Am I just unlucky or are defenders insanely hard to procure in this game?

[LetsNotScoreGoals]

I've just been absolutely unable to find any competent defenders. Any decent defender I find is marked "Unwilling to sell" and any defender that is slightly below decent is marked at ridiculous price tags. Who would pay 80 mil for a 30-year old dude who is clearly just being offloaded because he can't play at such a high level any more?

It's my fourth season with no decent defenders and it's really hurting my team. The funny thing is that I can manage to find three right backs, buts DC's and LB's remain extremely elusive.

Maybe you can say that common line "well it's realistic because nobody wants to be a defender hur hur" but this isn't really fun to sit through. I've even tried finding RB's, wingers, or defenders who can adapt to a defensive role but no luck! They're all still too expensive or too rubbish to be worth any investment.

And I'm not being picky. Every recommendation is sub-80 and comparing to my 2.5 star or 3 star guys, their stats are all worse.

It's frustrating.

[FrazT]

What team and in what division are you playing in?

[LetsNotScoreGoals]

4 minutes ago, FrazT said:

What team and in what division are you playing in?

I'm playing my own team, taking over from Cheltenham in League Two, and I'm in the Premier League right now.

I've got a decent, 4-star reputation and a decent record. I am also willing to spend about 20 million dollars.

I'm also kind of basing my signings on experience. Thus far I've signed 5 wonder kids for 20 mil or less, all 3.5 to 4 stars and with potential for improvement — a GK, wingers on each side,  a midfielder, and a striker. So as you can see, a cheap defensive wonder kid still remains missing.

Edited April 11, 2020 by LetsNotScoreGoals

[XaW]

1 hour ago, LetsNotScoreGoals said:

I'm also kind of basing my signings on experience. Thus far I've signed 5 wonder kids for 20 mil or less, all 3.5 to 4 stars and with potential for improvement — a GK, wingers on each side,  a midfielder, and a striker. So as you can see, a cheap defensive wonder kid still remains missing.

I'd flip that around, and say it's too easy to sign wonderkids from the AI in general. But I do find the transfer market very easy to exploit in general though,

[LetsNotScoreGoals]

18 minutes ago, XaW said:

I'd flip that around, and say it's too easy to sign wonderkids from the AI in general. But I do find the transfer market very easy to exploit in general though,

Some of the exploitable things like being able to randomly scout every player in the world or magically find similar calibre players is... a bit ridiculous yes. But in my experience it hasn't done much for me since all it does is turn up super old players or players whose clubs are not interested in negotiating.

[Etebaer]

Defenders are there in abundance but "good" Defenders are really hard to come by especially with a lower reputation - the only way to get them is to identifiy them b4 everyone else and contract them early or have luck and get some that have a Fallout with their former Team and pursuing them very agressiviely - you need the Transfer get done b4 other Clubs get aware of them which means you are willing to buy more than you need bcs you will probably get less than you wanted.

[LetsNotScoreGoals]

7 minutes ago, Etebaer said:

Defenders are there in abundance but "good" Defenders are really hard to come by especially with a lower reputation - the only way to get them is to identifiy them b4 everyone else and contract them early or have luck and get some that have a Fallout with their former Team and pursuing them very agressiviely - you need the Transfer get done b4 other Clubs get aware of them which means you are willing to buy more than you need bcs you will probably get less than you wanted.

So how do you identify them first? More importantly, how do you even buy them? I think I've well in finding them but many clubs just don't want to sell, even if it's a low-rated with high potential.

[zyfon5]

What I would say is if u find it hard to find certain players, try considering converting some players. In my fm18 long save, 4 players in my starting eleven were converted from other positions due to me having difficulty to find really specific attributes to fit the role. Try look for full backs or defensive midfielder that might be able to play as centrebacks.

 

[LetsNotScoreGoals]

1 hour ago, zyfon5 said:

What I would say is if u find it hard to find certain players, try considering converting some players. In my fm18 long save, 4 players in my starting eleven were converted from other positions due to me having difficulty to find really specific attributes to fit the role. Try look for full backs or defensive midfielder that might be able to play as centrebacks.

 

How do you know who you can covert. The ones with multiple circles are all too old and expensive.

[zyfon5]

look at the attributes. as i quote Rashidi, attributes is king in this game. as long as they have the attributes to do it, they can do it even if it is not their natural position. however retraining takes a bit of time. identify some youngsters with adaptability and the right attributes to do it.

take my long PSG FM18 save as an example:

right back-initially a winger with decent defensive attributes

ball playing defender-initially a deep lying playmaker

right inside forward-initially a natural advanced forward his job is to score goals

left inside forward-initially a natural advanced playmaker he plays more of a creative role

 

3 hours ago, LetsNotScoreGoals said:

How do you know who you can covert. The ones with multiple circles are all too old and expensive.

as ur save goes very long, some roles will naturally become very rare in the game so u either have to adjust ur tactics or be very creative how u find players. since i dun have enough info on how ur save looks like, i can only give so much advice. look up on some fm youtubers on how to set up scouting assignments maybe ur scouting is just not expansive and efficient enough to find the players u need. also invest in ur youth team especially when u dun have the reputation and money to recruit very good players.

[zyfon5]

8 hours ago, LetsNotScoreGoals said:

I'm playing my own team, taking over from Cheltenham in League Two, and I'm in the Premier League right now.

I've got a decent, 4-star reputation and a decent record. I am also willing to spend about 20 million dollars.

I'm also kind of basing my signings on experience. Thus far I've signed 5 wonder kids for 20 mil or less, all 3.5 to 4 stars and with potential for improvement — a GK, wingers on each side,  a midfielder, and a striker. So as you can see, a cheap defensive wonder kid still remains missing.

have u try set up a specific scouting assignment to find the defensive player that u need? u can even set the max value if i am not mistaken in the scouting assignment

[JordanMilly]

21 minutes ago, zyfon5 said:

look at the attributes. as i quote Rashidi, attributes is king in this game. as long as they have the attributes to do it, they can do it even if it is not their natural position. however retraining takes a bit of time. identify some youngsters with adaptability and the right attributes to do it.

take my long PSG FM18 save as an example:

right back-initially a winger with decent defensive attributes

ball playing defender-initially a deep lying playmaker

right inside forward-initially a natural advanced forward his job is to score goals

left inside forward-initially a natural advanced playmaker he plays more of a creative role

Yep, I do exactly the same - a significant number of my ball-playing defenders from youth intakes originally started as CM or DM deep-lying playmakers who had decent defensive and aerial attributes.

[Etebaer]

vor 8 Stunden schrieb LetsNotScoreGoals:

So how do you identify them first? More importantly, how do you even buy them? I think I've well in finding them but many clubs just don't want to sell, even if it's a low-rated with high potential.

Yeah, that is the Million Dollar Question...and the answer is - it depends!

What League are you playing in and what style of tactic do you use?

I can only speak for myself so i am in need of above average pacey defenders as i am playing attacking Football with a high defending line - also they should somewhat capable of being good at heading as i like to lead the other Team to the  wings so it can send crosses into my Box where my Team is wating to turn the attack into a counterattack and if unable to play out of defense and only clear the Ball to elsewhere in great danger.

So i have no use for "No-Nonsense Centre Backs".

Also i find "Ballplaying Defenders" highly overrated at it narrows your Defender pool to much and the Ball Playing Defender Role is only an additonal source of Goal concedeing error making imo (i use them as Deep Lying Playmakers in the DMC pos though).

My preferred type of Defender is the "Central Defender" on "Defend" Duty as i play with offside trap and i found a cover/stopper model making that less useful - cover comes from my Sweeper Keeper.

Now i have identified what type of Defender i use and why.

 

Now what Defender Player do i look for...

First - i do not care for Stars at all - it is all atributes!!!

Second - they need to be fast (Acceleration and Speed should be not lower than 12 and both together should be 27 at least for the highest league, agility is not of your concern)

Third - Strenght and Jumping - go for Jumping as long Strength is around average - 8+ strength is comletely ok but Jumping needs to be at least 14)

Fourth - Heading, Marking, Tackling - Marking is not of any matter as i never ever mark tight and play Zonal defending. Tackling can be as low as 12 (the lower the tackling the better must be the strength) and you have still a good Defender, Heading can be ignored as Jumping is the decisive factor.

Fifth - Mental values - FM is a game mostly about physical and technical Attributes but Positioning should not be lower than 9, and either you have a good Anticipation of 12+, or you have good Bravery (13+) and Agression with Agression being a double edged Sword.

I like to have very determined Defenders if possible but as long at least one of my 2 DCs is very determined i may go for a Partner that is less determined with better Physics or Technics.

Usually my defenders have a height of at least 1,90m but i tend to have Subs that also are able to play Wing Back that can be 1,80m or heigher.

And this is a defender that already works very well inside my tactics!

The Thing is - if you Play different you may have to look for a completely different type of Player...

 

When to look an where to look:

Well, the first Season you start already the first day with Screening Players, it takes Hours upon Hours upon Hours and there is no tabou where to look, what type of Transfer it is or if it is a free Agent . there are often surisingly good free agents around.

Sometimes your Director of Football may be able to conceive Players to come that rejected you and vice versa, loaning them out may offer a later window of purchase or contracting and you have to plan 3 years ahead.

Sometimes you may be able to start a transfer spiral by gettig "High Reputation Players" that attract other High Reputation Players - every Season there are one or two Players i do not buy for their Performance but to increase the attractivity of my Team for other Players i want that shy away from me for my low Reputation otherwise - good Players attract good Players and the more good Players you have the more will join you - you only need an exit strategy for the "lure in Players" to load off when you have what you really wanted.

And youth Players you need already know at latest with 16 yrs of age as after that you will only get second grade Players - it is a monumental Task of extraordinary dilligence that will make you reap the fruits of success.

 

I hope that was of any help to you

Edited April 11, 2020 by Etebaer

[LetsNotScoreGoals]

1 hour ago, zyfon5 said:

look at the attributes. as i quote Rashidi, attributes is king in this game. as long as they have the attributes to do it, they can do it even if it is not their natural position. however retraining takes a bit of time. identify some youngsters with adaptability and the right attributes to do it.

take my long PSG FM18 save as an example:

right back-initially a winger with decent defensive attributes

ball playing defender-initially a deep lying playmaker

right inside forward-initially a natural advanced forward his job is to score goals

left inside forward-initially a natural advanced playmaker he plays more of a creative role

 

as ur save goes very long, some roles will naturally become very rare in the game so u either have to adjust ur tactics or be very creative how u find players. since i dun have enough info on how ur save looks like, i can only give so much advice. look up on some fm youtubers on how to set up scouting assignments maybe ur scouting is just not expansive and efficient enough to find the players u need. also invest in ur youth team especially when u dun have the reputation and money to recruit very good players.

Yeah that's my concern. I'm on my fifth or sixth year and I don't think the regens are pulling their weight. I'll def pay more attention to the stats though.

I actually have a crazy amount of scouts, each meeting gives me 20 suggestions lol.

I've got a pretty decent youth set-up but it's taking some time to catch up. Right now my U18s are kicking ass in the youth league but my U23's are dead last in their table. Once a few batches of the U18s graduate, I can try to dig around for some good home-grown players.

[LetsNotScoreGoals]

59 minutes ago, zyfon5 said:

have u try set up a specific scouting assignment to find the defensive player that u need? u can even set the max value if i am not mistaken in the scouting assignment

Yeah I did that a bunch of time. Tried everything — hot prospect, replacement for, backup... nothing. They just give me stuff like Trent Alexander-Arnold which I can't afford lol. Or players the club don't want to sell.

[LetsNotScoreGoals]

16 minutes ago, Etebaer said:

Yeah, that is the Million Dollar Question...and the answer is - it depends!

What League are you playing in and what style of tactic do you use?

I can only speak for myself so i am in need of above average pacey defenders as i am playing attacking Football with a high defending line - also they should somewhat capable of being good at heading as i like to lead the other Team to the  wings so it can send crosses into my Box where my Team is wating to turn the attack into a counterattack and if unable to play out of defense and only clear the Ball to elsewhere in great danger.

So i have no use for "No-Nonsense Centre Backs".

Also i find "Ballplaying Defenders" highly overrated at it narrows your Defender pool to much and the Ball Playing Defender Role is only an additonal source of Goal concedeing error making imo (i use them as Deep Lying Playmakers in the DMC pos though).

My preferred type of Defender is the "Central Defender" on "Defend" Duty as i play with offside trap and i found a cover/stopper model making that less useful - cover comes from my Sweeper Keeper.

Now i have identified what type of Defender i use and why.

 

Now what Defender Player do i look for...

First - i do not care for Stars at all - it is all atributes!!!

Second - they need to be fast (Acceleration and Speed should be not lower than 12 and both together should be 27 at least for the highest league, agility is not of your concern)

Third - Strenght and Jumping - go for Jumping as long Strength is around average - 8+ strength is comletely ok but Jumping needs to be at least 14)

Fourth - Heading, Marking, Tackling - Marking is not of any matter as i never ever mark tight and play Zonal defending. Tackling can be as low as 12 (the lower the tackling the better must be the strength) and you have still a good Defender, Heading can be ignored as Jumping is the decisive factor.

Fifth - Mental values - FM is a game mostly about physical and technical Attributes but Positioning should not be lower than 9, and either you have a good Anticipation of 12+, or you have good Bravery (13+) and Agression with Agression being a double edged Sword.

I like to have very determined Defenders if possible but as long at least one of my 2 DCs is very determined i may go for a Partner that is less determined with better Physics or Technics.

Usually my defenders have a height of at least 1,90m but i tend to have Subs that also are able to play Wing Back that can be 1,80m or heigher.

And this is a defender that already works very well inside my tactics!

The Thing is - if you Play different you may have to look for a completely different type of Player...

 

When to look an where to look:

Well, the first Season you start already the first day with Screening Players, it takes Hours upon Hours upon Hours and there is no tabou where to look, what type of Transfer it is or if it is a free Agent . there are often surisingly good free agents around.

Sometimes your Director of Football may be able to conceive Players to come that rejected you and vice versa, loaning them out may offer a later window of purchase or contracting and you have to plan 3 years ahead.

Sometimes you may be able to start a transfer sprial by gettig "High Reputation Players" that attract other High Reputation Players - every Season there are one or two Players i do not buy for their Performance but to increase the attractivity of my Team for other Players i want that shy away from me for my low Reputation otehrwise - good Players attract good Players and the more good Players you have the more will join you - you only need an exit strategy for the "lure in Players" to load off when you have what you really wanted.

And youth Players you need already know at latest with 16 yrs of age as after that you will only get second grade Players - it is a monumantal Task of extraordinary dilligence that will make you reap the fruits of success.

 

I hope that was of any help to you

That is a lot of crap to watch out for. I'll really have to take my time looking at attributes. It's really quite a lot to take in.

[Etebaer]

Haha, yeah….;)

 

To give 2 examples:

Bad Defender = David Bates 

Good Defender = Yann-Aurel Bisseck

 

PS: A bad Goalkeeper can make your Defense look very bad - a superior Goalkeeper is the secret (as well as superior Strikers) that Bayern Munich has become that successful.

GK and ST are the 2 positions that allow no compromise and you have to go for the very best! at! all! cost!

Edited April 11, 2020 by Etebaer

[sporadicsmiles]

11 hours ago, LetsNotScoreGoals said:

I've got a decent, 4-star reputation and a decent record. I am also willing to spend about 20 million dollars.

In all fairness £20m is not all that much to be spending on a top class defender. 

Another question is what leagues do you have loaded? I find that you can often find some pretty nice defenders in South America. Particularly smaller nations like Colombia. You have to wait until they are 18 to sign them (and work permits may be an issue). If you have a relatively small database of players loaded, that can drive up asking prices simply because there are not enough top quality players. It is the opposite of using a huge database for a few leagues and never being able to sell people. 

Other than that, do not take "does not want to sell" as a reason to avoid trying to buy. If you are high enough rep relative to the other team you can unsettle a player and he may become available. It is not always effective, but it is an important part of the transfer market that should not be overlooked. Also aim for players with less than two years on their contracts when you do this. Asking prices are correlated to time left on contract. Better to sell low than to lose a player on a free. 

[Bielsa1975]

11 hours ago, LetsNotScoreGoals said:

I'm playing my own team, taking over from Cheltenham in League Two, and I'm in the Premier League right now.

I've got a decent, 4-star reputation and a decent record. I am also willing to spend about 20 million dollars.

I'm also kind of basing my signings on experience. Thus far I've signed 5 wonder kids for 20 mil or less, all 3.5 to 4 stars and with potential for improvement — a GK, wingers on each side,  a midfielder, and a striker. So as you can see, a cheap defensive wonder kid still remains missing.

Your willing to spend 20million dollars , what you need to do is buy of the transfer list its the only way to do it , or if you want to buy a player thats not on the list ,then look in the national league you might be able to get them to sell for 20million , because your not going to compete with prem clubs on 20million (even if a club excepts 20million from bradford its still 60million to you )

[busngabb]

I've not noticed any lack of decent centre backs and I'm in my 7th season now I think. There aren't as many left backs as right backs but I guess that's true in real life as well, but there's still enough. Ball winning defensive midfielders are like unicorns however, everyone wants to be a deep lying playmaker.

I can't help but think it's a reputation/data issue if you've created a team and built them up? Are you in Europe at all? If not, that will be why a lot are filtered out as not wanting to join you.

[LetsNotScoreGoals]

10 hours ago, sporadicsmiles said:

In all fairness £20m is not all that much to be spending on a top class defender. 

Another question is what leagues do you have loaded? I find that you can often find some pretty nice defenders in South America. Particularly smaller nations like Colombia. You have to wait until they are 18 to sign them (and work permits may be an issue). If you have a relatively small database of players loaded, that can drive up asking prices simply because there are not enough top quality players. It is the opposite of using a huge database for a few leagues and never being able to sell people. 

Other than that, do not take "does not want to sell" as a reason to avoid trying to buy. If you are high enough rep relative to the other team you can unsettle a player and he may become available. It is not always effective, but it is an important part of the transfer market that should not be overlooked. Also aim for players with less than two years on their contracts when you do this. Asking prices are correlated to time left on contract. Better to sell low than to lose a player on a free. 

I've tried unsettling them but they just come back with ridiculous, 200m price tags. I even once got a bill for 321m! Who can afford that? I try repeatedly to lowball them but I don't hear from them soon after.

Anyway, I've gotten a lot of good players in the ballpark of 20m so that was what I was basing it on. Are defenders supposedly more expensivee?

[LetsNotScoreGoals]

10 hours ago, Bielsa1975 said:

Your willing to spend 20million dollars , what you need to do is buy of the transfer list its the only way to do it , or if you want to buy a player thats not on the list ,then look in the national league you might be able to get them to sell for 20million , because your not going to compete with prem clubs on 20million (even if a club excepts 20million from bradford its still 60million to you )

Well, it's not like I want to only spend 20 mil. I'm only given around 80 mil a season, because my pigheaded owners still wouldn't get the new stadium going. And when that happens it'll only have 35k capacity. We're not making nearly enough money because things aren't moving fast enough sadly.

[Bielsa1975]

3 hours ago, LetsNotScoreGoals said:

Well, it's not like I want to only spend 20 mil. I'm only given around 80 mil a season, because my pigheaded owners still wouldn't get the new stadium going. And when that happens it'll only have 35k capacity. We're not making nearly enough money because things aren't moving fast enough sadly.

80 million will get you a good 20million value player,wait for another club to have a bid accepted for one thats not on the transfer list ,then jump in aswell with the same bid ,it will of course be refused but no harm in trying 

[sporadicsmiles]

4 hours ago, LetsNotScoreGoals said:

I've tried unsettling them but they just come back with ridiculous, 200m price tags. I even once got a bill for 321m! Who can afford that? I try repeatedly to lowball them but I don't hear from them soon after.

 

It does not always work. I tend to make non negotiable low offers that will be rejected. And if a player wants to join they can be unsettled by that. But it is hit and miss (just like it is when the AI does it to us).

4 hours ago, LetsNotScoreGoals said:

Anyway, I've gotten a lot of good players in the ballpark of 20m so that was what I was basing it on. Are defenders supposedly more expensivee?

It is not that defenders are more expensive, but that 20m is not really a lot of money to be spending on a player in the premier league in general. You have to be somewhat lucky (or good at scouting and finding targets) to get top quality players for that amount. 

[LetsNotScoreGoals]

13 minutes ago, sporadicsmiles said:

It does not always work. I tend to make non negotiable low offers that will be rejected. And if a player wants to join they can be unsettled by that. But it is hit and miss (just like it is when the AI does it to us).

It is not that defenders are more expensive, but that 20m is not really a lot of money to be spending on a player in the premier league in general. You have to be somewhat lucky (or good at scouting and finding targets) to get top quality players for that amount. 

Well guess what. I scouted every player in Boca and other players in the same league and found a defender with a 20m release clause. This is cheating but there you go, 20m is def enough.

[sporadicsmiles]

1 hour ago, LetsNotScoreGoals said:

This is cheating but there you go

Is it? You just got your scouts to go scout somewhere in South America to find cheap talent. That is literally what your scout department is for! Anyway, I am glad you managed to get your defender in the end. 

[LetsNotScoreGoals]

3 minutes ago, sporadicsmiles said:

Is it? You just got your scouts to go scout somewhere in South America to find cheap talent. That is literally what your scout department is for! Anyway, I am glad you managed to get your defender in the end. 

Well, yeah, I would imagine a manager just Googling random South American teams and telling his scouts to look at so and so player.

Really looking forward to the next season now. Finally can get rid of these League One ability deadweights...

[STaphouse]

15 minutes ago, LetsNotScoreGoals said:

Well, yeah, I would imagine a manager just Googling random South American teams and telling his scouts to look at so and so player.

Really looking forward to the next season now. Finally can get rid of these League One ability deadweights...

You don't think clubs have scouts in South America irl?

It's not cheating at all. I don't really understand how you can think using the scouting system is cheating.  You do realise that big clubs have extensive scouting systems irl right?

[zyfon5]

3 hours ago, LetsNotScoreGoals said:

Well, yeah, I would imagine a manager just Googling random South American teams and telling his scouts to look at so and so player.

Really looking forward to the next season now. Finally can get rid of these League One ability deadweights...

Lyon had an extensive scouting network based in Brazil during their golden days hence they had a lot of players from brazil and argentina during that time that not many in Europe has even heard of. this recruitment strategy is part of the reason for their success when they won 7 successive ligue 1 titles. spanish clubs and portugeuse clubs especially has well established scouting networks in south america. there is a reason why there are many south american players in these two leagues. and have u heard of the story how barcelona found messi? which is quite close to what u are doing now 

Edited April 12, 2020 by zyfon5

[LetsNotScoreGoals]

3 minutes ago, zyfon5 said:

Lyon had an extensive scouting network based in Brazil during their golden days hence they had a lot of players from brazil and argentina during that time that not many in Europe has even heard of. this recruitment strategy is part of the reason for their success when they won 7 successive ligue 1 titles. spanish clubs and portugeuse clubs especially has well established scouting networks in south america. there is a reason why there are many south american players in these two leagues. and have u heard of the story how barcelona found messi? which is quite close to what u are doing now 

Well I hope that bodes well. It's looking decent so far.