cmonreds

This is a process which is not finished, the gut feeling for what is the best for now are these three tactics, based on the results and data analytics so far. Advantages is using the same roles, good for tactical familiarity, not tested yet though. I haven't written about set-pieces but they are focused on maintaining possession as well, and based upon Barcelona during Guardiola. For the AMR a winger cut inside, crossing from byline for all versions of the tactic can be equally good as the IW role. More passing risk is added for the central midfielder with an attacking duty on this side/flank (both for the attacking version). If using two IW's I would enable swap positions between these. If opting for replacing the right IW with a winger your team will get crosses from both sides. If opting for using wingers you will acchieve what the 2-1 rest defence acchieves in a 2-2 rest defence, which should increases strength in centre areas, one more player preventing counter attacks against. If you test the tactic both as for now or with a winger, please give feedback of thow it goes. Possibly for very fluid tactics three defensive duties in a 3-2 might be too defensive. A 2-2 rest defence allocating one attacking duty for balanced/positive versions and 2 attacking duties for attacking versions might be a better option. Set Pieces_tiki taka_(Pep_Barca).fmf TeamWorkRate_Attacking.fmf TeamWorkRate_Positive.fmf TeamWorkRate_Balanced.fmf

I have used the allowed amount of size to upload in the post updating mathces, therefore continuing here. MARCH 2024 Played against Lorient at home. Mid-table team that we should beat. They line up in 3421 (AML/AMR) and the 2-2 version were selected to get one extra man in midfield. Pretty dull match with two goals that ended 1-1. After the match the tactic and progress was reviewed with data analytics which can be seen below. Review/data analytics after Lorient match Less shooting and xG than average, we haven't had any penalties given in the league as I can remember. xG has increased from 0.77 in September and currently averaging at 1. The xG for the 16 matches played since then is averaging at 1.22. Still quite low compared to comparable teams acchieving xG around 2.0. Decent defence and conceding slightly more goals than expected. The low xG is worrying as we are probably overacchieving with the amont of points we have got. If/when this starts to regress we will most likely start to loose and draw more matches. Fewest crosses in the league but accurate crossing. Crossing set to mixed both as PI and TI with how to deliver them. Due to quite decent crossing and decision ability as well as ability to receive them for the 1st picks playing the league games, the completion stats are good. In the cups playing the 2nd picks crosses are often set to low as TI. This is due to worse ability to both deliver and receive crosses from those players. Often there has been high crosses with low players are unable to receive. We cross the least of all teams. Can increased crossing or facilitate for crossing be a way to improve the xG ? The amount and completion of passes are as they should be in an extreme possession tactic. Still only 13% of those are in the final third and 36% in the opposition half. In september the numbers were 13% and 35% so the number are almost the same. Except the DLF hardcoded to take more passing risks all other players are set to passing risk medium/mixed. Can increased passing risk for more players help to progress play into opponents own 3rd and increase the xG ? In amount of passes the numbers are quite good for final 3rd passes compared to other teams, it is the percentage of final 3rd passes of the passing total that we want to increase. Shooting is a result of passing and crossing enabling finishes. Our shot map for the last five matches indicates to many long shots. When this happens when all players are set to do this less there is something not working as it should in the tactic. We do it even though we should not do it, this is the last option players should choose. The tactic presses high, has a high DL and tackling is done by stay on feet. The tactic do not prevent short GK distribution from the opposition GK by pressing their defenders. Instead the press commences as a high block more where the team should be more unified. The 3-2 version which has more men staying back in central areas has the purpose of being solid in defence. Should stay on feet when tackling as a TI be removed as the team are quite strong in tackling? How to better the OPPDA ? Defensively the tactic is decent, but there is room for improvement. Changing the 3-2 to a 2-2 rest defence The best finishers in the squad are the DLF's and IW's. In the 3-2 set-up 2/3 are positioned wide. The best crossers are the fullbacks. Changing to a 2-2 with one CWB allows for one IW to move more central (sit narrower)l as well as facilitating for one fullback to move forward for wide delivery. The shape of the back three in the 3-2 rest defence is good for passing, this is replicated by switching positions for the Libero and CD and changing duty for the Libero to defend. The IFB's are changed to left CWB (attack) and rigth IWB (support). Left Mezzala changed to CM (support/roaming) to tie things up. Width is still maintained and comparison between the current 3-2 and the new 2-2 below: Passing map Tested the same match several times. The pattern is more finishing inside the box, increased crossing where the CWB (left) consistently gets forward and contributes in creating chances. Amount of crosses varies and can be inflated by short corners, especially from the right side. No.3 (CBW) stays back for corners (Delegated) his crosses are from open play. Changing the AMR to winger can further increase crossing if that is wanted. For Rennes the finishing of the wide attacking players are better than for the central midfielders, so opting for the IW role at AMR. Images below (the best test) are 1) CCC's and half chances 2) Crosses 3) crosses completed/chances created/key passes Transitions - comparing average positions for in and out of possession to see the distance between the averages. This is one of the reasons why the LCB are libero defend, to move slightly up the pitch to close gaps/cover space. The AMR due to staying wider needs a little more time to get back into a defensive shape. The DC drops deeper by himself in possession, for this player ability to position and making correct decisons are important. These transitions movements and the increased risk by more crossing and increasing passing risks, leads to crossing and passing risks staying at mixed/medium. Will play next matches with this tactic. League The attacking play is really picking up.. Average possession with the tactic for the last three matches: 58,7 %. Average xG: 1,34. Average xGA: 1,74. xGA is mainly corners and crosses against, also a few double chances against gave high numbers. Haven't been caught on the break or been outnumbered in the slightly risky 2-2 set-up. Strasbourg (RCSA) played 442 and the 2-2 managed that well. Europa League At home against Villareal. Started with positive mentality, when they equalized went attacking untill the 85th minute when switching to balanced. The 2nd leg was a big surprise, had to play two 1st picks in midfield because of injury, beautfiul football played. April 2024: League Results not awful, still possession are decreasing to much. Decent defenc, attacking wise not consistent enough. Avg. possession: 59,5 . Avg xG: 1,09 . Avg xGA: 0,60. Europa League Quarter Final May 2024: League The last two 2-2 draws conceded late goals on balanced mentality. The tactic fares better with positive or attacking mentality. Avg. possesion: 60,3. Avg xG: 1,39. Avg xGA: 1,0.

Any PI's for the LB or AML? In the 2-2 version with CBW he often formed a 4 in the attack, the doubling up on players on his flank often gave him space to move into. I briefly tested Cross from byline / Cut inside for the CWB and that was very promising. It is possible to add PI's as cross more, cross centre to further tailor the CWB's delivery from wide dependant on the opposition weaknesses/strengths and own teams weaknesses/strengths. A few such small tweaks can be effective and a way for improving chance creation.

Looks good, how often do you reap the rewards of your left flank by creating chances / assists ?

Nice, appreciate you sharing your tactical ideas

Thanks mate Agree with you on the 3-2 / 5-5 split, attacking players winning 1v1's can be termed situational superiority (I think) by their skill set being superior compared to the opposition player, typicall example being the wide attackers/midfielder. Good suggestions you make, in the origin(al) tactic in this thread the narrow IW's, complete wingback's and CM's (only roaming not getting forward) formed good passing patterns in the wide/wide central areas, often the DLF came close and participated in the passing. Regarding the wingback; if decent pace preferrably attacking duty and PI's cross from byline and cut inside can create a lot of decent chances. This can further be built upon with cross often and for example cross to centre if this area has the most players/players that are good finishers.

Thanks a lot, more writings to come

Good points regarding duties, will soon write a little about that in post 3 (positioning and possible passing patterns), evolving the tactic is at a crossroad, MC's could be either CM's on attacking duty or Mezzala's on support duty. Thanks for sharing your views

That sweet spot are the aim of this thread, myself I hope to learn by other forum members contributions and ideas, their/yours perspectives might in the end be what make the tactic succesfull.

Thanks for the advice, there is a strong possibility that adding attacking duties to the tactic is required. I have had a look at passing patterns with different rest defences (2-1, 2-3, different 3-2's, will post them in the 3rd post of this thread.

very good results, maybe I am on a cul-de-sac with the very fluid tactics... I have not won Ligue 1 in the first season with Rennes..

Playing out from the back IW receives the ball (He tried to cut inside but are forced outside) DLF receives the ball (Holds and wait for support)

Yes and for the tactic to be solid and creating more chances, some of those ways has to been used, it is a question of finding a solution which acchieves possession as well as defensive and offensive capacity.

August 2023: "Tiki Tacatenaccio" First competitive month unfolded as expected tactics wise against mostly bottom half teams. Beaten by Lens which are a decent team. Out of possession already mostly decent performances, whilst in possession the tactic is not sparkling. Hopefully this will be better as team cohesion and player development progresses. Still early in the progress and when leading mentality is switched from positive to balanced. Possession and xG could possibly have been higher if not switching as the team were dominating those matches. League top seven teams Top four teams posession average with pass completion and number of passes Final third passes - top three teams Not so flattering - xG bottom three teams: compared to top two teams with xG high above the 9 mark Three teams with lowest xGA Impression so far: The tactic could be solid with a little more attacking spice. I will wait and see how it evolves as team cohesion evolves before making any changes. If anyone has any suggestions for changes without comprimising possession and defensive solidity, they are most welcome. Tactical familiarity is acchieved. September 2023: Three league games where Lille where the most challenging opponent as they were leading 2-0 before attacking mentality was taken. The two other teams are mid-table teams. In the Europa League against Villareal the young 11 picked for the match where out of their depths and had little to offer. Possession stats has not regressed yet and remain strong. xG still low - PSG 1st 16.27 and Marseille 2nd at 14.40. Rennes are the biggest overachiever for xG compared to scored goals at 5.58 more goals than the xG indicates. Benchmarking passing: For other tactics I have used passing numbers are normally around/a little below 700 passes per game, where 47-51 % is in the opponents half. October 2023: Managed a strong win against PSG at home, before loosing against Lorient at 7th, finally winning against Strasbourg. xG still to low and results can easily change if conceding goals. League Europa League Possession and xG for League Possession and xG for Europa League XG = 2.46 for three matches November 2023: Tweaked the tactic to improve attacking play Tactical change reduced the 3-2 rest defence to either a 2-2 or 3-1. As discussed in the 2nd post in this thread due to utilize width and more players contributing further up the pitch. The left IFB is now changed to a CWB. For the 2-2 rest defence with two defending duties and the rest on support, there is possible to allocate one attacking duty on balanced/positive mentality and two attacking duties for attacking mentality. In the league a tough away fixture against Nice settled for a win with the tactical tweaks and 2-2 rest defence due to them playing 433 with one striker. xG improved and possession and defence is still good for away fixture against strong opposition. Home against Lyon they played a 433 focusing on wing play with a high DL and press. A little unsure of how to start the match, but settled for the 2-2 rest defence. Their most notable performances were: After Lyon equalized to 1-1 the CWB went attacking, the Libero not hold position and attacking mentality for the team. Not able to score and a draw. The last league match was at home against Reims gegenpressing in a 433 with wingers. They are a strong attacking and 3-1 version was selected for the start of the match. Reims notable performances below: Reims dominated the first half and took a 2-0 lead, lots of corners and using the flanks. Changed to 2-2 rest defence, removed hold position for the Libero, assigned attacking duty to the left IW. Rennes scored just before half-time to make it 2-1 to Reims. Even creating a decent amount in the 2nd half this ended in a 1-2 loss. In Europa League the home fixture against Zorya playing 4231 the 2-2 version of the tactic were used. The CWB was given attacking duty for parts of the match to create five in the front line. This showed a lot of promise and was a direct cause for one of the goals and one of the disallowed ones. After we took the lead during the 2nd half they started to threaten our flanks in the 2-2 set-up. When changed to 3-1 this threat was reduced. Possession and defence has not suffered from the tweaks to the tactic. Last match of the month was away against Villareal. They are a strong team playing in a 442 formation. Started the match with the 3-1 set-up and balanced mentality. The CWB assisted our equalizer to 1-1 in the first half. Taking to much pressure and changing mentality to positive. Lost 2-3. Increase in team cohesion could also aid the improvements in offensive performance, as well as Terrier returning from start of the game injury. League Europa League The left flank with the CWB is where a lot of the build-ups and attacking play takes place. vs Nice (Rennes goal right) vs Lyon (Rennes goal Left) Possession decreasing xG improving December 2023: Further tweaks to improve attacking play and settling for tactical approach Aahh, December the month of snow, raindeers and red coated bearded fellows. When we pass the middle of the month I enjoy good and perhaps to much food, socializing, English football and if I am a little daring a nice Christmas sweater, and also a good portion of FM. Regarding FM around Christmas times individual training focus is reviewed for players in all squads. Changes can be made to individual training focus to develope other attributes, or continuing with the current individual training focus if these attributes needs further development. For Rennes the month of December has seen small tactical changes and tweaks. The first two matches where played with flexible fluidity and attacking duties for IW's in the 3-2 version. This is mainly to benchmark this fluidity against the preferred very fluid or atleast fluid. First match away against Marseille, a strong team. No clear conclusions can be made from this fixture as seen below. A win, decent possession but lacklustre xG's, our red card is making things very unclear and impossible to draw any conclusions. Lucky to get all three points. The last match played with flexible fluidity were against Monaco at home. Not totally satiesfied with what was seen and the match ended in a draw. In fairness to flexible fluidity these two teams are amongst the strongest in Ligue 1. Points gained are not the issue, it is the quality of pressing and team play that makes me slightly reluctant. Testing the new tweaks to the tactic (post 3) had lesser opponents. Starting away against Toulouse at 17th in the table with the 3-2 version. As should be against a weaker opponent things looked decently good, and Bouriegeaud as Mezzala assisted Kalimuendo. This was a goal acchieved by the tactic. Due to tight fixture schedule in the fixture away against Clermont the 2nd picks were elected, also with the 3-2 version. The reasoning for this that the first 11 was tired, decided not to rest them to give playing time to young developing players. This is long term thinking that in the long run will benefit the players and the club. No sparkling untill the late minutes when players from the first 11 substituted players tired players. Late goal from Bouriegeaud (Mezzala) from Le Fee (IWR) was due to play according to tactics and secured three points. All in all the tactical tweaks looks promising and I believe this is the way forward for the club DNA. Faithful to the principles of possession, defensively solid and with time the play in possession could be encouraging and create chances. During the matches lack of cohesion and tactical familiarity for some new roles where witnessed, especially in passing play. This will improve with time. Regarding crosses set to mixed this can be the best option when the team is cohesive and decisions making is sufficient. As for now it was set to low during the 2nd half of the last fixture. In fairness to the tactic and the level of players, the image below shows the attributes for Jacquet playing as Libero for the 2nd picks (Europa League), the reasoning for doing this is long term and his development. Currently he is trained at quickness and his passing and movement is priority after quickness stats of 13-14 are acchieved. League Europa League Qualified for the knock out round by placing 2nd behind Villareal. The match against Servette was the opposite of the Marseille fixture. This time we felt robbed for losing the points. January 2024: Sweeper Keeper Alban Lafont bought from Nantes. This is an important signing for the long term ambition of the club. He is the best SK the available for the clubs budget and willing to sign for Rennes. He will strongly strengthen the 1st team and the tactic. League First real test of the current tactic with the new tweaks at home against Nice trying to control possession. Considering the 2-2 version as they play 433, but they are too strong to experiment against and settled for the 3-2 version from the start of the match. Nice notable performances: Thuram their right MC with the role as Mezzala was a danger, I was considering to use OI's to eliminate him as he scored two against us, which OI's have you been succesful with for limiting Mezzala's ? Mistake by CD Theate and they equalized. He was probably targeted by the opposition AI for pressing. His passing is 12, vision 11, decisions 12, composure 12. He is strong in defence currently training his quickness (acc.15 / pace 13), as soon as this around 14/15 individual training focus will be passing. After their equalizer in the 60th minute switched to the 2-2 version. When we scored and went ahead switched to balanced mentality and won 4-3. They did not create any chances after we took the lead and this is promising for the 2-2 version. The offensive capability has drastically improved, whilst there is childhood diseases for passing and defensively leading to goals conceded. Next match away against Lyon at 7th, which is also a decent attacking team with xG of 1.83, trying to control possession in a 433 formation. The match ended 0-0 with Rennes closest to bag a goal. There was some incidents with poor passing between the SK and Theate. He seems to be the target of oppositon pressing. Coupe de France First match against a semi-professional club founded in 2018. Nothing to say about the fixture, Rennes dominated the match as they should do. 2nd match against another semi-professional club named Flerien. The 2nd picks chosen for the match to maintain match fitness for February with league, Europa League and hopefully more Coupe de France matches. Switched to attacking mentality just before half-time as the score was 0-0 and lacklustre attacking play. The match went to penalties which Rennes won. Team cohesion slowly progressing, still some time and improvement before the team will really benefit from it. League table with European qualification places Possession regressed to 65 % xG still low but slowly improving, top three in league: PSG 48.45, Marseille 35,31 and Reims 34,41 February 2024: Still competing in three competitions. The league and Champions Leage qualification ($) has priority, the first 11 will be played in league matches and the 2nd picks will get playing time in the cups. League Match home against Montpellier, changed to attacking mentality after 30 minutes, changed to positive again when scoring around the 60th minute. They equalized in the 74th minute, attacking mentality again. Changed to 2-2 version around the 85th minute and scored twice before full time. The next match was away against Le Havre at the 18th place in the bottom of the league. We would face a 4231 focusing on wing play. Started with the 3-2 on attacking mentality. Scored at the 28th minute changed to positive mentality. The shape of the 3-2 is good and the DLF often moved lateral and created overloads in wider areas. When they reduced to 1-3 in the 50th minute changed to balanced mentality and saw out the match. The next opponent was Clermont at Home, expecting them to play fluid counter attacking football in a 3421 (AM). Decided to start with the 2-2 and positive mentality. Changed to attacking mentality half-way through the 1st half. A long shot deflected on of our players and they were ahead. Rennes equalized and they with their first shot at goal went ahead 2-1. Changed to 3-2 and chasing with attacking mentality and soon the score was 2-2 and that became the final result. Huge disappointment and in retrospective should not have started with the 2-2 version / changed to attacking mentality against a team with three central offensive players. Result purely because of managerial mistake. Last match of the month are PSG away playing tiki taka in a 433 formation and a 3-2 rest defence. They are playing with a high DL and press which they perform excellent. Good at passing the ball and accurate crossing. This will be the toughest fixture domestically this season. Starting with the 3-2 and balanced mentality. They took an early lead and mentality was changed to positive, both teams scored one goal each after the first goal and at half-time the score was 2-1 to PSG. After PSG scored to make it 3-1 changed to the 2-2 rest defence. PSG were clearly the best team and won 4-1. Europa League In the knock out play off round the first leg is away vs Ferencvarosi, expected to play 4231 control possession. Starting with 3-2 and balanced mentality. Passing mistake by back up GK Gallon handed them a free goal and mentality was changed to positive. Allmost immediately we equalized in a beautiful passing attack utilizing almost every diamond created before scoring. Balanced mentality again in the 50th(ish) minute. Changed to 2-2 and positive in the 75th minute and the match ended 1-1. For the home tie we started with the 3-2 and positive mentality. First choice GK selected to play with the 2nd picks and that helped secure a 1-0 victory. The draw for the round of 16 Coupe de France Playing against away against Aubersvilliers at the 4th divisional level. Started with attacking mentality with the 3-2 version against their 3412. They scored first in the 28th minute. Changed to the 2-2 version and equalized in the 52nd minute. Even though One of their attackers dropped deeper the 2-2 version gave 5 vs 4 overload in the midfield. The match ended in a 1-1 draw and they won the penalty shoot out. The cup campaign against teams at very low levels were far from impressive and being knocked out in the 11th round is absymal.

Training and schedules First team schedules focusing on broad development of attributes and slightly biased towards possession, various individual focuses used for two seasons. First team - images of players at development age and potential staying with the club for the two seasons. Left: 5th august 2023 Rigth: 18th May 2025 Lambourde Belocian D. Doue Jacquet A. Truffert Kalimuendo Omari Theate Rieder Youth players promoted to the reserve team and staying with the club for the two seasons Images showing improvement in attributes for the most promising players. Important for deciding upon schedules and development for the youth and reserve team. Top: Schedules with match practice sessions and training for roles and additional individual focus Bottom: Schedules without match practice sesseions and not training for roles and only additional individual focus. Everything else being as equal as possible, improvement of training facilities, coaches, physios etc. Injury history can affect results and players with known longer term injuries are excluded for comparison. Rosier Akwa Coulibaly Coutadeur Ake Summary: There are no clear patterns in difference between the different methodologies/schedules for youth/reserves training. The schedules with no role training has 1 more general physical session compared to role training schedules. This benefits the physical development at the younger ages. This is preferable and these schedules is my preference. These will be used on players untill they go on loan or are moved to the 1st team. In the 1st team they will train for roles with the 1st team schedules. Training schedules for download, no match used both for 1st and reserves/youth team. Pre-season only for 1st teamPre Season.fmfNo Match.fmf1_Friday.fmf1_Saturday.fmf1_Sunday.fmf2_Tuesday Saturday.fmf2_Tuesday Sunday.fmf2_Wednesday Saturday.fmf2_Wednesday Sunday.fmf2_Thursday Sunday.fmfyth_1_Friday.fmfyth_1_Saturday.fmfyth_1_Sunday.fmfyth_2_Tuesday Saturday.fmfyth_2_Tuesday Sunday.fmfyth_2_Wednesday Saturday.fmfyth_2_Wednesday Sunday.fmfyth_2_Thursday Sunday.fmf:

In possession the most important thing is to create triangles/diamonds for passing patterns. Below are images showing average positions in possession and how these can be changed dependant on rest defence set-ups. 2-1: CM's roaming, CWB's forwards runs, IW's sit narrower 2-3: Mezzala's, IWB's, IW's stay wider 3-2: Mezzala's, IWB & IFB, IW's stay wider 3-2: Mezzala's, IWB & IFB, IW's stay wider, DC's stay wider 3-2: Mezzala's, IFB's & Libero, IW's stay wider, DC's stay wider For me the first and last image has the best positoning which can enable good passing patterns, and width as well. The first (2-1) is the origin tactic whilst the last are the current tactic with Mezzala's and IW's stay wider, as well as CF (supp). To increase chance creation and xG it is not the roles or positioning that is at fault. The tactic can be in need of attacking duties to acchieve this. Also passing shorter as PI can be removed (TI shortest passing already) for some positions in the 3-2 with IFB's and Libero (last image). Thinking about the IFB's and IW's for them to be able to pass to all players in their diamonds and triangles (IFB's to IW's and IW's to CF). Positioning with CM's in the current 3-2 set-up (3-2 (DC's stay wider) IFB's/LIB & CM's): This doesn't create very good diamonds/triangles. Players are positioned closed to eachother centrally and deep/middle of the pitch. With short passing this gives high possession numbers, but mainly in the wrong area of the pitch. The percentage of progressive/attacking passes will be lower and this will not create good chances measured in xG. Positioning as above with CM's move into channels Slightly increases width for the CM's but this is not sufficient to create satisfying passing patterns. CM's stay wider Width is better but the depth is the same, the CM's should be positioned higher up the pitch. The centre of the pitch is to congested by own players CM's move into channels with attacking duty This is better but at the expense of adding two attacking duties, which can have a negative effect on defence. The tactical fluidity with this set-up is described as flexible. Another option with a 2-3 / 2-2-1 rest defence 2-3: FB's / Libero's, IW's stay wider, DM changed to RPM, MC's move into channels with attacking duty Man City has set-up similiar this season. Two IFB's in a 2-3 set-up. This also has potential for good passing patterns, where the six sentral players alone positions in three possible diamonds. In this set-up the SK and the IFB's need to be able to pass the ball under pressure. Also the two at the back are positioned very wide, still this could be a good option against formations with just one central attacker. 2-3: FB's / Libero's, IW's stay wider, Mezzala's (support), DM changed to RPM The same with Mezzala's, several matches needs to be played to verify that the difference in positioning with support duties for the MC's compared to using attacking duties is not making the Libero's stay back. Next analytics that can be checked How the tactic will affect the quickness of transitioning from either in possession / out of possession shapes to the other. This can be checked by comparing average positioning for these. Compare average position in possession with average position for passing, see if there is any patterns. Summary: The current roles/duties/PI's for the MC's needs to changed. The following solutions and implications are considered: Mezzala's on support: Change their roles as the average positioning for Mezzala's indicates that this will create better passing patterns higher up the pitch, possibly leading to better chance creation. Support duties are preferred and this is weighted in the decision making. CM's on attacking duty: Change duties from support to attack and PI's move into channels. Average positioning with these changes indicates the same as for Mezzala's. Benefit is also attacking duty with penetration, drawback is potential weakened defensive balance as well as reducing support duties with fluidity described as flexible. Two tactical set-ups: 1) Evolve the existing 3-2 with either Mezzala's or CM's with attacking duty 2) Create the 2-3 / 2-2-1 with two IFB's as back line to use against formations with 1 central attacker Decided tweaks: Mezzala's on support for both the 3-2 and 2-2 version. Also no hold position for the DM and Libero in the 3-2 version, as well as no hold position for the Libero's in the 2-2 version. Will test the 3-2 version with for a couple of matches with attacking duty for both IW's and see how that fares and get an impression, before continuing to use the tweaked tactics as very fluid. TI crosses set to mix and this is the 3-2 and 2-2 rest defence versions of the tactic: IGNORE the next two images, they are repeated from above, i do not dare to delete them in danger of deleting an image used/positioned above..

Changes to the tactic to create more chances Timeline 1) Origin: The first very fluid tactic I used, gave quite good results and using almost identical TI's and PI's. Three players at the back providing defensive balance/rest defence (red triangle) and CWB's maintaining width. It is my impression when playing very fluid and short passing tactics that you need to have a sufficient amount of players going forward to contribute in the passing play. This tactic acchieved that. The main weakness is just three players at the back as well as just 6 central players. 2) Current tactic: Issue 1) Fewer players contributing with forward runs - The changes made to the tactic was to increase the numbers and strength in central areas. Now five players are staying back and providing defensive balance/rest defence (DM and LIB has hold position). The upside is stronger defence and the downside is weaker offence. This has effectively decreased the number of players going forward and contributing to the attacking play. The current set-up can work for tactics with attacking duties that to a larger extent early on threatens the space behind the opposition defence. But for what I want to acchieve and how to play this is clearly not working sufficiently. The randomness in football and FM will lead to bad runs of results more often when not producing and creating chances. 2) Current tactic: Issue 2) Lack of width - The IW's are naturally positioned wide. In the origin tactic they sat narrower to come closer to the DLF for passing play, creating space for the CWB's as well as posing a more central threat for goalscoring. In the current tactic they sit either narrow or stay wider. This doesn't sufficiently maintain width and the result is opposition which are compact in their shape, effectively hinders our chance creation leading to an increase in long shots and blocks. The IW's roaming will lead to theme sometimes going wider (also the opposition forces them outside) and the IFB's will also sometimes venture forward down the flanks, but not at a sufficient rate. 3) Possible solutions: The changes to the tactic needs to a larger degree to maintain width (Issue 2) as well as bringing more players forward to contribute to the short passing game (Issue 1). The change to the tactic to do this shouldn't to drastic change the overall tactic and shape. Solutions to issue 1 - too few players contributing in passing play in the forward areas of the pitch: Remove hold positon for the LIB and DM ? This will probably just pack a small area of the pitch with more players and not contribute to creating good passing patterns Reduce the rest defence to four players ? This is a possible solution that still will bring more defensive strength compared to the original tactic with just 3 players in the rest defence. This can be done in several ways (also based on the oppositon formation/pressing), either a 2-2 box or a 3-1 set-up. Which chosen has alos impact on on how width can be created and they can each be perfomed in multliple ways by adding one player going forward either centrally or a fullback. Examples below: 2-2 box rest defence: 3-1 rest defence: Solutions to issue 2 - lack of attacking width: By reducing the rest defence to four players this gives one player extra to send forward. This player can be used to create width in several ways dependant on if the player is positoned wide or central. Wide player (CWB) going forward in a 3-1 rest defence Roles changed: LB to CWB, RB to CD, RMC to Mezzala PI's changed: LMC no forward runs, left IW sit narrower, right IW stay wider This gives more width on both sides which can create more space centrally. Advantage is added width in the build-up on the left side. This can lead to 4-5 players in the front line during attacks in a 3-3-4 and sometimes 3-2-5 shape. The benefit of a 3-1 rest defence is that the widest defender in the back three can sometimes offer wide support, as well as a back three offers better support/width as passing outlets for players under pressure. 3-1 rest defence theoretically should be well suited against opponents with two attackers. Wide player (CWB) going forward in a 2-2 box rest defence Roles changed: LB to CWB, RCM to Mezzala PI's changed: LMC no forward runs, left IW sit narrower, right IW stay wider This could be well suited against opponent formations with just one striker. Either the LCM, DM or Libero could be allowed forward runs as well dependant on where the extra man is most needed, preferably the Libero holds position due to the Mezzala in front of him going forward. Centrally strong set-up but might be vulnerable to opponents countering down the flanks. Central player (RMP) going forward in a 3-1 rest Roles changed:DM to RPM, alternatively both CM's can be changed to Mezzala's or a mix with Mezzala and AP. PI's changed: IW's stay wider, CM's stay wider (also forward runs) This makes the whole attacking set-up wider and could possible weaken the high block and players positioned further apart. Stronger in the wide areas and IFB's also providing a minimum of support on their sides. In central areas this is dependant of the RPM's ability to go forward. Central player (RMP) going forward in a 2-2 box rest defence Roles changed: LB to IWB, DM to RPM, alternatively both CM's can be changed to Mezzala's or a mix with Mezzala and AP. PI's changed: IW's stay wider, CM's stay wider (also forward runs) This has as little more central defensive cover as the rest defence is centrally positioned. Either the LIB or the IWB can be given forward runs for increased support to offensive play.

Pretty solid results I totally understand you wanting higher possession numbers. With this preference of playing style possession % indicates how good your team/tactic is at passing and keeping the ball, as well as pressing and regaining possession. The higher the number the better team/tactic. Still, this is the possession numbers for Seria A so far this year. Be satiesfied with what you have acchieved, you are doing vey well

Thanks for sharing and I hear you. It is probably FM's way of punishing teams considered "not good enough" when acchieving high possession and mimick the consequences from real life. There is no plug and play if not exploiting this year, initially I used counter when playing with balanced mentality. Now only changing mentality dependant on match and what is happening. Probably change the passing patterns dependant on opposition could be one path to explore.

The first post is edited with what works after testing different tactics and training schedules IRL as per 5th of January 2024. Introduction El rondo Closer aquintance to El rondo by this Youtube link: Barcelona performing El Rondo. This sums up how the team should play. Quick passing in confined areas as well as skilled at pressing and regaining possession when loosing the ball. Implications The team should dominate possession. The team should be able to regain possession and restart the passing play. Barcelona with La Masia and youth development benefits of developing players able to play in their tactical system/style. Currently Barcelona are the top ranking team for possession in the five major leagues in Europe. Per 18th of December they average 64.7 % in possession in La Liga (Source). The same systematic approach of developing their own youngsters and required attributes should be taken for a less reputable club, when trying to tailor youth development towards their style of play and Club DNA. Club: Stade Rennais Stade Rennais (Clubs homepage) or Rennes in English is a club known to develope youngsters. Recent transfers are Doku to Man City, Ugochukwu to Chelsea and Tel to Bayern Munich. Besides those they are one of the clubs developing most players playing in both the Ligue 1 and the biggest five leagues in Europe. I have been playing with this club since FM2022. I know this club and their players from playing FM. This makes it a lot easier to benchmark and discover what works and does not work for the different approaches to managing a club. Major benefits for choosing this club is a good club infrastructure for player development already in place, as well as the boards eagerness to continue improving on it and develope the best youth development system in France. France is also being one of the top nations for regens and new talent in the game which to a larger degree enables the possibility of recruiting and developing own players. The current squad has a good 1st eleven with good youth prospects outside the the first picks. The team are particulary strong in midfield and the main weakness are the defence and the goalkeepers. Future transfers incoming should be a goalkeeper able to play as a SK (att), a central defender able to play as Lib (supp) and preferrably a defensive midfielder strong in both in/out of possession. Most notable players: Current ability : **** Terrier, ***/*Blas , Bouriegeaud, Gouri, Santamaria, Matic Most notable players: Future Potential (room for improvement/top potential): ***** D.Doue, ****/* Abline (loan), Gbeme (U19), Akwa (U19), **** Lambourde, Belocian, Jacquet, Alemdar (loan), Methods Tactics - Main tactic is control (positive mentality), dominate (attacking mentality) and cautious (balanced mentality) are used dependant of the match and in-match scenario. Set-pieces - regarded as a situation to continue the short passing game. Set-pieces are not trained but this can be included in the training schedules for those who wants to emphasize this. For the 2nd season 8 goals were scored from corners and only 1 conceded (best in the league). Downloads: Cautious_el Rondo_2-3 RD.fmf Control_el Rondo_2-3 RD.fmf Dominate_el Rondo_2-3 RD.fmf Set Pieces_tiki taka_(Pep_Barca).fmf Why the tactics work: With the tactic the team is compact both in and out possession, enabling immediate effective counter pressing, quick positional transitions and central overloads enabling quick short passing. The team controls the central area of the pitch both in and out of possession. The team are challenging to play against and the easiest way for the opposition is to go wide in possession. This is where the pressing traps occurs and for this to work sufficiently OI's are used. If failure to apply effective pressing traps the team can be outplayed from the flanks. Also this poses demands on minimum requirements of the players attributes/ability to master this tight and contested space (technical/passing/movement) as well as ability/attributes for pressing. If these abilities/attributes are lacking the tactic will be much less effective. In possession the shape of the tactic is a compact 2-3-2-3 (WW). The tactic has a large degree of positional freedom in possession, all players except the two LIB's and the DM are roaming. This leads to players swapping positions and using the available space in position, also out wide when this is necessary. Very fluid with abundance of support duties, contributing both in and out of possession. This can ensure that players are moving towards the player with ball, posing as passing outlets and creating numerical superiority in the ball zone, as well as leading to cohesive and collective pressing where the team press as one unit. Mentality: Positive, balanced and attacking mentality is changed between dependant of the opposition and in-match scenario. Rest defence set-up: The 2-3 rest defence is used mainly because of three players in the 2nd line which enables effective counter pressing and puts the opposition under pressure. In possession: TI's used are to stimulate and ensure (be more discliplined) quick short passing where players are positioned in close proximity to each other. This will most likely lead to confined and tightly congested areas/spaces in possession. Roles and positioning (in possession team shape) aims to create triangles/diamonds to enhance the selected passing play. The tactic stands or fall with the players ability and mastery of these confined/congested spaces/areas. Transitions to in possession, the team holds shape to keep the passing patterns trying to be established with numerical/positional superiority around the player with the ball. The number of players and positioning around the ballplayer also increases the quality of the counter press in transition out of possession if the ball player looses the ball at his feets. The compactness in possession leads to quick transitions towards out of possession shape. The GK are given role and instructions which gives freedom to pass the ball as he sees fit with a bias towards short passes. Out of possession: The narrow width and compactness in possession leads to quick transitions for counterpress as well as the team quicker establishing its defensive shape in a high and compact pressing block. The high pressing block is compact both vertical and horizontal/lateral. The opposition should be led towards the sideline with the ball when they are in possession. The tactic do not mark opposition defenders to prevent their GK distribution, as this can compromise the vertical compactness of the pressing block. The preference is to maintain the block and press in it if their defenders receive the ball from the GK. PI's, shorter passing for all positions, shoot less often and roaming to all roles this can be assigned to, IW's and CM's get further forward, Libero and DM holds position. All roles where it can be altered has dribbling set to mixed. Summary: The tactic is quite defensive, sacrificing width to maintain ability to counter press and rapidly press as an unit when loosing the ball. PI's for the IW's are not set to stay wider, this is done for the same reason as well as the danger for them being to isolated if given. The offensive weakness of the tactic is when playing against opposition also being compact where this can make it more difficult to create good goalscoring opportunities. The defensive weakness are the space given away behind own defence and on the flanks. The intensity of the tactic is kept at reasonable level. This should prevent some injuries and fatigue as well as keeping players conditions higher throughout the season and enhance training and development. OI's: The compact shape and TI trap outside leads to default OI settings as image below. The weakness/available space for the opposition is the wide areas. This has to be dealt with and OI's are applied to their wide players. Before each match the OI's can be changed dependant on individual players strenghts/weaknesses to prevent the danger they pose.First of all a weak foot leads to players showed onto this no matter what. Typical right footed wingers/fullbacks/wingbacks with good crossing abilities are forced inside/showed onto left foot, whilst left footed inverted winger/forwards/IWB's/IFB's with good finishing or creativity/passing are forced outside/showed onto right foot. This rule can not be applied for all players (some are two footed and good at both cut inside and wing play) and sometimes discretionary judgement also considering their style of play has to be considered. If no clear benefit can be identified (considering other opposition players as well) no OI for that player is given. These OI's doesn't affect the tactic too much and are the ones that have worked for me. This is not carved in stone and some of you might find OI's that works even better. If so, please share in the thread. Example of use of OI's: 1st get a general impression of how hte opposition will play, style of play and roles. Based on their wide players strengths and preferred foot this is OI's applied. Ito can pose a threat either way and the match is started with no OI's for him. Team cohesion is of the uttermost importance for the tactic as this influences the cohesiveness in pressing/defensive positioning and passing offensive movement. vs Player requirements: For all positions a minimum level for the technical and mental attributes on the image below is needed. For the positions playing in the most congested area higher levels are needed. Physically agility, quickness and stamina are after sought attributes. Speed is most important for the defenders and the IW's, and a huge benefit for the DLF as his roaming often leads to him threatening the space behind the opposition defenders. Training - due to limited uploads training images/schedules is moved to the 4th post of this thread. Explaining and showing results that leads to rationale for used schedules. Priorities - Aims for training is to rapidly increase team cohesion and tactical familiarity. Well rouned development of players suited to playing in the presented tactic. Prepare the team for matches as well as injury prevention. The effect of squad size on training: Larger squads will have more players not playing matches. I prefer smaller squads (1st: 23-25, Res: 18ish, Youths: 18ish) where all players gets a decent amount of playing time. The training schedules have been designed with that in mind. All players will get matches and this affects the intensity of training and the schedules. Methodoloy for training: Training intensity and player conditions effect training outcome. The tactic and different training schedules/weeks has been created with this in mind. Players with higher condition can train at a higher intensity and I use the current settings. Schedules: The training schedules utilizes sessions from the general, match preparation and physical (recovery) categories. Some weeks dependant on fixtures and travels enables broader training of attributes due to more sessions. Match practice sessions have highest priorities to train as these trains individual roles, to a high degree team cohesion and tactical familiarity. Of the general sessions possession are emphasized as well as aiming for one session with physical for most weeks. Match tactics are trained before every match. Schedules for reserve and youth teams: The training schedules for the reserve and youth team has no match tactics/match practice session and they are replaced with a general sessions . They also have increased intensity in training for some of the days. This is due to the focus on developing players instead of winning matches and at the younger age they can endure higher training intensity. Keeping players in the youth and reserve team gives them more time to train and develope. This is the main reason why they are kept in those squads untill they reach the year of 18. Before this age training is most important for player development. Training of roles and individual focus: I am not entirely sure if it is best to train the youth team without role training and just individual focus or to train them in roles/several roles. I have had good results with the former. For this save game I will start with training youth players in their roles and train them for serveral roles as well. Players in the reserves team are trained in their playing roles as well the 1st team. For reserve/youth team individual focus are trained with emphasis on ball controll, passing, attacking movement/defensive positioning, agility and acceleration/pace. Players decent in these areas as well as 1st team players have individual focus on weaknesses or focusing on strengths for their role. Feeder clubs: A network of feeder clubs playing at the minimum level of Ligue 2 in France or the top divisions in other good European leagues are needed for those players too good to stay in the reserves, and not yet able to get playing time in the 1st team. Management Importance of feedback, building relationships, has effect on both match and training performance, happiness and loyalty. Research points to feedback IRL as important for performance, motivation and job satisfaction. How giving feedback and communicating with players in FM simulates how feedback can be given similiar to management styles. Management style, supportive and focusing on motivation in all communication with players. Squad sizes has effect on amount of coaches and physios/sports scientists required to enhance training (coaches workload) and prevent injuries. Keep squad size at a level where the club can afford/allow the different staff. Keeping players match fit - if there is a problem with this in your squad you have to many players compared to competitions and matches. Important both for matches, training and injury prevention. Strategy - recruitment: Players that now or in the future can be able to play within the tactical system/style of play. Good coaches improves several/all players, good physios/sports scientists prevents injuries of the existing players. Compare this to the expenses of buying players. Strategy - Club Infrastructure: All facilities, youth coaching, youth recruitment network improves the existing players or the upcoming players. Compare this to the expenses of buying players. Results This thread is started on the date 10th of july 2023 in the game. As the save game progress I will regularly post results for matches, competitions and development, as well as updates for transfers and things learned or experienced during the save game. Match updates will be updated on a monthly in-game frequency and training and competitions will be updated with a yearly in-game frequency. Objectives (1st season - 2nd season the same for the competitions) Matches Against weak opposition at home, 3-0 victory over Auxerre. Dominate/attacking mentality. Against medium opposition at home. 3-0 victory over Strasbourg. Dominate/attacking mentality. Competitions As Rennes does not have the squad to be competitive in all competitions the primary focus are initially on the league. Position and stats will be derived from Ligue 1. Only transfers are in summer before the 2nd season: Lafont (GK), Roault (DC) and Gueye (DMC). Of these three Lafont is played in the 1st eleven, the others are squad rotation or for the future. 2023-24 2024-25 PSG remaining fixtures whom Rennes narrowly lost the league title to. Stats 2nd season: In possession Benchmarked against Barcelona IRL 64,7 % so far this season. In game Feyenoord, Real Madrid and Benfica in their respective leagues had the highest possession at 63%. Rennes possession and pass completion is the highest for playable leagues (England, France, Germany, Italy, Netherlands, Portugal and Spain). As @yonko pointed out Barcelona at the heights under Guardiola achieved possession at 67 %. That could be possible with this tactic with very good players. High number of chances created compared to shots for, ranked 8th (shots for). Ratio chances created and shots for are 152/365=0,42. PSG's numbers 206/529=0,39 Out of possession xGA Player development Moved to 4th post of this thread Discussion I hope it has been made clear what I want to acchieve in my game. I am sure that I have not fully understood or chosen the best solutions in every aspect of managing in FM. Hints and tips for improvement are most welcome, that is the main reason for starting this thread. More brains finds better solutions - your contributions are welcomed. I will update with my findings on what works well with the current approach and what does not work so well. Thanks to everyone contributing to the thread and discussing it.

You probably have a good tactical set-up.

Football has evolved a lot during these +10 years, in most of the top leagues today it is not possible to recreate prime Barca times in regard to possession, as these leagues are more competittive. Look at the possession numbers for the top five leagues in Europe and see what the possession stats are. Gegenpress can give high possession numbers for good teams, able at regaining possession and and passing the ball, nothing wrong with that. For single "easy" matches high/very high numbers for possession can be acchieved. Also high xG can be acchieved with high possession. But for the whole season with Rennes and their players possession averages between 60-64 % for the whole season so far in FM24.

That is also a way of introducing yourself... Quite the contrary I am enjoying FM and has acchieved what I want to do in regard to tactics. You probably need to be enlightened about real world football, images shows possession stats for Ligue 1 this season, as well as for Premier League. My advice to you would be to look at them and see what the possession stats are for the best teams in real life.

Only positions with individual focus and club DNA has brought me the best results, actually when training that way with the reservers and 1st team as well, the training results are better. I use slightly different training schedules for the 1st team compared to the reserve/youth team. This is because match preparation sessions are included in the 1st team schedules as results are important (my gut feeling is that the team plays better when this is included), as well as it is an easy way to increase team cohesion at a low intensity. The reserves/youth schedule are much more focused on developing players and by skipping match tactics/match review there are more availabe sessions for development. Examples below for a schedule that broadly develops players, where individual focus are used. 1st Reserves/Youth A little tip when creating training schedules When creating training schedules the training intensity and players condition should be considered. Players at low condition will have lower training intensity and lower outcome of the the sessions. Try to design the schedules in a way that the condition is not "kept low". Click on any session in your training schedule and hover the cursor over the intensity bar for any day, this brings up details of that days sessions in regards to injury risk, condition, fatigue, sharpness and happiness. Players condition will naturally increase independent of training, but adding sessions that increases condition slightly or more at the start of the week leads to better training outcome for the following days.

Yes, that is true. Players also reach maximum familiarity as long as they as play enough games in that role, over time competency for position will increase as well. My approach to training has changed and the only reason for training players in tactical role/duty are for more quickly gaining tactical familiarity for the role/becoming natural in position. For all teams: 1st, reserve and youth team, I only use training schedules and additional/individual focus for each player.