4 if I'm not mistaken, and I would NOT like to go back to this.

I would, however, get more detailed reports from the assistant instead of just a monthly review with some "good" and some "bad" performances. In an ideal world I would like to get a report I could change with ease. For instance what defender in my youth team have had the best percentage improvement in technical abilities, and the change it to who have had the best percentage improvement in total. Then change it to see who have improved most points in strength. Some ability to customize with some easy to use graphs or something like that. Along with reports from the assistant with information like "Though your preferred choice,  <player x> have played poorly as a left back lately. <player y> have shown a great attitude and skill in training the last couple of days and could be a good choice for the next match against <poor opponent>." Something like that would give detailed and relevant advise from an assistant.

For more general feedback it would be nice to get assistants impression of his change in stats lately. "Young <player x> have improved his strength lately, but his technical improvement are lacking. He is maturing and his mental stats shows his growth". Or "Veteran <player y> 's decline are really showing now as his physical stats keep declining. His leadership and determination however are a help for the younger players".

Those are just examples and might not even be correct, but things like that would, at least for me, help with the immersion of the game as well as giving me the information i want.

[Smurf]

Yes I remember that well. We definitely don't need a day by day training schedule - and that's why we have staff after all, to organise all that. 

However, I'd like to be able to instruct the As.Man to complete certain training drills, like penalties, free kicks, defensive training etc.

For example, I'm going up against Barca in the 1st Leg of a Champions league match - I'd like them to train in defense a bit more, practice penalties, and maybe an quick counter attack with 1 striker against 2 defenders and goalkeeper.

I should be able to get the As.Man to do this with a few clicks. 

 

Perhaps, after matches there could be a "Tactics" overview for the next match, where the As.Man gives a review of the upcoming team, their style of play, and several suggestions to brush up on for the next game. 

 

It doesn't have to be elaborate, but I'd imagine that's how a lot of clubs do it - meet with the staff to discuss training options to prepare for the next match.

 

 

I'd much prefer this over handling media on a daily basis.

 

 

[forameuss]

Funny you should mention that.  I was listening to the "Quickly Kevin Will He Score" podcast (give it a listen, it's brilliant in parts) and they had @Miles Jacobson on (very good listen Miles, although your knowledge of old CM players was truly shameful).  He told a story about a manager/coach (whose name slips my mind, apologies) who they consulted with on the training module.  It went into far, far too much detail, assigning players to duties every 15 minutes I think they said.  They hated it, despite it being "realistic" and coming from the right place.

[Cougar2010]

1 minute ago, Smurf said:

Yes I remember that well. We definitely don't need a day by day training schedule - and that's why we have staff after all, to organise all that. 

However, I'd like to be able to instruct the As.Man to complete certain training drills, like penalties, free kicks, defensive training etc.

For example, I'm going up against Barca in the 1st Leg of a Champions league match - I'd like them to train in defense a bit more, practice penalties, and maybe an quick counter attack with 1 striker against 2 defenders and goalkeeper.

I should be able to get the As.Man to do this with a few clicks.

Perhaps, after matches there could be a "Tactics" overview for the next match, where the As.Man gives a review of the upcoming team, their style of play, and several suggestions to brush up on for the next game.

It doesn't have to be elaborate, but I'd imagine that's how a lot of clubs do it - meet with the staff to discuss training options to prepare for the next match.

I'd much prefer this over handling media on a daily basis.

I think there is a fair bit of misunderstanding here about what training does in FM.

Training in FM is primarily there to increase attributes, nothing else.  When you select different training options you are simply altering the way CA is allocated to attibutes.  This has no direct connection to the matches you play.

There are then a couple of secondary options.

The first is learning PPMs which is similar to the attributes in that it has no direct connection to the matches.

The second is the match training which does have a direct connection to the next match - You get a small boost in the area you select.

 

To change training and make it more integrated to the matches is clearly then a major change and would need to be done with a lot of thought.

[Smurf]

Therein lies the rub! 

Training for certain matches could in theory give a slight boost to your tactical style of play, and the players in the area they are training in. For example, a penalty shootout, because you practiced this your players would be a bit sharper. For quick counter attacks, they'd be more likely to attempt it - because you opted for training exercise. 

I think the training could play a bigger part in preparing for your next game - as I'm sure it does in real life. 

 

[BorussiaDortmund]

Im one of the 1% who whould like to see training visual. To get an feeling for attributs, variants of set pieces, how my players convert my idea of football in training-sessions on different ways. Simple example: sprints. It takes SI not so much work and for me it whould be ideal to compare 2 players with different quickness. Shots outside of the box and in, with passes, against a defender and all the stuff around. If i dont like to watch, i simple dont do. But training is the biggest in football, it needs to be something in a game like a football simulation also. 

[ilkork]

On 8/1/2017 at 18:24, lemeuresnew said:

i think this is part of the problem. as things are, most features in game are designed to be useful without giving such a clear advantage. can you imagine how much a difference this could be over the AI? you know they aren't going to be able to make anywhere near the use of it a human could

Well, good point.
What SI could do though, is to create 50 patterns (random number) of, let's say, set-piece routines (free-kicks, corners). And then make all the AI teams (at least the ones who are in active leagues) to train in 10 of them, all year round. That way, you, as a manager, can choose from 50 patterns and exploit that area, as real life managers often do.
Also, SI could add bars, like the ones in tactical familiarity. And if a set-piece routine is fluid, it won't necessarily mean that you will succeed everytime you try it on the pitch, just that you'll have more chances (%) of succeeding and scoring a goal.

Sorry for the wording, I hope you understand what I mean.