Football Manager 2021 Official Feedback Thread

[fmgod3]

In club vision transfer activity is broken, top of the league, when expected to fight bravely against relegation, I signed an 18 year old striker on cheap wages

 

Board rating a  - pleased with the finances of the deal, nothing about the player himself performance wise

Fans rating c -

He has scored 15 goals in 21 games for christ sake

 

This seems a theme with all my transfers when it comes to transfer activity, I've got the board not mention if they've been good or not, fans totaly mis-rating them,, when these players are playing well every week and top of the league

 

This is the same with a great winger I've got ripping the league apart, C from the fans towards him

 

Bonkers and totally broken

 

 

 

 

[OlivierL]

I'm really in love with this edition. After playing a few season with different teams, i'm settled with FC United and loving it !

Love almost every screen , it works fast , runs smooth.  Yes i'm missing the condition percentages and the time line during matches.

But this is the best edition ever for me, right after CM 00/01  

EDIT : i see people posting about PI bug and a few transfer bugs but that's something i couldn't test.. i'm doing a youth only since last FM and i'm addicted .  

Edited December 6, 2020 by OlivierL

[Jimbokav1971]

3 hours ago, KiLLu12258 said:

what the hell is wrong with union berlin? i cant win a game and after 30 matches i did not see a good corner kick for my team. thats so annoying, especially i should have a team with decent heading.

 

Maybe it has something to do with the delivery of the ball rather than the player waiting to head it? 

[Jimbokav1971]

7 hours ago, Harper said:

4k is commonly available, yes, but it's still in it is infancy of its uptake. 

And the application does scale. You don't need to change your resolution, but you should use the scale in the preferences to zoom in a bit. Other programs have this to (Excel example below), perhaps SI could make the scale selections available on the sidebar to allow for quick changes. 

• Excel: Laptop v Monitor

I just went through and compared different screens on my laptop screen (MacBook Pro - 1680 x 1050) and my second monitor (ASUS ProArt Display PA278QV - 2560 x 1440). All of these are with the default skin, on 100% scale.

A majority of the screens scale, or better put, the panels scale. The problem is there isn't enough information to fill the scaled panels and text scales relative to its point size (again this happens in most programs).

• Inbox: Laptop  v Monitor
• Player Overview: Laptop v Monitor
• Tactical Meeting: Laptop v Monitor
• Match: Laptop v Monitor

That said, there were obvious issues specifically in the pre-match build-up.

• Team Selection: Laptop v Monitor
  • Might be able to expand the panel width to fill up more space and allow users with higher resolutions to see more columns in the squad view panel.
• Dressing Room: Laptop v Monitor v Monitor @ 125% Scale
  • This has to be a bug initially, but once I changed the scale in the preferences, it looks fine.
• Team Sheet: Laptop v Monitor
  • Looks fine to me, but it is a fluff experience screen. SI could potentially add panels on the side that display formations, league context, and other matches (and results of games player earlier in the round) and disappear on lower resolutions.

A solution here might be for SI to refine scaling so users can scale text separately from the skin panels. I'm sure it's possible, but is it worth while investment of developer time?

This is a really interesting post. I can see that very few people have clicked on some of the pictures and I would urge you to look at the comparison between laptop and monitor, (which is astonishing and has really surprised me). 

This is the player overview screen viewed on a laptop. 

This is the player overview screen viewed on a monitor. 

The problem is that SI is obviously making a game that works on both. 

I don't know anything about the technical aspect of it, but many of my criticisms, (not all), are as a result of me playing on a laptop rather than a monitor.

[Snootch]

Is anyone seeing quite a few missed penalties? Across 4 different teams and saves, I would venture to guess about roughly a 75% miss rate on the user side. I basically expect them to be saved when given at this point. (small sample size admittedly)

[jim5000]

I've played Football Manager since the 90s, when it was called Championship Manager. I took 9 years off when they switched to the 3d match engine (my steam catalogue shows I last purchased FM2011 but barely played it).

In March I got a new PC with the XBOX game pass, which lead me to try FM2020 again, and it sucked me right back in. The UI was excellent, the fact you could assign away boring tasks like training to assistant managers was great, and you could just focus on the core gameplay of the earlier editions - transfers, tactics, and matches, and the game engine and 3d match engine were both good.

I sunk over 500 hours since March into FM2020 before I accidently lost my save when rebuilding my PC. So I thought, if I have to to start my save again, I may as well get the latest version: FM2021.

And my heart has sunk. While I appriciated the match engine improvements and graphics improvements, the UI is a complete and utter mess. It's like a new version of MS Office where they have just moved the icons around for no reason at all. Basic things like the next match info now being at the top rather than the bottom left means you can't see it while the game is processing.

The new skin is far too dark and ugly, and the matchday overlays are horrible, it's information overload and it's really hard to find the right part of the screen to look at. I hate that you cannot centre the 'match tablet', even if you turn off the dugout the match tablet is always right-aligned.

The gestures are nonsense. They are just rebranded 'emotions' from FM2020. Just because I want to be assertive doesn't mean I want to point at someone.

The team meetings, while I see what they are trying to do, by spreading the players all over the screen rather than in a simple list in the middle it just makes it much harder to see at a glance what the reactions are. It takes much longer to review all of the reactions, and it does not make the players feel more 'real'.

As I start my careers in the lowest league, the covid stuff doesn't really affect me.

It's a real shame, the actual match engine and match graphics are far superior to FM2020, but every other element of the UI is atrocious, it's just like someone has thrown up information all over the screen with no thought on how the end user will visually process it, and the colour scheme is far too dark. I am desperately waiting for someone to create a light skin.

If I hadn't accidently lost my FM2020 save (season 2041 - 500+ hours in), I would have skipped FM2021 as I really feel with FM2020 they hit the sweet spot with a great UI, great accessibility, ability to tailor the elements you manage to focuse the game on the areas you like, and a good match engine and graphics.

I would have been happy with the exact same UI, none of this gesture nonsense, an updated database, and the updated match engine and match graphics. Nothing else needed to change.

The UI changes and gestures just feel like change for change sake, without thinking of the end user, for the purposes of selling a yearly iteration. If SI can release and 'FM2020' skin for FM2021 that rebranded the gestures (they do the exact same thing as the old 'tone' options), then I would be very happy.

As it is, I'm hugely dissapointed with FM2021 and feel it is a huge step backwards, match engine and match graphics excepted.

[kertiek]

4 hours ago, MatthewS17 said:

22 games into a season. Not a single Free Kick goal scored across the league. 

 

Hmm.... 

had the same thing happen to my, until i started training set pieces at least once every two weeks, then they started scoring FK's

[upthetoon]

1 hour ago, jim5000 said:

The gestures are nonsense. They are just rebranded 'emotions' from FM2020. Just because I want to be assertive doesn't mean I want to point at someone.

I would have been happy with the exact same UI, none of this gesture nonsense,

The UI changes and gestures just feel like change for change sake, without thinking of the end user, for the purposes of selling a yearly iteration. If SI can release and 'FM2020' skin for FM2021 that rebranded the gestures (they do the exact same thing as the old 'tone' options), then I would be very happy.

great post. I've never really given my feedback on the gestures as not much is also mentioned here.

Also in my opinion, the 'gestures' feature is indeed complete utter nonsense. As anyone actually seen a press conference on TV? The TV angle are almost always a portrait shot where their hands can't be seen. Who actually flails their arms and hands all over the place when answering questions from the press? The feature is completely ridiculous and redundant. Please go to youtube and watch the official pre-match conferences and tunnel interviews. Where are their hands if not usually clasp infront? If you are going to introduce 'body language' into the game, then where is the 'Shrugging of shoulders'? it's one of the most commonly noticeable human body language when tough and unfavorable questions are asked.

On top of the already needless clicking all over, they introduced the useless gestures features to have even more clicking. The terrible UI just makes matters worse.

The gestures feature is a horribly misguided and executed attempt at introducing something new to the series. It is one of the worst - or the worst -new feature to have been ever introduced to the series.

[goranm]

3 hours ago, Snootch said:

Is anyone seeing quite a few missed penalties? Across 4 different teams and saves, I would venture to guess about roughly a 75% miss rate on the user side. I basically expect them to be saved when given at this point. (small sample size admittedly)

I'm seeing the opposite extreme with penalties rarely missed. I'm playing with a top club and even in shootouts, where not everyone has a good penalty attribute, penalties are rarely missed.

[fabiogabriel]

as I said, you have to correct Portugal’s rules a lot, I have the game for 1 month since the beta and 2 weeks for the official game and everything remains the same. If it is to continue making the beta available and keep everything the same, it is better not to launch the beta. Our warnings are useless.

[CaptCanuck]

 

2 hours ago, upthetoon said:

great post. I've never really given my feedback on the gestures as not much is also mentioned here.

Also in my opinion, the 'gestures' feature is indeed complete utter nonsense. As anyone actually seen a press conference on TV? The TV angle are almost always a portrait shot where their hands can't be seen. Who actually flails their arms and hands all over the place when answering questions from the press? The feature is completely ridiculous and redundant. Please go to youtube and watch the official pre-match conferences and tunnel interviews. Where are their hands if not usually clasp infront? If you are going to introduce 'body language' into the game, then where is the 'Shrugging of shoulders'? it's one of the most commonly noticeable human body language when tough and unfavorable questions are asked.

On top of the already needless clicking all over, they introduced the useless gestures features to have even more clicking. The terrible UI just makes matters worse.

The gestures feature is a horribly misguided and executed attempt at introducing something new to the series. It is one of the worst - or the worst -new feature to have been ever introduced to the series.

Worst is a really competitive race. TBF I think there is one more gesture than tone (I delegate all interactions with media/squad to the assman because... well obviously it's the thing to do, so cannot remember the total number) and I'm guessing all they've done is map the 'new' gestures' to the existing tones and changed the labels on the UI. Honestly I think it's the exact same code and has the same results, but with some label/icon changes and maybe a small mapping change to account for an extra gesture.

Edited December 6, 2020 by CaptCanuck

[janrzm]

Such a positive addition but at the moment its a missed opportunity.

I like the format, but can someone at SI tell me why its so disjointed in terms of the suggestions. Surely, the players put forward by the staff in this meeting should in the main align with specific requirements of your club vision/culture?

For example, If the board want me to sign players under 23 why am I looking at 10 suggestions in this meeting all over 30? Not to mention players you can't afford or whos wage demands you'll never be able to meet. There's no logic to it and it kills immersion. Likewise it would be a benefit to be able to dictate the geographical range of suggestions, nationalities and other criteria ahead of the first meeting.

Fair enough to include a couple of "wild card" suggestions in there but these elements of the game must be logically linked. 

 

Edited December 6, 2020 by janrzm

[cherryman71]

14 hours ago, Roncatto99 said:

Ahh the classic FM crap where as soon as your team is too good, the CPU makes your teams feet turn to bananas when they shoot to keep the scores down.

It really is boring to watch 30+ shots to score 1 goal yet the CPU has 2 shots to score.

100 percent agree, see this time and time again, managing different clubs, different leagues, pattern is always the same

[samdiatmh]

keepers are too OP

 

I'm not mad as I think keeping a clean sheet against a Liverpool side (season 2) is almost deserving of that rating

Edited December 6, 2020 by samdiatmh

[CaptCanuck]

I am continually amazed at the bugs big and small I keep running into while trying to play FM21.

I am going back to FM20 now. Will a late winter/post transfer window patch be expected to clean up the dozens and dozens of issues great and small?

Blow up the UI, pass off label/icon changes as new features, promote XG all you want, but when the bugs impact game play and being able to create/edit tactics, I mean c'mon

 

[craiigman]

7 hours ago, CaptCanuck said:

I am continually amazed at the bugs big and small I keep running into while trying to play FM21.

I am going back to FM20 now. Will a late winter/post transfer window patch be expected to clean up the dozens and dozens of issues great and small?

Blow up the UI, pass off label/icon changes as new features, promote XG all you want, but when the bugs impact game play and being able to create/edit tactics, I mean c'mon

 

Get that PI bug all the time as well. Also under complete forward it doesn’t list that they hold up play, but then it’s an instruction that gets added. 
I completely understand the games development was hindered by the virus and I can certainly give passes to stuff. But I’m really starting to wish they went does the PES method for FM21. Just going yep basically the same as last year, we’ve updated the database and made changes to the ME, we will be back with a fully featured FM22. 
These little bugs just keep on adding up and making the experience less enjoyable.

[trevjim]

Yea I completely skip this feature. Along with player interactions and press conferences.

 

[Jimbokav1971]

13 hours ago, Snootch said:

Is anyone seeing quite a few missed penalties? Across 4 different teams and saves, I would venture to guess about roughly a 75% miss rate on the user side. I basically expect them to be saved when given at this point. (small sample size admittedly)

I'm not seeing anything like that. I would say, (and I'm guessing here), is that we are scoring penalties at about 90% in my current game.d

 

15 hours ago, MatthewS17 said:

22 games into a season. Not a single Free Kick goal scored across the league. 

 

Hmm.... 

I'm scoring free kicks regularly. Not conceding many though, (although I haven't had my GK start taking them yet). The test will be, (as usual), if I can get some random GK to convert free kicks and penalties based largely on his positive morale and not at all on his lack of technical ability. 

[Jimbokav1971]

22 minutes ago, Jimbokav1971 said:

I'm not seeing anything like that. I would say, (and I'm guessing here), is that we are scoring penalties at about 90% in my current game.d

 

14 minutes ago, Jimbokav1971 said:

I'm scoring free kicks regularly. Not conceding many though, (although I haven't had my GK start taking them yet). The test will be, (as usual), if I can get some random GK to convert free kicks and penalties based largely on his positive morale and not at all on his lack of technical ability. 

Just loaded up my game to check. 

[FrazT]

Yep- tried to interact at the first one at got lots of scout reports for players earning twice what my top wage allowance was, so have politely declined all other interactions

[Thalo]

4 hours ago, upthetoon said:

Who actually flails their arms and hands all over the place when answering questions from the press?

 

[KiLLu12258]

vor 8 Stunden schrieb Jimbokav1971:

Maybe it has something to do with the delivery of the ball rather than the player waiting to head it? 

 

trimmel and kruse has good ratings. at all i did not see a good chance after a corner - i think its just not working.

Edited December 6, 2020 by KiLLu12258

[janrzm]

The initial meeting should be to agree your criteria, the club suggesting it's stance based on vision and culture, you looking to add the finer detail within that framework.

That could be followed up with any suggestions that meet those criteria if the clubs scouting network has existing knowledge of anyone.

It could be embellished further by the manager or DOF making suggestions on geographical areas to concentrate on, areas where they believe there is greater "value for money" for example. 

Beyond that the meeting can largely follow the new format but it must be relevant or its worthless. As it stands its an extension of the DOF making worthless suggestions that don't relate to the clubs criteria.

Frustrating because it seems such an obvious and easy fix.

[Junkhead]

I personally think in general since the scouting module has changed, things have been poor. It feels like the scouts are just chucking every player they can think of in my direction.

I'm constantly told I should "take a closer look" at a player who the scouts know NOTHING about, and then I have to tell them to scout the player. A week later I'm told the player is useless. I feel the scouts should be doing a bit of filtering here before they bother me. I know there are settings to change the way it works, such as delegation, but then I find it isn't transparent enough and regardless of club vision, what is agreed at recruitment meetings, etc, there seems to be no logic to who they suggest.

For us lower league players the scouting budget is great, however. I just want to be able to tell them what my plans are for the summer, ie. Three/four positions to fill and then they filter out all the rubbish themselves and bring the top 3-5 options to me a couple of months before the window opens.

 

[Hovis Dexter]

I thought that the idea was good but it’s badly implemented. In my present game I’m supposed to be signing players who are younger than 22 but the majority of suggested players are either in their late 20s early 30s or cost more than my entire transfer budget. Also if you agree to the suggestion to have a short term scouting focus the individual scout is removed from his current assignment and does not return to that assignment at the end of short term job.

[MatthewS17]

58 minutes ago, Jimbokav1971 said:

I'm scoring free kicks regularly. Not conceding many though, (although I haven't had my GK start taking them yet). The test will be, (as usual), if I can get some random GK to convert free kicks and penalties based largely on his positive morale and not at all on his lack of technical ability. 

I wasn't referring to me, I was referring to the league as a whole. There have been a grand total of 0. 

 

I'm not talking Direct or Indirect Set pieces. I'm talking shots on goal from a Free Kick. Total goals scored from anyone in the league after 22 games taking a free kick is zero. 

Total in La Liga after 22 games is 4.

 

Total in Bundesliga is 1.

 

THAT, is indeed quite a problem. 

[Grifty]

I'm finding the players they suggest are in line with club vision, in positions where I am genuinely lacking quality or players contracts are soon to be up and also they are finding a few gems. Signed 3 or 4 regens who are now in my first team this way.

[Jimbokav1971]

2 minutes ago, MatthewS17 said:

I wasn't referring to me, I was referring to the league as a whole. There have been a grand total of 0. 

I'm not talking Direct or Indirect Set pieces. I'm talking shots on goal from a Free Kick. Total goals scored from anyone in the league after 22 games taking a free kick is zero. 

Total in La Liga after 22 games is 4.

Total in Bundesliga is 1.

THAT, is indeed quite a problem. 

[Guest]

Just another 'click manager' addition to fm.

Like most, I found it useless and just ignore the extra clicking as a waste of time.

Shame, because initially I thought it might be useful.

The integration of the various roles, scouts, DOF etc, seems lacking in several areas.  At least for me.

[sthptngomad76]

On 04/12/2020 at 22:47, joshpmilton said:

This UI is bananas. As mentioned before, bottom left is the quick change in tactics. Top right is then the confirmation, a point on the screen that I'm 99% sure no other in match decisions require you to click up here? Very odd decision.

I am one of the 'old school' FM players who never watches highlights- still plays in in the CM style text only.

Is there ANY way you can play it something remotely like in this fashion? Two team names, maybe some logos next to them, a set of stats, and text commentary?

Going by this, no chance

[Zoolok42]

1 hour ago, Thalo said:

 

So because of that one guy, they added the feature.

I'm guessing the idea is to use gestures very rarely, not all the time.

[FrazT]

7 minutes ago, Zoolok42 said:

So because of that one guy, they added the feature.

I'm guessing the idea is to use gestures very rarely, not all the time.

I suspect that have been more than a few managers at all levels who have utilised the hair-dryer tactic to motivate their team- Sir Alex, Jose, Roy Keane, Warnock etc

[Zoolok42]

4 minutes ago, FrazT said:

I suspect that have been more than a few managers at all levels who have utilised the hair-dryer tactic to motivate their team- Sir Alex, Jose, Roy Keane, Warnock etc

This was a press conference, I was referring to that.

[Dagenham_Dave]

Anyone else noticing a few too many occasions where a goalkeeper launches a kick downfield directly to a striker who runs in to score a 1v1?

I know this can happen in real life, but it's pretty rare. I'm seeing quite a few of these, both for and against. Managing in the lower Scottish Leagues. 

[BamBamBam]

Think i'm gonna go the matrix ignorance is bliss route, and stop reading about all these bugs and problems.....

[Jimbokav1971]

I often play Youth Only saves. I know I'm not typical of the way the game is played, but it's certainly becoming more and more popular as time goes on. 

With that in mind I was astonished when I received these 2 messages. 

First of all I think we would all agree that this is the worst Youth Intake preview that you have ever seen. There are no positives (green) and just negatives (yellow). 

Now let's fast-forward to the Youth Intake itself. It's a bloomin Golden Generation. 

So my question is, if the Youth Intake preview doesn't have any correlation with the Youth Intake itself...... what's the point of the Youth Intake preview? 

 

[kiwityke]

22 minutes ago, Dagenham_Dave said:

Anyone else noticing a few too many occasions where a goalkeeper launches a kick downfield directly to a striker who runs in to score a 1v1?

I know this can happen in real life, but it's pretty rare. I'm seeing quite a few of these, both for and against. Managing in the lower Scottish Leagues. 

Its about 60% of the goals I've conceded this season! I panic everything their keeper gets the ball.

[4football]

17 minutes ago, Jimbokav1971 said:

So my question is, if the Youth Intake preview doesn't have any correlation with the Youth Intake itself...... what's the point of the Youth Intake preview? 

 

It is the same bugged piece of not working stuff as coaches reports that says that young player XXX with bad stats can become better than some star player in ur main squad.
But if u take a look at that player - u will realise that he will never reach such skills, not even close...

[tmolvik]

1 hour ago, sthptngomad76 said:

I am one of the 'old school' FM players who never watches highlights- still plays in in the CM style text only.

Is there ANY way you can play it something remotely like in this fashion? Two team names, maybe some logos next to them, a set of stats, and text commentary?

Going by this, no chance

I'm also awaiting a clearification on this. I play with "only commentary" 95% of the time, but from what I read here, it seems like that option is pretty much gone. I didn't buy FM2020 because of ME-issues, but looking at the first feedback of FM2021 I was quite sure that I was coming back this year (FM2020 the first one I've missed in the whole CM/FM-series). After seeing (and reading) the insanely bad UI here, it seems like it will be a longer separation than anticipated. If "only commentary" for all practical purposes is gone as well, then it's bye bye... 

[KamyKaze]

Nice. Would be nice to know what I'm promissing to the player 

If I change the language to english it appears. Should this be a bug for the translations bug threads?

 

[kiwityke]

35 minutes ago, Jimbokav1971 said:

I often play Youth Only saves. I know I'm not typical of the way the game is played, but it's certainly becoming more and more popular as time goes on. 

With that in mind I was astonished when I received these 2 messages. 

First of all I think we would all agree that this is the worst Youth Intake preview that you have ever seen. There are no positives (green) and just negatives (yellow). 

Now let's fast-forward to the Youth Intake itself. It's a bloomin Golden Generation. 

So my question is, if the Youth Intake preview doesn't have any correlation with the Youth Intake itself...... what's the point of the Youth Intake preview? 

 

It was broken last season too. Was almost never accurate. I have stopped even looking at it to be honest.

Also broken the board vision stuff. I'm top was expected a top half finish...with 2 games to go. My board are almost suicidal due to poor results on the pitch!

Erm we are massively over achieving here boys lets step off the ledges...mainly because the board seemingly expect 4-0 wins every game.

Draw away at 2nd place thats a C rating. Only win 3-0 at home against a midtable team...thats a C rating.

Lose only 2 days after a cup game during an injury crisis to 4th in the league thats an F.

 

Transfers are equally broken. I signed a full international who had a relegation release clause for 7.2 million his nominal value to his club was 11 million...he was worth 22 million as soon as he stepped foot into my club.

The Board: we aren't happy with th financial aspects of this deal.

Its a total immersion killer.

[MatthewS17]

8 hours ago, kertiek said:

had the same thing happen to my, until i started training set pieces at least once every two weeks, then they started scoring FK's

For the second time, I've having to say this, I am not talking about my personal team, I am talking about every team in the league. Second, I am not referencing DFKs or IDFKs. I have scored 4 from IDFKs and 2 from DFK's. What I have yet to see is the Free Kick taker scoring the goal. 

 

In the Premier League, there have been 6 goals scored by the set piece taker. 3 of them being from James Ward-Prowse. So, I'm not sure who's on 11 games, but that means around 100 games have been played and 6 goals scored from a set piece taker.

 

I am at 220 games played and not a single goal scored by a set piece taker. Potentially it could go the entire season of 380 games without a goal by a player standing over a free kick. 

 

Do ya get it now?

[joshpmilton]

51 minutes ago, Dagenham_Dave said:

Anyone else noticing a few too many occasions where a goalkeeper launches a kick downfield directly to a striker who runs in to score a 1v1?

I know this can happen in real life, but it's pretty rare. I'm seeing quite a few of these, both for and against. Managing in the lower Scottish Leagues. 

Yeah I've been on the wrong end of this many times and I'm also managing in the Scottish lower leagues. Figuring out ways to combat it took a little while, but it can be largely worked around. 

[Jimbokav1971]

39 minutes ago, Dagenham_Dave said:

Anyone else noticing a few too many occasions where a goalkeeper launches a kick downfield directly to a striker who runs in to score a 1v1?

I know this can happen in real life, but it's pretty rare. I'm seeing quite a few of these, both for and against. Managing in the lower Scottish Leagues. 

I usually have my GK taking free-kicks so this would skew the results, but in this particular save I'm not doing that. 

Let me have a look and see how many assists the GK's have at each club. 

We have 0. (because he is out on loan and will be counted later). 

Europa FC have 0. 

Boca Juniors have 0. 

Lions have 0. 

St Joseph's have 0.

Europa Point have 1. 

Magpies have 1. 

Manchester 62 have 0.

Lynx have 0.

Glacis have 0. 

Mons Calpe have 1.

College 1975 have 0. 

So I think that makes 3 assists by GK's after 95 games, (or 190 GK appearances). 

If you are getting loads of goals assisted by your or opposition GK's then you need to report it as a bug

[KeegBCFC]

On 04/12/2020 at 19:21, ai2ker said:

So this post was inexplicably removed without explanation, but its very pertinent to the general tenor of this thread:

FM21 has been released and I'm flabbergasted at how bad some of the changes made are. There's clearly some sort of 'bell and whistles' directive coming down which is why the UI is constantly tweaked, with shaky or non-existent justifications. I think the notion of leaving things well enough alone should be taken to heart. Frankly, I think it's probably too late for a lot of this, but at least I'll feel better having aired it all and maybe the next iteration can be saved. I've also tried to offer compliments where possible so this isn't all one way traffic. Anyways to the point, and I'll have shots of FM20 as well for comparison.

Pre-Match, FM20: 

Cleanly presented info, lack of clutter. This screen is now gone. Instead we have this:

 

Where's the game? Who's the ref? What other games are going on right now? Recent Form? Previous Meetings? Prefered Formations? Upcoming Fixtures? Who's injured for the match? Why did we lose all this information? The game now feels like it is in a vacuum, not part of an on-going league or cup. Not to mention we've lost all the tabs I've highlighted in red in FM20. 

Thing I like: For Next Match only - good if you want to change mentality specifically for a game against a league leader or minnow, but don't want it to be a permanent adjustment to the tactic.

In FM20, during the lead up to kickoff we have this great graphic showing the lineups, uniform colors AND formations:

 

For comparison, here's a real television pre-match screen:

 

Now we have this:

 

No formation,  no headshots; a stark white sheet with a rough font instead. In FM20, you can drill down into any of the players listed if you'd like - cannot do that in FM21. We do now have a simulacrum of social media on the left, which is entirely ignorable (just like real life, or this post - perhaps I'm getting too meta). Oh and we now know who the ref is. Who the ref is is not very important, but it's a nice piece of immersion.

What I like: The match sheet could have an old-timey, authentic feel, especially with lower-league clubs, but it should be in addition to, not in lieu of the formation screen.

Next pre-match screen, the pep talk. In FM20:

Again, clean, easy to read and use. Now FM 21:

I know this has a snowball's chance in hell of being changed as what we're looking at is one of the big 'features' and others have posted about it, but it's cluttered, confusing and an eyesore. Relabeling aggressive, cautious, etc. to thrash arms, point fingers, etc is pretty underwhelming. If you cannot represent the players beyond a box with their name in them (I mean at the very least add the headshots like in dynamics), there's little reason to arrange them in this difficult way to read. I can promise you it does not feel like a locker room with me the manager in the center.

Anyways - we give our pep talk, and onto the match:

In FM20, there's several things to note - first, we have a timeline, if want to rewind or see something again.

We have full club names (even if they're the FM trademark-avoiding version) with logos (when I have the pack installed), which again can be drilled into if you want to easily see the page of the team your playing (or your own).

We have customizable match information allowing yout display what you want, and not what you don't.

We have updates, which allows you to see the live standings. 

We have all the coaching tools on the top, while commentary runs on the bottom.

In FM21:

 

The timeline - where is it? 

The club names are all again in the same harsh font of the team sheet and strangely truncated and without logos. It's a weirdly, self-enforced limitation and makes it less obvious who you're playing. You cannot drill into the names to see. Not an improvement, in fact a decided downgrade. I like to play in unfamiliar leagues and it's not easy to always know who's being played in-match at a glance.

We've completely lost the ability to curate our match information on screen. The tablet is a poor substitute. I'm sure this was 'by design'.

Updates only flash when they change - I have to activate the tablet to see them now, taking up one of two available screens there.

The tactics and subs being adjacent to the commentary is confusing and cluttered. I accept that this may just be an adjustment to make, but the commentary is a lot easier to follow when it's the sole thing on the bottom of the screen. I understand the tactics bar can be minimized, but if you're using it, it'll be visible a fair amount. 

What I like: Not much to be honest, this was the chief driver of me making this post.

What about between highlights? FM20 vs. FM21

I won't even touch the memed-to-death-already passing chart in 'the dugout' but again this is not an improvement. Information is more scattered, less intuitive. My team is still on the bottom, theirs is in formation on the right. What use to be a simple scan across is now similar to the pep talks one of up down over and around. Are you guys trying to limit screen time through sore eyes?

What I like: How much that passing chart made me laugh - I think the sub recommendations are okay but will surely become 'overrun in midfield' tedious. Post Beta Edit: This has been fixed, sort of. 

Finally, let's talk goals and substitutions:

Why are there no headshots with goals? When are you ever going to see them? When you drill into their individual details only? This change is inexplicable to me. Again because the bottom of the screen is now cluttered, it's actually somewhat easy to miss events. In FM20 you have goalscorers and subs prominently at the top. 

I could very well go on further, but this is enough. I realize this may read like a complete trashing, and that's not the goal. I'm obviously a fan of FM and a lot of what is done is positive- FM21 has greater speed and an improved ME which I am a fan of. Would just love a more intuitive design and things to not be so unilaterally removed when there's no demand for it. This isn't even getting into the insistence that there is only one skin (from 3 default last version) that primarily consists of purple and snowblind white. I know people will have different opinions and I welcome them, but to me this new UI/UX is obviously less clear and informative, more click-intensive and graphically worse. I am more tempted than ever to just remain with FM20 than to persist in this purple purgatory but I am hoping some of this can be redressed.

 

Please SI read this post, read it again, and then read it one more final time and use it as everything this person says is brilliant,

[swangin]

Why are shots on target(and therefore saves by GKs) so super inflated in Football Manager compared to real life still? In real life, 10 shots on target by one team is quite rare. In FM, that is happening constantly. Always tons of shots on target between both teams on FM.

[KeegBCFC]

9 hours ago, jim5000 said:

I've played Football Manager since the 90s, when it was called Championship Manager. I took 9 years off when they switched to the 3d match engine (my steam catalogue shows I last purchased FM2011 but barely played it).

In March I got a new PC with the XBOX game pass, which lead me to try FM2020 again, and it sucked me right back in. The UI was excellent, the fact you could assign away boring tasks like training to assistant managers was great, and you could just focus on the core gameplay of the earlier editions - transfers, tactics, and matches, and the game engine and 3d match engine were both good.

I sunk over 500 hours since March into FM2020 before I accidently lost my save when rebuilding my PC. So I thought, if I have to to start my save again, I may as well get the latest version: FM2021.

And my heart has sunk. While I appriciated the match engine improvements and graphics improvements, the UI is a complete and utter mess. It's like a new version of MS Office where they have just moved the icons around for no reason at all. Basic things like the next match info now being at the top rather than the bottom left means you can't see it while the game is processing.

The new skin is far too dark and ugly, and the matchday overlays are horrible, it's information overload and it's really hard to find the right part of the screen to look at. I hate that you cannot centre the 'match tablet', even if you turn off the dugout the match tablet is always right-aligned.

The gestures are nonsense. They are just rebranded 'emotions' from FM2020. Just because I want to be assertive doesn't mean I want to point at someone.

The team meetings, while I see what they are trying to do, by spreading the players all over the screen rather than in a simple list in the middle it just makes it much harder to see at a glance what the reactions are. It takes much longer to review all of the reactions, and it does not make the players feel more 'real'.

As I start my careers in the lowest league, the covid stuff doesn't really affect me.

It's a real shame, the actual match engine and match graphics are far superior to FM2020, but every other element of the UI is atrocious, it's just like someone has thrown up information all over the screen with no thought on how the end user will visually process it, and the colour scheme is far too dark. I am desperately waiting for someone to create a light skin.

If I hadn't accidently lost my FM2020 save (season 2041 - 500+ hours in), I would have skipped FM2021 as I really feel with FM2020 they hit the sweet spot with a great UI, great accessibility, ability to tailor the elements you manage to focuse the game on the areas you like, and a good match engine and graphics.

I would have been happy with the exact same UI, none of this gesture nonsense, an updated database, and the updated match engine and match graphics. Nothing else needed to change.

The UI changes and gestures just feel like change for change sake, without thinking of the end user, for the purposes of selling a yearly iteration. If SI can release and 'FM2020' skin for FM2021 that rebranded the gestures (they do the exact same thing as the old 'tone' options), then I would be very happy.

As it is, I'm hugely dissapointed with FM2021 and feel it is a huge step backwards, match engine and match graphics excepted.

Agree with everything in your post apart from the skin bit, I actually quite like the skin this year, so much in fact that I probably won't bother with my usual downloading of skins and backgrounds etc. 

[duesouth]

16 minutes ago, joshpmilton said:

Yeah I've been on the wrong end of this many times and I'm also managing in the Scottish lower leagues. Figuring out ways to combat it took a little while, but it can be largely worked around. 

How did you manage it in the end?  I'm wanting to play a middle block, but giving up a ton of goals to long punts (and also perfect slide rule passes)...  I'm playing in Serie D/San Marino League in one save and Spanish 2nd div B3/Andorran league in another - so low level stuff as well.

[joshpmilton]

11 minutes ago, duesouth said:

How did you manage it in the end?  I'm wanting to play a middle block, but giving up a ton of goals to long punts (and also perfect slide rule passes)...  I'm playing in Serie D/San Marino League in one save and Spanish 2nd div B3/Andorran league in another - so low level stuff as well.

Mainly by dropping a little deeper, and setting one of my defenders to cover. For the large part this reduced the opportunity for them to go over the top, and if they did my covering defender was there. Man marking an opposition lone striker with the other DC meant that they were more likely to contest said long ball, denying them the chance to run through.

At least that seemed to work for me.

[MatthewS17]

Feel like complaining about the UI is like beating a dead horse. So many changes for this implied idea of nonsensical realism. Changes that weren't even needed. 

 

SI's design team for the UI always seemed on the ball in the past. Given Miles was so obsessive over how good the UI was, it seems it will remain this year and next year and the year after as well. Miles doesn't seem the type for criticism, and I mean that as a person who is probably similar. However, as someone who is severely OCD, the lack of organisation in the UI gives me an absolute headache, and having to go through multiple screens makes me want to throw my laptop against a wall. But, it's all on deaf ears.

You'll still buy the game, they'll still profit. It's unfortunate, but this thread is quite pointless.