FM 25 DEVELOPMENT UPDATE

[Muja]

3 ore fa, anagain ha scritto:

I'm pretty sure other FMs have had preorders up before we knew everything about the game. Many, many other games do, for certain.

Are you trying to tell me it’s normal to spend money on a video game that doesn't exist yet and you know nothing about?
After a trailer that seems like it was made with the sole purpose of being as vague as possible, and 5 screenshots that really show nothing?

I believe that such a leap of faith can only be taken by those with absolute and unwavering trust in a brand.
Frankly, no one has ever earned that kind of trust from me.

[Fat_Frank8]

3 minutes ago, CoffeeKittyGrey said:

Well, the minimum and recommended specs are out and seem to preclude any kind of iGPU in a laptop unless you want it to look like 8bit?

 

Sure there are a lot of things to complain about, this isn't one of them. You simply can't expect to play a computer game in 2025 without a real graphics card. 

[2feet]

2 hours ago, Craigus89 said:

The whole approach SI have taken with marketing the game going in a 'new direction' or whatever the phrasing is, makes a lot more sense if you adjust who it is aimed at.

We naturally assume it is aimed at us, the hardcore fans, and that it's telling us about all the good things that we have been asking for for years. A new direction means more depth and improvements to all the things that get us frustrated. Finally, they are sorting things out.

Actually... it's likely aimed the people who have never played the game, for the very reasons that we love it, that its too dense, too impenetrable with the endless screens of information, too much of a spreadsheet simulator for XG nerds etc. We're taking it in a new direction, this is not that stodgy game your uncle plays etc.

Reading it in that context makes so much more sense, but is also hugely disappointing. 

I truly do fear that this is going to just be FM touch, optimised for consoles to attract a new playerbase at the expense of us long-time fans. 

EDIT: I realise this is just speculation, but so is the idea that the game will be great. The point is, we have NOTHING to go on, and that is the fault of SI, and SI alone. 

Sorry but I have to say I hope they do make the game more open to the average player who is not so obsessive with spreadsheet analysis, etc

That should still be there, but the extent to which it is required to have success perhaps should be eased.

The need to watch tons of YouTube videos to get tactics working to even a basic degree is a massive downer.

And I hope they improve the role play element too, with interesting stories, to deepen connection to the characters and the clubs, like we read in the newspapers for the clubs we support.

[CoffeeKittyGrey]

2 minutes ago, Fat_Frank8 said:

Sure there are a lot of things to complain about, this isn't one of them. You simply can't expect to play a computer game in 2025 without a real graphics card. 

It's an observation, partly based on the popularity of laptops in the enormously popular laptop thread. Indeed, the overarching discussion of recent months has been people wondering whether their laptop will cut it. For many, it won't.

You've imagined a complaint, but no offence taken, mistake easily made in this environment.

[Lempicka]

It might be an unpopular opinion, but I'm looking forward to FM25, whatever it is and whenever it comes out. Looking back, I don't think had a really memorable save from FM18 through to FM24. I played all of them a lot, but IMO none of these games came close to FM17 for enjoyment. If FM25 is different from the last few iterations  - I'll be happy with that. 

Very disappointing to see that FM25's now ready for pre-order but we haven't seen any real glimpses of the game though. 

For now, I'll go back to FM17 (as I occasionally do) and I hope to be pleasantly surprised in November.     

[ohnonottheshouts]

16 minutes ago, CoffeeKittyGrey said:

Well, the minimum and recommended specs are out and seem to preclude any kind of iGPU in a laptop unless you want it to look like 8bit?

A 2060 is about 50% faster than the current Radeon 880M and I'm not sure Intel iGPU offerings - Arc/Iris XE2 competes with 880M either.

The 880M is a hell of a lot more powerful than the old AMD R9 M375, it'll be more than fine. 

[trevjim]

30 minutes ago, Fat_Frank8 said:

Sure there are a lot of things to complain about, this isn't one of them. You simply can't expect to play a computer game in 2025 without a real graphics card. 

Agreed. It's a video game at the end of the day. Even the new specs are pretty basic. A £350 steamdeck can run Cyberpunk and red dead 2 etc. 

So having a laptop that can't run as something as gentle as FM is a personal issue. The line needs to be drawn somewhere and people with low to top end machines shouldn't be punished because bottom end machines cant run it.

 

 

 

Edited 21 hours ago by trevjim

[ohnonottheshouts]

1 minute ago, trevjim said:

Agreed. It's a video game at the end of the day. Even the new specs are pretty basic. A £350 steamdeck can run Cyberpunk and red dead 2 etc. 

So having a laptop that can't run as something as gentle as FM is a personal issue. The line needs to be drawn somewhere and people with low to top end machines shouldn't be punished because bottom end machines cant run it.

 

 

 

The minimum requirement lists an Intel HD 530, which is a laptop integrated GPU from 2015. Can't get much more bottom end than that.

[ostkiz]

They might not release the beta for this reason: people pre-order it, test it and get dissapointed, and due to Steam’s policies, when the game comes out, everyone returns it in masse.

If there’s no beta, people buy it, easily surpass the minimum two hours, and then can’t request a refund anymore.

This is looking really bad...

Edited 20 hours ago by ostkiz

[mkstatto]

32 minutes ago, trevjim said:

Agreed. It's a video game at the end of the day. Even the new specs are pretty basic. A £350 steamdeck can run Cyberpunk and red dead 2 etc. 

So having a laptop that can't run as something as gentle as FM is a personal issue. The line needs to be drawn somewhere and people with low to top end machines shouldn't be punished because bottom end machines cant run it.

 

 

 

Totally agree and its not like this was one of the major things from dev updates a year or two ago. They warned you might need to save up for new hardware.

[forameuss]

1 hour ago, Muja said:

Are you trying to tell me it’s normal to spend money on a video game that doesn't exist yet and you know nothing about?
After a trailer that seems like it was made with the sole purpose of being as vague as possible, and 5 screenshots that really show nothing?

I believe that such a leap of faith can only be taken by those with absolute and unwavering trust in a brand.
Frankly, no one has ever earned that kind of trust from me.

No, they're saying pre-orders have always been available.  And completely optional.  If someone fully intends to buy the product anyway, what does it matter if they give SI their money now, as opposed to late November?  The world isn't going to crumble if a handful of people do that, and everyone else doesn't.  As exhibited by, again, them doing this exact same thing for years.

[spursfan]

6 hours ago, mkstatto said:

My feelings on the game, is that we will get a minimal viable product for release

Yes that's what I mentioned weeks ago, unfortunately seems to be the case indeed 

[kiwityke1983]

44 minutes ago, forameuss said:

what does it matter if they give SI their money now, as opposed to late November? 

Actually in cash flow terms it could be make or break for a company.

Successful, profitable companies can and do go bankrupt due to cashflow problems.

SI as a business gets most of its income in a period between September and November when it sells most of its copies of FM.

They still have bills to pay 12 months of the year though, so if you as a business are used to getting large cash injections in September and October, having to wait until almost December for them could be problematic, from a cashflow perspective.

[CamAshworth]

I notice how all the usual "Content Creators" who enjoy visits to Si Towers are all pushing pre orders through a personalised link already on the back of no news whatsoever.

[davehanson]

4 minutes ago, kiwityke1983 said:

Actually in cash flow terms it could be make or break for a company.

Successful, profitable companies can and do go bankrupt due to cashflow problems.

SI as a business gets most of its income in a period between September and November when it sells most of its copies of FM.

They still have bills to pay 12 months of the year though, so if you as a business are used to getting large cash injections in September and October, having to wait until almost December for them could be problematic, from a cashflow perspective.

I’m not sure Sega are going to go bankrupt over a months delay to FM

[jimbo22]

3 minutes ago, CamAshworth said:

I notice how all the usual "Content Creators" who enjoy visits to Si Towers are all pushing pre orders through a personalised link already on the back of no news whatsoever.

To be fair, a few of them that I've seen have said that they cant recommend pre orders yet as there's nothing to go on. 

[HighFlyingDwarf]

5 minutes ago, CamAshworth said:

I notice how all the usual "Content Creators" who enjoy visits to Si Towers are all pushing pre orders through a personalised link already on the back of no news whatsoever.

Fair play to WTS. At least he said you might want to wait...

[andu1]

11 minutes ago, CamAshworth said:

I notice how all the usual "Content Creators" who enjoy visits to Si Towers are all pushing pre orders through a personalised link already on the back of no news whatsoever.

You didn't watch any videos have you?

[CamAshworth]

2 minutes ago, andu1 said:

You didn't watch any videos have you?

Of course not. I have just guessed that is what is occurring.

If they are saying don't pre order then don't be advertising kickback links.

[kiwityke1983]

14 minutes ago, davehanson said:

I’m not sure Sega are going to go bankrupt over a months delay to FM

No they won't but it could be very bad for SI cashflow wise and video game execs are hardly known for their patience with such things.

[jimbo22]

Anyone that has Game Pass would be mental to pre order anyway. No beta? Game Pass saves you money this year. 

[kiwityke1983]

12 minutes ago, jimbo22 said:

To be fair, a few of them that I've seen have said that they cant recommend pre orders yet as there's nothing to go on. 

Every single one of them that I've seen so far and I watched 4-5 I think earlier, said exactly that.

[jimbo22]

1 minute ago, kiwityke1983 said:

Every single one of them that I've seen so far and I watched 4-5 I think earlier, said exactly that.

These videos dont look good on SI and this game. This is as negative a build up I can remember for a CM/FM game. 

Its blowing my mind that this new era and game engine and the lead feature is woman's football. It absolutely screams that they arent comfortable showing it just now and leading with the woman's feature gives them another 2 weeks, at least, to work on it. If thats not a huge red flag for this games development im not sure what else could be.

[BuryBlade]

Anyone else notice the Steam page says incorporates Denuvo DRM?

Ahead of Civ 7 this has been a big negative talking point online in that community.

[Kickballz]

Denuvo and In-app Purchases...lol

Yeah that really makes me want to pre-order this game that we know nothing about.

[whatsupdoc]

6 minutes ago, jimbo22 said:

These videos dont look good on SI and this game. This is as negative a build up I can remember for a CM/FM game. 

Its blowing my mind that this new era and game engine and the lead feature is woman's football. It absolutely screams that they arent comfortable showing it just now and leading with the woman's feature gives them another 2 weeks, at least, to work on it. If thats not a huge red flag for this games development im not sure what else could be.

I think that's the first feature reveal as they can talk about it without revealing some other stuff they're probably still working on, like the graphical side of things.

[astrocreep2000]

2 minutes ago, Kickballz said:

Denuvo and In-app Purchases...lol

Yeah that really makes me want to pre-order this game that we know nothing about.

In app purchases probably means the in game editor 

[Muja]

1 ora fa, forameuss ha scritto:

No, they're saying pre-orders have always been available.  And completely optional. 

Oh yeah, that's for sure, no debate there.

1 ora fa, forameuss ha scritto:

As exhibited by, again, them doing this exact same thing for years.

This is where we disagree, because I wouldn’t be worried at all if that were really the case.

The point is that FM25 should mark the beginning of a new era for the franchise, with the switch to Unity, yet the announcement trailer has NEVER been so bare and completely lacking actual game footage.

This can only mean that either the marketing team doesn’t know how to do their job (which I highly doubt at this level) or that they still have NOTHING ready to show us, and for me, that’s VERY concerning.

The idea that it’s all a strategy to create 'mystery' and hype doesn’t convince me either, because if that was the goal, it’s failed miserably with me.

I truly hope to be proven wrong, but you can’t say that those who are concerned don’t have a reason to be.

[waldywaldy]

[Kickballz]

9 minutes ago, astrocreep2000 said:

In app purchases probably means the in game editor 

Yeah, but at this point I wouldn't be surprised if there was more.

[spursfan]

3 hours ago, StevehFC said:

So if you have a international save from FM24 you can carry it forward to FM25?

On FM Mobile, yes.

International matches on PC version will be viewable, just not playable.

[kiwityke1983]

22 minutes ago, jimbo22 said:

These videos dont look good on SI and this game. This is as negative a build up I can remember for a CM/FM game. 

Its blowing my mind that this new era and game engine and the lead feature is woman's football. It absolutely screams that they arent comfortable showing it just now and leading with the woman's feature gives them another 2 weeks, at least, to work on it. If thats not a huge red flag for this games development im not sure what else could be.

I'm more interested to see what they actually announce with the women's "reveal" next week.

It's not like we haven't known for over two years it's coming.

If they are still using mock ups for screenshots etc then big warning claxons will be going off in my head.

[whatsupdoc]

7 minutes ago, kiwityke1983 said:

I'm more interested to see what they actually announce with the women's "reveal" next week.

It's not like we haven't known for over two years it's coming.

If they are still using mock ups for screenshots etc then big warning claxons will be going off in my head.

I doubt we'll get much gameplay footage until the 4th part of that roadmap - likely in that order for a reason.

[davehanson]

39 minutes ago, kiwityke1983 said:

No they won't but it could be very bad for SI cashflow wise and video game execs are hardly known for their patience with such things.

Yeah, I agree the boss of Sega could get uppity with the studio, but unlikely to do something really stupid- but then I guess FM is still quite small fry compared to some of their other titles.

However - I was responding to your comments 'Successful, profitable companies can and do go bankrupt due to cashflow problems.'

Highly unlikely.

[kiwityke1983]

8 minutes ago, davehanson said:

Yeah, I agree the boss of Sega could get uppity with the studio, but unlikely to do something really stupid- but then I guess FM is still quite small fry compared to some of their other titles.

However - I was responding to your comments 'Successful, profitable companies can and do go bankrupt due to cashflow problems.'

Highly unlikely.

Quite common with SME's especially ones that rely on seasonal cashflow to keep them going through a whole year.

Only takes one bad cashflow season and they are in trouble.

I don't think SI are in danger but it does happen.

 

[davehanson]

6 minutes ago, kiwityke1983 said:

Quite common with SME's especially ones that rely on seasonal cashflow to keep them going through a whole year.

Only takes one bad cashflow season and they are in trouble.

I don't think SI are in danger but it does happen.

 

But they don't. SI are owned by Sega. As long as Sega are happy with the release dates and the income that then comes in from the game there isn't an issue. 

[sc91]

55 minutes ago, BuryBlade said:

Anyone else notice the Steam page says incorporates Denuvo DRM?

Ahead of Civ 7 this has been a big negative talking point online in that community.

Denuvo, and just like that I'm in the let it crash and burn camp.

[XaW]

1 minute ago, sc91 said:

Denuvo, and just like that I'm in the let it crash and burn camp.

Then don't look at what FM24 has....

Honestly, why are some people reacting like Denuvo haven't been on the game for some years at least...

Edit: Just checked, and it's on FM24 and FM23 at least!

Edited 18 hours ago by XaW

[davehanson]

1 minute ago, sc91 said:

Denuvo, and just like that I'm in the let it crash and burn camp.

FM24 uses Denuvo too?

[XaW]

2 minutes ago, XaW said:

Then don't look at what FM24 has....

Honestly, why are some people reacting like Denuvo haven't been on the game for some years at least...

Edit: Just checked, and it's on FM24 and FM23 at least!

It's there back to FM19, earlier than that I can't find the Steam Store page! This is not a new thing people!

[Novem9]

3 минуты назад, XaW сказал:

Edit: Just checked, and it's on FM24 and FM23 at least!

Since FM17, mb even FM16.

FM15 was without this

[sc91]

4 minutes ago, davehanson said:

FM24 uses Denuvo too?

 

4 minutes ago, XaW said:

Then don't look at what FM24 has....

Honestly, why are some people reacting like Denuvo haven't been on the game for some years at least...

And who says I own that, to clarify, I don't, neither do I own 23. 22 from what I understand didn't have any mention of it, saying that, that all remains dormant in my steam library, in fact my most active FM is 07 . Assume less, gents.

Denuvo is a performance hogging annoyance that has been continually illsuited to optimisation.

Edited 18 hours ago by sc91

[Lord Rowell]

14 minutes ago, kiwityke1983 said:

Quite common with SME's especially ones that rely on seasonal cashflow to keep them going through a whole year.

Only takes one bad cashflow season and they are in trouble.

I don't think SI are in danger but it does happen.

7 minutes ago, davehanson said:

But they don't. SI are owned by Sega. As long as Sega are happy with the release dates and the income that then comes in from the game there isn't an issue. 

As far as I'm aware SI are a subsidiary company of SEGA, which is the parent company.

This means that SI is still its own legal identity, has its own financial obligations, can be sued etc.

If SI got into cashflow problems, SEGA are under no obligation whatsoever to bail them out. Furthermore, the parent company, SEGA, would expect SI to be self-sustaining.

Hence, I'd assume on the whole, SI has to run its finances like any other limited company.

Edited 18 hours ago by Lord Rowell

[davehanson]

1 minute ago, sc91 said:

 

And who says I own that, to clarify, I don't, neither do I own 23. 22 from what I understand didn't have any mention of it, saying that, that all remains dormant in my steam library. Assume less, gents.

Denuvo is a performance hogging annoyance that has been continually illsuited to optimisation.

Assuming?

[XaW]

Just now, sc91 said:

And who says I own that, to clarify, I don't, neither do I own 23. 22 from what I understand didn't have any mention of it, saying that, that all remains dormant in my steam library. Assume less, gents.

Denuvo is a performance hogging annoyance that has been continually illsuited to optimisation.

I haven't, but you act like this is something new. It's been in for almost 10 years, so if you have any of those, you've used it seemingly without noticing...

[grade]

There is another problem with FM25... At least in my end. I'm probably gonna be spec out. 

Edited 18 hours ago by grade

[sc91]

1 minute ago, XaW said:

I haven't, but you act like this is something new. It's been in for almost 10 years, so if you have any of those, you've used it seemingly without noticing...

Actually one of my major gripes with the more modern FMs is how I could only play it with instant results or details on the minimum. Which is something of an irony of lesson learned that it was present in games I derived at absolutely chugging on a decent (then) laptop. 

.

Learn something new every day.

[XaW]

2 minutes ago, sc91 said:

Actually one of my major gripes with the more modern FMs is how I could only play it with instant results or details on the minimum. Which is something of an irony of lesson learned that it was present in games I derived at absolutely chugging on a decent (then) laptop. 

.

Learn something new every day.

Just for the record, I do think forcing DRMs on players is a negative thing, I'm just saying this is not something new that is happening to FM25.

[davehanson]

3 minutes ago, Lord Rowell said:

As far as I'm aware SI are a subsidiary company of SEGA, which is the parent company.

This means that SI is still its own legal identity, has its own financial obligations, can be sued etc.

If SI got into cashflow problems, SEGA are under no obligation whatsoever to bail them out. Furthermore, the parent company, SEGA, would expect SI to be self-sustaining.

Hence, I'd assume on the whole, SI has to run its finances like any other limited company.

Wholly owned subsidiary of Sega.

[kiwityke1983]

11 minutes ago, davehanson said:

But they don't. SI are owned by Sega. As long as Sega are happy with the release dates and the income that then comes in from the game there isn't an issue. 

I assure you they do all the time, I worked in accounting for years, and as Lord Rowell has pointed out you are wrong about Sega and SI's relationship too by the sounds.