Football Manager 2022 Headline Features - In The Studio Part 2

[Daveincid]

vor 11 Minuten schrieb Malicious Penguin:

This is the first time I've felt disillusioned with CM/FM, and feel there's become a disconnect between SI and the userbase. 

I don't expect lots of shiny new things, but so far, data hub aside, I don't see anything anyone has actually wanted, at least in any form of numbers. I think I've used "deadline day" once, and realised it's been the same old questions, same old pointlessness. If DD had been advertised as part of a huge improvement in transfers (see @Daveincid's work!) I'd be excited.

 

Ultimately, I think SI are slowly becoming an EA - and I don't mean that as a compliment.

You need to differ between coding (new features, functions etc.) and research.

Research in general: Everything which you can edit is research, which is runned by 1000's of people around the world who do this mostly in their free-time. SI provided us with the great tool called "editor" to do those changes.

Every bug etc. is mainly SI's job to try to fix them. (I can only imagine that I'm not that popular at SI with all my reports )

I'm pretty sure that a new feature causes problems in existing ones. So I prefer less features over a less buggy game for sure!

 

[akm.91]

Anyone that has used the deadline date feature on this game...I’m 99% sure has never used it again. Takes forever, so repetitive, just outright brain numbing. 
 

You can make signings on deadline day irregardless of whether you click the icon to participate. It’s just a chore. 

[GreenTriangle]

8 minutes ago, FedAt said:

but on this forum a lot of people who buy this game no matter what

Because the other games with a similar theme (football) are poor in quality. They are nicely packaged, but their content is completely unrealistic : "Christmas tree, balloons, tinsel, beautifully colored light bulbs, fireworks and Santa Claus coming down the chimney to bring presents to good children." Let's be serious. That's anything but not football.

[XaW]

15 minutes ago, FedAt said:

yeah, I thought about a demo, but the person I quoted said about beta, so that not really make sense, 'cause, as you mentioned, you have to buy the game to get the beta.

That is correct, but at least you can read the feedback of those who have pre-ordered and have tried it. But as always, how anyone feels about the game is very individual. I might love something you hate, and vice versa. So if you are in doubt, I always suggest trying the demo, read some reviews, or watching some Youtube videos from some creator.

15 minutes ago, FedAt said:

And I don't want to be negative or offend anybody, but on this forum a lot of people who buy this game no matter what, and who praises si and Miles no matter what, but I think you have to take off "pink glasses" and judge promotion and updates of fm22 and what changes this game got for the past few years in more serious manner.

Off course there are some who will be happy no matter, and there will be some who will be negative no matter. It's just how it is. Some will disagree with the decisions made because they would have liked another thing or how to do it. I personally try to take a pragmatic view of it and realise I will most likely love a few features and dislike a few other.

[GreenTriangle]

5 minutes ago, davehanson said:

I don't play FIFA either, don't like it. however 31m people would disagree with us! The conversation was around the price of the two, not the quality. They are not that far off each other in terms of price. But, yes I agree, for value of money, imo, FM is far better.

Well, I meant the price. FIFA is excessively expensive compared to what it offers. FIFA players appreciate the "Final Fantasy" game-style. It doesn't matter how unrealistic what they see is, the more unrealistic the game is, the more they like it. But these players are not and will never be FM fans, and that's because FM does not offer them the dose of unrealism they are looking for.

[davehanson]

3 minutes ago, GreenTriangle said:

Well, I meant the price. FIFA is excessively expensive compared to what it offers. FIFA players appreciate the "Final Fantasy" game-style. It doesn't matter how unrealistic what they see is, the more unrealistic the game is, the more they like it. But these players are not and will never be FM fans, and that's because FM does not offer them the dose of unrealism they are looking for.

The original point was that FIFA cost £50. It doesn't. It is £35 (or thereabouts). I know plenty of people that ONLY play FIFA. For them £35 is good value, just as for us £25 is good value for FM. 

[TioPatinhax]

46 minutos atrás, Malicious Penguin disse:

This is the first time I've felt disillusioned with CM/FM, and feel there's become a disconnect between SI and the userbase. 

I don't expect lots of shiny new things, but so far, data hub aside, I don't see anything anyone has actually wanted, at least in any form of numbers. I think I've used "deadline day" once, and realised it's been the same old questions, same old pointlessness. If DD had been advertised as part of a huge improvement in transfers (see @Daveincid's work!) I'd be excited.

 

Ultimately, I think SI are slowly becoming an EA - and I don't mean that as a compliment.

I feel the same, unfortunately. And to add to this the waste of resources and time (in my opinion) to develop the female version of FM leads me to believe the situation isnt getting better anytime soon.

However, and myself included, I dont want to judge a game when its not even released, not even a demo. Lets wait and see, I´m keeping a bit of positivity in me but so far the direction it is going isn´t positive.

[GreenTriangle]

34 minutes ago, davehanson said:

The original point was that FIFA cost £50. It doesn't. It is £35 (or thereabouts). I know plenty of people that ONLY play FIFA. For them £35 is good value, just as for us £25 is good value for FM. 

If for them £35 is a good value then for us £40 is a very good value. Remember : they get a simple and scripted game while we get a much more varied game.

[FedAt]

24 минуты назад, XaW сказал:

Off course there are some who will be happy no matter, and there will be some who will be negative no matter. It's just how it is. Some will disagree with the decisions made because they would have liked another thing or how to do it. I personally try to take a pragmatic view of it and realise I will most likely love a few features and dislike a few other.

yeah, but as a person who played this game for almost 20 years and doesn't see progress in training and set pieces systems over those years, I honestly can't understand how those such important parts not receiving proper amount of attention from developers, but instead we have body language and ineffective advices from staff and recruitment team.

I understand that a lot of people here would like to see something very niche, like unique stadiums, or new faces, but in general those are just additions, that is not a gameplay itself, but training, on the other hand, should be part of the gameplay because it's day to day task to train and develop your players, train you system teamwork etc., how often some footballers said that particular head coach have different training approach, or that in some particular league physicality is a massive so obviously training also is different. And getting response from assistant that some player show good work on training don't tell you much, you have to see how players work on a pitch, how they understand you tactic, how they understand and execute personal instructions and not wait until the match to see that it doesn't work.

Same with set pieces, currently we have like 10-15 positions to place players, you set some basic instruction where player should be and that's all, you as a manager don't have any control over actions of players after a pass from a corner, you cant create combinations, players movement etc. I remember some time ago some of the players from man city said that Pep literally take player by the hand and show him where he should be and where to go, so obviously this is part of combinational play (teamwork), which, as I think, most managers work on during trainings.

Again, I just honestly can't understand how in current state of the football this is not considered as important part of fm.

[davehanson]

8 minutes ago, GreenTriangle said:

If for them £35 is a good value then for us £40 is a very good value. Remember : they get a simple and scripted game while we get a much more varied game.

In your opinion. You are completely missing the point, and have done so since the start. 

[The Gold Guard]

Man oh man, these past few threads about FM22...

 

Are we the "Tool fans" of the gaming industry? 🤔

[GreenTriangle]

12 minutes ago, davehanson said:

In your opinion. You are completely missing the point, and have done so since the start. 

To be honest, I don't care what FIFA players think about their game. It's their right to like colorful light bulbs and fireworks. Personally, I got terribly bored after only a few hours of playing that game. But I know for sure : FM is much more versatile and realistic than any other football game. And this although in which, according to some, it would need some improvements. So, any improvement for FM does nothing but increase the quality difference between FM and other games. Under these conditions, to say that FM has to be cheaper than other games is like claiming that a player in the 3rd league should earn more money than Harry Kane.

[davehanson]

21 minutes ago, GreenTriangle said:

To be honest, I don't care what FIFA players think about their game. It's their right to like colorful light bulbs and fireworks. Personally, I got terribly bored after only a few hours of playing that game. But I know for sure : FM is much more versatile and realistic than any other football game. And this although in which, according to some, it would need some improvements. So, any improvement for FM does nothing but increase the quality difference between FM and other games. Under these conditions, to say that FM has to be cheaper than other games is like claiming that a player in the 3rd league should earn more money than Harry Kane.

Wasn't about this, I'm not replying anymore as it is totally derailing the thread, but you need to go back to the original point.

[XaW]

31 minutes ago, FedAt said:

yeah, but as a person who played this game for almost 20 years and doesn't see progress in training and set pieces systems over those years, I honestly can't understand how those such important parts not receiving proper amount of attention from developers, but instead we have body language and ineffective advices from staff and recruitment team.

I understand that a lot of people here would like to see something very niche, like unique stadiums, or new faces, but in general those are just additions, that is not a gameplay itself, but training, on the other hand, should be part of the gameplay because it's day to day task to train and develop your players, train you system teamwork etc., how often some footballers said that particular head coach have different training approach, or that in some particular league physicality is a massive so obviously training also is different. And getting response from assistant that some player show good work on training don't tell you much, you have to see how players work on a pitch, how they understand you tactic, how they understand and execute personal instructions and not wait until the match to see that it doesn't work.

The training mode have been redesigned several times already, so there is change there, but the current one is quite fine by me. If you have any great suggestions to change it, post it in the feature requests.

31 minutes ago, FedAt said:

Same with set pieces, currently we have like 10-15 positions to place players, you set some basic instruction where player should be and that's all, you as a manager don't have any control over actions of players after a pass from a corner, you cant create combinations, players movement etc. I remember some time ago some of the players from man city said that Pep literally take player by the hand and show him where he should be and where to go, so obviously this is part of combinational play (teamwork), which, as I think, most managers work on during trainings.

Again, I just honestly can't understand how in current state of the football this is not considered as important part of fm.

As for set pieces, I agree, I'd like to see it changed/revamped. Not exactly sure how though, to not make it any more of a chore than it is currently. The obvious problem is making it so it feels like an improvement to everyone. For me, what you describe would not be a fun part of things. I don't like to overly tinker with details around these things. For me, that would detract from my enjoyment with the game. A much more important thing for me is squad management and player development. I'd like to dive deep into keeping the squad content (game time, talks, squad planning, etc) and  overseeing the development of player (game time, training focus, mentoring, etc). I always do long term saves, so the results on the pitch are not the biggest thing for me in my saves, and thus micro managing set pieces or tactics are not my main driver to play the game. Doing too much of that would push me away from the game, in the same way you would if they had added more chats, player unhappiness, etc.

And both what you are talking about and what I'm talking about are key things a manager deal with on a daily basis, but we have a very different parts of it we enjoy the most. And therein lies the issue for SI, how do they make the game enjoyable for both of us? Either the details we enjoy will only give minimal benefit (to avoid punishing those who don't like it), or risk alienating a part of the customer base? Currently, they seem to be trying to balance it out.

Taking it into the even grander part of things, remember that we who write here on the forum might be very vocal or clear in our expectation, but we are not the majority of the customer base of this game. The silent majority will have their own ideas of how it is, and not all of them could tell you the tactical benefits and drawbacks of playing a 3-5-2 vs a 4-3-3. There are loads who just like to take over their team skip to next match play it, rinse and repeat. So would they like EITHER of our preferred version?

[FedAt]

9 минут назад, XaW сказал:

And both what you are talking about and what I'm talking about are key things a manager deal with on a daily basis, but we have a very different parts of it we enjoy the most. And therein lies the issue for SI, how do they make the game enjoyable for both of us? Either the details we enjoy will only give minimal benefit (to avoid punishing those who don't like it), or risk alienating a part of the customer base? Currently, they seem to be trying to balance it out.

 

Yes, I understand that get everyone satisfied is close to impossible 😁, but then I think good solutions would be dlc of some kind, like really complicated set piece editor, or stadiums pack or stadiums editor that people mentioned on this forum, or something else, So if you want it, you buy it, but I suspect that this is bad solution for SI from business point of view, so I don't even hope for this.

[Bababui]

4 hours ago, Johnny Ace said:

It doesn't have a AAA title price tag, at least here in the UK it doesn't. It's £25, no idea what FIFA 22 is, £50? then DLC on top?

Its $49.99 after release on Steam USA.

[XaW]

1 hour ago, FedAt said:

Yes, I understand that get everyone satisfied is close to impossible 😁, but then I think good solutions would be dlc of some kind, like really complicated set piece editor, or stadiums pack or stadiums editor that people mentioned on this forum, or something else, So if you want it, you buy it, but I suspect that this is bad solution for SI from business point of view, so I don't even hope for this.

I'm actually really happy that SI haven't gone the DLC route (IGE aside). You get the full game with all the bells and whistles, and you can download user created stuff for free if you want more (within the bounds of editing). Would not like it if things were more DLC, because that would mean user mods would likely become more restricted to encourage paying for DLC's. Why pay for something you can get from free?

[Tony Wright 747]

6 hours ago, DarJ said:

The issue with that is that there are a lot more people that play the game other than those of us that are on the forum regularly so it still wouldn't be representative of the people that play the ha actually want 

Maybe, but do you think that the opinions of people on the forums so different from those that don't visit the forums

[Tony Wright 747]

5 hours ago, BrightLad5 said:

This is something I incorporate into most of my saves anyway. I try to never use the “player search” feature. Any player I sign has to be recommended by a staff member like DoF or Scouts, or agents/direct approach from the player. It adds a nice level of realism as opposed to shopping for footballer on the Amazon-like player search screen  

me too

[mp_87]

Yeah I'm another who would hope we can do something different with set pieces. I get some will find it fiddly and far too time consuming to set up but the current options are fairly limiting.

I'm not even talking about necessarily wholesale improvement - for me I'd like back the ability, as you could do on previous editions, to just place your players in "default" positions ie. in formation. For instance if I wanted to take short corners, you used to be able to (without even selecting a short option) via just putting everyone on Default have your RW on the side of the penalty area, your RB for an angled pass back down the touchline, and your RCM towards the corner of the penalty area. So plenty of scope for short corner interchanges.

Or for throw ins you could send a couple short whilst everyone else stayed in formation.

Now that's basically impossible to replicate, as you're forced to put people in the few limited straightjacketed options (and that's even before the bugs of FM21 regarding what instructions were obeyed, eg. your DM always vacating the centre of the pitch).

Come on SI, I get a stable set piece creator that isn't massively exploitative is hard work and why you disappoint some who want massive evolution of it.... but give us/me back the old possibilities at least.

[RandomGuy.]

I'm a sucker for real life deadline day, so always enjoy lower league saves where you can often get loanees available out the blue to come in. Anything that helps take you "in" the game through immersion is a good thing IMO. 

The staff meeting will just be added to the pre match meeting and scouting meetings as something that I look at once then never use again.

A lot of folk don't really understand how hard it is to improve things under the hood of this game though especially the ME. Like it's not a case of just changing a 1 to a 0, there'll be thousands of lines of manually created code that only a few people will understand. One change to that might improve say pressing, but then it breaks something else. It can take me weeks to find flaws in basic coding I do, and more weeks to resolve it, for something this size it could easily take years of work.

[Ronnieekelund]

3 hours ago, TioPatinhax said:

I feel the same, unfortunately. And to add to this the waste of resources and time (in my opinion) to develop the female version of FM leads me to believe the situation isnt getting better anytime soon.

However, and myself included, I dont want to judge a game when its not even released, not even a demo. Lets wait and see, I´m keeping a bit of positivity in me but so far the direction it is going isn´t positive.

Exactly, does anyone actually want womens football in the game? Has there ever been a poll on the subject. Seems ridiculous to me when there is still bugs from previous games that haven't been addressed.

[PhilT]

So all in all, vast majority of people happy with the new features 

[PhilT]

3 hours ago, GreenTriangle said:

To be honest, I don't care what FIFA players think about their game. It's their right to like colorful light bulbs and fireworks. Personally, I got terribly bored after only a few hours of playing that game. But I know for sure : FM is much more versatile and realistic than any other football game. And this although in which, according to some, it would need some improvements. So, any improvement for FM does nothing but increase the quality difference between FM and other games. Under these conditions, to say that FM has to be cheaper than other games is like claiming that a player in the 3rd league should earn more money than Harry Kane.

@davehanson@GreenTriangle Lets not fight & argue guys. Take it back to the summer of love, when flower power ruled & all we wanted was to love each other & the new edition of FM 

[Freakiie]

15 minutes ago, Ronnieekelund said:

Exactly, does anyone actually want womens football in the game? Has there ever been a poll on the subject. Seems ridiculous to me when there is still bugs from previous games that haven't been addressed.

In fact yes, a lot of people have been asking about this over the years.

A lot of people seem to forget again that their opinions are just opinions and not universal facts. Just because you want something it doesn't mean everyone must want it and vice versa, you not wanting something does not mean that nobody else wants it.

[Ronnieekelund]

13 minutes ago, Freakiie said:

In fact yes, a lot of people have been asking about this over the years.

A lot of people seem to forget again that their opinions are just opinions and not universal facts. Just because you want something it doesn't mean everyone must want it and vice versa, you not wanting something does not mean that nobody else wants it.

As I said has there been a poll stating that this is a much wanted addition? Opinion on here states it isn't so where do you get your info from. Or anyone on this forum crying out for women's football to be included in fm. If so where has it been said.

[Ronnieekelund]

4 pages of feature requests and womens football is not mentioned once lol.

[XaW]

@Ronnieekelund@Freakiie This is not the thread for that discussion, please have it in the right place.

[Ronnieekelund]

Why isn't it, was mentioned in the video about how they are implementing women's football into football manager. Albeit not this years. Oh well.

[lukavski]

1 hour ago, Ronnieekelund said:

Exactly, does anyone actually want womens football in the game? Has there ever been a poll on the subject. Seems ridiculous to me when there is still bugs from previous games that haven't been addressed.

I Would love to see Women football in the game. Right now, it's my most wanted feature for the game. Next year edition will be a must buy for me.

[XaW]

9 minutes ago, Ronnieekelund said:

Why isn't it, was mentioned in the video about how they are implementing women's football into football manager. Albeit not this years. Oh well.

This is the thread for Women's football, keep that discussion there. This is for the features from the video.

 

[limey150781]

FM21 was the best version for some time for me. I have no real issues around there being no obvious ground breaking developments in 22. For me the ME remains the heart and soul of FM and if the game can develop that (the ideas around pressing etc look great) and can be displayed in a realistic and engaging way, then that will be good enough for me. The AI particularly around transfers is next on my personal list but I'm comfortable with the lack of "new" things as long as they get the basics right! 

[grasu]

It seems that, with every passing year, FM is starting to become one of those yearly releases that you're better off skipping every now and then rather than buying it every year. I skipped FM21, so FM22 was a no-brainer, but if this is all we can look forward to from now on I personally think I'm gonna start taking 2 year breaks between games.

Having said that, I simply cannot fathom what made SI decide that Deadline Day was a headline feature. The concept of deadline day goes against everything that makes a manager successful in FM. If you're only sealing the deal during the last day of the transfer window you're failing as a manager. Players that are signed on DD aren't fit to play, don't know their role in the squad and, realistically, should only be last minute replacements for a poorly planned transfer window.

Making this "feature" one worthy of a highlight is baffling...

Edited October 9, 2021 by grasu

[Ampalaea4]

Lets face it guys... as long as there is no competitor, we will get journalist questions as new features.. 

We will buy it anyway just for the updated database and for our collection. 

I wouldnt bother put effort if I was in their position either... 

[bobbyb12345]

2 hours ago, grasu said:

. The concept of deadline day goes against everything that makes a manager successful in FM. If you're only sealing the deal during the last day of the transfer window you're failing as a manager. Players that are signed on DD aren't fit to play, don't know their role in the squad and, realistically, should only be last minute replacements for a poorly planned transfer window.

Not sure I agree here, at least with the spirit of the point. Deadline day SHOULD matter in the game, it matters in real life (although slightly less than it did a few years ago), the problem I think the game has, as people have said, is that the dynamics elsewhere in the transfer window just don’t seem right. 

For example, and here’s something I don’t see mentioned much, on FM if you try and negotiate a contract with a player and the talks get rejected, it sometimes means for weeks and weeks after the player/agent in question won’t even allow you to make another offer. Is that what happens in real life? I appreciate you can’t have it so that you can keep having negotiations fall apart every day, but there’s just no game dynamics that mean that impending deadline day pressure builds. You either agree a contract or the deal falls apart, there’s no middle ground. As a player of the game you just move onto the next guy until you sign someone. 

I say this as someone who mainly does LLM, so fair if people have more context here. But SI promoting a new improved deadline day dynamic feels like them adding a new paint job to a car that’s still got a dodgy gear box.  Not to mention how binary AI transfer negotiations seem to be, it’s peculiar how many offers I’ve seen that appear to be non-negotiable. Like, sometimes I’ve been OK with the fee I just want to add a sell on clause and the game seems far too restrictive this side.

[Powermonger]

43 minutes ago, Ampalaea4 said:

Lets face it guys... as long as there is no competitor, we will get journalist questions as new features.. 

We will buy it anyway just for the updated database and for our collection. 

I wouldnt bother put effort if I was in their position either... 

Well we all live in hope each year, I am still waiting for the day where the UI gets a complete revamp because many parts have been largely untouched for years. 
 

Take attribute masking, this has been a feature people have asked for revamping for at least 15 years, same with adding club location maps. Maybe one day we will be surprised. 

[renato.]

Deadline day is so relative useless that it can means nothing if I build my entire squad during the pre-season, for example. 

But hey, great headline, congratulations 

Edited October 9, 2021 by renato.

[Lexis]

I would really be interested in seeing the leads come to us and discussing the priorities. I feel a huge disconnect between the fan base and the feature teams. I do not understand why this disconnect is allowed to exist, when it is in the best interest of everyone that this connection exists.  How is there such a gap between our expectations and what is being delivered?

[TioPatinhax]

25 minutos atrás, Lexis disse:

I would really be interested in seeing the leads come to us and discussing the priorities. I feel a huge disconnect between the fan base and the feature teams. I do not understand why this disconnect is allowed to exist, when it is in the best interest of everyone that this connection exists.  How is there such a gap between our expectations and what is being delivered?

Great question

[Dagenham_Dave]

23 hours ago, davehanson said:

Why? Genuinely curious as top why you think an official one is better than a community one?

Perhaps because the developers have consistently produced a brilliant game every year for almost 30 years? 

[(sic)]

This just shows that FM has so many issues, I don't even know where to start.

 

Take a step back and compare FM 19, 20 and 21. How much has your gameplay experience changed and/or improved? Besides adding 'In-transition' instructions, I play the game in totally the same way. This doesn't necessarily mean it's a bad thing, but it's not great either. There are so many new "features" that were added, that I don't even use or care about.

Dynamics. I did use that tab when it was first released. After that I rarely if ever use it. I understand why it was added, but the way it was implemented I just don't feel the need to use it. It's just something that exists in game.

Training. It was desperately in need of an overhaul. It's certainly better than what it used to be, but again I don't want to and don't feel the need to use it because of the way it was implemented. I just set assistant manager to manage my general training, while I manage player training. It's tedious and overwhelming, and while I do want it to be detailed as it is, it's just not implemented in a way that would make me want to use it regularly.

Development centre. Again, a nice addition. Nothing more than that, doesn't impact my gameplay in any way.

 

I can't remember if there's anything else added in past years that I could point out.

 

So FM22 brings us what exactly?

Data Hub. Could be something useful, even for someone like me who doesn't care about statistics that much.

I wouldn't even bother commenting on the other additions that are being advertised as "headline features".

WCB role is a great addition, but while you were at it, why not add an Inverted Fullback role - a fullback that will transition to be a CB and form a back three. You see a lot of teams implementing this sort of thing, and currently it's impossible to recreate successfully in-game.

 

There obviously are under-the-hood improvements that sometimes aren't visible to players, and I feel those are really important. So, I'm glad they're trying to improve transfers, match engine etc.

New animation engine can be promising, match engine still needs improvements, and I wont even comment on the graphical engine for matches. Everyone knows how bad it looks, it almost looks worse each year.

 

Every player is different. More hardcore players, like myself, are really into tactics. For me, tactical creator is pretty limiting, especially in trying to replicate/recreate some IRL tactics.

On the other hand you have more casual players, that aren't interested in tinkering with tactics and just use plug-and-play tactics.

There are players that like to control every single aspect of the club, and there are players that are only interested in squad building, and winning titles.

 

For as long as SI try to pander to both types of players, both types will be dissatisfied with the game. Both will still buy the game so it's a win for them, so they don't care.

What they need to do is try to implement all those in-depth realistic features, and give players the option to not use them if they don't want to. Be it by assigning a staff member to take care of things or in some other way.

For example: a new revamped tactical creator that allows for more customization, closer to real life. That would obviously require a lot of work in the match engine department and the AI. At the same time give more casual players the option to use a basic or advanced version of a tactical creator. In the basic version, players wont have access to all settings and some of them would be automatically selected, something based on the current tactical styles and presets that exist in game.

 

Also, UI/UX redesign. Despite quite a few redesigns each year, the UX is pretty much the same since 10 years ago. SI need to find a way to connect all the features that exist in game, right now they just feel separated and it could be the reason players don't feel the need to use them (be it training, dynamics, or something else).

 

There's a million of things I could go on about, more in-depth, but rant over.

 

 

[davehanson]

3 minutes ago, Dagenham_Dave said:

Perhaps because the developers have consistently produced a brilliant game every year for almost 30 years? 

Where did I say they haven’t? The community have also consistently produced brilliant content for almost 30 years which has enabled the game to become more popular than it would have been without them, or do you disagree?

[Dagenham_Dave]

1 hour ago, Lexis said:

I would really be interested in seeing the leads come to us and discussing the priorities.

Who do they come to? You? 50,000 other people all with wildly different ideas of how the game should be designed? I can see that being a great use of their time and resources. Maybe people should trust them to continue doing what they have all these years and butt the hell out. I'm really looking forward to Elden Ring being (finally) released. Am I desperate to have a meeting with From Software to discuss what features I want the game to have? No, would never dream of it. Some FM players are so self-absorbed. It's a game, buy it/don't buy it, play it/don't play it. By all means, use these forums to express dissatisfaction or otherwise, or voice your ideas as to what you'd like to see in future editions, but refrain from throwing the dummy from the pram when it's not specifically designed to your exact specifications. 

[Dagenham_Dave]

1 minute ago, davehanson said:

Where did I say they haven’t? The community have also consistently produced brilliant content for almost 30 years which has enabled the game to become more popular than it would have been without them, or do you disagree?

"Additional" content, try and understand the difference. 

[davehanson]

Just now, Dagenham_Dave said:

"Additional" content, try and understand the difference. 

And my original point was about data/transfer updates which the community do, and do very well.

If you are going to try and be smart and criticise a post at least try to understand it before you do.

[itsrpss]

17 hours ago, Ronnieekelund said:

Exactly, does anyone actually want womens football in the game? Has there ever been a poll on the subject. Seems ridiculous to me when there is still bugs from previous games that haven't been addressed.

If they never added new features until all bugs were squashed, they’d never launch a new feature again. Imagine how well that would go down? I think adding women’s football to the game is the first significant feature since the 2D match engine that I’ve been excited about. I’ve long wanted a different route in to managing top clubs, so assuming the game allows us to move between managing men’s and women’s teams, I’m looking forward to it. Non-league -> Lower leagues -> Women’s higher leagues -> Men’s higher leagues is an interesting route through a career to me. It lets me build experience in European competitions and winning cups on my way to managing a Premier League team. I’ve no idea how well it’s going to work, but I’m looking forward to trying it.

It does feel like that announcement was preparation for not having anything significant to announce for the 2022 version, though. I guess it’s to be expected a bit, with the team suddenly working remotely. It’s hard to be as productive and creative when you’re learning a new way of working, at least in my experience.

[Dagenham_Dave]

Just now, davehanson said:

And my original point was about data/transfer updates which the community do, and do very well.

If you are going to try and be smart and criticise a post at least try to understand it before you do.

There's a bit of a difference between updating transfers with zero deadlines and dealing with the whole database and its myriad of changes etc to have the main game ready for release, but still, you know best. 

[davehanson]

Just now, Dagenham_Dave said:

There's a bit of a difference between updating transfers with zero deadlines and dealing with the whole database and its myriad of changes etc to have the main game ready for release, but still, you know best. 

I never said the whole database. The original quote was data update. Never a whole database. 

[Malicious Penguin]

1 hour ago, (sic) said:

This just shows that FM has so many issues, I don't even know where to start.

 

Take a step back and compare FM 19, 20 and 21. How much has your gameplay experience changed and/or improved? Besides adding 'In-transition' instructions, I play the game in totally the same way. This doesn't necessarily mean it's a bad thing, but it's not great either. There are so many new "features" that were added, that I don't even use or care about.

Dynamics. I did use that tab when it was first released. After that I rarely if ever use it. I understand why it was added, but the way it was implemented I just don't feel the need to use it. It's just something that exists in game.

Training. It was desperately in need of an overhaul. It's certainly better than what it used to be, but again I don't want to and don't feel the need to use it because of the way it was implemented. I just set assistant manager to manage my general training, while I manage player training. It's tedious and overwhelming, and while I do want it to be detailed as it is, it's just not implemented in a way that would make me want to use it regularly.

Development centre. Again, a nice addition. Nothing more than that, doesn't impact my gameplay in any way.

 

I can't remember if there's anything else added in past years that I could point out.

 

So FM22 brings us what exactly?

Data Hub. Could be something useful, even for someone like me who doesn't care about statistics that much.

I wouldn't even bother commenting on the other additions that are being advertised as "headline features".

WCB role is a great addition, but while you were at it, why not add an Inverted Fullback role - a fullback that will transition to be a CB and form a back three. You see a lot of teams implementing this sort of thing, and currently it's impossible to recreate successfully in-game.

 

There obviously are under-the-hood improvements that sometimes aren't visible to players, and I feel those are really important. So, I'm glad they're trying to improve transfers, match engine etc.

New animation engine can be promising, match engine still needs improvements, and I wont even comment on the graphical engine for matches. Everyone knows how bad it looks, it almost looks worse each year.

 

Every player is different. More hardcore players, like myself, are really into tactics. For me, tactical creator is pretty limiting, especially in trying to replicate/recreate some IRL tactics.

On the other hand you have more casual players, that aren't interested in tinkering with tactics and just use plug-and-play tactics.

There are players that like to control every single aspect of the club, and there are players that are only interested in squad building, and winning titles.

 

For as long as SI try to pander to both types of players, both types will be dissatisfied with the game. Both will still buy the game so it's a win for them, so they don't care.

What they need to do is try to implement all those in-depth realistic features, and give players the option to not use them if they don't want to. Be it by assigning a staff member to take care of things or in some other way.

For example: a new revamped tactical creator that allows for more customization, closer to real life. That would obviously require a lot of work in the match engine department and the AI. At the same time give more casual players the option to use a basic or advanced version of a tactical creator. In the basic version, players wont have access to all settings and some of them would be automatically selected, something based on the current tactical styles and presets that exist in game.

 

Also, UI/UX redesign. Despite quite a few redesigns each year, the UX is pretty much the same since 10 years ago. SI need to find a way to connect all the features that exist in game, right now they just feel separated and it could be the reason players don't feel the need to use them (be it training, dynamics, or something else).

 

There's a million of things I could go on about, more in-depth, but rant over.

 

 

Nailed it. You've also made me realise why I had no interest in full fat FM and was all about Touch. Dynamics, training, dev centre... no interest in. And you can't ignore dynamics/allow your AM to take charge of it.

 

Xbox edition or bust from here on in.

[Bradley21]

It's classic SI to dress up a pointless feature that nobody asked for or wanted as something ground breaking, while ignoring the same complaints people have had for years. This is a feature that literally nobody asked for, nobody wants and nobody will use more than once. This is a complete waste of time and resources and it just blows my mind how anybody at SI could think this is a good idea. 

The only thing SI should be focusing on as a new feature would be a completely overhauled AI transfer system, it is the single one feature that would have a tangible positive impact on the entire playerbase and is something people have been requesting vocally for years. But SI never listen, so we always end up with the same pathetic AI that made nonsensical decisions, make absurd demands while bidding peanuts for players, AI clubs demanding you pay £100m then selling to another AI team for £30m the next day or teams who never make transfers at all. Teams have no identity, no squad building ethos and managers barely have individual identities with signings, the game would improve a hundredfold if this was addressed. 

But i guess getting a Twitter hypeman to do a flashy video is all the content we actually need, so what do i know. 

Edited October 10, 2021 by Bradley21