[FM23.4] Norwegian Lower Leagues - Done all the way down to 11th tier

[XaW]

18 minutes ago, TheMattB81 said:

I think I've noticed a bug, however I'm not sure if it's a bug with your edits or the SI database rules for prizemoney. 

If I select Alta, who are in Post Nord 1, I get a reasonable some of money for TV etc. Can't recall exactly how much it was. 

If I manage Lyn, who start off in a lower league, the prize money for TV is only £273. This is the same in the league below the top league too. 

It simply has to be a bug. Thoughts?

 

I haven't touched Lyn, as they are in one of the original databases. However, they might have an individual TV deal set... I'll have a look.

[XaW]

Yeah, they seems to have an individual TV-deal set...

Lyn:

Alta:

This is from the original database, so not an issue with my file. I mean, I can fix it by removing it, but this should probably be reported to SI as a database error.

[TheMattB81]

36 minutes ago, XaW said:

Yeah, they seems to have an individual TV-deal set...

Lyn:

Alta:

This is from the original database, so not an issue with my file. I mean, I can fix it by removing it, but this should probably be reported to SI as a database error.

Thanks. Damn this is a shame, I've got a few seasons into my save and this is kind of ruining it as I'm always in debt. 

Can it be changed at all? 

If I start over, should I just remove it? I'd like it to be the correct amount, whatever that is. 

[XaW]

3 hours ago, TheMattB81 said:

Thanks. Damn this is a shame, I've got a few seasons into my save and this is kind of ruining it as I'm always in debt. 

Can it be changed at all? 

If I start over, should I just remove it? I'd like it to be the correct amount, whatever that is. 

Afaik, you can't change it in game.

I think removing it with the PGE is the best thing. It will go back to being dynamic as every other team then.

[TheMattB81]

14 hours ago, XaW said:

Afaik, you can't change it in game.

I think removing it with the PGE is the best thing. It will go back to being dynamic as every other team then.

One other issue I've found, again I suspect it's nothing to do with your file, is that after the first season I can no longer make 5 subs. At least that's what happened with Lyn 1896 after I got out of the fourth division and promoted to the third and then the second division. 

According to SI, this was fixed in the last and final patch however for me its still an issue. Can you check on that? Or is there something I can change myself to fix it?

EDIT - I think I found the problem, is it with your file or the SI database? 

Edited May 23, 2023 by TheMattB81

[XaW]

38 minutes ago, TheMattB81 said:

One other issue I've found, again I suspect it's nothing to do with your file, is that after the first season I can no longer make 5 subs. At least that's what happened with Lyn 1896 after I got out of the fourth division and promoted to the third and then the second division. 

According to SI, this was fixed in the last and final patch however for me its still an issue. Can you check on that? Or is there something I can change myself to fix it?

EDIT - I think I found the problem, is it with your file or the SI database? 

I haven't changed anything regarding subs, other than adding the 5 from 9 (3 stops) to all the divisions I created (4th and below).

That said, I'm playing a vanilla save with Follo at the moment and there everything looks fine. I'll boot up a new save with the file and have a look. It might be something I've inadvertently done...

[TheMattB81]

4 minutes ago, XaW said:

I haven't changed anything regarding subs, other than adding the 5 from 9 (3 stops) to all the divisions I created (4th and below).

That said, I'm playing a vanilla save with Follo at the moment and there everything looks fine. I'll boot up a new save with the file and have a look. It might be something I've inadvertently done...

Yes, I looked inside the editor and to me it looks like all leagues have 3 from 7 set. 

[XaW]

2 minutes ago, TheMattB81 said:

Yes, I looked inside the editor and to me it looks like all leagues have 3 from 7 set. 

Which divisions are those?

[XaW]

Nevermind, I think it has to do with my file, but it is strange... there are no conflicts in the file.. Anyway, I'll fix it and update.

[TheMattB81]

9 minutes ago, XaW said:

Nevermind, I think it has to do with my file, but it is strange... there are no conflicts in the file.. Anyway, I'll fix it and update.

Thanks. I had a look and it appears that all the Norway divisions are wrong for subs, bar maybe a few in the lower leagues. Please check the cups and playoff games too. 

Once that's sorted I'll start a new and hopefully final save. 

Thanks for your work. 

EDIT - I better go and and edit my post in the bugs forum as I was blaming SI.

Edited May 23, 2023 by TheMattB81

[XaW]

Just now, TheMattB81 said:

Thanks. I had a look and it appears that all the Norway divisions are wrong for subs, bar maybe a few in the lower leagues. Please check the cups and playoff games too. 

Once that's sorted I'll start a new and hopefully final save. 

Thanks for your work. 

Yeah, I think it's due to the fact that I made my file before they fixed it, but the editor claims there are no clashes, so I never picked up on it. Making the changes now and then I have to verify and update, so will likely update later today, if time allows.

[XaW]

@TheMattB81

I have changed it here, but haven't tested it. Can you run a test save to see if the rules work?

Lower League Norway.fmf

[TheMattB81]

20 minutes ago, XaW said:

@TheMattB81

I have changed it here, but haven't tested it. Can you run a test save to see if the rules work?

Lower League Norway.fmf 253.12 kB · 0 downloads

I had a quick look and I noticed you didn't include the 5 from 9 + 1 in extra time. I think it needs to be that for all league and cup/playoff games. It will obviously only apply to cup and playoff games though. 

[XaW]

2 minutes ago, TheMattB81 said:

I had a quick look and I noticed you didn't include the 5 from 9 + 1 in extra time. I think it needs to be that for all league and cup/playoff games. It will obviously only apply to cup and playoff games though. 

Are those the rules though? I had a look and only found 5 from 9 (3 stops).

https://www.fotball.no/globalassets/regler-og-retningslinjer/turneringsbestemmelser/turneringsbestemmelser-eliteserien.pdf

Quote

INNBYTTE/INNBYTTERE

Ved kamper i NFF Eliteserien er det tillatt med 5 innbyttere, med maks 3 stopp utenom pausen. Spillere som er byttet ut kan ikke settes inn i spillet igjen. Det skal benyttes dobbel elektronisk innbyttertavle.

 

[TheMattB81]

2 minutes ago, XaW said:

Are those the rules though? I had a look and only found 5 from 9 (3 stops).

https://www.fotball.no/globalassets/regler-og-retningslinjer/turneringsbestemmelser/turneringsbestemmelser-eliteserien.pdf

 

I can't read that sadly Lol, however that's for the Eliteserien. Does that apply to the cup games? What about the play off games?

I'm pretty sure SI have it so you can make one extra sub in cup games in extra time at least. Not sure about playoff.

[XaW]

2 minutes ago, TheMattB81 said:

I can't read that sadly Lol, however that's for the Eliteserien. Does that apply to the cup games? What about the play off games?

I'm pretty sure SI have it so you can make one extra sub in cup games in extra time at least. Not sure about playoff.

For the cup you are right, I'll fix it

https://www.fotball.no/globalassets/regler-og-retningslinjer/turneringsbestemmelser/turneringsbestemmelser-nmmenn.pdf

Quote

INNBYTTE/INNBYTTERE

Ved kamper i NM Menn og kvinner er det tillatt med 5 innbyttere, med maks 3 stopp i tillegg til pausen. Det åpnes for ett sjette innbytte i eventuelle ekstraomganger med ett ekstra bytte. Laget kan ved ekstraomganger gjøre innbytte etter full tid av kampen og før ekstra omgangene starter, samt i pausen av ekstra omgangene. Hvis laget ikke har brukt maks av antall innbyttere eller antall stopp i ordinær spilletid, kan dette overføres til ekstraomgangene. Dette i tillegg til den ekstra innbytter og stoppet i ekstraomgangene. Når begge lag foretar ett bytte samtidig, vil det telle som ett innbytte for hvert lag. Spillere som er by

I tried to find stuff for the playoff, but couldn't see anything there...

You need to learn Norwegian, man, for native English speakers it's considered one of the easiest languages to learn! I'll even help you!  

[TheMattB81]

3 minutes ago, XaW said:

For the cup you are right, I'll fix it

https://www.fotball.no/globalassets/regler-og-retningslinjer/turneringsbestemmelser/turneringsbestemmelser-nmmenn.pdf

I tried to find stuff for the playoff, but couldn't see anything there...

You need to learn Norwegian, man, for native English speakers it's considered one of the easiest languages to learn! I'll even help you!  

Thanks dude.

I think Play offs are probably right how you have them now, but if you can double check that would be great. 

[XaW]

26 minutes ago, TheMattB81 said:

Thanks dude.

I think Play offs are probably right how you have them now, but if you can double check that would be great. 

Decided to add the extra time sub for all cups and playoffs. Currently verifying and will update when it's done.

[XaW]

There, fixed and updated the first post and Steam.

[TheMattB81]

7 minutes ago, XaW said:

There, fixed and updated the first post and Steam.

Many thanks.

Curious, what were the other things you fixed? @XaW

Edited May 23, 2023 by TheMattB81

[TheMattB81]

I've noticed another issue, although I think this is an SI database issue but nonetheless its a problem. 

Coaches and Physio's are all amateur contracts in the second and third divisions. Handy for those clubs to save money!

However, in the first and fourth divisions, they are either full time or part time only. So those fourth division clubs can only hire coaches on part time contracts.

Surely the fourth division should be amateur only and the second and (perhaps) third should be full/part time only. 

Edited May 23, 2023 by TheMattB81

[XaW]

2 minutes ago, TheMattB81 said:

I've noticed another issue, although I think this is an SI database issue but nonetheless its a problem. 

Coaches and Physio's are all amateur contracts in the second and third divisions. Handy for those clubs to save money!

However, in the first and fourth divisions, they are either full time or part time only. So those fourth division clubs can only hire coaches on part time contracts.

Surely the fourth division should be amateur only.

Yeah, I see it.... I'll change it.

[TheMattB81]

4 minutes ago, XaW said:

Yeah, I see it.... I'll change it.

I just checked and the second division (OBOS) seems okay actually, it lists part time under coach and physio. 

So I guess third and fourth division should be amateur only for coach and physio.

Edited May 23, 2023 by TheMattB81

[XaW]

Just now, TheMattB81 said:

I just checked and the second division (OBOS) seems okay actually, it lists part time under coach and physio. 

I just set all roles for everything as amateur for 4th div and below. No one is semi-pro at that level or below anyway.

[TheMattB81]

1 minute ago, XaW said:

I just set all roles for everything as amateur for 4th div and below. No one is semi-pro at that level or below anyway.

Agreed.

Not sure about third division, what to you think? Should it be part time or amateur?

Edited May 23, 2023 by TheMattB81

[XaW]

3 minutes ago, TheMattB81 said:

Agreed.

Not sure about third division, what to you think? Should it be part time or amateur?

I'll leave it as SI has set it. I think there is a slight mix there in real life.

[XaW]

@TheMattB81 - Here is the update, mind testing it?

Lower League Norway.fmf

[TheMattB81]

Just now, XaW said:

@TheMattB81 - Here is the update, mind testing it?

Lower League Norway.fmf 270.41 kB · 0 downloads

Yep will do. 

One question, in the last update posted a while earlier today you mentioned changed some other small things were fixed. 

What were those changes out of interest?

[XaW]

1 minute ago, TheMattB81 said:

Yep will do. 

One question, in the last update posted a while earlier today you mentioned changed some other small things were fixed. 

What were those changes out of interest?

Just some small niggles I had noticed, typos and the like. I also fixed Lyn's TV deal.

[TheMattB81]

1 minute ago, XaW said:

Just some small niggles I had noticed, typos and the like. I also fixed Lyn's TV deal.

Should these be blank? This would still give fourth division teams part time only staff contracts?

[XaW]

35 minutes ago, TheMattB81 said:

Should these be blank? This would still give fourth division teams part time only staff contracts?

Yes, because the 4th TIER is a mix of semi-pro and amateur ones (and one that has been set by SI(, while 4th DIVISJON (5th tier and created by me) is strictly amateur.

[TheMattB81]

4 minutes ago, XaW said:

Yes, because the 4th TIER is a mix of semi-pro and amateur ones (and one that has been set by SI(, while 4th DIVISJON (5th tier and created by me) is strictly amateur.

The thing is though if you look at the Postnord two divisions, they have amateur contracts for coach and physio, even for semi pro clubs. But in the Tipping leagues, its semi pro contracts only. 

Tipping is a lower league so it makes no sense. 

Edited May 23, 2023 by TheMattB81

[XaW]

5 minutes ago, TheMattB81 said:

The thing is though if you look at the Postnord two divisions, they have amateur contracts for coach and physio, even for semi pro clubs. But in the Tipping leagues, its semi pro contracts only. 

Tipping is a lower league so it makes no sense. 

Seems strange... will change the Norsk Tipping divisions to the same as PostNord then....

[TheMattB81]

We need to get these reported to SI so they can get fixed next year hopefully. 

[XaW]

There we go. Now it should work, @TheMattB81Lower League Norway.fmf

[TheMattB81]

Thanks for fixing these.

[Djordison]

This is absolutely legendary stuff. I played for more than 40 seasons with this database. For me it was a 'Youth only' save with St. Olavskameratene, but I had a blast with it. Despite minor issues the only one bothering me was that some international matches were played during my own games. So two times a season I had to pull the club shop employe and play him. 

[XaW]

3 minutes ago, Djordison said:

This is absolutely legendary stuff. I played for more than 40 seasons with this database. For me it was a 'Youth only' save with St. Olavskameratene, but I had a blast with it. Despite minor issues the only one bothering me was that some international matches were played during my own games. So two times a season I had to pull the club shop employe and play him. 

Happy to hear you are enjoying it! 
If you get youth caps way down in the leagues, then that’s rare enough to be worth it! If it happens in the top tiers, then that’s not something I touched, so probably an issue with the base game. I will note it though, and perhaps I can fix it for any future version. 

[Djordison]

Just now, XaW said:

Happy to hear you are enjoying it! 
If you get youth caps way down in the leagues, then that’s rare enough to be worth it! If it happens in the top tiers, then that’s not something I touched, so probably an issue with the base game. I will note it though, and perhaps I can fix it for any future version. 

It was one of my best saves and I play the game since 96. Made possible by this database, eventually won the UCL. So thanks again.

So it should be the base game, because it occured during my time in the Eliteserien. I had some call ups when I was in the lower divisions, so that wasn't a big problem. Sometimes I could move the match, other times I couldn't. Not sure why some time I could and others not. 

[XaW]

2 hours ago, Djordison said:

It was one of my best saves and I play the game since 96. Made possible by this database, eventually won the UCL. So thanks again.

So it should be the base game, because it occured during my time in the Eliteserien. I had some call ups when I was in the lower divisions, so that wasn't a big problem. Sometimes I could move the match, other times I couldn't. Not sure why some time I could and others not. 

That’s great to hear! Always nice to see people enjoying the work!

I’ll have a look the next time I load up and see if there is a way to set it…

[TheMattB81]

UEFA Europa Conference League seems to be stuck at 3 subs.

[XaW]

2 minutes ago, TheMattB81 said:

UEFA Europa Conference League seems to be stuck at 3 subs.

I can promise you I haven't touched that...

[TheMattB81]

5 minutes ago, XaW said:

I can promise you I haven't touched that...

My mistake. 

[Quickzz]

On 04/07/2023 at 16:34, XaW said:

I can promise you I haven't touched that...

 

Hi @XaW! Is the download in the openings post the latest version?   And does your file work / is compitable with the Realism files from Daveincid? 

Edited August 2, 2023 by Quickzz

[Quickzz]

The PostNord-Ligaen Div. 1 has 13 teams instead of 14. Is that a bug? Div. 2 has 14 teams. Lyn FK is missing, they are still in the Norsk Tipping Ligaen Avd. 1, but are promoted i guess? 

Edited August 2, 2023 by Quickzz

[XaW]

1 hour ago, Quickzz said:

 

Hi @XaW! Is the download in the openings post the latest version?   And does your file work / is compitable with the Realism files from Daveincid? 

Yeah, it's the one in the opening post, or you can subscribe to it on Steam through the link. I haven't tested it with Dave's files, and I don't know what he changes, but I have only created clubs, divisions below the 4th tier, some stadiums, and a few 2nd and 3rd teams. So depending on what Dave has changed, it could work or not, I can't say.

7 minutes ago, Quickzz said:

The PostNord-Ligaen Div. 1 has 13 teams instead of 14. Is that a bug? Div. 2 has 14 teams. Lyn FK is missing, they are still in the Norsk Tipping Ligaen Avd. 1, but are promoted i guess? 

Tested my file just now and, yes it has 13 teams, but so does it without my file. Lyn is not missing, Lyn is in the tier below, as this is based on the start of the 2022 season, not 2023.

[Quickzz]

10 minutes ago, XaW said:

Yeah, it's the one in the opening post, or you can subscribe to it on Steam through the link. I haven't tested it with Dave's files, and I don't know what he changes, but I have only created clubs, divisions below the 4th tier, some stadiums, and a few 2nd and 3rd teams. So depending on what Dave has changed, it could work or not, I can't say.

Tested my file just now and, yes it has 13 teams, but so does it without my file. Lyn is not missing, Lyn is in the tier below, as this is based on the start of the 2022 season, not 2023.

But there will be no bugs after the first season(s) with promotions and relegations?

[XaW]

1 minute ago, Quickzz said:

But there will be no bugs after the first season(s) with promotions and relegations?

I haven't seen anythings strange in my tests, but with custom databases like this I can't guarantee stuff, especially when mixed with other files. If you want to try with Dave's file as well as mine, I'd suggest creating a holiday save and let it run for 5-6 seasons and then have a look around, just to see that everything works. Sure beats getting 3 seasons in and finding out something has clashed....

[Quickzz]

16 minutes ago, XaW said:

I haven't seen anythings strange in my tests, but with custom databases like this I can't guarantee stuff, especially when mixed with other files. If you want to try with Dave's file as well as mine, I'd suggest creating a holiday save and let it run for 5-6 seasons and then have a look around, just to see that everything works. Sure beats getting 3 seasons in and finding out something has clashed....

 

I know, it's always a guess  You also have in the Norsk-Tipping ligaen every division 4 teams to relegate, this is in the real competitions just 3 to relegate. 

[XaW]

10 minutes ago, Quickzz said:

 

I know, it's always a guess  You also have in the Norsk-Tipping ligaen every division 4 teams to relegate, this is in the real competitions just 3 to relegate. 

Yeah, I had to in order to make every 5th tier division have a promotion... Not everyone does in real life every season due to financial restraints and such, but for the game I think it fits. In real life the number of sub divisions in the 5th tier changes every season to fit what teams actually have squads as well, and I can't really replicate that well enough either. So that's why I just set it in stone to keep it a bit more sane.