*Official* Football Manager 2023 Feedback Thread

[Neil Brock]

3 minutes ago, FM Zagueiro said:

Game crashes on start on steam for me @Neil Brockfm-2023-01-25-182517.ips

Crash report linked.

Do you have a crash dump file? Have you tried this? - https://support.sega.com/hc/en-gb/articles/9997644231185

[Neil Brock]

37 minutes ago, neckdee said:

My game won't launch since it updated today. Bringing up a denuvo error saying I need to remove "dtdata.dll" file. That file isn't anywhere on my C drive, can anyone help?

We're checking in to see if it's something on our end. Please let us know if you're able to load successfully. 

[FM Zagueiro]

4 minutes ago, Neil Brock said:

Do you have a crash dump file? Have you tried this? - https://support.sega.com/hc/en-gb/articles/9997644231185

Unfortunately did not work. Is a crash dump file on MacBook this?  

fm-2023-01-25-183523.ips

[Neil Brock]

7 minutes ago, FM Zagueiro said:

Unfortunately did not work. Is a crash dump file on MacBook this?  

fm-2023-01-25-183523.ips 29.69 kB · 1 download

We've had some reports that downloads got a bit corrupted so first step is to reverify your game files as shown here - https://support.sega.com/hc/en-gb/articles/9997753543185 

If that doesn't work, try uninstalling and reinstalling. All saves etc will be kept safe during this process as they can only be deleted if you do so manually. 

[FM Zagueiro]

7 minutes ago, Neil Brock said:

We've had some reports that downloads got a bit corrupted so first step is to reverify your game files as shown here - https://support.sega.com/hc/en-gb/articles/9997753543185 

If that doesn't work, try uninstalling and reinstalling. All saves etc will be kept safe during this process as they can only be deleted if you do so manually. 

Sorry to be a pain in the ass, but neither worked :/

Should I just give it a few hours and hopefully it somehow sorts itself?

[Lempicka]

I restarted my pc and updated via steam - rather than clicking on the game shortcut. That worked for me.

[bgs4]

Personally I'm loving FM23- seems a much smoother game than 22. I'd still love it if Touch was brought back for the PC but I'm not holding by breath.

However 2/3 things which are really annoying me:

1- Players unhappy with playing time when they play most of the matches in a season/need to be rested after being tired. I speak to them- they accept usually but then are unhappy about not playing when it comes to the match.

2- Linked to this- the Carabao Cup- irl most teams rest their first team yet mine all get upset about being left out and the players brought in don't agree with the team selection even when they benefit from it. 

3- Injuries to top performers/lots when going on a run. I had 3 right backs injured for 3 months plus after going top of the league for the first time in 5 seasons and now my top 3 goalscorers are all injured after we've won the first 5 games of the season. I know it happens in real life but injuries linked to doing well happens way too often and I fear this has been the case since you've had the option to buy an ingame magic sponge and really needs to be looked at.

[Tony Wright 747]

9 hours ago, Choi seung won said:

The reason is simple.

This is because si lacked something to promote as a new feature while releasing the fm23. 

So si forced to promote things that weren't new at all, such as squad planner, coach customization, and so on.

Please, in fm24, I would like to supplement existing features rather than "new features".

There are so many things to fix. Interaction with the press, players, other managers, AI improvements, not to mention the match engine.

In particular, the stadium graphics, which have not improved at all in the past 10 years, must be changed unconditionally.

I would agree that stadium graphiics especially lighting, textures and weather need massive improvement.  How difficult or simple that would be I have no idea, but I would have thought that it would be relatively simple to remove the massive and out of scale tunnels from some stadiums for FM24, which would be an instant improvement.

[kepz]

Please fix MLS trade negotiations so that I can actually negotiate them instead of having them outright rejected.

[kingjericho]

Hope the hotfix addresses the ME lagging

[91427]

23 hours ago, Marko1989 said:

This. The game really does need some big changes. FM 2023 is the first FM I didn't buy, nor I will waste my money on it. The transition from text only CM to 2D engine was WOW as you say. If I remember correctly, I also had that feel when they changed from Championship Manager to Football Manager.

Then in 2009 we got 3D ( which is still very poor ) but again, it was huge improvement.

If I am not wrong, after FM 2012, in FM 2013 they added collision to the match engine. 

Nowadays, to me, FM just looks like slightly updated skin, "we will update continue button from this  to this  and it is ready to go"
( I know I am exaggerating but that is how I feel when I see new fm these days )

In recent years, instead of remembering big updates like before, what I remember the most is, ruined 2D engine in FM 2018 and ruined lightning in 3D engine.  I simply can't believe they went backwards in case of both. 



10 YEARS. 10 YEARS.

It's really awful when you see the comparisons side by side. I don't mind slow improvements year to year but it shouldn't be too much to ask for the game to not get worse. 2D is even worse now than it was in that FM20 screenshot, in particular the flashing banner ads around the pitch that are very difficult to get rid of

[CaptCanuck]

5 hours ago, bgs4 said:

Personally I'm loving FM23- seems a much smoother game than 22. I'd still love it if Touch was brought back for the PC but I'm not holding by breath.

However 2/3 things which are really annoying me:

1- Players unhappy with playing time when they play most of the matches in a season/need to be rested after being tired. I speak to them- they accept usually but then are unhappy about not playing when it comes to the match.

2- Linked to this- the Carabao Cup- irl most teams rest their first team yet mine all get upset about being left out and the players brought in don't agree with the team selection even when they benefit from it. 

3- Injuries to top performers/lots when going on a run. I had 3 right backs injured for 3 months plus after going top of the league for the first time in 5 seasons and now my top 3 goalscorers are all injured after we've won the first 5 games of the season. I know it happens in real life but injuries linked to doing well happens way too often and I fear this has been the case since you've had the option to buy an ingame magic sponge and really needs to be looked at.

In regards to #2, I've felt this would be a good one to address and could likely be handled a couple ways programmatically:

- League Cup: if your club has a reputation of _____ or higher then for the league cup (or whatever domestic cup competition doesn't mean much in your country), until you reach the quarters or semi finals the matches wouldn't count in regards to player happiness playing time calculations
- European competitions: once you club has mathematically qualified out of the group stages it wouldn't count and possibly if you have a 4 goal or larger lead after the first leg.

Edited January 26, 2023 by CaptCanuck

[alian62]

Although any game update is pleasingly accepted i was wondering why it is only a minor update . Looking through the bug section its full of so many issues and we all know how hard SI work on this game but its been nearly 2 months since the December 2 update and this is it ? 

Im disappointed but and the same time happy for the update . 

[cwilcox]

12 hours ago, kingjericho said:

Hope the hotfix addresses the ME lagging

I don't think it has, I never had lagging, now I do - and I have a top spec PC.......!!!  (Please hope it's not true)

 

[Neil Brock]

28 minutes ago, cwilcox said:

I don't think it has, I never had lagging, now I do - and I have a top spec PC.......!!!  (Please hope it's not true)

Try this first - https://support.sega.com/hc/en-gb/articles/9997644231185 and then verify your game files as shown here - https://support.sega.com/hc/en-gb/articles/9997753543185

If that doesn't work, try as suggested here - https://support.sega.com/hc/en-gb/articles/10002466293009

 

[sthptngomad76]

20 hours ago, rp1966 said:

One of the things that has become common in recent FMs is that the big clubs tend to stay dominant even 100s of years into the future and it is quite normal to see PSG dominate Ligue 1 completely for the first 20-25 seasons (so much so that I refer to it as 'the PSG league'), so I've been pleasantly surprised to see that an AI controlled Rennes have managed to break the PSG dominance so early in the game.  Ligue 1 is playing in full detail in case anyone was thinking it was an artefact of a view-only league.

Realism is nice, but it's also great to see an FM save become its own universe with unusual outcomes.

 

Rennes do very well in mine as well.

Some of the long term experiments conducted by FM streamers show some completely chaotic changes in reputation of some leagues as well

Edited January 26, 2023 by sthptngomad76

[Mitza]

I knew AI youth development and rotating was bad, but not THIS bad. 

I just realised after it happened to me the second time, in a different league.

First, I was managing Club Arenas from the 4th division of Spain, and had the luck to play Barcelona in the cup. I knew it was going to be hard, but I realised they literally fielded their best XI possible. Against a 4th division club. I checked their schedule and it was packed, our match was midweek, in between two La Liga games. 

Now I managed another low division club, with my best player at around 110 CA, and same thing, got a cup game against the top division winner who is playing in the UCL. Same thing, they field their best XI possible, not even rotating their keeper. They played PSG just 5 days before. 

No wonder everyone is complaining that the AI is stuck at playing the same old players until they retire with 0 regards to the youth players, when even Barcelona vs a 4th division club doesn't play any youngsters.

[Jack Joyce]

46 minutes ago, Mitza said:

I knew AI youth development and rotating was bad, but not THIS bad. 

I just realised after it happened to me the second time, in a different league.

First, I was managing Club Arenas from the 4th division of Spain, and had the luck to play Barcelona in the cup. I knew it was going to be hard, but I realised they literally fielded their best XI possible. Against a 4th division club. I checked their schedule and it was packed, our match was midweek, in between two La Liga games. 

Now I managed another low division club, with my best player at around 110 CA, and same thing, got a cup game against the top division winner who is playing in the UCL. Same thing, they field their best XI possible, not even rotating their keeper. They played PSG just 5 days before. 

No wonder everyone is complaining that the AI is stuck at playing the same old players until they retire with 0 regards to the youth players, when even Barcelona vs a 4th division club doesn't play any youngsters.

Hey, do you have save games from before these matches were played? If so, could you upload them for us to look at (feel free to send me a DM!)

[Domoboy23]

56 minutes ago, Mitza said:

I knew AI youth development and rotating was bad, but not THIS bad. 

I just realised after it happened to me the second time, in a different league.

First, I was managing Club Arenas from the 4th division of Spain, and had the luck to play Barcelona in the cup. I knew it was going to be hard, but I realised they literally fielded their best XI possible. Against a 4th division club. I checked their schedule and it was packed, our match was midweek, in between two La Liga games. 

Now I managed another low division club, with my best player at around 110 CA, and same thing, got a cup game against the top division winner who is playing in the UCL. Same thing, they field their best XI possible, not even rotating their keeper. They played PSG just 5 days before. 

No wonder everyone is complaining that the AI is stuck at playing the same old players until they retire with 0 regards to the youth players, when even Barcelona vs a 4th division club doesn't play any youngsters.

I've had several cup games against ''bigger'' opposition and a lot of them tend to field their reserve/youth team. Might just be an exception.

 

[GOODNAME]

11 hours ago, alian62 said:

Although any game update is pleasingly accepted i was wondering why it is only a minor update . Looking through the bug section its full of so many issues and we all know how hard SI work on this game but its been nearly 2 months since the December 2 update and this is it ? 

Im disappointed but and the same time happy for the update . 

The last the big ME update will be in late Feb.

[Lempicka]

2 hours ago, Domoboy23 said:

I've had several cup games against ''bigger'' opposition and a lot of them tend to field their reserve/youth team. Might just be an exception.

 

I saw similar in my French lower league save. PSG were knocked out of the Coupe de France up by a National 2 team. Shock of the century I thought. However, PSG just fielded their 'B' Team.

[dunk105]

On 23/01/2023 at 23:17, GOODNAME said:

SI really need to break the same scenario year after year after year

BETA OUT - decent ME

1ST patch (before Christmas) - going backwards

Winter patch - playable ME but still not enough 

 

This. As an ex-Fifa player the cycle is exactly the same in that each year there are changes, brave new ME. First patch its back to the last release.

This year its so more noticeable because with new features thin on the ground the ME changes were the jewel this year. Yes, defending issues but it was glorious and a real change.

Take those ME changes away and I may as well have just installed a database update.

[FM Zagueiro]

21 hours ago, Neil Brock said:

We've had some reports that downloads got a bit corrupted so first step is to reverify your game files as shown here - https://support.sega.com/hc/en-gb/articles/9997753543185 

If that doesn't work, try uninstalling and reinstalling. All saves etc will be kept safe during this process as they can only be deleted if you do so manually. 

I deleted this time from steamapps/common and moved the game to my bin. Seems to have worked. I was just uninstalling from steam itself last time. Thank you.

[CaptCanuck]

I searched on 'late goals' and nothing came up in this thread, so maybe it's only me - but there seem to be a load of goals scored in the last 10 mines into injury time in FM23 vs FM21?

And this isn't a whinge about getting FM'd, we're benefiting from it too. I'll check some IRL league scores, but in Feb '24 across all competitions in our 2nd season we've got the following so far:

Brighton:
- 62 Goals - 36 Matches (7 matches shutout) - 14 goals 80+ (6 80-89, 8 90+)

Opposition:
- 35 Goals - 36 Matches (12 clean sheets) - 11 goals 80+ (8 80-89, 3 90+)

So both sides are roughly scoring 1 goal every 2 matches, in which they score, 80+ mins into the match.

[fc.cadoni]

On 25/01/2023 at 11:44, Sanel said:

I'm not sure whether the devs are aware of this, but the one from 2012 looks far better. Or is it just me?

FM12 graphics was much worse. That’s a single frame from different versions; it is unfair. Only the turf was good looking good.

Animation in newer generations of FM is far more superior. Yes, turf must be better in next FM.

[MBarbaric]

16 minuti fa, fc.cadoni ha scritto:

FM12 graphics was much worse. That’s a single frame from different versions; it is unfair. Only the turf was good looking good.

Animation in newer generations of FM is far more superior. Yes, turf must be better in next FM.

animations and graphics are two separate things.

[Lempicka]

37 minutes ago, fc.cadoni said:

FM12 graphics was much worse. That’s a single frame from different versions; it is unfair. Only the turf was good looking good.

Animation in newer generations of FM is far more superior. Yes, turf must be better in next FM.

Maybe, but the match-day lighting was much better, more stadium variation and more realistic scales (e.g. lower league 2,000 capacity grounds didn't look like a 15,000 League 1 stadiums)

I don't have a problem with the current graphics, but SI really do need to look at the following:

• Stadium scales - as mentioned above.
• Fix the silly stuff (e.g. stadiums with only three floodlights, stands covered in massive entrances/tunnels, etc).
• More stadium variety and better lower league representations. FM13-17 had some decent models.
• Corner infill issues. Standalone stands in larger grounds are noticeably not long enough, so we see blocks of flats, massive TV screens filling in the void. Make the stands longer and reduce the corner infill size.
• More background variety - almost every stadium looks like it's in some generic Northern town. When playing tricky European away legs I want to feel like I'm actually playing the game on the continent - not Burnley-on-Seine (no offence to Burnley). 
• Better pitches and lighting.
• Better snow and rain.

IMO, all of the above should be easily doable. I'm not expecting FIFA  style improvements.

Oh and one day, I'd love to see a running track - but I'm probably asking too much.

 

Edited January 26, 2023 by Lempicka
typo

[fc.cadoni]

1 hour ago, MBarbaric said:

animations and graphics are two separate things.

Only the turf was good. The rest was like cubic things and very low quality from what we have now.

 

Edited January 26, 2023 by fc.cadoni

[Sanel]

2 hours ago, fc.cadoni said:

FM12 graphics was much worse. That’s a single frame from different versions; it is unfair. Only the turf was good looking good.

Animation in newer generations of FM is far more superior. Yes, turf must be better in next FM.

No, sorry.

I play this game for over 16 years now and the ME looks the same as it did in FM 19. It's not only the turf but also lightning. I've been looking at the same type of stadiums and crowd for a couple of years.

5:30, what is that?

Edited January 26, 2023 by Sanel

[Zoolok42]

49 minutes ago, fc.cadoni said:

Only the turf was good. The rest was like cubic things and very low quality from what we have now.

 

That really doesn't look all that much better, especially not like a 10 years worth of work and improvement.

[Lempicka]

17 minutes ago, Sanel said:

No, sorry.

I play this game for over 16 years now and the ME looks the same as it did in FM 19. It's not only the turf but also lightning. I've been looking at the same type of stadiums and crowd for a couple of years.

5:30, what is that?

Taken from the 2018 video:

Ultimately the new graphics engine creates more opportunity for development and you can expect some exciting innovations to the matchday experience over the next few years..

When SI, when?

 

[rp1966]

1 hour ago, fc.cadoni said:

Only the turf was good. The rest was like cubic things and very low quality from what we have now.

 

I've watched that video and the guy gets totally hung up on player models and animations (which actually have improved since the FM18 change).  He completely failed to acknowledge people's main issues which are around lighting, texturing (only pitch textures acknowledged) and stadium modelling/variety which all went backwards from FM17 to FM18.

 

[tropicsafc]

On 21/01/2023 at 12:00, tropicsafc said:

Scheduling is still a bit buggered. First season at Valencia and I've got 4 consecutive home games to begin followed by 9 away games in 12. 
I can sort of forgive it further into a save but not at the very start.

Second season. Mid-season and cross-competition to be slightly fair. 4 away games followed by 4 home games followed by 6 away games. It's really a bit annoying. I've seen similar issues in different leagues on different saves but never this bad.

[alian62]

7 hours ago, Sanel said:

No, sorry.

I play this game for over 16 years now and the ME looks the same as it did in FM 19. It's not only the turf but also lightning. I've been looking at the same type of stadiums and crowd for a couple of years.

5:30, what is that?

SI have always maintained this game was a text driven model first and foremost . They were pressured into delivering a 3D animation match simulation back in 2010 as this is what FIFA Manager was doing to great success . They have got by on the same old modeling now for 10 years plus but as the years roll on and now , as even mobile games have overtaken them on graphics output , its all going to come to the point of biting the bullit and get on with builing a new graphic formula . Right now we are looking at the 2018 graphics that the game had and its even older when you think it was probably being made in 2017 for the 2018 release . People laugh when they are shown this game for the first time ? We all love this game hence why we all get fustrated but the time has come to move forward and catch up with the world otherwise people are going to become dispondant and just play the older games . I bet there isnt one person who plays FM for years doesnt go back and play the older games . 

Edited January 27, 2023 by alian62

[Tyburn]

Can the code please be tweaked to recognise “qualify for continental football” (or ANY promise involving a clubs inclusion to a competition) isn’t just about league finish?

I finished 10th in premier league but won the euro conference. I qualified for the euro league, a continental competition. But the code is tied to league finish.

Either players should demand a league finish position, or if, as it stands, they demand a competition inclusion, the game should recognise there is more than a league finish position to achieve it.

Now dealing with unhappy players, again, when the information presented should suggest that not to be the case.

Irksome.

[XaW]

4 minutes ago, Tyburn said:

Can the code please be tweaked to recognise “qualify for continental football” (or ANY promise involving a clubs inclusion to a competition) isn’t just about league finish?

I finished 10th in premier league but won the euro conference. I qualified for the euro league, a continental competition. But the code is tied to league finish.

Either players should demand a league finish position, or if, as it stands, they demand a competition inclusion, the game should recognise there is more than a league finish position to achieve it.

Now dealing with unhappy players, again, when the information presented should suggest that not to be the case.

Irksome.

I agree, this should be taken into account. Please put this in the bug tracker, if you haven't already.

[Tyburn]

2 minutes ago, XaW said:

I agree, this should be taken into account. Please put this in the bug tracker, if you haven't already.

I know this is “company line”, and I have no wish to antagonise, but this issue isn’t new mate. It’s been here since the dawn of time. There is literally no way SI do not know it exists.

I will put it in the bug tracker. SI can tell me they are aware of it (as they would have done 20 years ago) and it can safely be ignored.

Because. More important things to worry about. Like earrings on our avatars 😉

 

[XaW]

1 minute ago, Tyburn said:

I know this is “company line”, and I have no wish to antagonise, but this issue isn’t new mate. It’s been here since the dawn of time. There is literally no way SI do not know it exists.

I will put it in the bug tracker. SI can tell me they are aware of it (as they would have done 20 years ago) and it can safely be ignored.

Because. More important things to worry about. Like earrings on our avatars 😉

I'll refrain from comment much on that last snarky comment there, but I will say, posting bugs here in the feedback thread is LESS useful than posting it in the bug tracker.

And please, you've been here long enough to know we mods don't have any "company line" to walk. If you haven't seen us posting very critical (yet constructive) feedback here, you haven't been paying attention, mate! Pointing to the bug tracker is just common sense.

I do agree there are too many legacy bugs in the game, and I would love for SI to focus more on those than new features going forward, just to be clear. I've posted loads of them myself over the years, as well as what I consider severely missing QoL issues.

[Sanel]

5 hours ago, alian62 said:

SI have always maintained this game was a text driven model first and foremost . They were pressured into delivering a 3D animation match simulation back in 2010 as this is what FIFA Manager was doing to great success . They have got by on the same old modeling now for 10 years plus but as the years roll on and now , as even mobile games have overtaken them on graphics output , its all going to come to the point of biting the bullit and get on with builing a new graphic formula . Right now we are looking at the 2018 graphics that the game had and its even older when you think it was probably being made in 2017 for the 2018 release . People laugh when they are shown this game for the first time ? We all love this game hence why we all get fustrated but the time has come to move forward and catch up with the world otherwise people are going to become dispondant and just play the older games . I bet there isnt one person who plays FM for years doesnt go back and play the older games . 

I don't think FM should strongly improve their graphics in comparision to other games out there. I think the lack of graphics are a part of FM and is one of many reasons why the game is good. The game has its own style and it should be that way. This is why I dislike that 2D is changed, although I don't play it that way anymore, it had a sense of nostalgia. The graphical side should be tweaked and I think that SI has a good idea what the community wants, but it's hard to see that some areas were better a couple of years back.

[Cobblers]

6 hours ago, alian62 said:

I bet there isnt one person who plays FM for years doesn't go back and play the older games . 

I've played since CM1, never once have I gone back to play the older version.

 

 

[Tyburn]

24 minutes ago, XaW said:

I'll refrain from comment much on that last snarky comment there, but I will say, posting bugs here in the feedback thread is LESS useful than posting it in the bug tracker.

And please, you've been here long enough to know we mods don't have any "company line" to walk. If you haven't seen us posting very critical (yet constructive) feedback here, you haven't been paying attention, mate! Pointing to the bug tracker is just common sense.

I do agree there are too many legacy bugs in the game, and I would love for SI to focus more on those than new features going forward, just to be clear. I've posted loads of them myself over the years, as well as what I consider severely missing QoL issues.

You’ve missed the point.

But I respect you. 

[orlyzao]

15 hours ago, fc.cadoni said:

Only the turf was good. The rest was like cubic things and very low quality from what we have now.

 

He should've compared similar stadiums. In the FM23 footage he played at Stamford Bridge where it's expected to see a packed stadium and good lighting whereas in the FM13 footage he played in smaller stadiums from teams with less reputation.

 

Either way here's SI official footage

 

[rp1966]

48 minutes ago, orlyzao said:

He should've compared similar stadiums. In the FM23 footage he played at Stamford Bridge where it's expected to see a packed stadium and good lighting whereas in the FM13 footage he played in smaller stadiums from teams with less reputation.

 

Either way here's SI official footage

 

As soon as you get to the second and third clips you see something that you'll never see in FM23 - a shadow that isn't short from the left; long from the top or 'X' for spotlights - the only three shadows that exist in game now.  The previous match visualiser had, at worst, more angles of light and, possibly, genuine geo-tracking sun lighting.

Having gone through the full video - I'm pretty sure there was proper sun-tracking lighting on the old engine - lighting and shadow direction different virtually every clip.

It really is the case that the only things that have improved are the player modelling/animation and the way the crowds are done. Everything else looks better modelled and textured than the current engine and with the better lighting it all feels more solid and convincing. There's something about the FM18 onwards engine that's always had a slightly cartoon-y edge to it - I think it's that the palette is a little too bright/saturated and the textures are all a bit off.

Edited January 27, 2023 by rp1966

[jeru]

1 hour ago, XaW said:

I agree, this should be taken into account. Please put this in the bug tracker, if you haven't already.

It would actually be more beneficial if mods actually knew the difference between a bug and a feature before gaslighting users to use the bug forum. 
 

This is not a bug per say, a bug by definition is code that doesn’t work as expected, the issue of clubs not updating to reflect a reputation or promotion event is due to the logic but it is working as expected. 
 

the game takes a point in time to do all the database updates at the “end” of the season, there will be lots of functionality that ties into that - promotion, relegation, contracts, promises, transfers, managerial movements and probably lots more that I can’t think of right now. 
 

now you can argue that this happens in game too late into the summer but at some point in FM history there will have been a reason why it happens when it does. And while I am speculating here I expect that this arbitrary date will now have had other features built on top of it

 

this is meaning that I would happily bet that it’s a huge job to now take that arbitrary date and move it, this is called technical debt. FM as a whole I would bet has an awfully large amount of issues like this which is why the devs are struggling in places, but I divulge. 
 

The TLDR version is it’s a meme - it’s not a bug it’s a feature - and Mods on these boards shouldn’t be gaslighting users into using the bug tracker to upload non bugs, that just wastes everyone’s time. 

[forameuss]

5 minutes ago, jeru said:

It would actually be more beneficial if mods actually knew the difference between a bug and a feature before gaslighting users to use the bug forum. 
 

This is not a bug per say, a bug by definition is code that doesn’t work as expected, the issue of clubs not updating to reflect a reputation or promotion event is due to the logic but it is working as expected. 
 

the game takes a point in time to do all the database updates at the “end” of the season, there will be lots of functionality that ties into that - promotion, relegation, contracts, promises, transfers, managerial movements and probably lots more that I can’t think of right now. 
 

now you can argue that this happens in game too late into the summer but at some point in FM history there will have been a reason why it happens when it does. And while I am speculating here I expect that this arbitrary date will now have had other features built on top of it

 

this is meaning that I would happily bet that it’s a huge job to now take that arbitrary date and move it, this is called technical debt. FM as a whole I would bet has an awfully large amount of issues like this which is why the devs are struggling in places, but I divulge. 
 

The TLDR version is it’s a meme - it’s not a bug it’s a feature - and Mods on these boards shouldn’t be gaslighting users into using the bug tracker to upload non bugs, that just wastes everyone’s time. 

It's really hard to take a point that is, at it's core, probably justified, too seriously when you're going around throwing out words like "gaslighting".  It's really not that deep.

But as for the point itself, the whole reason the bugs forum is there is because the one party that can actually go into the code and determine whether it's a bug, a feature, or just complete nonsense are SI.  If something is really bothering someone, then raising it is the quickest way to determining what it is.  It's not always going to be as black and white as being either a bug or a feature.

Edited January 27, 2023 by forameuss

[XaW]

1 minute ago, jeru said:

It would actually be more beneficial if mods actually knew the difference between a bug and a feature before gaslighting users to use the bug forum. 

This is not a bug per say, a bug by definition is code that doesn’t work as expected, the issue of clubs not updating to reflect a reputation or promotion event is due to the logic but it is working as expected. 

the game takes a point in time to do all the database updates at the “end” of the season, there will be lots of functionality that ties into that - promotion, relegation, contracts, promises, transfers, managerial movements and probably lots more that I can’t think of right now. 

now you can argue that this happens in game too late into the summer but at some point in FM history there will have been a reason why it happens when it does. And while I am speculating here I expect that this arbitrary date will now have had other features built on top of it

this is meaning that I would happily bet that it’s a huge job to now take that arbitrary date and move it, this is called technical debt. FM as a whole I would bet has an awfully large amount of issues like this which is why the devs are struggling in places, but I divulge. 

The TLDR version is it’s a meme - it’s not a bug it’s a feature - and Mods on these boards shouldn’t be gaslighting users into using the bug tracker to upload non bugs, that just wastes everyone’s time. 

Gaslighting? Really? Exaggerating much?

I'd say it's clearly a bug, because the game does not seem to recognize that teams can qualify for continental competitions in other ways than the league and thus "fails" the requirement when it should be "completed" instead. This is not what I'd call a ambiguous issue, it's clearly 1+1 = 3.

That said, this STILL isn't the place for feature requests either, and I'd point the user that way if I thought it was.

Also, I know SI don't mind getting in bug reports that could be construed either way, you know why? BECAUSE THEY SAY SO THEMSELVES! They've said bugs, or even potential bugs, should be reported in the bug tracker to either be logged as a bug or investigated and found not to be and rather be a feature request or something that could be clearer to the user at the very least.

[jeru]

6 minutes ago, XaW said:

Gaslighting? Really? Exaggerating much?

I'd say it's clearly a bug, because the game does not seem to recognize that teams can qualify for continental competitions in other ways than the league and thus "fails" the requirement when it should be "completed" instead. This is not what I'd call a ambiguous issue, it's clearly 1+1 = 3.

That said, this STILL isn't the place for feature requests either, and I'd point the user that way if I thought it was.

Also, I know SI don't mind getting in bug reports that could be construed either way, you know why? BECAUSE THEY SAY SO THEMSELVES! They've said bugs, or even potential bugs, should be reported in the bug tracker to either be logged as a bug or investigated and found not to be and rather be a feature request or something that could be clearer to the user at the very least.

Your opinion of a bug is wrong, lack of logic or lack of code to recognise continental qualification through other means is not a bug. 
 

I’ll say it slowly and I’LL USE ALL CAPS JUST LIKE YOU DID BECAUSE IM CLEVER JUST LIKE YOU - unjoined up logic or lack of code is not a bug. Hence you are directing users to log bugs for things that don’t exist which wastes everyone’s time. 

[XaW]

Just now, jeru said:

Your opinion of a bug is wrong, lack of logic or lack of code to recognise continental qualification through other means is not a bug. 
 

I’ll say it slowly and I’LL USE ALL CAPS JUST LIKE YOU DID BECAUSE IM CLEVER JUST LIKE YOU - unjoined up logic or lack of code is not a bug. Hence you are directing users to log bugs for things that don’t exist which wastes everyone’s time. 

Even with caps you missed the whole "That's what SI wants" comment?

[Neil Brock]

2 hours ago, Tyburn said:

Can the code please be tweaked to recognise “qualify for continental football” (or ANY promise involving a clubs inclusion to a competition) isn’t just about league finish?

I finished 10th in premier league but won the euro conference. I qualified for the euro league, a continental competition. But the code is tied to league finish.

Either players should demand a league finish position, or if, as it stands, they demand a competition inclusion, the game should recognise there is more than a league finish position to achieve it.

Now dealing with unhappy players, again, when the information presented should suggest that not to be the case.

Irksome.

Just to be clear, this code is rather complex given all the potential 'bonus' places that can be given out due to coefficient ratings and winning of other competitions etc. 

It could definitely be clearer - generally players accept qualifying for the Europa League as 'European qualification' which given the Conference League, isn't all that well presented to the user manager. That was partly due to when this was first implemented, the Conference League didn't exist! So yes, will require a change to what we call the strings (text in game) to update this.  

However saying that, winning the Conference League will pass the promise from what we've checked in the code today, so if you have a save game where it doesn't, ideally just before the final took place, we'd be extremely interested in looking at it. 

But yeah, would say Bug Tracker is always the best place for things like this. 

[alian62]

2 hours ago, Cobblers said:

I've played since CM1, never once have I gone back to play the older version.

 

 

Ok there's 1 person 🤣