In game advertising.

[Os]

I was wondering if Si could enlighten me how much it gets paid for the in match pop up advert hoardings?

 

If they are being paid does that lead to any game user benefit?

[FrazT]

6 hours ago, Os said:

I was wondering if Si could enlighten me how much it gets paid for the in match pop up advert hoardings?

 

If they are being paid does that lead to any game user benefit?

Realistically, there is no chance that SI will give any details of their commercial dealings.  Suffice to say that any revenue received from the in-game advertising will help to offset the expenditure on in-game licenses.

[alian62]

In FM24 I think these will be hard coded now . So no adboard mods.  

[Maviarab]

23 hours ago, Os said:

If they are being paid does that lead to any game user benefit?

 

OFC it does....do you not see how much easier it will be for you to be able to buy something you didn't know you didn't need that wasn't on your Amazon wishlist but Google found something and the targeted ads thought you needed it?????

C'mon man, any fool can see the benefits there...benefits all round...

Edit:  If not obvious, the whole above post is sarcasm served with a slice of fresh sarcasm on some fresh sarcasm toast.

Edited January 9, 2023 by Maviarab
Grammar

[priority76]

12 hours ago, alian62 said:

In FM24 I think these will be hard coded now . So no adboard mods.  

Based on what though? They could have 'hard coded' them for FM23 and didn't.

[Maviarab]

13 minutes ago, priority76 said:

Based on what though? They could have 'hard coded' them for FM23 and didn't.

Maybe based on (as you're well aware about) the fact they have threatened fan sites with the removal of said modded content.  I'd have personally have told them to stick it and do their worst if I ran a fan site but that's me, other site owners are not as brash or stubborn as me heh.  Slippery, slippery, slippery slope....

Edited January 9, 2023 by Maviarab

[alian62]

35 minutes ago, priority76 said:

Based on what though? They could have 'hard coded' them for FM23 and didn't.

Thats right but thats when Advertisers started complaining and SI ask for those mods to be removed from FMscout etc , This is why you cant download them anymore

 

[Os]

21 hours ago, FrazT said:

Realistically, there is no chance that SI will give any details of their commercial dealings.  Suffice to say that any revenue received from the in-game advertising will help to offset the expenditure on in-game licenses.

 

Fair enough but I think it is a bit disrespectful for me to pay to play a product that proceeds to advertise companies that may go against my ethics.

 

I respectfully ask for an opt out.

[fc.cadoni]

40 minutes ago, Os said:

 

Fair enough but I think it is a bit disrespectful for me to pay to play a product that proceeds to advertise companies that may go against my ethics.

 

I respectfully ask for an opt out.

Hm? 

[XaW]

2 hours ago, Os said:

Fair enough but I think it is a bit disrespectful for me to pay to play a product that proceeds to advertise companies that may go against my ethics.

I respectfully ask for an opt out.

You mean the option to opt in or out of targeted ads?

Other than htat what ads in the game goes against your ethics currently?

[priority76]

7 hours ago, Maviarab said:

Maybe based on (as you're well aware about) the fact they have threatened fan sites with the removal of said modded content.

I thought that was because of the Man U court case thingy which as far as I know has been settled.  And all they've done to the one wonderful fan site that I know of that did tell them to stick it, was tell them they couldn't be an official seller of the game any more.

[Huey Lewis]

17 hours ago, Os said:

 

Fair enough but I think it is a bit disrespectful for me to pay to play a product that proceeds to advertise companies that may go against my ethics.

 

I respectfully ask for an opt out.

Do you not watch football matches then due to the advertising that happens on shirts and ad hoardings? Assuming you're based in the UK have you written to the BBC to complain about your license fee being used to advertise certain companies during their FA Cup coverage? 

[TopToffee]

16 hours ago, XaW said:

Other than htat what ads in the game goes against your ethics currently?

I'd love to know the answer to this too, since (off the top of my head) the majority of the adverts are for charities or FM/SI related stuff?

[priority76]

Just now, TopToffee said:

I'd love to know the answer to this too, since (off the top of my head) the majority of the adverts are for charities or FM/SI related stuff?

Aren't Carabao energy drinks a likely carcinogen?

[phnompenhandy]

I hope the targeted ads don't include "Manscaping" which has nabbed half the YouTube army. My daughter watches me play this game!

[podunkboy]

21 hours ago, Os said:

 

Fair enough but I think it is a bit disrespectful for me to pay to play a product that proceeds to advertise companies that may go against my ethics.

 

I respectfully ask for an opt out.

I believe your "opt out" is to ask for a refund of your game purchase, although to be perfectly honest, I don't have a clue what the advertising in-game is for, as I'm fairly good at tuning out distractions like that. 

[Os]

On 09/01/2023 at 22:11, XaW said:

You mean the option to opt in or out of targeted ads?

Other than htat what ads in the game goes against your ethics currently?

All ads.

[Os]

20 hours ago, Huey Lewis said:

Do you not watch football matches then due to the advertising that happens on shirts and ad hoardings? Assuming you're based in the UK have you written to the BBC to complain about your license fee being used to advertise certain companies during their FA Cup coverage? 

 

The difference for me is I seem to be paying for the right to have people advertise to me.

[Huey Lewis]

20 minutes ago, Os said:

 

The difference for me is I seem to be paying for the right to have people advertise to me.

You mean like when you pay for a ticket for a football match? Or when you subscribe to Sky, BT, Amazon etc for a sports subscription?

Saying that with a subscription to most TV providers like Sky, you still get adverts show between shows. So yes, for a lot of areas in life you pay for services which come with their right to advertise to you. 

Movies, games, TV. Even when you get the bus or train there's often adverts inside the vehicle. This is not something new or unique. 

[XaW]

1 hour ago, Os said:

All ads.

Then no. In the same way you pay to watch a football match with ad board, the same goes for the game.

Also, you didn't answer what ads in the game you think are against your own ethics. Which ones is it?

[Os]

31 minutes ago, XaW said:

Then no. In the same way you pay to watch a football match with ad board, the same goes for the game.

Also, you didn't answer what ads in the game you think are against your own ethics. Which ones is it?

I don't wish to answer that and it bears no relevance to the point I am making.

[XaW]

Just now, Os said:

I don't wish to answer that and it bears no relevance to the point I am making.

Well, that kind of makes your point moot, doesn't it?

Now, don't get me wrong, I also think advertising in payed content should not happen, but as far as I remember all the ad boards in the game is for Sega, SI, and charities so it's easier for me to take a more lenient stand here than elsewhere. At least this image from my current match seems to be it.

[Os]

2 minutes ago, XaW said:

Well, that kind of makes your point moot, doesn't it?

Now, don't get me wrong, I also think advertising in payed content should not happen, but as far as I remember all the ad boards in the game is for Sega, SI, and charities so it's easier for me to take a more lenient stand here than elsewhere. At least this image from my current match seems to be it.

 

I don't object to any of them, I started to get more corporate stuff which peaked my concerns.

[fc.cadoni]

In the world of trackers & bots in background (even your phone scanning you) for commercial reasons, I found this thread a little (not little exactly) strange. I should worry more about this rather than War Child, Kick it Out being displayed in a football simulation game. If we like to talk about ethics.

[Maviarab]

3 hours ago, Huey Lewis said:

You mean like when you pay for a ticket for a football match? Or when you subscribe to Sky, BT, Amazon etc for a sports subscription?

Saying that with a subscription to most TV providers like Sky, you still get adverts show between shows. So yes, for a lot of areas in life you pay for services which come with their right to advertise to you. 

Movies, games, TV. Even when you get the bus or train there's often adverts inside the vehicle. This is not something new or unique. 

While I get your pooint, it's very bad.  All the other things you mention are services and are to be expected.  Football manager is a (primarily) a single player GAME....

One is not like the others.  Not like them at all in fact.

 

Maybe you're also a CoD fan perhaps....just before shooting the bad guys Ghost blurts out, "Alright guys, lets grab a KFC before we bust some nuts!" 

Would that be acceptable?

Or maybe in Hogwarts Legacy (Top Game on Steam right now)....the main characters can be seen entering an 1800's Pizza Hut while a ressurected Alan Rickman ponders of which new Mercedes to buy while Amazon spam something on your wishlist on a billboard hmmm?  All in your face, unavoidable.  You getting the point now?

On the bus it's annoying, at the stadium it's annoying (but expected), in a film it royally pisses me off (though sometimes, sometimes, they do try and do it subtly), in a game it's unnacceptable imo, especially when the first screen after starting the game is an ad-useage policy asking if I want to opt in or not before even I've started said game.  I really wouldn't be surprised at this point is FM25 is on Kickstarter to raise the funds to make it before they even start (another cancer to the games industry).

 

@fc.cadoni You do know why ad-blockers exist right?  That they are a thing?  You're not still stuck on Windows 95 without one are you?  I never see ads anywhere, on any platform (and I don't watch TV nor sub to streaming sites).  The fact FM now presents you with an ad-useage screen before you can even start the damn game and makes you literally jump through hoops (should, for whatever reason, you not wish to see anything at all)...and then threaten fan sites with the removal of fan modded content....

Still wonder why this thread exists?  really?

Edited January 11, 2023 by Maviarab
Grammar & Edits

[Huey Lewis]

22 minutes ago, Maviarab said:

While I get your pooint, it's very bad.  All the other things you mention are services and are to be expected.  Football manager is a (primarily) a single player GAME....

One is not like the others.  Not like them at all in fact.

 

Maybe you're also a CoD fan perhaps....just before shooting the bad guys Ghost blurts out, "Alright guys, lets grab a KFC before we bust some nuts!" 

Would that be acceptable?

Or maybe in Hogwarts Legacy (Top Game on Steam right now)....the main characters can be seen entering an 1800's Pizza Hut while a ressurected Alan Rickman ponders of which new Mercedes to buy while Amazon spam something on your wishlist on a billboard hmmm?  All in your face, unavoidable.  You getting the point now?

On the bus it's annoying, at the stadium it's annoying (but expected), in a film it royally pisses me off (though sometimes, sometimes, they do try and do it subtly), in a game it's unnacceptable imo, especially when the first screen after starting the game is an ad-useage policy asking if I want to opt in or not before even I've started said game.  I really wouldn't be surprised at this point is FM25 is on Kickstarter to raise the funds to make it before they even start (another cancer to the games industry).

 

@fc.cadoni You do know why ad-blockers exist right?  That they are a thing?  You're not still stuck on Windows 95 without one are you?  I never see ads anywhere, on any platform (and I don't watch TV nor sub to streaming sites).  The fact FM now presents you with an ad-useage screen before you can even start the damn game and makes you literally jump through hoops (should, for whatever reason, you not wish to see anything at all)...and then threaten fan sites with the removal of fan modded content....

Still wonder why this thread exists?  really?

Thing is - FM tries to replicate real life football. In real life stadiums have advertising hoardings. Like them or loath them, they're a part of the match day experience. The game would probably look weirder without them at this stage. 

Adding them in where there's no rhyme or reason for them I 100% agree. But this is just replicating what's actually there IRL.

[forameuss]

28 minutes ago, Maviarab said:

While I get your pooint, it's very bad.  All the other things you mention are services and are to be expected.  Football manager is a (primarily) a single player GAME....

One is not like the others.  Not like them at all in fact.

 

Maybe you're also a CoD fan perhaps....just before shooting the bad guys Ghost blurts out, "Alright guys, lets grab a KFC before we bust some nuts!" 

Would that be acceptable?

Or maybe in Hogwarts Legacy (Top Game on Steam right now)....the main characters can be seen entering an 1800's Pizza Hut while a ressurected Alan Rickman ponders of which new Mercedes to buy while Amazon spam something on your wishlist on a billboard hmmm?  All in your face, unavoidable.  You getting the point now?

On the bus it's annoying, at the stadium it's annoying (but expected), in a film it royally pisses me off (though sometimes, sometimes, they do try and do it subtly), in a game it's unnacceptable imo, especially when the first screen after starting the game is an ad-useage policy asking if I want to opt in or not before even I've started said game.  I really wouldn't be surprised at this point is FM25 is on Kickstarter to raise the funds to make it before they even start (another cancer to the games industry).

 

@fc.cadoni You do know why ad-blockers exist right?  That they are a thing?  You're not still stuck on Windows 95 without one are you?  I never see ads anywhere, on any platform (and I don't watch TV nor sub to streaming sites).  The fact FM now presents you with an ad-useage screen before you can even start the damn game and makes you literally jump through hoops (should, for whatever reason, you not wish to see anything at all)...and then threaten fan sites with the removal of fan modded content....

Still wonder why this thread exists?  really?

Pulling massively hyperbolic examples that don't really compare to the actual thing you're arguing against doesn't really make your point stronger.

[fc.cadoni]

45 minutes ago, Maviarab said:

 

 

@fc.cadoni You do know why ad-blockers exist right?  That they are a thing?  You're not still stuck on Windows 95 without one are you?  I never see ads anywhere, on any platform (and I don't watch TV nor sub to streaming sites).  The fact FM now presents you with an ad-useage screen before you can even start the damn game and makes you literally jump through hoops (should, for whatever reason, you not wish to see anything at all)...and then threaten fan sites with the removal of fan modded content....

Still wonder why this thread exists?  really?

Ad-blocker is something different from trackers, but it's different discussion this and out of topic.

That's exactly my question as well. Why this thread exist.

[Maviarab]

2 hours ago, fc.cadoni said:

Ad-blocker is something different from trackers, but it's different discussion this and out of topic.

That's exactly my question as well. Why this thread exist.

Not different at all.  Ads are constantly forced upon us and these things exist because they annoy the majority of people.  So yes, very same discussion.

 

3 hours ago, forameuss said:

Pulling massively hyperbolic examples that don't really compare to the actual thing you're arguing against doesn't really make your point stronger.

They were extreme for a reason, guess that went over your head.  My point applies and stands as to where the industry (and this game in particular) is/are heading.

Edited January 11, 2023 by Maviarab

[fc.cadoni]

1 minute ago, Maviarab said:

Not different at all.  Ads are constantly forced upon us and these things exist because they annoy the majority of people.  So yes, very same discussion.

As you said, there is no point of this thread. Let's move on.

[FelixForte]

I kinda get his point. Why do we need adds in the game? Just show SI or so on the add boards during matches.

I know you can turn targeted adds of, but nonetheless I feel like it's odd to pay for a game in which they're also going to show you adds. Maybe remove the adds or make the game free to play?

[forameuss]

4 hours ago, Maviarab said:

They were extreme for a reason, guess that went over your head.  My point applies and stands as to where the industry (and this game in particular) is/are heading.

Yes.  You completely deviating from trying to make a point by going deliberately "extreme" went over my head.  I was naively thinking you were trying to be sensible and balanced.  My mistake.

It's replicating what is already present in real life, not inserting ads where they're not.  In a sport where clubs and entities are happy to accept bucketfuls of money from betting companies and be bought by despotic regimes, a few ad boards relating to charities and SI themselves is really not that deep.

[TopToffee]

13 hours ago, Maviarab said:

Not different at all.  Ads are constantly forced upon us and these things exist because they annoy the majority of people.  So yes, very same discussion.

 

They were extreme for a reason, guess that went over your head.  My point applies and stands as to where the industry (and this game in particular) is/are heading.

Counterpoint:

Using ad blockers is astonishingly entitled.

”I know that someone put effort into creating this content, writing this article, making this video etc etc, but I am not on board with them being compensated for doing so”

”slippery slope” is generally a weak argument. The example you used of COD would completely break immersion and take you out of the experience. The ads (particularly limited as they are) if anything do the opposite in FM, as they also appear in the real thing that is being simulated.

in fact, the potential future inability to install user generated content on those boards is being lamented here, but those packs (or certainly the vast majority of them) tend to have MORE corporate advertising than the default set (which is much more focused on FM and Charities)